Brexit bedlam - May's EU divorce deal crushed by 230 votes in parliament

[CG1 Blue]

1 hour ago, bomber said:

sorry but that was was nearly 3 years ago,was she another one who fell for the lies and BS at the time?was the story was ever true? NO,she hasnt supported democracy either as leave won,after seeing the damage who wants democracy.

I'll help you out. Here's the transcript of the Queen's speech today at the WI meeting. 

“The continued emphasis on patience, friendship, a strong community-focus, and considering the needs of others, are as important today as they were when the group (*The Women's Institute) was founded all those years ago. Of course, every generation faces fresh challenges and opportunities.

“As we look for new answers in the modern age, I for one prefer the tried and tested recipes, like speaking well of each other and respecting different points of view; coming together to seek out the common ground; and never losing sight of the bigger picture. To me, these approaches are timeless, and I commend them to everyone.”

If this is a speech supporting Remain, I'm the Sultan of Brunei. 

 

 

[aright]

5 hours ago, tebee said:

A pyrrhic victory though - no one seems to be able to decide what you won

We certainly know what you wanted to win and we didn't want that. A monolithic, non accountable, wasteful institution where farming subsidies account for 40% of the budget (can you believe that?). A moribund union, economically and demographically, good at passing new laws for trivial matters but very bad at tackling fundamental issues.

We find Remainers logic difficult to understand, determined as they are to remain shackled to the EU Gulag and the totalitarian EU Commission.

Normally when Inmates are given the keys to their cells they run for freedom but not the Remainers. Better to stay in the EU and apply a wrecking ball, not just to the results of the UK referendum, but also to the promises made at the time and implied in the 2016 election, and disregarding the wishes, nay instructions,  of the majority of MPs in both major parties who said they would honour the referendum result.

Tribalism will continue to dominate and threaten the future of the EU. Unlike the USA the EU has no common language or shared culture and national interests are fiercely defended.  Monetary policy decisions and the migration crisis put Member States one against the other which feeds populist opinion....….so much for integration. 

I am sure you regard yourself as lucky living in France because you get to keep what you wanted . I spent Christmas and New Year in Belgium and France. I was taken off the road by yellow vests between Calais and Bruges then the following week detoured between Bruges and Amiens. Unlike Paris it was all very civilized and the vests and police were very friendly 

Whatever the outcome of Brexit the European Union will remain a cluster of inter-tribal compromises dominated by Germany. 

The Europe of Dreams is slowly becoming the Europe of Reality, what with Brexit, Migration and Refugees, the economy, digital Europe, Foreign and Security Policy and the political and social scene. Perhaps you and other Remainers would like to tell us Leavers who/what party you are voting for to solve these problems and what action the EU will take? I am happy to change my mind if you can make a good case.

 

 

 

 

[tebee]

2 hours ago, aright said:

We certainly know what you wanted to win and we didn't want that. A monolithic, non accountable, wasteful institution where farming subsidies account for 40% of the budget (can you believe that?). A moribund union, economically and demographically, good at passing new laws for trivial matters but very bad at tackling fundamental issues.

We find Remainers logic difficult to understand, determined as they are to remain shackled to the EU Gulag and the totalitarian EU Commission.

Normally when Inmates are given the keys to their cells they run for freedom but not the Remainers. Better to stay in the EU and apply a wrecking ball, not just to the results of the UK referendum, but also to the promises made at the time and implied in the 2016 election, and disregarding the wishes, nay instructions,  of the majority of MPs in both major parties who said they would honour the referendum result.

Tribalism will continue to dominate and threaten the future of the EU. Unlike the USA the EU has no common language or shared culture and national interests are fiercely defended.  Monetary policy decisions and the migration crisis put Member States one against the other which feeds populist opinion....….so much for integration. 

I am sure you regard yourself as lucky living in France because you get to keep what you wanted . I spent Christmas and New Year in Belgium and France. I was taken off the road by yellow vests between Calais and Bruges then the following week detoured between Bruges and Amiens. Unlike Paris it was all very civilized and the vests and police were very friendly 

Whatever the outcome of Brexit the European Union will remain a cluster of inter-tribal compromises dominated by Germany. 

The Europe of Dreams is slowly becoming the Europe of Reality, what with Brexit, Migration and Refugees, the economy, digital Europe, Foreign and Security Policy and the political and social scene. Perhaps you and other Remainers would like to tell us Leavers who/what party you are voting for to solve these problems and what action the EU will take? I am happy to change my mind if you can make a good case.

 

 

 

 

OK we all know what you don't want, but your lot have had 2 and a half years now, and no one seems to be able to agree on what you do want. 

 

There are only slightly fewer versions of Brexit around than there are brexiters and no one vision of our future course seems to command enough support to get any decent number of people to agree on it.

 

We are rapidly running out of time    - the most likely option at the moment seems to be the crash out disorganised brexit, but that will almost certainly be so bad, that we'll end up clamoring to rejoin in a few months - whether they will let us is another mater, of course.

[aright]

17 minutes ago, tebee said:

OK we all know what you don't want, but your lot have had 2 and a half years now, and no one seems to be able to agree on what you do want. 

 

There are only slightly fewer versions of Brexit around than there are brexiters and no one vision of our future course seems to command enough support to get any decent number of people to agree on it.

 

We are rapidly running out of time    - the most likely option at the moment seems to be the crash out disorganised brexit, but that will almost certainly be so bad, that we'll end up clamoring to rejoin in a few months - whether they will let us is another mater, of course.

The question I asked was obviously unworthy of comment. I must assume you believe my criticism was uncalled for and  you really do live in the Europe of Dreams. 

 

[tebee]

13 minutes ago, aright said:

The question I asked was obviously unworthy of comment. I must assume you believe my criticism was uncalled for and  you really do live in the Europe of Dreams. 

 

 

3 hours ago, aright said:

W

Perhaps you and other Remainers would like to tell us Leavers who/what party you are voting for to solve these problems and what action the EU will take? I am happy to change my mind if you can make a good case.

 

 

 

 

That question ?

 

None 

 

I don't get a vote anymore .

 

This year been out of UK for more than 15 years so don't get to vote in UK GE.

 

Don't get to vote in French GE unless I apply for French citizenship.

[aright]

2 minutes ago, tebee said:

 

That question ?

 

None 

 

I don't get a vote anymore .

 

This year been out of UK for more than 15 years so don't get to vote in UK GE.

 

Don't get to vote in French GE unless I apply for French citizenship.

I understand but you must have an opinion on the EU.....you live there/here.

If my comments are justified fully or partially  and you had a vote in the UK and/or France what Political party would you vote for to put it right.

[tebee]

1 minute ago, aright said:

I understand but you must have an opinion on the EU.....you live there/here.

If my comments are justified fully or partially  and you had a vote in the UK and/or France what Political party would you vote for to put it right.

Pirate party !

[aright]

Troll reply!

[tebee]

Not true - I do actually like the Pirate party policies - especially as they are promoting a minimum basic income, which would solve the problem of concentration of wealth in a small portion of the population. 

[aright]

And what is their take on the EU? its easy to find "living wage " parties, my difficulty and yours I suspect is finding a Political Party which has a will to change the EU. The economy, is far less important to me (given time it will sort itself out....it always has) than the issues surrounding sovereignty , the judicial system, control of borders and politics. No party in the UK has concerns on these issues...…..that's why I voted Brexit.

[Spidey]

4 hours ago, CG1 Blue said:

If this is a speech supporting Remain, I'm the Sultan of Brunei. 

If this is a speech supporting Brexit, I'm the Sultan of Brunei's mum.

[Grouse]

https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/mark-francois-criticised-for-germanophobic-remarks-on-

-news-1-5866948

 

Here is an example of a specific Brexiter moron! Embarrassing!

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/mps-expenses/5431750/MPs-expenses-Mark-Francois-A-bit-of-an-animal.html

More moronic behaviour

 

I note he made lieutenant in The Royal Anglians, so another ex military Brexiter! What do they teach them in the army? Can they teach them anything? How do they work alongside othe NATO units with attitudes like that?  Worrying.

[Grouse]

A little ray of sunshine

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-47012523

 

The party whip system is inappropriate in these febrile times.

[Grouse]

 

Tim of Weatherspoon with several beers on board discusses living wage. Hic.

[Grouse]

Good infographic on inequality in the U.K. Out of date but things have deteriorated not improved. This a root cause of Brexit

 

 

[nauseus]

2 hours ago, Grouse said:

 

Tim of Weatherspoon with several beers on board discusses living wage. Hic.

Snowflake-in-Chief Jones! Your hero?

 

I messed up and actually watched this. No more please.

 

Early happy hour. Hup!

[bomber]

4 hours ago, Grouse said:

https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/mark-francois-criticised-for-germanophobic-remarks-on-

-news-1-5866948

 

Here is an example of a specific Brexiter moron! Embarrassing!

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/mps-expenses/5431750/MPs-expenses-Mark-Francois-A-bit-of-an-animal.html

More moronic behaviour

 

I note he made lieutenant in The Royal Anglians, so another ex military Brexiter! What do they teach them in the army? Can they teach them anything? How do they work alongside othe NATO units with attitudes like that?  Worrying.

i know around 10-12 ex forces guys,all voted leave,we wont have any statistics but i would estimate that 85-95% of any current or former force's personal will of also done so,you could probably add to that a very high % of their families,i will say it again if Germany was not in the EU the vote to leave would not of won,

[vogie]

1 minute ago, bomber said:

i know around 10-12 ex forces guys,all voted leave,we wont have any statistics but i would estimate that 85-95% of any current or former force's personal will of also done so,you could probably add to that a very high % of their families,i will say it again if Germany was not in the EU the vote to leave would not of won,

All your posts come from 'I know someone' 'I heard it in the pub' do you ever have any proof to substantiate your posts, please stop posting 'facts' you cannot or will not corroborate. Give us some evidence for a change.

[bomber]

2 hours ago, Grouse said:

 

Tim of Weatherspoon with several beers on board discusses living wage. Hic.

the man comes across as a clown,i liked the question when he was asked what EU laws he didnt like,and he couldnt come up with one,then claimed to be a barrister,he makes a fool of himself on the euro issue and the low wages questions had him beat ,another clown trying to hog the limelight,

[bomber]

13 minutes ago, vogie said:

All your posts come from 'I know someone' 'I heard it in the pub' do you ever have any proof to substantiate your posts, please stop posting 'facts' you cannot or will not corroborate. Give us some evidence for a change.

i stated the ex forces leave vote we wont have any facts,personal friends who have told me which way they voted are facts,we know as a fact that the older generation were very much leave voters,i would think of the older generation their will be a sizeable proportion of ex servicemen and even women,many still alive from the national service era.

[vogie]

2 minutes ago, bomber said:

i stated the ex forces leave vote we wont have any facts,personal friends who have told me which way they voted are facts,we know as a fact that the older generation were very much leave voters,i would think of the older generation their will be a sizeable proportion of ex servicemen and even women,many still alive from the national service era.

 

31 minutes ago, bomber said:

i know around 10-12 ex forces guys,all voted leave,we wont have any statistics but i would estimate that 85-95% of any current or former force's personal will of also done so,you could probably add to that a very high % of their families,i will say it again if Germany was not in the EU the vote to leave would not of won,

You clearly stated that if Germany was not in the EU the vote to leave would not have won, now would you kindly show some evidence as to this, "probably" doesn't mean a thing, that is in your interpretation only. Please stop making things up.

Are you still of the opinion that our queen is a remainer.????????????

[melvinmelvin]

34 minutes ago, bomber said:

i know around 10-12 ex forces guys,all voted leave,we wont have any statistics but i would estimate that 85-95% of any current or former force's personal will of also done so,you could probably add to that a very high % of their families,i will say it again if Germany was not in the EU the vote to leave would not of won,

if what you right is true I would say that,

this is pretty sick

frightening

 

[nontabury]

56 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Snowflake-in-Chief Jones! Your hero?

 

I messed up and actually watched this. No more please.

 

Early happy hour. Hup!

Is it just me, but do you think this Guardian sponsored video, could have been heavily edited.

[nauseus]

48 minutes ago, bomber said:

i know around 10-12 ex forces guys,all voted leave,we wont have any statistics but i would estimate that 85-95% of any current or former force's personal will of also done so,you could probably add to that a very high % of their families,i will say it again if Germany was not in the EU the vote to leave would not of won,

So don't blame us then. ????

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, nauseus said:

Snowflake-in-Chief Jones! Your hero?

 

I messed up and actually watched this. No more please.

 

Early happy hour. Hup!

You are quite correct. Jones makes me vomit.

 

I did enjoy seeing Tim after several happy hours being caught out for paying wages below living standards

[aright]

 

I was in a Special Forces Operations room somewhere in southern Afghanistan watching the situation unfold. A Royal Marines patrol had been hit hard in a follow-up on an IED strike that had severely injured one of their colleagues. They had extracted the casualty at such a pace that his legs were left behind - severed in the blast. The Taliban were dancing, holding the Marine's legs above their heads - a call had come in to launch our Special Forces Task Group to recover them.

The men were angry - they wanted to go on the job. The Squadron Commander was not convinced.

"I cannot lose a lifter (CH47 Chinook) over a pair of f------ legs," he kept saying. "You think the lad would want that?" "I think you're wrong," said one of the lads. "I know you do," he replied.

 

This is Brexit related.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/01/24/courage-leadership-can-bring-brexit-home/

If you can't get it directly from the Daily Telegraph try

https://snewsi.com/id/19185150201

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, bomber said:

i know around 10-12 ex forces guys,all voted leave,we wont have any statistics but i would estimate that 85-95% of any current or former force's personal will of also done so,you could probably add to that a very high % of their families,i will say it again if Germany was not in the EU the vote to leave would not of won,

I'm inclined to agree.

 

Why do they hold on to, and pass on, these pathetic WW2 memes: Achtung himmel!" Agh! Spitfire! 

 

As I say, I do wonder how we integrate with NATO

[7by7]

19 hours ago, CG1 Blue said:

I'm not aware that the government has ever asked a pro-Brexit business owner to speak about the impact of leaving the EU. It's the deceit from the government that I don't like. 

The government did not aske Airbus to speak about the impact of Brexit per se, they asked Airbus to speak about the effects of a no deal Brexit.

 

I, too, am not aware of any pro Brexit business or industry being asked by the British government to speak in favour of a no deal Brexit. Even if they wanted to, they probably wouldn't find anyone from business or industry willing to do so. Even pro Brexit business and industry people know a no deal Brexit for the disaster it would be.

 

After much research I have found many business and industry spokespeople supporting Brexit; but none supporting a no deal Brexit. 

 

Businesses “watching in horror” as no-deal Brexit risk rises

Quote

The CBI, EEF, Institute of Directors, Federation of Small Businesss and the British Chambers of Commerce – which between them represent hundreds of thousands of firms across the UK – claim that businesses have been “watching in horror” as politicians have focused on internal disputes rather than the practical steps that are required to protect the economy.

As that article says, many companies are making plans to relocate out of the UK in the event of a no deal Brexit; some have already done so; and that includes companies whose bosses were pro Brexit!

 

Wealthy Brexiteers like James Dyson are jumping ship. Why might that be?

 

OK, Dyson is going to Singapore. But, as the article asks, is that because the trade deal between Singapore and the EU agreed last October will give his company better access to EU markets than remaining in a post no deal Brexit UK will?

 

His spokespeople say the move is to make the company 'future proofed.' Future proofed against what? A no deal Brexit? If not, why did he decide on this move when a no deal began to look more and more likely and after the Singapore/EU trade deal had been signed?

 

[nauseus]

11 minutes ago, Grouse said:

I'm inclined to agree.

 

Why do they hold on to, and pass on, these pathetic WW2 memes: Achtung himmel!" Agh! Spitfire! 

 

As I say, I do wonder how we integrate with NATO

Well if Germany was not in the EU there would be no EU, no Brexit and no problem. ????

[Grouse]

5 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Well if Germany was not in the EU there would be no EU, no Brexit and no problem. ????

Interesting! So it's all about Germany!

 

In which case you must surely agree that EEC/EU has worked well.

 

Personally, I would be happy to see a German battalion parked on Poland's lawn rather than American one!

 

One thing's certain, the Poles, Lithuanians and Latvians won't rely on help from the U.K.! I can't see our aircraft carriers going in to the Baltic!