Vogie

 

I think that Soubry, Grieve and Cooper all want to get no deal off the table along with most responsible (Ha!) politicians and that means stopping us getting to Brexit day and ending up with that dire scenario.  Hence trying to delay it.

 

It all depends how people want to interpret what is happening and given that we are usually batting from different sides over Brexit we are always going to see things differently.

5 hours ago, dick dasterdly said:

Do you honestly believe this will go down well with the electorate?

 

Even (most?) remainers would be a bit disturbed at this tactic to completely ignore the referendum result?

 

Who says they would?

 

The referendum was never more than advisory, an opinion poll, despite what chancer Cameron and Treasonous Theresa try and say.

 

Parliament copped out of doing it's job because those hypocritical toads are more interested in their own careers and agendas than in adhering to their sworn duty.

 

Many people are now understanding this and how it undermines British parliamentary representative democracy.

I think it fair to say that leavers can parrot, with a degree of conformity, what they don't like. Because Dominic Cumberbatch told them!

 

But NONE of them can tell us what they want in future and provide a rational explanation!

 

The lack of knowledge exhibited by them is, frankly, terrifying. And they expect us to agree with them!!! There is nothing to agree with!

 

Just for fun, let's ask them why they will not consider staying in the CU and explain their rationale. This will be good ????!

 

Remember this largely resolves the NI issue and the problems facing our automotive industry.

4 hours ago, Grouse said:

As it has turned out to be such a damn silly idea, I don't think anyone cares what the huddled masses of C- and D demographic classes think anymore. If you ask them, they dont understand anything. Why should we humour morons? just because they form some kind of majority? A coalition of the ignorant?

I understand A, B, C1, C2, D & E, but what is "C-"???

36 minutes ago, Grouse said:

 

 

But NONE of them can tell us what they want in future and provide a rational explanation!

Don’t be silly. Blue passports, bendy bananas and the freedom to re- engineer your supply chain and largest markets for those half way around the world and who will give you a 10th of the access you already have with the quite large one across the channel. 

 

 

2 hours ago, Basil B said:

I understand A, B, C1, C2, D & E, but what is "C-"???

Same as C2. Sorry

4 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Who says they would?

 

The referendum was never more than advisory, an opinion poll, despite what chancer Cameron and Treasonous Theresa try and say.

 

Parliament copped out of doing it's job because those hypocritical toads are more interested in their own careers and agendas than in adhering to their sworn duty.

 

Many people are now understanding this and how it undermines British parliamentary representative democracy.

 

I'd like to offer a comment here. You refer to the referendum as an opinion poll, fair enough.

 

I don't know if you listened in on the may-deal debate in parliament, I did,

very very closely, syllable by syllable.

Found it extremely interesting.

 

At any rate as we say in Yorkshire,

I noted that several MPs when talking about the referendum they opined

that when parliament did the referendum act parliament gave the decision power over to the people,

Several MPs said this. They were not arrested and corrected by other MPs.

They were not arrested and corrected by the Speaker.

 

just fancied mentioning this

 

14 hours ago, Thingamabob said:

No deal will be best for Britain, no doubt about it.

Today Brexit was a short topic in German TV. The Airbus boss UK briefly said that Brexit supporters think Airbus would not relocate its wing production because the factories are very large. He said here they are wrong. 14000 Airbus workers + 110000 suppliers jobs. Next: Dyson is moving its headquarters to Singapore. Sony moves its headquarters to Amsterdam. 50 companies from the UK financial industry want to relocate parts to Luxembourg.

Is that good for the UK as a business location?
I have my doubts.
But it applies to all negative news from the economy, the all healing mantra: Project Fear.

On 1/24/2019 at 8:55 AM, soalbundy said:

and a 20% drop in the pounds value, I'm so happy that 90% of my pension is in Euro's.

No need for you to worry then?  Many of us whose income will be further adversely affected by a no deal, will still welcome that outcome versus accepting a deal with an organisation which many of us despise.

3 minutes ago, Retiredandhappyhere said:

No need for you to worry then?  Many of us whose income will be further adversely affected by a no deal, will still welcome that outcome versus accepting a deal with an organisation which many of us despise.

Worryingly, for a few of us - it has increased our dislike of the uk govt. as much as the eu govt.....

18 hours ago, Basil B said:

I understand A, B, C1, C2, D & E, but what is "C-"???

Don't pander to Grouse's ego, as you must know by now, as he tells us on here all the time, that he knows everything there is to know. about everything and that anyone who does not agree with his point of view is automatically labelled a "moron".

On 1/24/2019 at 2:46 PM, OneMoreFarang said:

It will be a no-deal by default. If they don't get a majority for anything else it will be a no-deal.

And even if there is a majority against no-deal there is currently no majority for anything else.

Good news then?

6 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

Worryingly, for a few of us - it has increased our dislike of the uk govt. as much as the eu govt.....

Fair enough, but we can leave the EU if we do not like them.

21 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Who says they would?

 

The referendum was never more than advisory, an opinion poll, despite what chancer Cameron and Treasonous Theresa try and say.

 

Parliament copped out of doing it's job because those hypocritical toads are more interested in their own careers and agendas than in adhering to their sworn duty.

 

Many people are now understanding this and how it undermines British parliamentary representative democracy.

You're just another sore loser.

 

For once, our political leaders are actually doing what a majority of us told them to do - even though they had spent a fortune (of our money) trying to persuade us to vote the other way!

 

Sod your "parliamentary representative democracy". That's REAL democracy at work.

49 minutes ago, Krataiboy said:

You're just another sore loser.

 

For once, our political leaders are actually doing what a majority of us told them to do - even though they had spent a fortune (of our money) trying to persuade us to vote the other way!

 

Sod your "parliamentary representative democracy". That's REAL democracy at work.

your vision is way better than mine,

I can not spot your political leaders making any efforts to lead UK out of EU

 

Just now, melvinmelvin said:

your vision is way better than mine,

I can not spot your political leaders making any efforts to lead UK out of EU

 

If Theresa May really meant what she said - "No deal is better than a bad deal" - then unless she pulls the proverbial rabbit out of the hat in the next few weeks, that is where we are heading.

Regardless of whether anybody thinks a referendum is advisory, they only come once a flood and the govt did take it seriously.
They (Parliament as a whole) enacted the EU Referendum Act 2015 to allow it to happen.
When Leave won they (Parliament again) eventually enacted the Notification of Withdrawal Act 2017, to send the Article 50 notice to the EU.
A year later they (Parliament) passed the EU Withdrawal Act 2018, to permit the negotiations and repeal the old EU laws into UK law. This gives us the exit date of 29th March 2019 and is now law, unless amended before that date.

The problem now lies with the “meaningful vote” at the end of EU negotiations and amendments being tabled to frustrate the exit date. Many of the Parliamentarians were closet Remainers, now outed, who had to be seen to respect the referendum. The worlds biggest opinion poll is now UK law, despite the Remainers wails. The legislative wheels grind slowly, and in the right direction, so far not thwarted by those traitorous Remainers.


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46 minutes ago, Krataiboy said:

If Theresa May really meant what she said - "No deal is better than a bad deal" - then unless she pulls the proverbial rabbit out of the hat in the next few weeks, that is where we are heading.

right,

but TM's slogan/refrain has been slightly updated over the past months

new issue of slogan; my deal or no Brexit 

On ‎1‎/‎24‎/‎2019 at 4:25 AM, OneMoreFarang said:

When will the UK politicians and UK citizens realize that the EU can't and won't deliver the impossible.

You can't have that cake and eat it. It's just not possible, even if you want it very much. It's impossible!

But Vote.Leave promised we could have that cake and eat it!

 

They promised us that we would only ditch the bits of the EU we didn't like and be able to keep all the rest!

 

Were they lying, or just stupid?

 

Vote.Leave's chief strategist, Dominic Cummings, is not stupid.

1 hour ago, melvinmelvin said:

right,

but TM's slogan/refrain has been slightly updated over the past months

new issue of slogan; my deal or no Brexit 

Like Mother Theresa has said, there's no deal by 29 March, we will be out. That's what the majority of people (in the referendum) and Parliament have voted for.

 

But for me this would be like an atheist dying and finding himself being handed a harp by somebody calling themselves God.

 

So, realistically, isn't going to happen.

 

My best guess: at the last knockings, the EU will offer "concessions" on the Irish border non-issue - and the Parliamentary turkeys will fall over themselves to vote for Christmas.

 

 

21 minutes ago, Krataiboy said:

Like Mother Theresa has said, there's no deal by 29 March, we will be out. That's what the majority of people (in the referendum) and Parliament have voted for.

 

But for me this would be like an atheist dying and finding himself being handed a harp by somebody calling themselves God.

 

So, realistically, isn't going to happen.

 

My best guess: at the last knockings, the EU will offer "concessions" on the Irish border non-issue - and the Parliamentary turkeys will fall over themselves to vote for Christmas.

 

 

right,

if EU moves, anything might be achieved

 

provided that your omni loved PM doesn't derail it

 

 

On 1/24/2019 at 7:27 PM, Grouse said:

I think it fair to say that leavers can parrot, with a degree of conformity, what they don't like. Because Dominic Cumberbatch told them!

 

But NONE of them can tell us what they want in future and provide a rational explanation!

 

The lack of knowledge exhibited by them is, frankly, terrifying. And they expect us to agree with them!!! There is nothing to agree with!

 

Just for fun, let's ask them why they will not consider staying in the CU and explain their rationale. This will be good ????!

 

Remember this largely resolves the NI issue and the problems facing our automotive industry.

24 hours later and no response from the Brexit intelligencia. Not a dicky bird; not a tweet. What should one conclude?

20 hours ago, melvinmelvin said:

 

I'd like to offer a comment here. You refer to the referendum as an opinion poll, fair enough.

 

I don't know if you listened in on the may-deal debate in parliament, I did,

very very closely, syllable by syllable.

Found it extremely interesting.

 

At any rate as we say in Yorkshire,

I noted that several MPs when talking about the referendum they opined

that when parliament did the referendum act parliament gave the decision power over to the people,

Several MPs said this. They were not arrested and corrected by other MPs.

They were not arrested and corrected by the Speaker.

 

just fancied mentioning this

 

Lack of knowledge of the constitution or of parliamentary procedure is not confined to the great unwashed; MPs are just as ignorant for the most part. IMO, the current crop are crap

4 hours ago, Retiredandhappyhere said:

Don't pander to Grouse's ego, as you must know by now, as he tells us on here all the time, that he knows everything there is to know. about everything and that anyone who does not agree with his point of view is automatically labelled a "moron".

Lovely to hear from you again!

 

Your statement is entirely false

 

I do indeed know a huge amount in a small number of specialised areas.

 

I also know quite a lot generally after 65 years of reading

 

I do indeed think that Brexit is a moronic idea.

 

I also contend that Brexiters in demographic classes C2 and D act as if they were morons. Not Mormons, morons. What else can one say about people voting for self harm, poverty, redundancy?

30 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

right,

if EU moves, anything might be achieved

 

provided that your omni loved PM doesn't derail it

 

 

Brexiters won't say WHAT they want because they haven't been told yet.

57 minutes ago, Krataiboy said:

But for me this would be like an atheist dying and finding himself being handed a harp by somebody calling themselves God.

I'd tell him to stop harping on and hand me a Les Paul, the industry Standard.

33 minutes ago, Grouse said:

Lack of knowledge of the constitution or of parliamentary procedure is not confined to the great unwashed; MPs are just as ignorant for the most part. IMO, the current crop are crap

right @Grouse we include the Speaker as well then

mai pen rai

 

anyway

 

My mission is not to conclude but to question and spur exchange of views

 

 

24 hours later and no response from the Brexit intelligencia. Not a dicky bird; not a tweet. What should one conclude?

That they’ve had enough of an aerosol (predictive text) like you.
That they’ve got real lives to live without grandstanding on TV.


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On 1/24/2019 at 11:29 AM, Baerboxer said:

 

Who says they would?

 

The referendum was never more than advisory, an opinion poll, despite what chancer Cameron and Treasonous Theresa try and say.

 

Parliament copped out of doing it's job because those hypocritical toads are more interested in their own careers and agendas than in adhering to their sworn duty.

 

Many people are now understanding this and how it undermines British parliamentary representative democracy.

 

 You forgot to mention that Cameron, was the P.M when he declared that the result of the 2016 people’s referendum would be respected and implemented. 

  Since that date, a General Election took place in June 2017, when more that 80% of the electorate voted for parties that promised to uphold the Democratic decision of the British electorate.

  Regarding your comments on Parliament,it’s now a case of the people against Parliament. 

 

 

19 minutes ago, nontabury said:

 

 You forgot to mention that Cameron, was the P.M when he declared that the result of the 2016 people’s referendum would be respected and implemented. 

  Since that date, a General Election took place in June 2017, when more that 80% of the electorate voted for parties that promised to uphold the Democratic decision of the British electorate.

  Regarding your comments on Parliament,it’s now a case of the people against Parliament. 

 

 

Good for you Bridget

 

At least you understand that you should act in your constituents' best interests which maybe not the same as what they say