Brexit deadlocked again: British parliament fails to find an alternative

[Chomper Higgot]

5 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Again what makes leaving the EU right wing.

Where there any left wing members of the Leave campaign?

[dick dasterdly]

5 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Where there any left wing members of the Leave campaign?

No.  But there were many 'left wing' voters.

[Loiner]

"So again what makes leavers right wing."
 
Precisely.  I am very left wing!  Which is why I 'switch off'  when posters incorrectly label the people with whom they disagree - or simply don't like....

I’m unashamedly right wing and much more so than just Leaving the EU.
We have cross-wing agreement in two respects here, and probably many more:
1) Incorrect labelling as ‘right wing’ of anyone who disagrees with posters like Wilcopops
2) Leaving the EU is the ‘right’ and proper thing to do, especially after the referendum.

[Laughing Gravy]

25 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Where there any left wing members of the Leave campaign?

Interesting read for you. Hopefully

 

https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2017/05/inside-story-labour-leave-left-wing-eurosceptics-who-toppled-tory-prime-minister

[wilcopops]

Your just ticking all the rightwing boxes every time you post .......

[malagateddy]

As I said it will be interesting to see what these people will do to after their unconstitutional and undemocratic 3 year rampage is finally put to rest.
Democracy will win and those who have sought to pervert it will not be happy.....

Yip..hopefully democracy wins..ie. LEAVERS are rejoicing LEAVING A CORRUPT FASCIST NEST OF VIPERS OVER IN brussels.
We BRITISH people are no strangers to veiled threats or would be intimidation..and you know what..WE ALWAYS WON THE " BATTLE "


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[malagateddy]

Where there any left wing members of the Leave campaign?

Think..momentum..labour party hard left

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[beautifulthailand99]

4 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

At least not all journalists are not all scared to say it as it is. A must read for all remainers IMHO

 

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/comment/no-deal-is-the-real-deal-a-passport-to-freedom-j0hjk936d

 

No-deal is the real deal, a passport to freedom

Melanie Phillips

Soft Brexit is a delusion as we can’t be an independent nation if the EU has any control over us.

Despite Theresa May’s attempt in her weekend video to present a more human face, most have probably given up trying to explain her extraordinary inability to process information contradicting her chosen position.

Her behaviour, however, is not the only puzzle in this Brexit crisis. It seems to be an article of faith among most MPs that Britain cannot leave the EU with no deal. This is presented as an unthinkable disaster which cannot be allowed to happen.

 

The question is why. For it has become clear that the apocalyptic no-deal scenarios have been much exaggerated. The French government has launched a “smart” customs border at Calais to enable goods to keep flowing. Legislative measures have been taken to ease traffic at British ports.

A civil servant at the heart of no-deal preparations, writing anonymously, has described multiple contingency measures and bilateral arrangements to protect financial services, essential trade, transport and so on, and concludes: “There is nothing whatsoever to fear from leaving the EU without an agreement and reverting to WTO rules.”

 

The leaked end-of-the-world warning by the cabinet secretary, Sir Mark Sedwill, that leaving with no deal would create recession (as well as cripple national security and the judicial system and lead to direct rule in Northern Ireland) was described by the former Brexit secretary David Davis as ridiculous.

 

Following the Brexit vote, after all, it was predicted that jobs would be lost and the economy would go into free fall. Yet the economy is holding up and the unemployment rate is the lowest for 44 years.

For sure, some companies have said they will be leaving Britain; but several of these, such as Nissan or Dyson, insist this decision has little or nothing to do with Brexit.

 

Lord King of Lothbury, the former Bank of England governor who wants to leave with no deal after a six-month delay to avoid a “short-run dislocation cost”, says the predictions of economic ill effects from no deal have been a “scare story” and it’s not obvious that any jobs would be lost overall.

 

Even the present governor, Mark Carney, who appears to blow one way then the other over Brexit, has said the country’s borders and banks are increasingly well prepared for no deal, softening the blow to growth and avoiding the worst of any potential chaos.

The reasonable conclusion should surely be that, while problems are inevitable, the country can weather leaving without a deal and that whatever the short-term difficulties, these are outweighed by the greater good. So why is it instead unthinkable?

The answer is surely that no-deal is the real deal. It’s the only way in which the UK really will free itself from the EU — the outcome that Remainer MPs believe reverses the laws of nature and must be stopped.

 

These MPs claim their alternative proposals are compromises for a “sensible” Brexit. Mrs May seems sincerely to believe likewise that Brexit would be delivered by her deal. These are all feints and delusions. For the UK cannot be independent of the EU while remaining to any extent under its control, as entailed by all these scenarios.

Now it seems likely that Brexit will be kicked into the long grass of a protracted delay. Among the public, the fury at this whole debacle is hard to exaggerate. There’s also a deep feeling of grief that something of infinite value is about to be lost.

For people didn’t vote for Brexit through racism or imbecility or a fantasy of returning to some mythical past. It was simply their wish to govern themselves solely through laws and policies passed by their own democratically elected parliament.

This yearning is embedded in Britain’s identity as an island nation for whose independence its people have fought and died over centuries. A nation that gave the world parliamentary democracy and political liberty precisely because being an independent and free people was written into its history over a thousand years.

In the 17th century, parliament pitted itself against the monarchy to liberate the people from political serfdom under an autocratic crown. To the anguish of many, parliament is now tearing up its own rules and constitutional conventions to repudiate the core concept of democracy: that sovereignty ultimately lies with the people.

Aware of the fury, some Remainers protest that they are just as patriotic as any Brexiteer. Well, people love different ideas of what their country is. But, by definition, Remainers don’t love it as an independent nation.

 

What many seem to love instead is a country they assumed had repudiated the very idea of an independent nation. This viewpoint, associated with profound cultural demoralisation, has broadly been the orthodoxy of our political and intellectual classes for more than half a century.

 

The referendum was the first time that the people were able to reject that orthodoxy. A flame was lit that day, and some of us dared hope that there was at least a chance that Britain would restore its sense of purpose as a beacon of freedom and independence.

 

As MPs prepare their final onslaught against the law under which the UK is due to leave the EU this Friday — a law they themselves passed — we are watching that flame gutter and die. And for many of us, that is just unbearable.

 

Oh yes ex-commie Mad Mel - a tawdry beacon of demented light in the Brexit darkness..probably shilling for elite forces profiting from financial gaming the demise of the UK. 

 

https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Melanie_Phillips

[beautifulthailand99]

36 minutes ago, malagateddy said:

Yip..hopefully democracy wins..ie. LEAVERS are rejoicing LEAVING A CORRUPT FASCIST NEST OF VIPERS OVER IN brussels.
We BRITISH people are no strangers to veiled threats or would be intimidation..and you know what..WE ALWAYS WON THE " BATTLE "


Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

Aye ye may have won the "BATTLE" (referendum) but you are most decisively losing the WAR - with mass desertions on your side. Surrender and we will spare your position. Meanwhile some light reading whilst you lick your wounds.

 

[Laughing Gravy]

13 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

Oh yes ex-commie Mad Mel - a tawdry beacon of demented light in the Brexit darkness..probably shilling for elite forces profiting from financial gaming the demise of the UK. 

 

https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Melanie_Phillips

Glad you liked the straight talking, says it as it journalist.

 

Your link is hilarious. Quality writing not.  Ex Communist right winger. Now that is a new one. I guess we can say that the link is absolutely worthless and factually incorrect on so many levels.

[aright]

7 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Please explain the already damaged 'democratic path'. 

 

6 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Again what makes leaving the EU right wing.

 

4 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

So again what makes leavers right wing.

 

 

4 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

So for the 3rd time what is right wing about wanting to leave the EU and be unshackled from the protectionist EU.

 

 

4 hours ago, dick dasterdly said:

"So again what makes leavers right wing."

 

It seems some posters love to denigrate peoples beliefs with blind statements and questions but when asked to explain themselves they loose their tongue and as a result their veracity.

Lets not forget the Remainers and their claims regarding the future of British politics want us to be part of a Union which has significant extreme parties, which play  significant parts in member states governance. The AfD in Germany, National Front in France, Party for Freedom in Netherlands, Freedom Party Austria. etc. The UK doesn't have a significant extreme political party.

On the one hand they feign worry about the future of British politics while ignoring the accelerating influence of  extremist parties in the EU. Watch this space after the May elections.

Edited April 9, 2019 by aright

[tebee]

8 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Glad you liked the straight talking, says it as it journalist.

 

Your link is hilarious. Quality writing not.  Ex Communist right winger. Now that is a new one. I guess we can say that the link is absolutely worthless and factually incorrect on so many levels.

Right wing Communist? 

[damascase]

56 minutes ago, malagateddy said:

Yip..hopefully democracy wins..ie. LEAVERS are rejoicing LEAVING A CORRUPT FASCIST NEST OF VIPERS OVER IN brussels.
We BRITISH people are no strangers to veiled threats or would be intimidation..and you know what..WE ALWAYS WON THE " BATTLE "


Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

You are going downhill faster and faster............ Ever tried different medication?

[beautifulthailand99]

10 minutes ago, tebee said:

Right wing Communist? 

ex-communist right winger  - they are always the worst. Once an extremist always an extremist sort of thing. 

[Laughing Gravy]

5 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

ex-communist right winger  - they are always the worst. Once an extremist always an extremist sort of thing. 

Glad you have shown how much attention you have paid to the obviously shambolic link. The first paragraph just shows the lack of quality and reliability it is. But that's up your street. 

 

She writes for the Times so another infactual piece of rubbish from this despot author who wrote it. The saddest thing is the poster who has used it as some form of justification.

 

 

[Loiner]

Your just ticking all the rightwing boxes every time you post .......

Yes, because right wing is right. Left is not. You have your left and right arse about face.

[evadgib]

9 minutes ago, Loiner said:

Yes, because right wing is right. Left is not. You have your left and right arse about face.

HTH (???? )

[beautifulthailand99]

52 minutes ago, aright said:

 

 

 

 

It seems some posters love to denigrate peoples beliefs with blind statements and questions but when asked to explain themselves they loose their tongue and as a result their veracity.

Lets not forget the Remainers and their claims regarding the future of British politics want us to be part of a Union which has significant extreme parties, which play  significant parts in member states governance. The AfD in Germany, National Front in France, Party for Freedom in Netherlands, Freedom Party Austria. etc. The UK doesn't have a significant extreme political party.

On the one hand they feign worry about the future of British politics while ignoring the accelerating influence of  extremist parties in the EU. Watch this space after the May elections.

With the right split, Tory / UKIP / Brexit party Labour might just get a good crack of the whip and Jezza might just be PM. My better half wants that if we are going to have radical change let's have a go a post-1945 socialist reconstruction re NHS, affordable housing and the like. My greedy financial side fears that this would make a hard-Brexit look like a walk in the park by comparison.  Watch this space after the May elections.

[aright]

40 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

With the right split, Tory / UKIP / Brexit party Labour might just get a good crack of the whip and Jezza might just be PM. My better half wants that if we are going to have radical change let's have a go a post-1945 socialist reconstruction re NHS, affordable housing and the like. My greedy financial side fears that this would make a hard-Brexit look like a walk in the park by comparison.  Watch this space after the May elections.

Very laudable!. How do you think it should be financed?

[malagateddy]

Fancy a little wager??

Aye ye may have won the "BATTLE" (referendum) but you are most decisively losing the WAR - with mass desertions on your side. Surrender and we will spare your position. Meanwhile some light reading whilst you lick your wounds.
 

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[malagateddy]

The TRUTH is my medication..what's yours?

You are going downhill faster and faster............ Ever tried different medication?

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[tebee]

So brexit destroys the very thing it promised 

 

Brexit leading to the end of global Britain

 

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/opinion/2018/06/26/commentary/world-commentary/brexit-leading-end-global-britain/#.XKymRJgzaUl

 

 

Nowadays, Britain’s words and actions on the world stage are so at odds with its values that one must wonder what has happened to the country. Since the June 2016 Brexit referendum, British foreign policy seems to have all but collapsed — and even to have disowned its past and its governing ideas

 

 

Still, if ever there was a moment for Britain to sprinkle some of its characteristic calm and resolve over world affairs, that moment is now. And yet, the U.K. appears to have checked out. Since World War II, Britain’s close relationships with continental Europe and the U.S. have served as the two anchors of its foreign policy. But now, both lines have essentially been severed.

 

 

[observer90210]

Politics is not an easy game.

 

Even those with a great idea will have it challenged by opponents,  not because the idea is not worth, but because they (the rivals) did not think of it first. And it's the same mess in almost every  democracy. ........And the consequence is that nothing moves, nothing is done, things are delayed etc. etc. etc.

 

And in between, its the people, those who wake up, trudge to work,  sometimes surrounded by as*h%les, who suffer and pay the price.

 

That's why I hate democracy, but if it wasn't for democracy, I would surely get jailed for saying this. ????

 

Edited April 9, 2019 by observer90210

[Brigand]

There is an easy way out...hang Bercow as an example, get rid of May for spinelessness and being unfit for purpose plus arrest & prosecute Cameron for setting the whole thing in motion in the first place. As for the Liebour Party, also arrest top individuals for shallowness and lies plus not honouring commitments they made previously and being duplicitous about socialism and intent as you also want to leave as you will never be able to enact your socialist goals from within the EU ... ergo intentionally deceiving the public with fakeness. Secondly, as the cluster F is now in motion (due to talentless politicians that represent themselves and not their voters) just leave with no deal and call their bluff ... as the current begging is getting embarrassing and we will get a better deal. 

Edited April 9, 2019 by Brigand

[beautifulthailand99]

5 hours ago, malagateddy said:

Fancy a little wager??

 

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

 

A crisp 1000 baht note that we won't have left by the end of May 2019.  Could make it a double with Prayuth to be PM by the same date.

[beautifulthailand99]

2 hours ago, Brigand said:

There is an easy way out...hang Bercow as an example, get rid of May for spinelessness and being unfit for purpose plus arrest & prosecute Cameron for setting the whole thing in motion in the first place. As for the Liebour Party, also arrest top individuals for shallowness and lies plus not honouring commitments they made previously and being duplicitous about socialism and intent as you also want to leave as you will never be able to enact your socialist goals from within the EU ... ergo intentionally deceiving the public with fakeness. Secondly, as the cluster F is now in motion (due to talentless politicians that represent themselves and not their voters) just leave with no deal and call their bluff ... as the current begging is getting embarrassing and we will get a better deal. 

I like the cut of your jib - a Mussolini ending for pig-shagging Cameron who got us all into this mess and promptly peed off. 

[Opl]

3 hours ago, tebee said:

So brexit destroys the very thing it promised 

 

Brexit leading to the end of global Britain

 

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/opinion/2018/06/26/commentary/world-commentary/brexit-leading-end-global-britain/#.XKymRJgzaUl

 

 

Nowadays, Britain’s words and actions on the world stage are so at odds with its values that one must wonder what has happened to the country. Since the June 2016 Brexit referendum, British foreign policy seems to have all but collapsed — and even to have disowned its past and its governing ideas

 

 

Still, if ever there was a moment for Britain to sprinkle some of its characteristic calm and resolve over world affairs, that moment is now. And yet, the U.K. appears to have checked out. Since World War II, Britain’s close relationships with continental Europe and the U.S. have served as the two anchors of its foreign policy. But now, both lines have essentially been severed.

 

 

Thank you for sharing this link! Mark Malloch-Brown nails it clearly : " a Europe without Britain’s traditional leadership, judgment and diplomacy will be a lesser Europe. And Britain, by its own hand, risks being reduced to a footnote."

Edited April 9, 2019 by Opl

[sandyf]

23 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

So again what makes leavers right wing.

 

Undemocratic rampage you must be on the sauce. A democratic referendum and a democratic General Election in 2017. You must be smashed or thinking of another country.

People welcomed into the UK and lived there for over 30 years not allowed to vote.

A hypocritical referendum.

Thousands of UK citizens not allowed to vote due to shortcomings in government systems.

An incompetent referendum

A life changing decision based on one vote out of 10s of millions.

An ill-conceived referendum.

Proven illegal activity by the leave campaign.

A fraudulent referendum.

 

"Democratic" - probably the most inappropriate adjective that could be used.

[malagateddy]

Right..lets put down the exact wording re the bet.
Single bet only as thai politics should in all honestly be avoided by expats imo.
Once we have phrased the wording of the wager..perhaps the Moderator DARKSIDEDOG could pm you and I his thai bank details then both of us lodge 1,000 baht into his account. ?????
What do you say???

A crisp 1000 baht note that we won't have left by the end of May 2019.  Could make it a double with Prayuth to be PM by the same date.

Sent from my SM-G7102 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[sandyf]

9 hours ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

A crisp 1000 baht note that we won't have left by the end of May 2019.  

Odds are certainly in your favour.

Very unlikely the EU will go along with 30th June, and even if they did it's beyond the end of May.

Most likely outcome will be a take it or leave it offer of a long extension from the EU. It would be up to TM to go against parliament and crash out on Friday, again highly unlikely.