Is NY Bangkok Bank still processing ACH transfers?

[sfokevin]

I know they said they would cut off transfers not adhering to the IAT protocol on April 1st...

 

But some have said they have extended it for Social Security & Govt transfers...

 

Can regular (non  governmental) transfers be made?

[Pib]

"All" non-IAT transfers are still getting through "for now"....including bank ACH transfers. 

 

See below post which includes a response from Bangkok Bank New York.   And posts following confirming peoples' bank transfers are still getting thru (for now).

 

 

[cmarshall]

I did an ACH to BKK bank a few days ago and got a letter from the bank about how IAT is required, etc.  They did say that they will "try" to continue to process old format ACH transfers until June 30, but they want you to use SWIFT or their baht remittance system instead.

[DepDavid]

I did an ACH to BKK bank a few days ago and got a letter from the bank about how IAT is required, etc.  They did say that they will "try" to continue to process old format ACH transfers until June 30, but they want you to use SWIFT or their baht remittance system instead.

I got the same letter today. I have used swift wires to BKKNY the last couple months to test the system. Works fine and is actually 2 days quicker.


Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Pib]

Can someone post this letter....would love to see the exact wording.

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

5 hours ago, cmarshall said:

I did an ACH to BKK bank a few days ago and got a letter from the bank about how IAT is required, etc.  They did say that they will "try" to continue to process old format ACH transfers until June 30, but they want you to use SWIFT or their baht remittance system instead.

 

Regardless of what ends up happening with the eventual cutoff of domestic non-IAT ACH transfers going thru BKKB New York, the branch there has confirmed that they will continue to receive and forward Swift wire transfers that are sent to them for onward routing to Thailand by using the recipient info of your BKKB Thai account number (which includes both your TH branch info and actual account number together).

[Langsuan Man]

16 hours ago, Pib said:

Can someone post this letter....would love to see the exact wording.

 

I would like to see from which bank this letter is from ?

[Pib]

I also wonder what "...use their baht remittance system..." means. Yeap...hope some one will post the letter they got.

[smo]

2 hours ago, Langsuan Man said:

19 hours ago, Pib said:

Can someone post this letter....would love to see the exact wording.

 

I would like to see from which bank this letter is from ?

Here it is , and from BKK headquarters in Silom, I received it yesterday and stapled to the envelop is a yellow confirmation return ("advice of receipt") postcard to  be sent back to the sender via post.

[Pib]

Guess I need to query Bangkok Bank NY about their "baht remittance system"....just exactly what is it. But my gut is telling me it would be a lower exchange rate and/or require an account with their NY branch.

[smo]

15 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

Regardless of what ends up happening with the eventual cutoff of domestic non-IAT ACH transfers going thru BKKB New York, the branch there has confirmed that they will continue to receive and forward Swift wire transfers that are sent to them for onward routing to Thailand by using the recipient info of your BKKB Thai account number (which includes both your TH branch info and actual account number together).

According to that criteria I think that my transfers are SWIFT.. but to find out for sure that they are is there some way I can verify that via my online banking (transfer history, etc.) short of a phone call to ask the bank directly?

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

5 hours ago, smo said:

According to that criteria I think that my transfers are SWIFT.. but to find out for sure that they are is there some way I can verify that via my online banking (transfer history, etc.) short of a phone call to ask the bank directly?

 

With U.S. domestic ACH transfers, you're typically are linking your sending and recipient account in advance in online banking using your receiving account's 9-digit ABA/routing number and your account number. And that's often done thru confirming of trial deposits that your sending bank deposits into your recipient bank account. ACH transfers are generally free, and once the account-to-account link is established, you typically don't have to reenter all the recipient info every time to do an ACH transfer.

 

With U.S. domestic wire transfers (which can including sending a domestic wire to BKKB NY), you're using the same receiving entity routing number and account number for your recipient info. But there's typically no account linking/trial deposits process that occurs, so you're having to re-enter your recipient info each time you send a domestic wire. They're also not usually free, with sending U.S. banks charging anywhere from $15 to $25 or more per wire as a fee.

 

Also, especially among smaller U.S. banks, a lot of them may not even offer the ability to initiate a domestic wire transfer from their online banking modules. Instead, at many places, you have to call, go into the branch or fax or email instructions. But with ACH transfers, these days, most U.S. banks offer that capability as part of their online banking modules.

 

Of course, both your sending bank, and your receiving bank, should be able to tell you whether you're doing a wire transfer or an ACH transfer from the details of the transaction, if you don't know.

 

 

[LawrenceN]

When Bangkok Bank issued the letter last year, we phoned the woman (named in the letter) at the main office. She confirmed that my wife's and my transfers from our state pension are in the correct format and would continue uninterrupted. My monthly transfer from a private source was not in the correct format. It took a while to get this private source to pay attention, but finally last month they switched it to a wire transfer. No fees at the source, same BkkBk fees as the previous method. Both transfers came as expected early this month.

 

My only concern is that the new wire transfer doesn't show the FTT code that Immigration wants to see. Will it be trouble next January when I extend? Time will tell.

 

 

[Pib]

I got the letter today also....had to sign for it as it came registered.   

 

And by chance I got to talk to one of the Bangkok Bank reps today (I happened to be in the HQ Bangkok Bank building today) on this IAT goatrope and the rep said that Bangkok Bank NY did get an extension.   I pretty much got the impression today from that discussion that 30 Jun would be the last day non-IAT transfers would be allowed whether from a bank or govt agency....come 1 Jul all non-IAT payments will be rejected.  Since Bangkok Bank originally made the IAT announcement in Apr 2018 that means people will have had 15 months to make necessary changes to get their payments/transfers switched to IAT format, SWIFT, or other method. 

 

And the fact they are now sending out registered letters with one final notification pretty much tells me 30 Jun will be the last day for non-IAT transfers/payments.

 

Yeap...I think 30 Jun will be the last day....no more extensions...but that's just my impression.  

[Pib]

17 minutes ago, LawrenceN said:

My only concern is that the new wire transfer doesn't show the FTT code that Immigration wants to see. Will it be trouble next January when I extend? Time will tell.

A lot will depend on the routing/intermediary bank the sender uses.  If it first arrives an intermediary bank in Thailand who does the currency conversion and then forwards over to your account at Bangkok Bank then it may not show the FTT/International transfer since the very last leg of the transfer to Bangkok Bank was a domestic transfer.  

 

Recently I did a couple of transfers using the OFX transfer service (just another company like Transferwise).  OFX uses SWIFT to get the money to your Thai bank.  However, even through I sent the transfer to Bangkok Bank using their SWIFT code OFX used an intermediary SWIFT code belonging to the Bank of Thailand (BOT) BAHTNET system.   BAHTNET interfaces with the SWIFT system.  I expect OFX did the routing that way because that's the cheapest for them.

 

So, when the funds arrived BOT BAHTNET SWIFT code then BOT relayed the funds onto my Bangkok Bank SWIFT code but I did not receive the FTT/International Transfer code and description.  Instead it ended up being coded on my Bangkok Bank passbook/ibanking as BTN/BAHTNET.  However, in the SMS I got from Bangkok Bank when the funds posted it said "....funds from abroad..." and when getting a Credit Advice it showed the funds coming from abroad.  It's just I didn't the the passbook coding of FTT or an ibanking description of International Transfer.....it's still an international transfer just with different coding/description which would require a Credit Advice or listed on the Bangkok Bank immigration letter to prove.

 

Yeap...before most folks were not concerned with coding/description of their international transfer...as long as the money arrived they were happy.  But now if trying to use the "monthly international transfer rule for immigration extension of stay renewal purposes" then the transfer coding/description becomes very important and you are "not" happy when the coding/description does not clearly state international transfer.

 

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

3 hours ago, Pib said:

Yeap...I think 30 Jun will be the last day....no more extensions...but that's just my impression.  

 

Pib, I'm assuming you asked the BKKB staff about future cutoff date. What was their/her actual response to that question?

 

[Pib]

3 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Pib, I'm assuming you asked the BKKB staff about future cutoff date. What was their/her actual response to that question?

 

The rep I talked to said 30 Jun...just like stated in their letter.  What else could the rep say as that's the bank's published policy.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

On 4/23/2019 at 11:24 AM, smo said:

Here it is , and from BKK headquarters in Silom, I received it yesterday and stapled to the envelop is a yellow confirmation return ("advice of receipt") postcard to  be sent back to the sender via post.

 

 

1. I wonder who exactly they're sending the letter to.... I've done several ACHs thru the NY branch lately (all post-April 1 and successful), and haven't received any letter as yet.

 

2. It's kind of weird that they're sending out a letter now in mid to late April that still talks about an April 1 cutoff date for traditional ACHs that obviously has come and gone without being enforced by BKKB / BKKB NY....  I don't know why they didn't just say June 30 and leave it at that.

 

3. Anyone know any of the particulars about the "baht remittance" service they mention in the letter. I got a brief explanation of that from a BKKB NY staff person some time back, and it didn't sound very helpful/useful the way it was described to me. But, at that time, I'll admit I wasn't focused on that as an alternative...

 

PS - Thanks very much for posting a copy of the letter.

[smo]

On 4/23/2019 at 5:25 PM, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

With U.S. domestic ACH transfers, you're typically are linking your sending and recipient account in advance in online banking using your receiving account's 9-digit ABA/routing number and your account number. And that's often done thru confirming of trial deposits that your sending bank deposits into your recipient bank account. ACH transfers are generally free, and once the account-to-account link is established, you typically don't have to reenter all the recipient info every time to do an ACH transfer.

Thanks TallGJohn for the details which help me determine, yes mine is ACH transfer since it involved a couple of trial deposits to get the gears moving.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

3 minutes ago, smo said:

Thanks TallGJohn for the details which help me determine, yes mine is ACH transfer since it involved a couple of trial deposits to get the gears moving.

 

So then more than likely, that particular transfer method via your bank is going to die at whatever point BKKB starts enforcing the cutoff on traditional ACH transfers going thru the NY branch. Time to explore alternatives.

 

[Pib]

3 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

3. Anyone know any of the particulars about the "baht remittance" service they mention in the letter. I got a brief explanation of that from a BKKB NY staff person some time back, and it didn't sound very helpful/useful the way it was described to me. But, at that time, I'll admit I wasn't focused on that as an alternative...

 

The rep I talked to said I needed to talk to the NY branch about that.  So, I emailed the NY branch yesterday....didn't get a response yet.   Also re-transmitted my request to a couple additional NY branch email addresses this afternoon. 

 

I'm not hopeful this Thai baht remittance service will be something we would want to use if it follows similar guidelines for the London and Japan branches.   I also expect the Remittance Service is something they have had setup for a long time for "corporate" use....maybe good for transfers of BIG money but not so good for transfers of a mere few thousand per month.  But I'm guessing....will have to wait and see what the NY branch response is....it may turn out to be a good deal....one can hope.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Just now, Pib said:

The rep I talked to said I needed to talk to the NY branch about that.  So, I emailed the NY branch yesterday....didn't get a response yet.   Also re-transmitted my request to a couple additional NY branch email addresses this afternoon. 

 

I'm not hopeful this Thai baht remittance service will be something we would want to use if it follows similar guidelines for the London and Japan branches.   I also expect the Remittance Service is something they have had setup for a long time for "corporate" use....maybe good for transfers of BIG money but not so good for transfers of a mere few thousand per month.  But I'm guessing....will have to wait and see what the NY branch response is....it may turn out to be a good deal....one can hope.

 

I wish I could remember the particulars I heard on that during a phone call with a BKKB staff person some weeks back. I can't remember the details, unfortunately. But I do remember coming away from the conversation with it not SOUNDING like something I'd need/want to spend much time pursuing.

 

[Pib]

10 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

1. I wonder who exactly they're sending the letter to.... I've done several ACHs thru the NY branch lately (all post-April 1 and successful), and haven't received any letter as yet.

My last ACH transfer from a US bank was sometime late last year.  Now I've also done several Transferwise and OFX transfers over the last few month but they are "not" done via ACH. 

 

I do not have any of my US govt benefit payments going to Bangkok Bank although I do have a Direct Deposit account setup which I opened about a decade ago and used briefly for military retirement payments...but stopped that after a few months once I got some no foreign transaction fee debit cards.  But I have kept that account open and do put some money into it....send some transfers to it occasionally.   

 

Maybe only people with Direct Deposit accounts are getting the letter.   But the letter I got did not have any account number listed...I have multiple accounts at Bangkok Bank.

 

Hard telling what grand plan is being used to mail the letters out.   Maybe up to each branch?....my accounts at at the head branch in the HQ Bangkok Bank building....branch code 101.   

 

But I figure if they are mailing out registered letters of notification they are serious this time....30 June will be the last day to squeak a non-IAT transfer thru the system.

[Pib]

10 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

I wish I could remember the particulars I heard on that during a phone call with a BKKB staff person some weeks back. I can't remember the details, unfortunately. But I do remember coming away from the conversation with it not SOUNDING like something I'd need/want to spend much time pursuing.

 

I thought I remember someone recently talking some scheme where you could mail the NY branch a check with certain additional info included, once it cleared then the NY branch would do a baht transfer to your in-Thailand account.  Maybe it was in a post or in a PM.  Maybe that was the Thai baht remittance scheme Bangkok Bank is now mentioning.  But I can't remember where I read that....and too burnt-out over this whole non-IAT goatrope to try to find it again.  I'll just wait and see if the NY branch responds to my request for info.

[Shaunduhpostman]

I just received today the very same letter posted earlier in this thread. I read it 4 or 5 times trying to glean whether there was anything I wasn't understanding because what they seemed to calling new rules or a new procedure or format (whatever they mean by that)  did not seem in any way different from what my broker has been doing all along.

 

They say that the new format requires that the name of the recipient, his BBK account number and Bangkok Bank's New York Branch routing number be given. OK...so..., how else is the broker supposed  to get the money to me if they don't have that information? Seems very square one basics just to do the transfer. Makes me feel that there is something I am supposed understand that isn't stated directly. I hesitate to just leave it at, that we're already doing what they want. it doesn't make sense to me, seems they want me to take some action that I haven't taken already in the past. That they wouldn't come out and say specifically and clearly what they want from me would be par for the course in Thailand, so you are left wondering what are they really trying to tell me.

 

Do they mean that I have to ask my broker to submit a special form to the National Automated Clearing House Association with the info they have stated the NCHA needs?

Edited April 24, 2019 by Shaunduhpostman

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

3 hours ago, Pib said:

I thought I remember someone recently talking some scheme where you could mail the NY branch a check with certain additional info included, once it cleared then the NY branch would do a baht transfer to your in-Thailand account.  Maybe it was in a post or in a PM.  Maybe that was the Thai baht remittance scheme Bangkok Bank is now mentioning.  But I can't remember where I read that....and too burnt-out over this whole non-IAT goatrope to try to find it again.  I'll just wait and see if the NY branch responds to my request for info.

 

Dunno if the U.S. to Thai process is going to be anything like the Japan to Thai process with BKKB. But the Japan process, according to the BKKB website, has some interesting requirements for the sender, including showing a health insurance certificate and a driver's license in the country being sent from (which a lot of U.S. expats living in Thailand may well not have).  And then there's the starting sending fee of about $31 per transfer.

 

https://www.bangkokbank.com/en/Personal/Other-Services/Transfers/Transferring-Into-Thailand/Transfer-money-from-Japan-to-Thailand-via-Bangkok-bank-branches

 

There's also a part about each time having to enter the sender's BKKB super secret special customer code number as part of the sending process, which AFAIK, is going to be a non-starter with any kind of U.S. ACH transfers, since they typically don't have any ability to add on misc. sender or recipient info...

 

Quote

When transferring funds via internet banking or an ATM, the sender must specify the TK/OS and KYC numbers followed by their full name in the “sender” or “remitter” fields.
...
If the sender is unable to fill in all the required details in internet banking or at the ATM, please contact Bangkok Bank’s Tokyo or Osaka branch and send the registration number by fax to the branch.

 

It basically looks a lot like a kind of pre-set/pre-configured wire transfer where you have to set up the sender and the recipient IDs and accounts info in advance, and then use their secret codes to initiate each subsequent use.

 

 

 

 

Let's see what BKKB NY says, and how similar or not their process is going to be for U.S. to Thai senders.

 

Edited April 24, 2019 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

2 hours ago, Shaunduhpostman said:

I just received today the very same letter posted earlier in this thread. I read it 4 or 5 times trying to glean whether there was anything I wasn't understanding because what they seemed to calling new rules or a new procedure or format (whatever they mean by that)  did not seem in any way different from what my broker has been doing all along.

 

They say that the new format requires that the name of the recipient, his BBK account number and Bangkok Bank's New York Branch routing number be given. OK...so..., how else is the broker supposed  to get the money to me if they don't have that information? Seems very square one basics just to do the transfer. Makes me feel that there is something I am supposed understand that isn't stated directly. I hesitate to just leave it at, that we're already doing what they want. it doesn't make sense to me, seems they want me to take some action that I haven't taken already in the past. That they wouldn't come out and say specifically and clearly what they want from me would be par for the course in Thailand, so you are left wondering what are they really trying to tell me.

 

Do they mean that I have to ask my broker to submit a special form to the National Automated Clearing House Association with the info they have stated the NCHA needs?

 

No....

 

It depends on whether what you're doing now is an ACH transfer or a wire transfer. ACH transfer is likely going to die. Wire transfer should continue just fine, in terms of going thru BKKB NY onward to Thailand.

 

The main additional info that the NACHA process wants, beyond the normal account info on both ends, is the recipient name and residence/mailing address in Thailand.

 

Right now, there's no way to add that for most domestic ACH transfers being sent from U.S. banking entities. But, that kind of info usually is part of the existing info required for wire transfers.

 

That's why domestic ACH transfers thru BKKB NY to Thailand basically are going to die...  But wire transfers from the U.S. to BKKB NY and onward to Thailand are going to continue without any changes at all.

 

[Searat7]

Last week I sent money from USA bank to my FX account at BB via SWIFT and it arrived within hours. My bank mailed me a proof of payment showing me as sender and receiver with both USA and Thailand addresses. Best of all my bank does not charge me a wire transfer fee.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

23 minutes ago, Searat7 said:

Best of all my bank does not charge me a wire transfer fee.

 

What bank would that be?  And are there any special balance or other requirements to obtain that perk?

 

Most U.S. banks and CUs do not offer even domestic wire transfers for free, and free international wires are even more rare.

 

Interesting, Transferwise did a web article about a year ago that involved a pretty good survey of U.S. bank international wire transfer fees. Not a free option among them, with the one exception being certain types of high-value Citibank accounts.

 

https://transferwise.com/us/blog/best-bank-international-wire-transfer

 

Edited April 24, 2019 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Shaunduhpostman]

52 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

That's why domestic ACH transfers thru BKKB NY to Thailand basically are going to die...  But wire transfers from the U.S. to BKKB NY and onward to Thailand are going to continue without any changes at all.

Thanks for input T.G. John, helps a bit. I did call one of the brokerage houses a few hours ago and ask. They were as clueless as I was. They were like, "There's no reason what we've been doing before wouldn't work. No idea why they would send you a letter. Don't worry about it. But you will have to try it as the ultimate test, no guarentee what worked before will work anymore, but it should."

 

I don't know if they are ACH transfers or not from my broker to BKKB New York. Though seems I recall being uncomfortable that an operator I was talking to about doing  a transfer was calling what i wanted to do a wire transfer. The reason being that half the time the brokerage won't send me money I've requested because they say they won't do an international wire transfer. Seems i recall they said, "No, even just sending the money from the brokerage house to BKKB New York is a wire transfer, it doesn't have to be international to be called that." They have been happy with the loophole of sending money to BKKB New York, mostly, but seems like it is a grey zone to them whether that constitutes an international wire or not and some staff refuse to do it.