Issan biking

[carlf]

Hello friends in Thailand.  I'm looking for hints and suggestions for biking.  I'll be with 2 other friends, and we're all experienced road bikers, and we usually cover 60-120 kms/day on our road bikes, although with the heat in May, I think we might be closer to 60.  I'm thinking about biking for about 4 days or so from Ayutthaya to Khorat to Phimai.  I'm not at all familiar with this area.  I see route #2 covers most of this route, from Saraburi to Phimai, but I'm afraid that #2 might not be a very good road for biking.  Does anyone have any experience with this route?  Any reasonable alternatives?  We don't mind some extra kilometers if we can have prettier roads as long as they are in reasonable condition for road biking, and we need to pass through a few towns that would have accommodations (even simple, primitive) for 3 tired bikers.  Thanks for any thoughts or suggestions.

[DJ54]

Maybe look at these type of websits

[carlf]

1 hour ago, DJ54 said:

Maybe look at these type of websits..

DJ54, thanks very much for this comment.  The little bit that I see there does indeed look very interesting.  Can you tell me the URL and/or name of that website?  Thanks.

[Gecko123]

General comments:

While bicycling around Thailand in areas where you know the roads and traffic patterns can be fun and reasonably safe, in my opinion long distance touring in Thailand is simply too dangerous, even in a group. I think your asking about Hwy 2 reveals extreme naivete about road conditions in Thailand. When you think Hwy 2, think Indy 500 and cars going 100 km/hr using the road shoulder as an extra lane. I have never ever seen a bicycle on Hwy 2. Also, you should know that Isaan has some of the highest driving under the influence rates in Thailand. Every Songkran when provincial tabs on alcohol related accidents are publicized, Isaan is at the top or close to the top of the list. Thai drivers, while many are reasonably considerate, many are flat out inconsiderate -borderline reckless - when it comes to bicycles which oftentimes makes the cycling experience harrowing, stressful, and sometimes deadly.

 

Time of year:

The sugar cane harvest is over which removes all of the huge tractor trailer trucks off the road. These trucks, while very intimidating because of their size, actually in some ways are a bicyclist's friend because they tend to slow traffic down. However, starting in May as the rainy season begins, all manner of farming activity is starting to pick up so rural roads, aside from harvest time, are at their most busiest. Roads truly out in the countryside can be very peaceful and make for enjoyable riding, but the problem is on a long distance tour you will inevitably go through towns with much more congestion, and these areas are typically not very bicycle friendly. Dogs in rural areas can also be a problem.

 

Another thing to keep in mind is that there has been a protracted heat wave. This may have abated in the last few days, but recent overnight temperatures have rarely dipped below 80 degrees F, and that's only for one or two hours. By 10 or 11 it's already 90 degrees and climbing, not my idea of ideal bicycling weather. Rain showers and storms usually come in the late afternoons, which too can potentially narrow the number of hours available for riding. Double up on lights and reflective gear as Thailand does not enforce it's corrective lense / visual acuity standards, and I can tell you for a fact that many drivers with poor eyesight are out on the roads, and if you study accident accounts, poor eyesight is often a contributing cause of the accident. I'm not trying to scare you, but don't let anyone tell you the risks are inconsequential.

My advice would be to scope out a remote area which has a network of roads in every direction which you could take 30-50 km morning day trips (when the weather is coolest) and return to your home base in the afternoons.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Edited May 10, 2019 by Gecko123

[carlf]

Gecko123,

Thanks so much for all this info and suggestions. 

 

"... I think your asking about Hwy 2 reveals extreme naivete about road conditions in Thailand.."  Well you're right... if I was an expert about those road conditions, I probably wouldn't be posting the questions, right?  I have been biking quite a bit around Bangkok since I arrived 9 months ago, so I have some idea of biking at least in Bangkok, but I haven't had many opportunities outside of Bangkok, and I've never been in the Issan area at all, so I am truly grateful for this "evaluation" of the quality of Route #2.  Clearly I'll want to avoid it.  I do go out regularly these days for 60-90 km/day rides, and the thermometer is hitting 39C, so I know that it's cookin', and I try to get out by 06:00 and get most of my riding in before 10:00 to mitigate (and the road around Bangkok are calmer before 08:00, too).  If you do have any suggestions for (calmer, safer) roads that would sort of parallel Route #2 to go from Ayatthuya to Phimai, I'd certainly be grateful.

[Gecko123]

Sorry if I came on too strong. Definitely did not intend comment as a put down, just trying to voice my concern. Good luck and happy trails.

[soistalker]

There is a very good chance that you will be hit by a car, truck, van, or motorbike and hurt, maimed or killed. I think you have a 60% chance of not getting injured or killed on thai roads. 

Google foreign bicyclists killed in Thailand for dozens of deaths.

[LawrenceN]

I did a really nice ride three years ago in January. Started in NongKhai and followed the Mekhong west. Our destination was meant to be Chiang Rai, but the weather turned nasty: less than 10C and steady rain. Someone got sick and we called it quits in Phayao. But that won't happen this time of year.

 

The roads were fine, with a clearly marked shoulder most of the time. Rolling and scenic. There are lots of guesthouses along the way with rates around 600 baht/night. Traffic really wasn't a problem.

 

I agree you want to stay the hell off the big fast roads. The suggestion to use a website to plan your route is a good one. Take a compass; this time of year, you can't tell direction using the sun mid-day because it's straight up.

 

I live in Chiang Mai and ride quiet rural roads year round. You'll be fine and have the time of your life.

[Ireland32]

You do know many professional bikers have died here, Crazy

[Paul52]

On 5/10/2019 at 4:02 PM, carlf said:

DJ54, thanks very much for this comment.  The little bit that I see there does indeed look very interesting.  Can you tell me the URL and/or name of that website?  Thanks.

The website is routeyou.com

[Grusa]

2 hours ago, soistalker said:

There is a very good chance that you will be hit by a car, truck, van, or motorbike and hurt, maimed or killed. I think you have a 60% chance of not getting injured or killed on thai roads. 

Google foreign bicyclists killed in Thailand for dozens of deaths.

Op, you need to wear this:-

but if you cant afford it, try this:-

[theboogeyman]

I have a few suggestions for you.  Be careful, watch traffic, have cat like reflexes out there on your bike, and don’t die because it’s dangerous.  I used to go running around here when I was still in peak physical condition and still had those cat like reflexes but definitely not anymore I’m physically disabled now.  Just be careful and don’t die.  We had a professional round the world biker who was killed not that long ago in traffic right here in Korat.  Personally I would not recommend this unless you stick to the country roads only and avoid the traffic in the cities because people are killed all over this country every day on the road.  Be careful out there I don’t want to be reading a bad story about you later.  Stay safe and maintain situational awareness.  

[cycolista]

If you have a smartphone download Pocket Earth or the Maps.me apps.  They do a great job of picking cycling routes and the maps are downloadable so you don't need the internet.

 

Also, ignore the naysayers.  I've been cycling around Thailand and other SE Asian countries for years now and have never had a problem.

[55Jay]

Hope you find a good route through the interior up to Korat.  Nice country along with way, Pak Chong, Sikhio.  It's a terribly long slog uphill, but check out the man-made reservoir and wind farm on top of a mountain in Sikhio.  Commanding views back over the highway, valley and Lam Tahkong reservoir.  Fun to ride around and take some photos.  Good luck.  ????

[NoshowJones]

4 hours ago, soistalker said:

There is a very good chance that you will be hit by a car, truck, van, or motorbike and hurt, maimed or killed. I think you have a 60% chance of not getting injured or killed on thai roads. 

Google foreign bicyclists killed in Thailand for dozens of deaths.

I think you are going a bit too far there, I say that if you are an experienced biker, never go above the speed limit, use genuine common sense at all times, always be aware of what is going on around you.

 

If you can honestly say all that about yourself, then you have a 99% chance of avoiding a serious accident.

 

Your last sentence, what do you expect when you rent a bike, have little or no riding experience, and just jump on and start riding? In amongst Thai motorcyclists, in which the biggest majority of them are morons with very little or no common sense.

[theboogeyman]

If you have a smartphone download Pocket Earth or the Maps.me apps.  They do a great job of picking cycling routes and the maps are downloadable so you don't need the internet.
 
Also, ignore the naysayers.  I've been cycling around Thailand and other SE Asian countries for years now and have never had a problem.

It’s always a risk no matter what but if you’re in really good shape and have very sharp reflexes you’ll probably be okay as long as you’re careful. I know because I used to be an extremely fast long distance runner and I used to run all over the place. I used to trail run through the woods, and in the big cities such as Washington, D.C., Baltimore, Tokyo, Japan, here in Thailand as well, Seoul, Korea which is also dangerous, and many other places. When I used to run through the cities I didn’t stop for nothing not even traffic I’d do 20K in about an hour I was in top physical shape back then almost at professional athlete level. I’ve almost been ran over many times but back then I had those really sharp cat like reflexes and I could easily run between cars across busy streets and just crazy stuff out there and I’ve never been hit by a vehicle in over 20 years of running that way.

Running through Tokyo was safer because the traffic moves slower there and the drivers in Japan are safer. Around here in Thailand and in Seoul, Korea sometimes it’s like they’re trying to run you over. I loved running through Tokyo when we lived there. And in Seoul, Korea there’s a really long and very good running trail that goes along the Han River nearby the JW Marriott in Seoul. But Thailand was probably the most dangerous for running. If you are confident and in good shape and have very sharp reflexes then do it if you want, but be extremely careful because people have been killed here doing exactly what you are planning on doing. Just be aware of the conditions and the risks. Don’t die out there be extremely careful!


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[Gecko123]

To be honest, I thought the OP was talking about bicycling (as in pedaling a bicycle) not road touring on a motorcycle. Personally, I wouldn't be caught dead on motorcycle here, for the simple reason that the level of driving proficiency here is so low and you are so vulnerable and unprotected on a bike. Plenty of videos of Thailand motorcycle accidents available on U-tube. I'm not going to screen a bunch of them to find the goriest one just to make my point. OP can make up his own mind about whether he wants to take the risk.

 

 

[theboogeyman]

To be honest, I thought the OP was talking about bicycling (as in pedaling a bicycle) not road touring on a motorcycle. Personally, I wouldn't be caught dead on motorcycle here, for the simple reason that the level of driving proficiency here is so low and you are so vulnerable and unprotected on a bike. Plenty of videos of Thailand motorcycle accidents available on U-tube. I'm not going to screen a bunch of them to find the goriest one just to make my point. OP can make up his own mind about whether he wants to take the risk.

 

 

 

 

Oh wait so did I wow. I guess I should have read his entire post I also thought that he meant bicycling through Issan. So he’s talking about a motorcycle tour okay that’s not quite as dangerous but still not the safest thing to do in the world. One of my Nieces was tragically killed here in Korat in a motorbike accident and she was the passenger riding on the back. Very very sad she was very very young with two kids unfortunately. I didn’t know that he meant a motorcycle tour either until I read your reply. As long as he knows what he’s doing but just stay safe out there, and have medical insurance!

 

 

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[emptypockets]

2 hours ago, possum1931 said:

I think you are going a bit too far there, I say that if you are an experienced biker, never go above the speed limit, use genuine common sense at all times, always be aware of what is going on around you.

 

If you can honestly say all that about yourself, then you have a 99% chance of avoiding a serious accident.

 

Your last sentence, what do you expect when you rent a bike, have little or no riding experience, and just jump on and start riding? In amongst Thai motorcyclists, in which the biggest majority of them are morons with very little or no common sense.

Do you think he is riding a motorbike or a push bike?

[carlf]

2 hours ago, Gecko123 said:

To be honest, I thought the OP was talking about bicycling (as in pedaling a bicycle) not road touring on a motorcycle. Personally, I wouldn't be caught dead on motorcycle here, for the simple reason that the level of driving proficiency here is so low and you are so vulnerable and unprotected on a bike. Plenty of videos of Thailand motorcycle accidents available on U-tube. I'm not going to screen a bunch of them to find the goriest one just to make my point. OP can make up his own mind about whether he wants to take the risk.

 

 

Sorry, I don't recognize the term "OP".  I guess that you're referring to me (!?) as the one who was looking for advice?  Anyway...  assuming that I am indeed the "OP", then Yes, I am talking about bicycling, using a "road bike" (sometimes referred to as a "racing bike" or I think Brits say "Push bike"?).   I am NOT talking or thinking about motorcycles.

[emptypockets]

2 hours ago, Gecko123 said:

To be honest, I thought the OP was talking about bicycling (as in pedaling a bicycle) not road touring on a motorcycle. Personally, I wouldn't be caught dead on motorcycle here, for the simple reason that the level of driving proficiency here is so low and you are so vulnerable and unprotected on a bike. Plenty of videos of Thailand motorcycle accidents available on U-tube. I'm not going to screen a bunch of them to find the goriest one just to make my point. OP can make up his own mind about whether he wants to take the risk.

 

 

So did I. 60 k a day is hardly pushing it on a motorbike of any description. Embarrassing actually. Something not quite right here.

[emptypockets]

1 minute ago, carlf said:

Sorry, I don't recognize the term "OP".  I guess that you're referring to me (!?) as the one who was looking for advice?  Anyway...  assuming that I am indeed the "OP", then Yes, I am talking about bicycling, using a "road bike" (sometimes referred to as a "racing bike" or I think Brits say "Push bike"?).   I am NOT talking or thinking about motorcycles.

 

1 minute ago, carlf said:

Sorry, I don't recognize the term "OP".  I guess that you're referring to me (!?) as the one who was looking for advice?  Anyway...  assuming that I am indeed the "OP", then Yes, I am talking about bicycling, using a "road bike" (sometimes referred to as a "racing bike" or I think Brits say "Push bike"?).   I am NOT talking or thinking about motorcycles.

Thanks for clearing that up. Good for you planning on 60 k a day.

 I'm reavaling mov

ing the fridge closer to my favourite chair. 60 steps these days is unreasonable.

[theboogeyman]

Sorry, I don't recognize the term "OP".  I guess that you're referring to me (!?) as the one who was looking for advice?  Anyway...  assuming that I am indeed the "OP", then Yes, I am talking about bicycling, using a "road bike" (sometimes referred to as a "racing bike" or I think Brits say "Push bike"?).   I am NOT talking or thinking about motorcycles.

I hope you’re familiar with Thailand at least be careful out there. People have been killed doing what you’re planning on doing. Select your routes very carefully as well.


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[moe666]

I know Thai people who bicycle all over Thailand none have been killed yet. A person can be killed in their home country on a bicycle just as one can be killed here in Thailand, no gurantees anywhere. Get ahold of a regular road map of Thailand or find one for Issaan. I find them more handy planning a trip as you get a bigger over view of the area. Then use your GPS during the trip. I do perfer regular road maps as this gives me a reason to take a break

Edited May 11, 2019 by moe666

[Pdavies99]

On 5/10/2019 at 10:50 AM, Gecko123 said:

General comments:

While bicycling around Thailand in areas where you know the roads and traffic patterns can be fun and reasonably safe, in my opinion long distance touring in Thailand is simply too dangerous, even in a group. I think your asking about Hwy 2 reveals extreme naivete about road conditions in Thailand. When you think Hwy 2, think Indy 500 and cars going 100 km/hr using the road shoulder as an extra lane. I have never ever seen a bicycle on Hwy 2. Also, you should know that Isaan has some of the highest driving under the influence rates in Thailand. Every Songkran when provincial tabs on alcohol related accidents are publicized, Isaan is at the top or close to the top of the list. Thai drivers, while many are reasonably considerate, many are flat out inconsiderate -borderline reckless - when it comes to bicycles which oftentimes makes the cycling experience harrowing, stressful, and sometimes deadly.

 

Time of year:

The sugar cane harvest is over which removes all of the huge tractor trailer trucks off the road. These trucks, while very intimidating because of their size, actually in some ways are a bicyclist's friend because they tend to slow traffic down. However, starting in May as the rainy season begins, all manner of farming activity is starting to pick up so rural roads, aside from harvest time, are at their most busiest. Roads truly out in the countryside can be very peaceful and make for enjoyable riding, but the problem is on a long distance tour you will inevitably go through towns with much more congestion, and these areas are typically not very bicycle friendly. Dogs in rural areas can also be a problem.

 

Another thing to keep in mind is that there has been a protracted heat wave. This may have abated in the last few days, but recent overnight temperatures have rarely dipped below 80 degrees F, and that's only for one or two hours. By 10 or 11 it's already 90 degrees and climbing, not my idea of ideal bicycling weather. Rain showers and storms usually come in the late afternoons, which too can potentially narrow the number of hours available for riding. Double up on lights and reflective gear as Thailand does not enforce it's corrective lense / visual acuity standards, and I can tell you for a fact that many drivers with poor eyesight are out on the roads, and if you study accident accounts, poor eyesight is often a contributing cause of the accident. I'm not trying to scare you, but don't let anyone tell you the risks are inconsequential.

My advice would be to scope out a remote area which has a network of roads in every direction which you could take 30-50 km morning day trips (when the weather is coolest) and return to your home base in the afternoons.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Very good advice...I ride a mountain bike every day and I'm sure it is far too dangerous on Thailand roads in general...on country roads truck drivers etc really do not pay attention and an accident is highly likely.

[LawrenceN]

15 hours ago, Pdavies99 said:

Very good advice...I ride a mountain bike every day and I'm sure it is far too dangerous on Thailand roads in general...on country roads truck drivers etc really do not pay attention and an accident is highly likely.

I disagree. I rode more than 5000 km on country roads in Chiang Mai last year. Are you speaking from experience or your reading of the scary news stories? People die using motor vehicles, too. In my roughly 30,000 km experience on road bikes in rural CM, drivers are careful and courteous. The smaller the road the better.

 

To the OP (original poster): You say you're riding road bikes. How are you planning to haul your gear? You can't fit racks and panniers, and a backpack is gonna get heavy fast. Are you just gonna put a toothbrush and a tube of Colgate in your back pocket? I'm not trying to throw up a roadblock; hoping I might learn from you.

[theboogeyman]

Very good advice...I ride a mountain bike every day and I'm sure it is far too dangerous on Thailand roads in general...on country roads truck drivers etc really do not pay attention and an accident is highly likely.

Always ride against traffic so you can see what’s coming at you. That’s what I almost always did when I used to run and it made it a lot easier to avoid getting ran over. If I had always ran the same direction as traffic back when I could run I’d probably be dead today and smashed by a truck.


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[geoffbezoz]

7 minutes ago, theboogeyman said:

 

 

Always ride against traffic so you can see what’s coming at you. That’s what I almost always did when I used to run and it made it a lot easier to avoid getting ran over. If I had always ran the same direction as traffic back when I could run I’d probably be dead today and smashed by a truck.


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So your advice of riding against the traffic flow is clearly the exact same principles employed by most Thai motor cyclists.  So lets be done with all the thread comments about stupid Thai motorcyclists riding the wrong way against the traffic flow, and instead let us all praise them for using their intelligence knowing full well that as you state "Always ride against traffic so you can see what’s coming at you".    Amassing Thailand to be sure.

 

However , certainly in Udon Thani, khon Kaen and Nong Khai areas all of the cyclists I see on the main highways must plainly be stupid in your eyes as they are always cycling on the near side of the road in the direction of the traffic flow, as is accepted practice.

Edited May 12, 2019 by geoffbezoz

[samsensam]

11 minutes ago, theboogeyman said:

 

 

Always ride against traffic so you can see what’s coming at you. That’s what I almost always did when I used to run and it made it a lot easier to avoid getting ran over. If I had always ran the same direction as traffic back when I could run I’d probably be dead today and smashed by a truck.


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so cyclists around the world are doing it all wrong and in thailand the cyclists and motorcyclists riding on the wrong side of the road were right all along! who'd have thunk it!

[geoffbezoz]

1 minute ago, samsensam said:

 

so cyclists around the world are doing it all wrong and in thailand the cyclists and motorcyclists riding on the wrong side of the road were right all along! who'd have thunk it!

Yep you just have to love these crackpots who go out of there way to justify stupidity. Re- my post #28 earlier