90 Day Rule Enforced

[CGW]

I arrived back in Thailand a couple of days ago, after many years commuting from Thailand with no problem, they spent time counting how many days I had been in the country over the past 180 days, pointing to the sign on desks stating only allowed 90 days out of 180, they eventually let me in for 15 days, as I understand it my only option now is to leave country and get visa at an embassy? Is that correct?

Thanks.

[Krub]

I arrived back in Thailand a couple of days ago, after many years commuting from Thailand with no problem, they spent time counting how many days I had been in the country over the past 180 days, pointing to the sign on desks stating only allowed 90 days out of 180, they eventually let me in for 15 days, as I understand it my only option now is to leave country and get visa at an embassy? Is that correct?

Thanks.

Yes

[Crash999]

Same thing happened to me as I entered Thailand via Survarnabhumi on Sunday morning. The immigration officer spent a good 5 minutes looking through all the various stamps in my passport and adding up the days. She came up with 31 days, which I told her was incorrect, so she had to go back and check all of the entry/exit stamps again.

First time this has happened to me this year, though it's my third entery since Jan 1.

As it was done manually, a seeminly easy way to skirt the issue would be to 'lose' one's passport or if one is a dual citizen the two passports could be alternated.

[sceadugenga]

Or get a big rubber and rub some stamps out.

[rainman]

Or get a big rubber and rub some stamps out.

Or you could take a pen and change the entry/exit dates, go to jail and maybe even die like the German Prince a few months ago

[cclub75]

pointing to the sign on desks stating only allowed 90 days out of 180

Do you remember the exact wording of this sign ? And what was its "look" (piece of paper with hand writing, or printed) ?

[astral]

I think you were lucky to be allowed 15 days..........

24 hours and out should be the norm.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Same thing happened to me as I entered Thailand via Survarnabhumi on Sunday morning. The immigration officer spent a good 5 minutes looking through all the various stamps in my passport and adding up the days. She came up with 31 days, which I told her was incorrect, so she had to go back and check all of the entry/exit stamps again.

First time this has happened to me this year, though it's my third entery since Jan 1.

As it was done manually, a seeminly easy way to skirt the issue would be to 'lose' one's passport or if one is a dual citizen the two passports could be alternated.

or even get a real visa

[Digitalbanana]

She came up with 31 days, which I told her was incorrect,

or even get a real visa

If the OP had only 31 days (or less as implied by saying the Imm Officer was wrong) then there is no need for a real visa. Some of us have no time to hang around consulates applying for TV's, we are in and out of Thailand too much.

[CGW]

pointing to the sign on desks stating only allowed 90 days out of 180

Do you remember the exact wording of this sign ? And what was its "look" (piece of paper with hand writing, or printed) ?

Don't remember the exact wording but it is a printed sign, "fair" sized and the only one on the desk top, reads something like, new rule - as from 1st Oct you will only be allowed 90 days out of 180, if you need more you have to go to embassy outside of country.

[uk_falang]

I am of the opinion that seeing as they are adding up manually (counting the green pen marks on your passort) that this info is not in the computer system.

If you get a new passport (old one is full / covered in mud etc) you can use that for three months. Then Vientinene for 2 month visa, extend for 30 days, then can make 3 1 month stamps again.

Should work

I arrived back in Thailand a couple of days ago, after many years commuting from Thailand with no problem, they spent time counting how many days I had been in the country over the past 180 days, pointing to the sign on desks stating only allowed 90 days out of 180, they eventually let me in for 15 days, as I understand it my only option now is to leave country and get visa at an embassy? Is that correct?

Thanks.

[george]

Your favourite Immigration officer might want to use our visa calculator (thousand of ThaiVisa members can't be wrong):

http://www.thaivisa.com/external/visa-calculator.html

[peterjackson]

Hey

I don't know what countries Digitalbanana visits or if he ever gets to the UK for a few days. But I have been an extremely busy guy for over 20 years and have never found the need to get an Embassy/Consulate Visa below the need to arrive on various countries Visa Exemption or On Arrival programs, which without exception have 'strings' attached.

It is also beyond me that the immigration service don't have a simple spreadsheet program that is installed locally and updated overnight on a national basis. I wrote something similar for a multi-site security/access control application and it took under a day of programming and integration. TIT.

Kind regards

Peter

[ThaidleHands]

I am of the opinion that seeing as they are adding up manually (counting the green pen marks on your passort) that this info is not in the computer system.

If you get a new passport (old one is full / covered in mud etc) you can use that for three months. Then Vientinene for 2 month visa, extend for 30 days, then can make 3 1 month stamps again.

Should work

It will work brilliantly right up until the moment the authorities have reason to look at your complete immigration record and then deny you entry (if incoming) or arrest you (if in-country) for breaking the law. You can change your passport but your name, nationality and birthdate (and more recently your photo) stay in the system for a very long time.

But should it work? Decidedly not. Hopefully the Thai authorities will improve the database just so these sorts of pathetic attempts to subvert the law will become more difficult. Until then anyone who is stupid enough to try it deserves exactly what they get when their dodgy little scheme blows up in their face.

[cclub75]

I'm surprised that this "official sign" at Suva does not create more reactions.

This sign is a... sign that the policy is real, and that Immigration wants to apply it. I mean : for real. Therefore, it's important to explain it to the largest audience.

My point : it should be really strange, even by thai standards, to scrap the 90 days rule, after such official announcement (sign to be seen by every people arriving in Thailand).

Before :

-we just had reports of stamps in passeports (number 1, 2 etc.) after visa exemptions.

-and many reports of totally inconsistant immigration officers (some counting, other not, and with different methods, results, etc. Mess thai style).

A U-Turn was still possible (many people on TV believed it : "TIT, the new rule will not pass the summer" etc.).

But now, odds are much lower...

However : there is something I don't understand. Passeports are scanned (at Suva). Why it's not linked to a database to automatically count the number of days etc. ?

Counting by hand (even if they use the Thai Visa Calculator ) is totally... surreal.

We must assume : mess thai style again.

Do you remember at Don Muang ? For the last 2 years : yes the famous and so funny "webcams", to take a nice picture of every people passing through Immigration (in and out).

They were scrapped at Suva.

My point is : they are toying with differents systems, looking for the good one. It takes time.

But eventually, they will have one (a real, serious, efficient one).

To finish : I stick to my first "feeling" : the 90/180 days rule for visa exemptions.... will have an impact on regular tourist visas. AKA : the idea to add visa exemptions and tourist visas (60+30 days), ad nauseum, does not match the basic principle : "you can't be a perpetual tourist in Thailand".

At one point : embassies will say no...

The process just takes times.

Edited March 9, 2007 by cclub75

[jeebusjones]

To finish : I stick to my first "feeling" : the 90/180 days rule for visa exemptions.... will have an impact on regular tourist visas. AKA : the idea to add visa exemptions and tourist visas (60+30 days), ad nauseum, does not match the basic principle : "you can't be a perpetual tourist in Thailand".

At one point : embassies will say no...

I have to disagree with this. The basic principle is not that "you can't be a perpetual tourist in Thailand." The basic principle is that they want to be able have a bit more discretion as to who can stay and who can't. Also, when combined with the 1,900 baht 30 day extensions, requiring people to get tourist visas creates quite a substantial revenue that didn't exist before.

It also allows immigration to keep track of people when they must turn up at the office every few months for the extension.

In addition, it will weed out the incredibly dodgy "tourists" who don't even have enough cash to make a trip out of Thailand every few months to get the new visa.

I've been doing visa exemption runs for over two years. After October 1, I switched to tourist visas. I just obtained my second tourist visa yesterday morning in Vientienne. Despite a passport full of visa exemptions and a just expired tourist visa, I was given another with absolutely no questions asked and no proof of onward ticket, adequate funds or any other such thing.

This rule seems to be about screening people and creating some extra revenue.

[dave111223]

Or get a big rubber and rub some stamps out.

Or you may accidently knock your cup of coffee over onto a few pages

[Brad]

I'm a 47 y/o American guy and I've been making 30 day visa runs to Poi Pet for 6 years running. I have made 4 of these now since the rule has gone into effect no questions asked. My plan from the get go was to keep doing these same runs until I get a warning or 7 days to leave the country. I can take this risk as I will just leave and get a 60 day tourist. On my 4th run, no one batted an eye and no one has ever added up days; they have just stamped me thru each time. btw, I am an early retiree with plenty of cash who would never even think of working in this country. Maybe this is how I look to the Immi guy . Afterall, It is up to the discretion of the officer, as I have heard many times.

[Brad]

Oh, and I also wanted to say to all of you, do not alter your passports, that is a federal offence.

[wpcoe]

I'm a 47 y/o American guy and I've been making 30 day visa runs to Poi Pet for 6 years running. I have made 4 of these now since the rule has gone into effect no questions asked. My plan from the get go was to keep doing these same runs until I get a warning or 7 days to leave the country. I can take this risk as I will just leave and get a 60 day tourist. On my 4th run, no one batted an eye and no one has ever added up days; they have just stamped me thru each time. btw, I am an early retiree with plenty of cash who would never even think of working in this country. Maybe this is how I look to the Immi guy . Afterall, It is up to the discretion of the officer, as I have heard many times.

I wonder what would happen if/when a border official realizes you have used the passport stamps in excess of the legal allocation limit (i.e. more than 90 days in 180 days)? Could you be arrested for violating immigration laws? Does the passport holder bear responsibility if an immigration officer stamps for a stay that would extend beyond the permitted limit?

[Sophon]

I'm a 47 y/o American guy and I've been making 30 day visa runs to Poi Pet for 6 years running. I have made 4 of these now since the rule has gone into effect no questions asked. My plan from the get go was to keep doing these same runs until I get a warning or 7 days to leave the country. I can take this risk as I will just leave and get a 60 day tourist. On my 4th run, no one batted an eye and no one has ever added up days; they have just stamped me thru each time. btw, I am an early retiree with plenty of cash who would never even think of working in this country. Maybe this is how I look to the Immi guy . Afterall, It is up to the discretion of the officer, as I have heard many times.

I wonder what would happen if/when a border official realizes you have used the passport stamps in excess of the legal allocation limit (i.e. more than 90 days in 180 days)? Could you be arrested for violating immigration laws? Does the passport holder bear responsibility if an immigration officer stamps for a stay that would extend beyond the permitted limit?

I think it's more likely that he will simply be refsed entry into Thailand and will be stuck in Cambodia. I don't think there is any regulation that says that he is entitled to enter for seven further days to pack up, especially if he has already stayed more than the 90 days allowed.

Sophon

[Fred Sanford]

I'm a 47 y/o American guy and I've been making 30 day visa runs to Poi Pet for 6 years running. I have made 4 of these now since the rule has gone into effect no questions asked. My plan from the get go was to keep doing these same runs until I get a warning or 7 days to leave the country. I can take this risk as I will just leave and get a 60 day tourist. On my 4th run, no one batted an eye and no one has ever added up days; they have just stamped me thru each time. btw, I am an early retiree with plenty of cash who would never even think of working in this country. Maybe this is how I look to the Immi guy . Afterall, It is up to the discretion of the officer, as I have heard many times.

I wonder what would happen if/when a border official realizes you have used the passport stamps in excess of the legal allocation limit (i.e. more than 90 days in 180 days)? Could you be arrested for violating immigration laws? Does the passport holder bear responsibility if an immigration officer stamps for a stay that would extend beyond the permitted limit?

I think it's more likely that he will simply be refsed entry into Thailand and will be stuck in Cambodia. I don't think there is any regulation that says that he is entitled to enter for seven further days to pack up, especially if he has already stayed more than the 90 days allowed.

Sophon

you can speculate all you want but I have not heard of a single case of this happening since the new regulation so I say there is no way he would be denied entry. You are just scaremongering. I never saw anyone buying beer after midnight get arrested either

[Krub]

I'm a 47 y/o American guy and I've been making 30 day visa runs to Poi Pet for 6 years running. I have made 4 of these now since the rule has gone into effect no questions asked. My plan from the get go was to keep doing these same runs until I get a warning or 7 days to leave the country. I can take this risk as I will just leave and get a 60 day tourist. On my 4th run, no one batted an eye and no one has ever added up days; they have just stamped me thru each time. btw, I am an early retiree with plenty of cash who would never even think of working in this country. Maybe this is how I look to the Immi guy . Afterall, It is up to the discretion of the officer, as I have heard many times.

I wonder what would happen if/when a border official realizes you have used the passport stamps in excess of the legal allocation limit (i.e. more than 90 days in 180 days)? Could you be arrested for violating immigration laws? Does the passport holder bear responsibility if an immigration officer stamps for a stay that would extend beyond the permitted limit?

I think it's more likely that he will simply be refsed entry into Thailand and will be stuck in Cambodia. I don't think there is any regulation that says that he is entitled to enter for seven further days to pack up, especially if he has already stayed more than the 90 days allowed.

Sophon

you can speculate all you want but I have not heard of a single case of this happening since the new regulation so I say there is no way he would be denied entry. You are just scaremongering. I never saw anyone buying beer after midnight get arrested either

Would you care to try and take the risk being stuckat theboarder and let us know the outcome ?

[visarunner]

There is NO emergency stamp.

If your 90days are up , leave the country and get , if applicable , a Tourist Visa in a neighbouring country.

[jeebusjones]

I wonder what would happen if/when a border official realizes you have used the passport stamps in excess of the legal allocation limit (i.e. more than 90 days in 180 days)? Could you be arrested for violating immigration laws? Does the passport holder bear responsibility if an immigration officer stamps for a stay that would extend beyond the permitted limit?

Actually, the wording of the new rule is quite vague about this. It says that the total duration of stay "should not" exceed 90 days in any six month period.

Now, maybe it's just a mistake in English. But that "should" leaves the window open for some serious rule-bending.

[engrin]

Seems they are counting retroactively, I mean before Oct 1.

I entered in October on a TV, extended for 30 days at immigration, did 2 Cambodia Runs and they said that was all.

I think because within the 6 months, before Oct, I did a visa run for 30.

Overall totaling 60 days in 6 months

[Fred Sanford]

I'm a 47 y/o American guy and I've been making 30 day visa runs to Poi Pet for 6 years running. I have made 4 of these now since the rule has gone into effect no questions asked. My plan from the get go was to keep doing these same runs until I get a warning or 7 days to leave the country. I can take this risk as I will just leave and get a 60 day tourist. On my 4th run, no one batted an eye and no one has ever added up days; they have just stamped me thru each time. btw, I am an early retiree with plenty of cash who would never even think of working in this country. Maybe this is how I look to the Immi guy . Afterall, It is up to the discretion of the officer, as I have heard many times.

I wonder what would happen if/when a border official realizes you have used the passport stamps in excess of the legal allocation limit (i.e. more than 90 days in 180 days)? Could you be arrested for violating immigration laws? Does the passport holder bear responsibility if an immigration officer stamps for a stay that would extend beyond the permitted limit?

I think it's more likely that he will simply be refsed entry into Thailand and will be stuck in Cambodia. I don't think there is any regulation that says that he is entitled to enter for seven further days to pack up, especially if he has already stayed more than the 90 days allowed.

Sophon

you can speculate all you want but I have not heard of a single case of this happening since the new regulation so I say there is no way he would be denied entry. You are just scaremongering. I never saw anyone buying beer after midnight get arrested either

Would you care to try and take the risk being stuckat theboarder and let us know the outcome ?

I already took the risk once and received a nice fresh 30 day stamp. I got a 60 day the last time but I'll take the risk again in the summer. I'm not the least bit concerned that they will deny me entry. They are good people and they want my business. People are intimidated and paranoid but dont count me among them. You can remain in that camp

[Krub]

I'm a 47 y/o American guy and I've been making 30 day visa runs to Poi Pet for 6 years running. I have made 4 of these now since the rule has gone into effect no questions asked. My plan from the get go was to keep doing these same runs until I get a warning or 7 days to leave the country. I can take this risk as I will just leave and get a 60 day tourist. On my 4th run, no one batted an eye and no one has ever added up days; they have just stamped me thru each time. btw, I am an early retiree with plenty of cash who would never even think of working in this country. Maybe this is how I look to the Immi guy . Afterall, It is up to the discretion of the officer, as I have heard many times.

I wonder what would happen if/when a border official realizes you have used the passport stamps in excess of the legal allocation limit (i.e. more than 90 days in 180 days)? Could you be arrested for violating immigration laws? Does the passport holder bear responsibility if an immigration officer stamps for a stay that would extend beyond the permitted limit?

I think it's more likely that he will simply be refsed entry into Thailand and will be stuck in Cambodia. I don't think there is any regulation that says that he is entitled to enter for seven further days to pack up, especially if he has already stayed more than the 90 days allowed.

Sophon

you can speculate all you want but I have not heard of a single case of this happening since the new regulation so I say there is no way he would be denied entry. You are just scaremongering. I never saw anyone buying beer after midnight get arrested either

Would you care to try and take the risk being stuckat theboarder and let us know the outcome ?

I already took the risk once and received a nice fresh 30 day stamp. I got a 60 day the last time but I'll take the risk again in the summer. I'm not the least bit concerned that they will deny me entry. They are good people and they want my business. People are intimidated and paranoid but dont count me among them. You can remain in that camp

There is no 60 day visa free stamp it is only with a visa

The 90 days max is only for 30 days visa free stays

[CGW]

If you are flying into Thailand the airlines are also checking your passport, if you are refused entry they are responsible, so if you have no days left they will refuse to let you board flight.

Cheers

[wrecker]

I arrived back in Thailand a couple of days ago, after many years commuting from Thailand with no problem, they spent time counting how many days I had been in the country over the past 180 days, pointing to the sign on desks stating only allowed 90 days out of 180, they eventually let me in for 15 days, as I understand it my only option now is to leave country and get visa at an embassy? Is that correct?

Thanks.

yes or ask for a second passport. And switch your passport now and than. Entries are counted on the basis of a passport number and the stamps, not on your full coordinates.