China and U.S. clash again on trade and regional security

[webfact]

China and U.S. clash again on trade and regional security

By Lee Chyen Yee

 

Chinese Defense Minister Wei Fenghe speaks at the IISS Shangri-la Dialogue in Singapore, June 2, 2019. REUTERS/Feline Lim

 

SINGAPORE (Reuters) - China and the United States clashed again this weekend on trade and security, accusing each other of destabilising the region and potentially the world.

 

Speaking on Sunday at the Shangri-La Dialogue in Singapore, Asia's premier defence summit, China's Defence Minister Wei Fenghe warned the United States not to meddle in security disputes over Taiwan and the South China Sea.

 

On Saturday, acting U.S. Defence Secretary Patrick Shanahan told the meeting that the United States would no longer "tiptoe" around Chinese behaviour in Asia.

 

"Perhaps the greatest long-term threat to the vital interests of states across this region comes from actors who seek to undermine, rather than uphold, the rules-based international order," Shanahan said.

 

It was the latest exchange of acerbic comments between the two sides as their ties come under increasing strain due to a bitter trade war, U.S. support for Taiwan and China's muscular military posture in the South China Sea, where the United States also conducts freedom-of-navigation patrols.

 

China has been particularly incensed by recent moves by President Donald Trump's administration to increase support for self-ruled and democratic Taiwan, including U.S. Navy sailings through the Taiwan Strait that separates the island from China.

 

Wei, dressed in his uniform of a general in the People's Liberation Army, said China would "fight to the end" if anyone tried to interfere in its relationship with Taiwan, which Beijing considers a sacred territory to be taken by force if necessary.

 

"If anyone dares to split Taiwan from China, the Chinese military has no choice but to fight at all costs ... The U.S. is indivisible, and so is China. China must be, and will be, reunified."

 

He however said both sides realised that any war between the two "would bring disaster to both countries and the world."

 

The United States, like most countries, has no formal ties with Taiwan, but is its strongest backer and main source of weapons.

 

While Shanahan's speech was critical of China, his tone was often conciliatory. Wei took a more combative approach.

 

Taiwan's government condemned Wei's remarks, saying Taiwan has never belonged to the People's Republic of China, that Taiwan would never accept Beijing's threats and that China's claim of its "peaceful development" was the "lie of the century".

 

Taiwan "will continue to strengthen its self-defence capabilities, defend the country's sovereignty and democratic system, and uphold the right of the 23 million people of Taiwan to freely choose their future", its Mainland Affairs Council said in a statement.

 

TIANANMEN ANNIVERSARY

Taiwan is gearing up for presidential elections in January, and Taiwan President Tsai Ing-wen has repeatedly accused Beijing of seeking to undermine Taiwan's democracy and has vowed to defend the island and its freedoms.

 

Wei, in a clear reference to the United States, also said: "Some countries from outside the region come to the South China Sea to flex muscles in the name of freedom of navigation."

 

This week will mark 30 years since a bloody Chinese military crackdown on protesters around Beijing's Tiananmen Square, refocusing scrutiny on China's approach to security threats.

 

Taking questions from the floor, Wei defended the government's handling of the Tiananmen "incident", a rare official acknowledgement of the events of June 4, 1989; references to it are heavily censored in China.

 

"The government was decisive in stopping the turbulence," Wei said of the Tiananmen Square crackdown.

 

"Due to this, China has enjoyed stability, and if you visit China you can understand that part of history."

 

On the ongoing trade war, which has shaken financial markets around the world, Wei said China would "fight to the end" if the United States wanted a fight. But if Washington wanted to talk, "we will keep the door open".

 

Trade tensions escalated sharply last month after Trump's administration accused China of having "reneged" on its previous promises to make structural changes to its economic practices.

 

Washington later slapped additional tariffs of up to 25% on $200 billion of Chinese goods, prompting Beijing to retaliate.

 

Speaking at a hastily arranged news conference in Beijing, Chinese Vice Commerce Minister Wang Shouwen said it was irresponsible of the United States to accuse China of backtracking.

 

"If the U.S. side wants to use extreme pressure, to escalate the trade friction, to force China to submit and make concessions, this is absolutely impossible," said Wang, who has been part of China's trade negotiating team.

 

(Reporting by Lee Chyen Yee; additional reporting by Gerry Doyle in Singapore, Cate Cadell in Beijing and Yimou Lee in Taipei; writing by Joe Brock and Ben Blanchard; Editing by Raju Gopalakrishnan)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2019-06-03

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[ExpatOilWorker]

The problem with lying is that soon everybody will stop believe ever single word you say. Can we trust anything China says anymore? 

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/05/30/whats-going-south-china-sea/?utm_term=.3cabec88a183

[4MyEgo]

Typical America, always putting its nose in other nations affairs, USA the hero nation of the world, never bossing nations into submission or threatening or obliviating them.

 

I think this time, the yanks will have to back down or take everybody down with them.

[car720]

and both nuclear.

[tonbridgebrit]

7 hours ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

The problem with lying is that soon everybody will stop believe ever single word you say. Can we trust anything China says anymore? 

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/05/30/whats-going-south-china-sea/?utm_term=.3cabec88a183

"The problem with lying is that soon everybody will stop believe ever single word you say. Can we trust anything China says anymore? "

Do you reckon that lots of people feel that your comment can very easily be applied to the US government's foreign policy ? I mean, Washington has started and fought a whole load of wars during the last few decades. And they constantly claim that these wars are being fought, to spread freedom and democracy. What's the real reason as to why Washington is creating and doing these wars ? Surely, we all know that spreading freedom and democracy is an excuse that Washington uses. Most people do actually reckon that the US government doesn't really care about spreading freedom and democracy across planet earth.

[Morch]

1 hour ago, tonbridgebrit said:

"The problem with lying is that soon everybody will stop believe ever single word you say. Can we trust anything China says anymore? "

Do you reckon that lots of people feel that your comment can very easily be applied to the US government's foreign policy ? I mean, Washington has started and fought a whole load of wars during the last few decades. And they constantly claim that these wars are being fought, to spread freedom and democracy. What's the real reason as to why Washington is creating and doing these wars ? Surely, we all know that spreading freedom and democracy is an excuse that Washington uses. Most people do actually reckon that the US government doesn't really care about spreading freedom and democracy across planet earth.

 

The USA government may be this or that. Doesn't make the Chinese government any truthful or trustworthy.

[Thaidream]

This isn't about freedom and democracy. It's about letting China know they cannot use their size to bully their way around the World.

 

The Chinese want to control the natural resources of various countries to enable the Communist Party to remain in power and to satisy their people's needs for jobs; food and other essentials.  As long as the Chinese people are satisfied- the Party remains in control.

 

While China may believe that it has a right to claim Taiwan- it just might be that Taiwan does not agree.  The US position is that the 2 countries  negotiate the issue and the US recognizes 1 China.  However, should the Chinese invade- the US will most likely support Taiwan in some manner short of military intervention.

 

What the US really needs to do is to stop China from buying US debt and  negotiate a decline in the massive trade imbalance.  Tariffs are not the way but blocking Chinese investment in America is the way.  The US should also block Chinese students from getting educated in the US or going to the US  and purchasing any land or business.

 

In addition- the Trans Pacific Partnership needs to be resurrected as a counter to China's Belt and Road Plan.  

 

You wante to stop the Chinese- follow the money.

 

 

[GreasyFingers]

4 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

The USA government may be this or that. Doesn't make the Chinese government any truthful or trustworthy.

So who do we trust?

[GreasyFingers]

1 minute ago, Thaidream said:

The Chinese want to control the natural resources of various countries

And the Americans would never do that.

[Morch]

4 minutes ago, GreasyFingers said:

So who do we trust?

 

As they say in these parts, up to you.

Me, I think going with the one who allows more criticism, freedom of press and speech. And yes, I'm aware some might interject with this or that nonsense comment - my advice is to try living in China and Russia while trying to practice these, then reflect.

[GreasyFingers]

3 minutes ago, Morch said:

Me, I think going with the one who allows more criticism, freedom of press and speech

If only someone would listen to me.

[Morch]

1 hour ago, GreasyFingers said:

If only someone would listen to me.

 

I'll settle for not going to prison because I aired my views.

[johnarth]

2 hours ago, Thaidream said:

This isn't about freedom and democracy. It's about letting China know they cannot use their size to bully their way around the World.

 

The Chinese want to control the natural resources of various countries to enable the Communist Party to remain in power and to satisy their people's needs for jobs; food and other essentials.  As long as the Chinese people are satisfied- the Party remains in control.

 

While China may believe that it has a right to claim Taiwan- it just might be that Taiwan does not agree.  The US position is that the 2 countries  negotiate the issue and the US recognizes 1 China.  However, should the Chinese invade- the US will most likely support Taiwan in some manner short of military intervention.

 

What the US really needs to do is to stop China from buying US debt and  negotiate a decline in the massive trade imbalance.  Tariffs are not the way but blocking Chinese investment in America is the way.  The US should also block Chinese students from getting educated in the US or going to the US  and purchasing any land or business.

 

In addition- the Trans Pacific Partnership needs to be resurrected as a counter to China's Belt and Road Plan.  

 

You wante to stop the Chinese- follow the money.

 

 

the nail on the head China is buying the world so they think they own it they following the old rule money talks they own the country I used to call home Australia what interests me is are they really paying all this money like they have spent billions in Australia but have they paid it or is it will pay when you pay us for busses, trains etc etc this is the question that needs an answer

Edited June 3, 2019 by johnarth
not finished

[IAMHERE]

10 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

Typical America, always putting its nose in other nations affairs, USA the hero nation of the world, never bossing nations into submission or threatening or obliviating them.

 

I think this time, the yanks will have to back down or take everybody down with them.

I wonder how the Taiwanese think about America's position on this matter.

[johnarth]

1 minute ago, johnarth said:

the nail on the head China is buying the world so they think they own it they following the old rule money talks they own the country I used to call home Australia what interests me is are they really paying all this money like they have spent billions in Australia but have they paid it or is it will pay when you pay us for busses, trains etc etc this is the question that needs an answer

and yes the Democrats of America (war weapons) makers are renowned for starting wars but Trump does not belong to them interesting

[metisdead]

A conspiracy troll post and a reply has been removed. 

[Pedrogaz]

12 hours ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

The problem with lying is that soon everybody will stop believe ever single word you say. Can we trust anything China says anymore? 

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/05/30/whats-going-south-china-sea/?utm_term=.3cabec88a183

I thought you were talking about the US....they want a 'rules-based international order' but break the rules continuously to regime change and illegally invade countries the don't like. Hypocrisy at its finest.

[Scott]

Off-topic post removed.  

[tonbridgebrit]

9 hours ago, Thaidream said:

This isn't about freedom and democracy. It's about letting China know they cannot use their size to bully their way around the World.

 

The Chinese want to control the natural resources of various countries to enable the Communist Party to remain in power and to satisy their people's needs for jobs; food and other essentials.  As long as the Chinese people are satisfied- the Party remains in control.

 

While China may believe that it has a right to claim Taiwan- it just might be that Taiwan does not agree.  The US position is that the 2 countries  negotiate the issue and the US recognizes 1 China.  However, should the Chinese invade- the US will most likely support Taiwan in some manner short of military intervention.

 

What the US really needs to do is to stop China from buying US debt and  negotiate a decline in the massive trade imbalance.  Tariffs are not the way but blocking Chinese investment in America is the way.  The US should also block Chinese students from getting educated in the US or going to the US  and purchasing any land or business.

 

In addition- the Trans Pacific Partnership needs to be resurrected as a counter to China's Belt and Road Plan.  

 

You wante to stop the Chinese- follow the money.

 

 

You have mentioned Taiwan. Beijing's attitude is, is that Taiwan will be attacked IF Taiwan declares independence. Taiwan is a de facto independent place, Beijing simply does not want Taiwan to declare independence. What about Washington's attitude ? Well, you've already said it. Washington itself has declared that it accepts the one China policy. That means there will not be two Chinas. And indeed, I agree, planet earth must never accept two Chinas. There's only one China, Peoples' Republic of China, the other one is Republic of China (Taiwan) , and planet earth must never accept that Republic of China is "a or the" second China.
So, if Taiwan carries on being a de facto independent place, well, China won't invade. And Washington doesn't have to start World War Three, as long as Taiwan does not declare independence.  So, we accept then, that the danger is, is that Taiwan is going to declare independence ?

You also mentioned the Trans Pacific Partnership. What can I say. I'm not actually against it. The TPP is basically about building a wall, with China on one side, and America and a load of Pacific Rim nations on the other side, with regards to trade. Now, it was Obama's big idea. Notice that Hilary Clinton did not talk loudly about the TPP in the election battle with Trump. That's because she knew that the TPP is not actually a popular idea with Americans. Bernie Sanders was openly against the TPP. As for Trump, he's against it as well.
Americans are against the TPP. It's not because they are against isolating China. It's because they don't actually want to be in a giant free trade zone with a load of Pacific Rim countries.

I really do think the TPP will never happen, because, because most Americans are actually against it.

Edited June 3, 2019 by tonbridgebrit

[UASCB500BIKER]

Starve the Chinse,  the C Party will Fail  Boycot THEM...

[Cryingdick]

10 hours ago, GreasyFingers said:

So who do we trust?

 

I know I prefer to live in a society where my merit is judged upon government issued social credits and my freedom depends on them.

[Longcut]

21 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

Typical America, always putting its nose in other nations affairs, USA the hero nation of the world, never bossing nations into submission or threatening or obliviating them.

 

I think this time, the yanks will have to back down or take everybody down with them.

Jealous much? It must be a terrible feeling to live with so much envy of another. Or hate because your own cannot achieve such greatness. 

Edited June 3, 2019 by Longcut

[Longcut]

14 hours ago, tonbridgebrit said:

"The problem with lying is that soon everybody will stop believe ever single word you say. Can we trust anything China says anymore? "

Do you reckon that lots of people feel that your comment can very easily be applied to the US government's foreign policy ? I mean, Washington has started and fought a whole load of wars during the last few decades. And they constantly claim that these wars are being fought, to spread freedom and democracy. What's the real reason as to why Washington is creating and doing these wars ? Surely, we all know that spreading freedom and democracy is an excuse that Washington uses. Most people do actually reckon that the US government doesn't really care about spreading freedom and democracy across planet earth.

By your writing. You strike me as one that really doesn't know the difference between the Chinese government and the CCP and who actually controls, who.

[Morch]

6 hours ago, tonbridgebrit said:

You have mentioned Taiwan. Beijing's attitude is, is that Taiwan will be attacked IF Taiwan declares independence. Taiwan is a de facto independent place, Beijing simply does not want Taiwan to declare independence. What about Washington's attitude ? Well, you've already said it. Washington itself has declared that it accepts the one China policy. That means there will not be two Chinas. And indeed, I agree, planet earth must never accept two Chinas. There's only one China, Peoples' Republic of China, the other one is Republic of China (Taiwan) , and planet earth must never accept that Republic of China is "a or the" second China.
So, if Taiwan carries on being a de facto independent place, well, China won't invade. And Washington doesn't have to start World War Three, as long as Taiwan does not declare independence.  So, we accept then, that the danger is, is that Taiwan is going to declare independence ?

You also mentioned the Trans Pacific Partnership. What can I say. I'm not actually against it. The TPP is basically about building a wall, with China on one side, and America and a load of Pacific Rim nations on the other side, with regards to trade. Now, it was Obama's big idea. Notice that Hilary Clinton did not talk loudly about the TPP in the election battle with Trump. That's because she knew that the TPP is not actually a popular idea with Americans. Bernie Sanders was openly against the TPP. As for Trump, he's against it as well.
Americans are against the TPP. It's not because they are against isolating China. It's because they don't actually want to be in a giant free trade zone with a load of Pacific Rim countries.

I really do think the TPP will never happen, because, because most Americans are actually against it.

 

You spend a whole post about how China might attack Taiwan, if the latter does something China disapproves on. And yet, across multiple posts and topics, insist China is neither a bully, not aggressive, and not a problematic neighbor. Basically, what you just described is all of the above.

 

As for your pronouncements on what planet Earth "must never accept" - a bit over the top even by your own ridiculous standards. One reading this might imagine that this is the centerpiece upon all else is balanced.

 

It would be nice if you could actually support your notions regarding the TPP, American positions and the rest of the waffle on offer. Taking your word for it? I don't think so.

 

[sukhumvitneon]

On 6/2/2019 at 9:53 PM, 4MyEgo said:

Typical America, always putting its nose in other nations affairs, USA the hero nation of the world, never bossing nations into submission or threatening or obliviating them.

 

I think this time, the yanks will have to back down or take everybody down with them.

I love getting social credits by using my Huawei phone too