UK PM Johnson tells EU: ditch backstop or face no-deal Brexit

[puipuitom]

2 hours ago, bomber said:

barely any portuguese wine in the UK,i looked in asda and tesco a while back and couldnt find any,i cannot speak about other supermarkets,spanish is widely available,after brexit wine will be a lot more expensive so they will be hit but so will the UK consumer,its no win for both parties,pretty much the same as trumps idiotic policies,the wine sellers will struggle for other markets for the simple reason nearly all countries in the EU produce mountains of it,north and south america,south africa,north africa,turkey,NZ,Aussie like wise,thats most of the planet,good thing is it keeps it nice and cheap for those lucky enough to live in the EU,none of them sovereign UK taxes and duty to inflate the price ???? i'll drink to that ????

But.. PORT...

And from Spain: SHERRY

 

For both I learn when I was still supermarket-buyer, the British were the demanders, their entire industry was based on.

[puipuitom]

2 hours ago, aright said:

It's not surprising there isn't too much Portuguese  wine in the UK.....its poor quality, however at the end of 2017 their Port exports were almost a £1 billion...not insignificant for a small country. Australia make a very good Port.

The fruit and vegetable sector is however much larger and if you look around the major supermarkets they sell greengrocery from around the world at very competitive prices so the question remains "Where would you recommend they find another large customer on their doorstep?" or are you saying Spain and Portugal don't care about that business. If so show me the evidence.

The production of port in Australia is far too small to fulful British thurst..

Same for fresh fruitsw and vegetables: the UK cannot buy these at thes ame low price , quantity and quality.

And with the GBP going down, down and down versus €uro and US$.. the British will have to be caregful with every penny.

https://www.poundsterlinglive.com/data/currencies/gbp-pairs/GBPEUR-exchange-rate  

 

You know the prayer in EU: God, give us our daily bread and thanks for letting Boris be PM of the UK ( soon to be the SK) 

Edited July 29, 2019 by puipuitom

[nkg]

13 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

mmmmm a very one sided remaining tabloid saying this. But it is German cars so personally I think people should buy British cars.

 

Perhaps it illustrates that the UK has a stronger bargaining position than is generally acknowledged. Apparently Germany exports more cars to Britain than to the US and China combined.

 

It will be interesting to see what the EU offers Britain before the October 31st deadline.

[Laughing Gravy]

2 minutes ago, nkg said:

 

Perhaps it illustrates that the UK has a stronger bargaining position than is generally acknowledged. Apparently Germany exports more cars to Britain than to the US and China combined.

 

It will be interesting to see what the EU offers Britain before the October 31st deadline.

I can see your point entirely and you make a valid point. I personally don't like the FT for their over bias reporting. I am surprised that article slipped through the net.

[puipuitom]

43 minutes ago, nkg said:

 

If cars are important ..... I just Googled "German cars brexit". Here are the first 2 searches:

 

Brexit could crush the German auto industry

 

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/brexit-could-crush-the-german-auto-industry-2019-02-11

 

https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1103378/brexit-panic-german-car-giant-bmw-savings-no-deal-car-industry-volkswagen-germany

You forget the market, which falls open, when UK cars have to face a 10% import duty into the EU. ( and for lorries 22 % ) 

[puipuitom]

5 minutes ago, nkg said:

It will be interesting to see what the EU offers Britain before the October 31st deadline.

No preferences anymore, accept Schengen and €uro + right lane traffic.

[Laughing Gravy]

1 minute ago, puipuitom said:

No preferences anymore, accept Schengen and €uro + right lane traffic.

Ha ha that's your dream isn't it. You have no idea of the UK if you think that will ever happen. How about Holland and the others start filling in the budget hole left by the UK. Start buying fish from the UK at least 3 times the price, as you won't be fishing in UK waters. The UK will be a new tax haven for countries and the EU will hate it.

 

If you ever go to the UK and see the lanes at immigration, the UK and EU lane is always full with EU citizens, the foreign lane is empty. Same in most countries of the EU, so I will take that lane anytime.

 

Your country has sold its soul to the EU don't tell others what to do. We voted leave and will. Sadly your country didn't have the gonads to do the same.

[nkg]

16 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

I can see your point entirely and you make a valid point. I personally don't like the FT for their over bias reporting. I am surprised that article slipped through the net.

 

The financial papers are generally in favour of the status quo (stability), so when the FT reports on nervous German auto manufacturers, there is a good reason for it.

 

Anything that is bad for British car manufacturing, will be even worse for German car manufacturing. Germany will have to find a market bigger than the US and China combined to compensate for their lost sales in Britain. Right now, BMW, Mercedes, Volkswagen and Audi are the best Brexit deal negotiators that the UK has.

[aright]

26 minutes ago, puipuitom said:

But.. PORT...

And from Spain: SHERRY

 

For both I learn when I was still supermarket-buyer, the British were the demanders, their entire industry was based on.

I don't understand what you are trying to say. Port and sherry are just fortified wines. Are you saying Australia can't increase output beyond the volumes needed to supply their current customers?

Even we Brits produce a fortified wine called Full Cream Fortified British Wine.....available at Tesco ...……...We are not allowed to call it Sherry. We even produce sparkling wine which in blind tasting scores better than many French Champagnes...…..we are not allowed to call it Champagne.

[puipuitom]

3 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Ha ha that's your dream isn't it. You have no idea of the UK if you think that will ever happen. How about Holland and the others start filling in the budget hole left by the UK. Start buying fish from the UK at least 3 times the price, as you won't be fishing in UK waters. The UK will be a new tax haven for countries and the EU will hate it.

 

If you ever go to the UK and see the lanes at immigration, the UK and EU lane is always full with EU citizens, the foreign lane is empty. Same in most countries of the EU, so I will take that lane anytime.

 

Your country has sold its soul to the EU don't tell others what to do. We voted leave and will. Sadly your country didn't have the gonads to do the same.

That's why the PVV, the only for a NEXIT, lost all their 4 seats in the EU parliament, back to ZERO. We donot want to commit economical + financial suicide.

Every day I love it to be at this pub.

Think of the British now on holidays in the EU or in US$ countries or soon to go, and will discover this morning they will get -1,47 % in Euro's or -1,22% in US$-connected currencies for their GBP compared with Monday morning ?

 

UK a tax haven ? How you think the "common wallet" also called the country's treasury, will be filled to pay the tax relief of Boris for his Eton boys ? 

 

And for the EU budget: do not worry, it will be filled more as all can expect with import duty over the products still imported from the UK. 5% at average over 50% left of the imports ex UK ( 288,9) = 38,89 billion, about 5 x the nett UK contribution to the EU.

Pity, the EU allowed the UK another 7 months delay.

[nkg]

29 minutes ago, puipuitom said:

You forget the market, which falls open, when UK cars have to face a 10% import duty into the EU. ( and for lorries 22 % ) 

 

And will we buy German cars without imposing import duty? Just as a gift to help our German buddies?

 

I think that the German automobile industry will demand that a compromise is found ???? Who else makes cars that Britain buys? Italy. France. Spain. Members of a trade organisation .... what is it called .... oh yes .... the EU. I expect all those countries would like to stay friends with the UK ????

 

 

 

Edited July 29, 2019 by nkg
Brexit

[puipuitom]

4 minutes ago, aright said:

I don't understand what you are trying to say. Port and sherry are just fortified wines. Are you saying Australia can't increase output beyond the volumes needed to supply their current customers?

Even we Brits produce a fortified wine called Full Cream Fortified British Wine.....available at Tesco ...……...We are not allowed to call it Sherry. We even produce sparkling wine which in blind tasting scores better than many French Champagnes...…..we are not allowed to call it Champagne.

so...drink that stuff then.

[aright]

26 minutes ago, puipuitom said:

You forget the market, which falls open, when UK cars have to face a 10% import duty into the EU. ( and for lorries 22 % ) 

Germany sell more cars in the UK than any other EU member state. I wonder what they will do when we apply large tariffs on their vehicles or the British public decide we don't want German we want Japanese.  

[nkg]

1 minute ago, aright said:

Germany sell more cars in the UK than any other EU member state. I wonder what they will do when we apply large tariffs on their vehicles or the British public decide we don't want German we want Japanese.  

 

Indeed. Britain's bargaining position is much stronger than many people would have you believe.

[puipuitom]

1 minute ago, nkg said:

And will we buy German cars without imposing import duty? Just as a gift to help our German buddies?

I think that the German automobile industry will demand that a compromise is found ???? Who else makes cars that Britain buys? Italy. France. Spain.

Why you think, the British buy about 50% of their car parts from the EU ? Because the British can make them better and cheaper ? 

Ever heard of " economies of scale "?  BMW Mini is already bound to migrate to Borne - NL. Honda goes back to Japan, as no import duty from there into the EU. The waiting is for Nissan. 12.500 employees to lose their job world wide. 

https://www.acea.be/statistics/article/motor-vehicle-trade-between-the-uk-and-main-eu-partners  

https://www.acea.be/uploads/statistic_documents/Brexit-facts_figures_March_2019.pdf

[aright]

1 minute ago, puipuitom said:

so...drink that stuff then.

You obviously know nothing about fortified wines. Penfolds and Yalumba make perfectly acceptable Port and Sherry. Cheers!

[puipuitom]

11 minutes ago, nkg said:

Indeed. Britain's bargaining position is much stronger than many people would have you believe.

Look around in Thailand: how many Mercedes, BMW, Audi, VW and.. how many British made... 

Same for many other countries.

Why you think nearly all British car makers went nearly bankrumpt and were bought by overseas car makers ? Because British cars were so excellent ? Even RR and Bentley are German owned.

Last-but-not-least: which British car manufacturers you mean ?  There is nearly nothing left. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry_in_the_United_Kingdom  

Edited July 29, 2019 by puipuitom

[nkg]

Just now, puipuitom said:

Why you think, the British buy about 50% of their car parts from the EU ? Because the British can make them better and cheaper ? 

Ever heard of " economies of scale "?  BMW Mini is already bound to migrate to Borne - NL. Honda goes back to Japan, as no import duty from there into the EU. The waiting is for Nissan. 12.500 employees to lose their job world wide. 

https://www.acea.be/statistics/article/motor-vehicle-trade-between-the-uk-and-main-eu-partners  

https://www.acea.be/uploads/statistic_documents/Brexit-facts_figures_March_2019.pdf

 

Britain is a huge market for car manufacturers. That's one of the reasons that Honda and Nissan set up shop in the UK.

 

If BMW like having tariffs placed upon the cars that they export to the UK, then they have made an excellent decision in migrating BMW Mini. Let's see which countries are perpared to do business with the UK.

 

[nkg]

8 minutes ago, puipuitom said:

Look around in Thailand: how many Mercedes, BMW, Audi, VW and.. how many British made... 

Same for many other countries.

Why you think nearly all British car makers went nearly bankrumpt and were bought by overseas car makers ? Because British cars were so excellent ? Even RR and Bentley are German owned.

Last-but-not-least: which British car manufacturers you mean ?  There is nearly nothing left. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry_in_the_United_Kingdom  

 

Yes, good job being deliberately stupid.

 

When did I mention British cars being exported to other countries? Never. Not once.

 

The Germans are worried that the British won't IMPORT their cars any more. IMPORT. Do you understand? No, you'll come out with some more rubbish about "British car exports".

[puipuitom]

6 minutes ago, nkg said:

 

Yes, good job being deliberately stupid.

When did I mention British cars being exported to other countries? Never. Not once.

The Germans are worried that the British won't IMPORT their cars any more. IMPORT. Do you understand? No, you'll come out with some more rubbish about "British car exports".

The Germans have the entire world as demanders, the UK - with a 10% import duty into the EU - only… the English, as I expect Scotland to Scexit and North Ireland.. might happen too.

Then the "economies of scale" are going to hurt.

In case you do not have the slightest idea what that means, see google.

Some to make it easy:

• Economies of scale in the automobile industry | SpringerLink

  https://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1057/9780230233591_3
  Recent discussion of productivity in the automobile industry has been focused on the rise of flexible manufacturing, even suggesting that this phenomenon now ...

• The continuing importance of economies of scale in the automotive ...

  https://www.emeraldinsight.com/doi/abs/10.1108/09555349710156046
  The continuing importance of economies of scale in the automotive industry. Author(s):. Rumy Husan (Research Fellow in the School of Business and Economic ...

• economies of scale in the motor industry - Wiley Online Library

  https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf/10.1111/j.1467-8586.1972.tb00326.x
  ECONOMIES OF SCALE IN THE MOTOR INDUSTRY. The purpose of this paper is to analyse the nature of the long-run average cost curvc facing motor car ...

• The continuing importance of economies of scale in the automotive ...

  https://www.emerald.com/insight/content/doi/10.1108/09555349710156046/full/html
  The considerable attention given to flexible methods of production and work organization as a fundamental determinant of achieving international levels of ...

Edited July 30, 2019 by puipuitom

[zorrow424]

Excellent time for UK,foreign dept wiped out cheaply at a stroke,put shutters up on EU,Eire finished..kaput totally,Leo,his underpants unwashed for weeks,cannot afford to wash...Eire kicked out of the EU for refusing EU loans (at a price)  cap in hand to IMF

[zorrow424]

39 minutes ago, puipuitom said:

The Germans have the entire world as demanders, the UK - with a 10% import duty into the EU - only… the English, as I expect Scotland to Scexit and North Ireland.. might happen too.

Then the "economies of scale" are going to hurt.

In case you do not have the slightest idea what that means, see google.

 

39 minutes ago, puipuitom said:

Some to make it easy..easy peasy Id day:

  .but never mind,for you,especially you I would concentrate on just one item  https://www.bbc.com/news/business-49130447  

Trump has already stated he is about to see the Kraut car industry go Kaput,and as for wine,well he has stated to the French that is on the kaput (French style too)   not much to do cept kiss the Blarney stone

 

Edited July 30, 2019 by zorrow424

[Laughing Gravy]

1 hour ago, puipuitom said:

That's why the PVV, the only for a NEXIT, lost all their 4 seats in the EU parliament, back to ZERO. We donot want to commit economical + financial suicide.

Every day I love it to be at this pub.

Think of the British now on holidays in the EU or in US$ countries or soon to go, and will discover this morning they will get -1,47 % in Euro's or -1,22% in US$-connected currencies for their GBP compared with Monday morning ?

 

UK a tax haven ? How you think the "common wallet" also called the country's treasury, will be filled to pay the tax relief of Boris for his Eton boys ? 

 

And for the EU budget: do not worry, it will be filled more as all can expect with import duty over the products still imported from the UK. 5% at average over 50% left of the imports ex UK ( 288,9) = 38,89 billion, about 5 x the nett UK contribution to the EU.

Pity, the EU allowed the UK another 7 months delay.

Your comments are like pub talk, full of nonsense. I pity you coming from a country that voted against the EU and you just let them overrule you. Not much backbone there at all, but that is history for you. London is still the financial capital of the world, as much as the French and Germans would like it not to be.

 

The weaker the pound the more people will spend at home, so more money for the UK economy. Employment is great in the UK so no issues there.

 

I am glad the other EU countries will fill the budget gap. Long overdue.

 

The UK will trade with the rest of the world and this is where the EU and the likes of you forget. There really is a bigger world outside of the EU. Sensible people realise that. I guess you have small country syndrome.

[JonnyF]

1 hour ago, puipuitom said:

Look around in Thailand: how many Mercedes, BMW, Audi, VW and.. how many British made... 

Same for many other countries.

Why you think nearly all British car makers went nearly bankrumpt and were bought by overseas car makers ? Because British cars were so excellent ? Even RR and Bentley are German owned.

Last-but-not-least: which British car manufacturers you mean ?  There is nearly nothing left. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry_in_the_United_Kingdom  

Why are you talking about Thailand sales of German cars, Thailand isn't even in the top 10 for German car exports.

 

In Thailand it's very rare to see a German car outside Bangkok (unless it has Bangkok plates) and of the German cars in Bangkok, the Thai goverment has made more money in sales tax on that car than the Germans made selling it.

 

However, the point here is that if the UK Government adds high tariffs to German cars then it will cost the Germans a lot of money in lost sales, and with the German economy teetering at the moment that is not money they can afford to lose. Not to mention if the UK public become so irritated by the behavior of the EU towards the UK that they decide to buy Japanese cars instead. Or maybe South African or South American Wine. Australian and NZ meat products. Start eating our own fish from our reclaimed UK waters etc.

 

I would bet my last penny that EU countries are putting a lot of pressure on the likes of Barnier now to drop the arrogant attitude and have a sensible conversation. It must be a bitter pill for him to swallow that he wasn't able to stitch the UK up with May's surrender treaty but it's time to get over it.

 

[billd766]

13 hours ago, Nigel Garvie said:

I'm sure you are a leaver, but (Sorry to use the "But" word just my perspective) this makes an excellent post when you say  "and TBH it is not fair to any of them". And also the friends and families falling apart bit. Brexit will be remembered as a sad tragedy whatever side you are on, and whatever the outcome. Triumphalism on either side when the coherence of our society has been destroyed, will be ill placed. 

Teresa May, David Cameron, Boris Johnson, Jeremy Corbyn, and even the conman Farage, are not traitors, only people consumed with anger and blinded by ignorance would think that. However each of them are - in their different (Largely self serving) ways- quite supremely unfit to serve as leader of this, or indeed any other nation. What the hell has gone wrong with us that these people are all that we have to chose from. However they are not traitors - that is idiotic hyperbole.

No need to be sorry that I am a leader as I am and proud to be so (also a member of the Brexit party).

 

The problem in the UK is that if you randomly pick 500 Leavers and 500 Remainers you will probably get at least 10 brain deficient nutcases on each side. When you gear that up into the voting public there are a hell of a lo of angry and violent people out there who in the name of their creed will be the people to be aware of. 

 

They look like us mostly and are not necessarily skinheads or covered in tattoos and a lot of the time they are normal but if you get into a conversation about Brexit on the wrong side it is like lighting the blue touch paper and running like hell to get away from the fallout.

 

Their doesn't seem to be much interest in politics as a whole in most of the UK any more compared to the 1950s to the late 80s. There are few people like Harold Wilson, James Callaghan, Margaret Thatcher, Anthony Wedgewood-Benn, Dennis Skinner etc. Oddly enough apart from Margaret Thatcher they are mostly Labour. From John Major onwards on the Tory side and Tony Blair on the Labour side they have gone downhill.

 

Will Boris Johnson open his bag and produce a rabbit and avoid a no deal Brexit? Who knows but he is the "nations" ???? last hope for Brexit this side of 31 October.

 

What a choice for us all.

[billd766]

5 hours ago, puipuitom said:

Look around in Thailand: how many Mercedes, BMW, Audi, VW and.. how many British made... 

Same for many other countries.

Why you think nearly all British car makers went nearly bankrumpt and were bought by overseas car makers ? Because British cars were so excellent ? Even RR and Bentley are German owned.

Last-but-not-least: which British car manufacturers you mean ?  There is nearly nothing left. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry_in_the_United_Kingdom  

How is the Dutch motor industry getting along nowadays?

 

I did a Google search and could only find this.

 

Netherlands
The Netherlands imports most of its vehicles, having little own manufacturing of less than 200,000 per year. Besides DAF Trucks and VDL buses, present Dutch auto production consists primarily of contract manufacturing for BMW and Mini by VDL Nedcar (formerly producing DAF, Volvo, Smart and Mitsubishi[62]), plus a few small sports car companies: Spyker Cars and Donkervoort. Another small company, PAL-V International, is now taking orders for production of a roadable gyrocopter, slated for deliveries in 2019.[63]

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry_by_country

 

 

[bristolboy]

1 hour ago, nkg said:

 

Britain is a huge market for car manufacturers. That's one of the reasons that Honda and Nissan set up shop in the UK.

 

If BMW like having tariffs placed upon the cars that they export to the UK, then they have made an excellent decision in migrating BMW Mini. Let's see which countries are perpared to do business with the UK.

 

If the UK i.poses tariffs on German cars, it has to impose the same tariffs on all foreign autos. WTO rules.

[Mavideol]

1 minute ago, bristolboy said:

If the UK i.poses tariffs on German cars, it has to impose the same tariffs on all foreign autos. WTO rules.

noooo, for Boris tariffs will only apply to cars made in the EU, WTO rules not an issue for him

[aright]

9 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

If the UK i.poses tariffs on German cars, it has to impose the same tariffs on all foreign autos. WTO rules.

Does it have to impose tariffs on Japanese cars made and sold in this country? 

[Joe Mcseismic]

5 hours ago, nkg said:

 

Britain is a huge market for car manufacturers. That's one of the reasons that Honda and Nissan set up shop in the UK.

 

If BMW like having tariffs placed upon the cars that they export to the UK, then they have made an excellent decision in migrating BMW Mini. Let's see which countries are perpared to do business with the UK.

 

No, Nissan and Honda set up in the UK because of the UK's laissez-faire economy and because (here's the main reason) the UK was in the EU which meant free trade for the car manufacturers within Europe.

Now, the Japanese car manufacturers are leaving because the primary reason to stay in the UK has disappeared. It isn't just car manufacturers leaving, either.

 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/brexit-companies-leaving-uk-list-job-cuts-eu-no-deal-customs-union-a8792296.html