Sign of the times: China's capital orders Arabic, Muslim symbols taken down

[Morch]

5 minutes ago, dexterm said:

China is a totally repressive regime that has no respect for human rights.

 

It needlessly forbids the most basic of Muslim and Tibetan religious observances.

 

China's minorities are a mere drop in the ocean in a 1.4 billion population.

Moves like the OP simply create resentment and reaction. The irony is that if the Han Chinese respected diverse minority religions and cultures, legislated cradle to grave health and education care, they would have the local Muslim and other minorities eating out of their hands and looking at all the repressive regimes in neighboring countries, and glad that they are a minority living where they do.

Instead it's just the same old story of repression until the valve bursts.

 

You've posted almost the same on past topics. Faulty logic to boot.

 

If these minority groups are "a mere drop in the ocean", then domestically maybe not much dire implications (re "resentment and reaction"). On the international front, the Chinese been getting away with mistreatment of the Uighur without much negative consequences as well.

 

If said minority groups are that insignificant, it wouldn't make sense (from the Chinese regime point of view) to pander to their needs and wishes. Doing so might lead to other groups wanting concessions and being treated differently.

 

Fully expecting a spin attempt - this is not offered as defense of the Chinese regime and its policies.

[thasoss]

13 hours ago, taichiplanet said:

it wasn't that long ago that they were coming down hard on Tibetan Buddhists. Anyone remember Falun Gong?! I wouldn't be surprised if the Commie Party wants to pick the next Pope. It's not like there hasn't been any precedence. They even frown upon  Daoism as a religion which is home grown.

Is n't communism supposed to be godless atheistic?...only worship allowed is worship of the state so chinese actions like these one's are to be expected no?

[bert bloggs]

13 hours ago, Guitarzan said:

That’s rich for a hideous communist regime. They couldn’t get Tibetans to give up their religion and devotion to the Dalai Lama, so they imported Muslims into Tibet to marry with Buddhist women. If you want to destroy a culture just bring in Islam, problem solved. Now through Chinas great vision and foresight they  have a Muslim problem. 

 

Same me thing happening in Burma!  

 

Dont ask ask me for a link. I read, write, and speak Tibetan, and was married to a Tibetan women. 

Everywhere has a muslim problem , or had you not noticed????

[Chomper Higgot]

1 minute ago, bert bloggs said:

Everywhere has a muslim problem , or had you not noticed????

No, but I note you have.

[Chomper Higgot]

29 minutes ago, dexterm said:

China is a totally repressive regime that has no respect for human rights.

 

It needlessly forbids the most basic of Muslim and Tibetan religious observances.

 

China's minorities are a mere drop in the ocean in a 1.4 billion population.

Moves like the OP simply create resentment and reaction. The irony is that if the Han Chinese respected diverse minority religions and cultures, legislated cradle to grave health and education care, they would have the local Muslim and other minorities eating out of their hands and looking at all the repressive regimes in neighboring countries, and glad that they are a minority living where they do.

Instead it's just the same old story of repression until the valve bursts.

I think it fairer to observe a culture that has a different view of human rights and the place of the individual in society, perhaps fairer still to observe two cultures with different views on the matter.

 

This overlaying the dominant group’s abuses of the minority.

 

And outside others with again different views, barely looking in, barely saying anything and doing next to nothing about the abuses.

 

[bert bloggs]

14 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

No, but I note you have.

well i worked amongst them for many years so know a bit about their controling ways , ,but never married one and took their faith as some have , the Bhuddists that is who lived there .

[Chomper Higgot]

4 minutes ago, bert bloggs said:

well i worked amongst them for many years so know a bit about their controling ways , ,but never married one and took their faith as some have , the Bhuddists that is who lived there .

Others worked amongst Muslims too, and drew different conclusions.

[bert bloggs]

10 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Others worked amongst Muslims too, and drew different conclusions.

Did they? good for them .

[bert bloggs]

25 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

I think it fairer to observe a culture that has a different view of human rights and the place of the individual in society, perhaps fairer still to observe two cultures with different views on the matter.

 

This overlaying the dominant group’s abuses of the minority.

 

And outside others with again different views, barely looking in, barely saying anything and doing next to nothing about the abuses.

 

you are talking about Muslims i take it ?

[Morch]

One thing about such headlines and topics, is that they serve as a good reminder regarding what an actual dictatorship/police state/whatever looks like, as opposed to imagined version applied to Western countries.

[charmonman]

We can at least hope the Muslim extremists come to the conclusion that they have a bigger enemy in this world than the democratic West where they can practice their religion freely. That might give them too much credit for being capable of logical thinking perhaps.

[Rimmer]

an off topic baiting post has been removed

[lannarebirth]

14 hours ago, sanemax said:

Communist Governments act "Right-winged"???? ?

It's right wing behaviour. Not much "communist" about China anymore. It's authoritarian, nationalistic, deep wealth divide, great disparity between treatment of citizens.  It's a fascist country now.  

[lannarebirth]

14 hours ago, Guitarzan said:

A common misperception. In the 30's and 40's parties like hum ... I dont know the "German National Socialist Party, Mao Tse Tung's "Communist Party of China", Mussolini's Socialist Fascist Party, Stalin's Communist party, Castro, and Che .... I could go on.  These dictators were socialist and communists, about as far away from the right as you can get. 

 

The political spectrum is a circular continuum. There's not much difference between fascism and communism as it affects those who suffer under these regimes.

 

http://factmyth.com/the-left-right-political-spectrum-explained/

 

 

[dexterm]

3 hours ago, Morch said:

 

You've posted almost the same on past topics. Faulty logic to boot.

 

If these minority groups are "a mere drop in the ocean", then domestically maybe not much dire implications (re "resentment and reaction"). On the international front, the Chinese been getting away with mistreatment of the Uighur without much negative consequences as well.

 

If said minority groups are that insignificant, it wouldn't make sense (from the Chinese regime point of view) to pander to their needs and wishes. Doing so might lead to other groups wanting concessions and being treated differently.

 

Fully expecting a spin attempt - this is not offered as defense of the Chinese regime and its policies.

You are supporting the repressive Chinese regime, either that or arguing for the sake of arguing. Probably the latter.

 

Faulty logic?

 

I call 11 million Muslims and 3 million Tibetans in a total Chinese population of 1,400,000,000 a drop in the ocean. What's your idea of a tiny minority then?

 

You belittle their mistreatment, claiming "not much dire implications" for China maintaining its repression. Just because the world and you think their suffering is of no consequence and turn a blind eye to it doesn't make it right.

 

The Chinese government seems to be treating them differently already. I am suggesting an alternative way of singling them out. Why not treat your minorities with respect and generosity. Would save a mountain of bad PR and animosity. Economically too it makes sense. Social welfare would cost a hell of a lot less than maintaining a armies of police and soldiers and re-education camps just to control 20 million people. And why not extend the same social welfare to all Chinese?

 

I never said the Chinese were bright.

[bert bloggs]

while reading this i see all going on about oppression by the Chinese of the Muslims ,but lets face it ,many Muslim nations are just as oppresive of minorities and in many cases more so than the Chinese ,that is even in the treatment of their own citizens in the way they treat them ..

[Morch]

5 minutes ago, dexterm said:

You are supporting the repressive Chinese regime, either that or arguing for the sake of arguing. Probably the latter.

 

Faulty logic?

 

I call 11 million Muslims and 3 million Tibetans in a total Chinese population of 1,400,000,000 a drop in the ocean. What's your idea of a tiny minority then?

 

You belittle their mistreatment, claiming "not much dire implications" for China maintaining its repression. Just because the world and you think their suffering is of no consequence and turn a blind eye to it doesn't make it right.

 

The Chinese government seems to be treating them differently already. I am suggesting an alternative way of singling them out. Why not treat your minorities with respect and generosity. Would save a mountain of bad PR and animosity. Economically too it makes sense. Social welfare would cost a hell of a lot less than maintaining a armies of police and soldiers and re-education camps just to control 20 million people. And why not extend the same social welfare to all Chinese?

 

I never said the Chinese were bright.

 

Yawn. Read my last line. No support offered for the Chinese regime. If you choose to pretend we never had almost exact exchanges, go right ahead. You could also consult my posts on matter Chinese - not generally a fan.

 

And no, I'm pointing out to an obvious flaw in your "logic", as exhibited on that post.

 

Now to untangle your twist:

 

I never said anything contradicting the fact that these are minorities or even tiny ones. Actually quite the opposite. The point made was that if they are that insignificant, there would be less incentive for the Chinese regime to be more gentle in its treatment of them.

 

Never did I "belittle their mistreatment". That there are no dire implications as far as the Chinese regime goes, is a fact. Never said anything about it being right. And, of course, it is not my view (nor, I think, the World's) that "their suffering is of no consequence".

 

You can suggest whatever you like. But what you suggest is alien to how the Chinese regime sees things, and what stands at the core of its policies. So "suggesting" it is all very fine, just irrelevant, other than as yet another rant effort

 

I'm pretty sure that the Chinese government does the math on both fronts mentioned, and comes to other conclusions. It doesn't follow I agree or support this position. Somehow doubt that you're able to accurately assess related costs and issues involved, but that shouldn't bar you from airing your musings as facts. Not on this forum, anyway.

 

Basically, you whine about China being China, and not some Western liberal multicultural democracy. That's cool. It's just irrelevant - and still doesn't address the faulty logic on offer.

[DrTuner]

1 hour ago, lannarebirth said:

The political spectrum is a circular continuum. There's not much difference between fascism and communism as it affects those who suffer under these regimes.

 

http://factmyth.com/the-left-right-political-spectrum-explained/

Hence, it's close enough to claim left wingers are nazis.

[lannarebirth]

1 minute ago, DrTuner said:

Hence, it's close enough to claim left wingers are nazis.

If that pleases you to think so. There are lots of variables but I'm guessing the details aren't that important to you; only the label.

 

 

[Baerboxer]

17 hours ago, Guitarzan said:

That’s rich for a hideous communist regime. They couldn’t get Tibetans to give up their religion and devotion to the Dalai Lama, so they imported Muslims into Tibet to marry with Buddhist women. If you want to destroy a culture just bring in Islam, problem solved. Now through Chinas great vision and foresight they  have a Muslim problem. 

 

Same me thing happening in Burma!  

 

Dont ask ask me for a link. I read, write, and speak Tibetan, and was married to a Tibetan women. 

 

Many people married to Thai women can be relied on to write informative comments about Thailand too.

[DrTuner]

45 minutes ago, lannarebirth said:

If that pleases you to think so. There are lots of variables but I'm guessing the details aren't that important to you; only the label.

Yes it would please me a lot if the Chinese were called neonazis. Whatever works to keep them at bay.

Edited August 1, 2019 by DrTuner

[Stargeezr]

China just retaining the Chinese culture in its own country.  Better than most countries that try the multi cultural routine, and end up neck deep in some other countries language.  I have seen so many Arabic signs, that I wonder what is coming next. Sharia  anyone?

Geezer

[Guitarzan]

16 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Many people married to Thai women can be relied on to write informative comments about Thailand too.

That is common sense but, I didn’t hear that from a Tibetan woman, I heard that from Lamas that escaped Tibet, then returned to see the situation there. 

[Guitarzan]

20 hours ago, bert bloggs said:

Everywhere has a muslim problem , or had you not noticed????

Nip it in the bud. 

[car720]

On 7/31/2019 at 9:55 PM, DrTuner said:

This time the Chinese might actually be onto something. Organized religions are a cancer.

Yep. On this one I hold with the Chinese.

Stamp the buggers out.

 

[Sujo]

Get rid of all those chinese signs in chinatowns around the world. Or better, get rid of all chinatowns. 

 

They are not our culture.

 

Sarcasm.

[bert bloggs]

3 hours ago, Guitarzan said:

Nip it in the bud. 

Pity we did not in the west , now its to late .