Police. Immigration. Press. Why do you let them into your home?

[spidermike007]

15 hours ago, emptypockets said:

Wish I had done the James Bond training. Or read the book anyway. Then I could make some pretty impressive claims on TVF that nobody takes seriously - most would, and do, get a good belly laugh.

Keep up the good work.

In all the years I have been here, I have pushed back against the police constantly. I never make their jobs easy for them. Never. Usually it works. I find they are usually looking for easy marks. When I give them hell, and alot of flack and resistance, they usually back down, and look for another easy mark. They do not like getting worked over, and typically they are looking to maximize their time and profit, from their local franchise. When they ask for a fine, I usually say NO, or negotiate down the amount. You would be surprised to see how flexible they are! This approach works even better if you have a Thai drivers license, and a residence card. 

Edited September 8, 2019 by spidermike007

[Farangwithaplan]

On 9/6/2019 at 10:52 PM, timendres said:

And what if the person you invite in is the fake police officer (one of many) recently arrested? And if I refuse, what they know is that I am not some numpty.

Then there may be the possibility of a fake arrest and some fake jail time doing fake hard labour.

[Artisi]

On 9/7/2019 at 8:22 AM, worgeordie said:

Thinking......No I cannot remember when I had Police,Immigration,or Press

at my door,and i have lived at same address for 30 years,so a non issue

for me,and many others on here I suppose.

regards Worgeordie

And if they did come and knock on the door, guess - like me you would politely ask why?. Given a reasonable answer / request you then might well consider the options - ask them to come in, arrange to meet at the police station or tell them to p iss-off.

 

Changing visa extension status some years back we had a pre-arranged visit from I M police along with the directive to have an independent person there during the visit. 

 

Can't understand the drama from some people, If you have nothing to hide what's the big drama about.

 

[Kwasaki]

19 hours ago, lkv said:

 

"About 15 minutes later, another police officer produced a bag of white powder, shook it near my face and accused me of buying it. I emphatically denied the claim. Meanwhile, other police officers began helping themselves to drinks from the bar. When the bartender protested, they kicked him in the shins. Eventually, a police officer took me outside where a Thai woman told me if I paid the equivalent of $15,200, I would be released."

 

For the full article, 

 

https://time.com/3674200/thailand-tourism-police-corruption-shakedown-extortion/

Well you just answered it " POLICE CORRUPTION "  Thailand has places that are just like people hanging around places like sewers, steer clear of em or man up.

[lkv]

2 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

Well you just answered it " POLICE CORRUPTION "  Thailand has places that are just like people hanging around places like sewers, steer clear of em or man up.

Yep. So in response to your "nothing to hide", "man up" etc, I advise you let them in your house as long as you have nothing to hide, and they might find you've hidden something, even if you haven't. ????

 

Either that or stay clear of your house.

Edited September 8, 2019 by lkv

[sunnyboy2018]

You have no rights here. Yanks woffling on about amendments are not facing up to reality of life in Thailand for visitors and Thais alike. There ate NO human rights here. No common law. No Napoleonic law. Its a military regime. Get real.

[Isaanbiker]

On 9/6/2019 at 11:41 PM, brokenbone said:

no, if he refuse, they dont know that something is wrong,

and his refusal may not be hiding something,

you arent logical.

hows that for a sandwish ?

Only if you put some real cheese on it. Some Leerdammer will do the trick. 

Edited September 8, 2019 by Isaanbiker

[Kwasaki]

22 hours ago, lkv said:

Yep. So in response to your "nothing to hide", "man up" etc, I advise you let them in your house as long as you have nothing to hide, and they might find you've hidden something, even if you haven't. ????

 

Either that or stay clear of your house.

Yeah OK you really don't get it, carry on with your movies scenario's of Police & immigration in Thailand, dealing with individuals who are obviously corrupt in a situation has nothing to do with going to the proper authorities.

I've seen nothing of the sort in 20 years going all over Thailand so go on living in your bad places, maybe get some help, sounds like you need it.

[emptypockets]

23 hours ago, lkv said:

Yep. So in response to your "nothing to hide", "man up" etc, I advise you let them in your house as long as you have nothing to hide, and they might find you've hidden something, even if you haven't. ????

 

Either that or stay clear of your house.

I doubt if it would get that far. After the police see him holding his wife's handgun they would probably shoot first and ask questions later. He is obviously a paranoid delusional.

Or simply return with a warrant for the illegal possession charge and then go in anyway.

[hobz]

On 9/7/2019 at 3:17 PM, Matzzon said:

Ok? Wow! personal experience I assume or have you just fallen for the great group pressure on this forum that makes almost all in Thailand more bad than everything else?

None of the above. ????

[hobz]

On 9/7/2019 at 11:38 PM, timendres said:

Just because what is lurking in the grass is 99% crickets and grasshoppers, does not mean you should ignore the possibility of a snake. And while you may have never seen a snake, it might be wise to listen to those who have.

Exactly... And it's a fact that Thai police have a tendency to Target foreigners for extortion in different ways.

And cops in general, worldwide, have been known to plant evidence.

 

I'm not saying that it's likely to happen. Hell, i might even let them in because the odds of them planting evidence is really low. But if I refuse to let them in the odds are that they think I have something to hide. It's a tricky one. I would probably let them in. Specially if they are more than 2 cops. If it's only 2 I would be more suspicious. To make a search you need more than 2 cops in general. You need like 2 cops per room or something.

 

 

Edited September 10, 2019 by hobz

[Matzzon]

On 9/8/2019 at 4:20 AM, spidermike007 said:

In all the years I have been here, I have pushed back against the police constantly. I never make their jobs easy for them. Never. Usually it works. I find they are usually looking for easy marks. When I give them hell, and alot of flack and resistance, they usually back down, and look for another easy mark. They do not like getting worked over, and typically they are looking to maximize their time and profit, from their local franchise. When they ask for a fine, I usually say NO, or negotiate down the amount. You would be surprised to see how flexible they are! This approach works even better if you have a Thai drivers license, and a residence card. 

Sure, you say no to pay a fine, and they just smile and let you go. That just because you have aresidence card and a Thai driver license that makes it much easier for you than it is for other people. You know, I would like to live in your dream world. At least you made me laugh.

[timendres]

5 hours ago, hobz said:

Exactly... And it's a fact that Thai police have a tendency to Target foreigners for extortion in different ways.

And cops in general, worldwide, have been known to plant evidence.

 

I'm not saying that it's likely to happen. Hell, i might even let them in because the odds of them planting evidence is really low. But if I refuse to let them in the odds are that they think I have something to hide. It's a tricky one. I would probably let them in. Specially if they are more than 2 cops. If it's only 2 I would be more suspicious. To make a search you need more than 2 cops in general. You need like 2 cops per room or something.

Actually, two cops is very common - aka motocy partners. But you are correct that an official search would never have less than 12 cops - given the photo op and all...

[timendres]

2 hours ago, Matzzon said:

Sure, you say no to pay a fine, and they just smile and let you go. That just because you have aresidence card and a Thai driver license that makes it much easier for you than it is for other people. You know, I would like to live in your dream world. At least you made me laugh.

You are missing the point. Most scamming police are looking for easy targets. When you show a driver's license or a residence card, the cop thinks "Farang know too much", and they will move on. Of course, if you are dealing with a straight cop, those items are meaningless, because you are going down for whatever you did wrong. We all have a dream world. The question is, can you tell the difference?

[Matzzon]

7 hours ago, timendres said:

You are missing the point. Most scamming police are looking for easy targets. When you show a driver's license or a residence card, the cop thinks "Farang know too much", and they will move on. Of course, if you are dealing with a straight cop, those items are meaningless, because you are going down for whatever you did wrong. We all have a dream world. The question is, can you tell the difference?

Yes, I can. And what I quoted was that a person do never make it easy for the police and say no to fines. That must mean that person only deal with bad police and scammers. I guess you do not know what you read. That´s the problem.

[BimBoon]

I knew this when my wife called them to a domestic next door. They said nothing we can do we can't go in the home. 

[Jo3200]

On 9/6/2019 at 10:06 PM, Kwasaki said:

If anybody official wants see me and come to my home I invite them in, what's your problem. 

Must be hiding something I guess.

[Jo3200]

On 9/6/2019 at 11:01 PM, timendres said:

and the one thing I will not do is show weakness. 

He's in uniform. Mostly 'show no weakness' here is seen as impolite which makes it more likely to be in trouble someway or another. That's maybe often the problem with foreigners here who 'show no weakness' and later complain about Thais being rude to them and always encounter trouble.

[Jo3200]

On 9/7/2019 at 3:11 PM, rech said:

I guess that the same people who fill tm30 and report any movement are the same who accepts all the idiots in their bedroom...

I guess the same people who never do the TM30 are responsible for them actually put their foot down for all of the foreigners staying here.

[timendres]

4 hours ago, Jo3200 said:

He's in uniform. Mostly 'show no weakness' here is seen as impolite which makes it more likely to be in trouble someway or another. That's maybe often the problem with foreigners here who 'show no weakness' and later complain about Thais being rude to them and always encounter trouble.

I have been stopped more than 20 times by officers, and never once ended up with any trouble. I think I have done just fine. As I specifically mentioned, I am polite and respectful. That is quite different from bending over and begging for it. Since I have never broken the law, I can confidently stand firm.

[tabarin]

Wether it would be a person really doing drugs, the suspicion being there by police or it be a set-up, it is almost always what it is about / what people fear most. 

To get to the point; as far my knowledge and intel goes, there are exceptions on needing a warrant.
One of them is the right suspicion of drugs, where you could get rid of the stuff if they didn't enter right away / risk of lost evidence.

So that would leave one in a tricky situation...
Aside of that, if a police forced it's way in and ignoring your desire to see a warrant, what would you do? Hit em? Can't stop them.

Edited September 11, 2019 by tabarin

[balo]

I don't want my pictures taken, so I would refuse anyone with a camera in. I wonder if the police would say they need pictures as evidence they visited?  And then my face would end up in the local news.  

[kevinmartyn]

Best thing to do is just to say "come in everyone, have just put on some fresh coffee" or do you prefer "Japanese Tea"

What can i do for you guys. Yes! i tried very hard to do my 90 days online and also the "TM30" but both systems have not worked in over 90 days. 55555

[Almer]

On 9/6/2019 at 11:01 PM, timendres said:

Nonsense in your book. Not in mine. I have dealt with police numerous times, and the one thing I will not do is show weakness. You may as well bend over. Polite, firm, intelligent interaction is advised. A random officer at my door gets an appointment at the station, nothing more. That said, 10 officers at my door, and I am going to have to reconsider my position, but I am still inclined to not open my door.

Agreed

[hobz]

On 9/10/2019 at 12:33 PM, timendres said:

Actually, two cops is very common - aka motocy partners. But you are correct that an official search would never have less than 12 cops - given the photo op and all...

It's not only for the photo op. It's also for the evidence Collection requiring witness and you also need to control the entire location so that nobody is running around hiding / getting rid of evidence.

 

Let's say it's two cops. If they go in separate rooms then they miss out on the witness aspect of witnessing each other's findings.

 

If they go in the same room together then the suspects could sneak into another room and destroy evidence.

 

Therefore, ideally, you would ha e like 2 cops per room plus a few extra to guard any suspects / hostiles.

[JimmyJ]

4675636b596f75 - "The police cannot just search your home without a warrant, not even in Thailand.

You don't have to speak with them.

You can meet with them on your own terms and certainly not in your dwelling.

You can refuse to allow press into your home. 

 

Do people not know this?"

 

I asked early on in this thread where the OP found this info.

He replied that he used to sleep with a Thai lawyer.

 

I haven't followed the thread, but did he ever provide a reference for his claim?

 

What he's stated above is worthless without verification.

Edited September 14, 2019 by JimmyJ

[dallen52]

On 9/7/2019 at 12:29 AM, ThomasThBKK said:

 

That. And also, can we stop calling these people police, it's offensive to real cops.

The BiB revenue collection department. Sounds better 

[9653]

On 9/6/2019 at 10:37 PM, Anythingleft? said:

Personally I would not be that trusting given the way things can work over here
There could be quite a benefit to having some witnesses around....

Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk
 

and what if it its no real police?

[Wongkitlo]

4675636b596f75 - "The police cannot just search your home without a warrant, not even in Thailand.
You don't have to speak with them.
You can meet with them on your own terms and certainly not in your dwelling.
You can refuse to allow press into your home. 
 
Do people not know this?"
 
I asked early on in this thread where the OP found this info.
He replied that he used to sleep with a Thai lawyer.
 
I haven't followed the thread, but did he ever provide a reference for his claim?
 
What he's stated above is worthless without verification.

In Australia (I guess similar UK as Australian law comes from there)they are not allowed to search a house without a warrant unless they believe a crime is being committed. Gives them the ability to do whatever they want. It is up to your lawyer to argue that evidence they find is invalid in court.

Sent from my SM-J730F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[timendres]

14 hours ago, JimmyJ said:

4675636b596f75 - "The police cannot just search your home without a warrant, not even in Thailand.

You don't have to speak with them.

You can meet with them on your own terms and certainly not in your dwelling.

You can refuse to allow press into your home. 

 

Do people not know this?"

 

I asked early on in this thread where the OP found this info.

He replied that he used to sleep with a Thai lawyer.

 

I haven't followed the thread, but did he ever provide a reference for his claim?

 

What he's stated above is worthless without verification.

A simple Google search results in:

https://www.siam-legal.com/thailand-law-library/legal_library/warrant_of_arrest_in_thailand.php

 

where it is stated:

 

Quote

 

Guidelines To Be Followed In Searches And Seizures With A Warrant

1. The search warrant must be shown to the occupant before the search is conducted;
2. The officer must give his name and title to the occupant prior to the search;
3. As much as possible, the search must be conducted in the presence of the owner or occupant or a competent member of his family;
4. If no owner/occupant/family member is available to witness the search, the police must secure the presence of at least two independent and competent witnesses before the search is conducted;
5. The items found in the search must be shown to the witnesses, who must acknowledge the items found.

Police may conduct searches and seizures without a warrant when he has reasonable grounds to believe that the suspect has in his possession:

1. Articles that may be used to commit a crime;
2. The fruits of a crime;
3. Illegal items (like illegal substances).

 

So, clearly there are several cases where a warrantless search may be conducted. And those cases seem to cover a lot of ground! Especially if it is believed that you possess a stolen pineapple...