Problems entering with a re-entry permit on ed visa

[darrendsd]

18 hours ago, timendres said:

So, almost one year on the ED visa, and 100 hours. At best, 3 hours per week. Not really serious schooling, is it? I believe that this is precisely the "education" that immigration has decided will no longer qualify. I am not judging you at all, just saying that I think immigration is changing their concept of what an ED visa is (or maybe it has been this way all along, and is just now being applied - like another famous rule).

But he didn't tell the I/O about the 100 hours so what's your point?

 

The I/O obviously had a problem from the start that the OP was on a ED Visa - as soon as he was tested on his Thai he was allowed to enter

 

No big deal - this has happened before at the Airports but as usual the TV brigade make a mountain out of a molehill

 

 

[emptypockets]

3 hours ago, cerox said:

That training is in CNX too?

I ask it directly what many think: required to go? or just pay and get the paperwork anyway? And how much did you have to pay up-front for the documents so you can go to the embassy? This is the money at risk if we do not get the visa because we lose it.

And this is the root cause of all the issues with the (abuse of) ED visa.

Am I actually required to go to lessons? Or can I just pay the money, get the paperwork and go out partying for 12 months?

Honestly, you guys aren't fooling anyone, neither the members of this forum and certainly not the immigration people. Unfortunately the genuine student is copping flak due to the actions of the party boys.

 

Go and read some posts from 6 or 7 years ago and you will see how Thailand has changed with respect to visas. You used to be able to stay here basically forever simply by doing a border run every 30 days and getting a new visa or visa exempt entry. A whole industry grew just to service this requirement. Those days are long gone. ED visas then became the choice for those wanting to stay 12 months or more and never actually attending any classes. The requirements for that got tightened up as well.

 

Personally I have great difficulty in believing a young man actually wanting or needing to learn the Thai language. Why? What good is it if you cannot stay in the country? I have no difficulty in believing a young man wanting to spend a long time in Thailand shagging anything that moves. Nothing wrong with that in my opinion. But I don't make the rules.

 

 

Edited September 11, 2019 by emptypockets

[wes360]

30 minutes ago, emptypockets said:

So you are saying the visa is simply to allow you to stay in Thailand. Hardly surprising. This is a problem that immigration are aware of and seem to be making an effort to stop this from happening by people they see as not being 100% genuine.

I don't judge you for wanting to stay in Thailand, it's a great place to be.

The answer to your 'why and what' questions is quite simple.

It is the law.

Over 50's don't make the law, married people don't make the law and Elite visa holders don't make the law.

Unfortunately people cannot simply go and live wherever they want, they must abide by the rules no matter how self entitled they think they are.

But half a million bhat bypasses that law right ? 

[The Theory]

The IO was actually too nice to you. Not all get lucky as much as you.

[wes360]

2 minutes ago, The Theory said:

The IO was actually too nice to you. Not all get lucky as much as you.

I don't see him as being too nice and I wasn't lucky I had been staying here on a Ed visa and going to school I had to go UK for 3 days so got a re-entry permit so I came back in on the ed visa that I had originally been staying here on and once I proved I could speak Thai he let me in how is that being too nice or me being lucky ? 

[Sheryl]

I have friends studying medicine at Mahidol University since years on an ED Visa, they have never been asked once.
These type of visas are meant for that kind of education i would guess...

Exactly. People enrolled in (and attending) bona fide degree programs have no problem.

The problem is those taking an odd course here or there, esoecially if they do so for a long time or right after a string if tourist entries.

But the blame IMO lies with immigration for not making a clearcut policy. Either limit it to degree programs or specify a time limit for non-degree courses.

Leaving people uncertain of whether they'll be allowed into the country is no way to go about things.

Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[cerox]

Yes you are right, it is the root cause for the tightening up.

 

I speak Thai, I learned it for 2-3 years here. I regret it. Wasted my time and now they want me to force buying Elite.

I will leave soon for now, things change now on a weekly basis. Who knows next year they might have 1/2 year Elite options, for those who want to be flexible. Maybe I like Vietnam or the Philippines - if not Elite is still an option if everything else fails. Just trying to stay flexible - the main reason why we use ED visa compared to Elite. ED is more expensive (yearly in total) than Elite.

 

If I stayed now, I just want a simple visa, not to attend any classes. That is what most people, unlike me because I actually learned Thai, did in the past. Of course people know the purpose of ED visas - everyone knows it is just a corrupt system to stay here if you are not 50. Immigration knows and they do not care in certain cities like CNX for now. But the consulates started caring.

 

The funny thing is the Thais are hurt the most by that. What about all the language schools now? Most of the students, no matter if they actually study, are ED visa holders. Must mean a lot of them should close down in the future.

[ExpatDraco]

3 minutes ago, cerox said:

ED is more expensive (yearly in total) than Elite.

That probably depends on where you study...

[cerox]

Talking about the total cost.

Usually for me:

- around 30k for the school

- 3x extensions around 6k in total

- around 80 USD for consulates (~2500 THB)

- travel trip to the consulate - at least 15k THB

 

Surely possible cheaper. But my main point is there is no big difference to the 50k Elite price - but flexibility is what we liked in the past. Now made impossible unfortunately.

 

[The Theory]

11 minutes ago, wes360 said:

I don't see him as being too nice and I wasn't lucky I had been staying here on a Ed visa and going to school I had to go UK for 3 days so got a re-entry permit so I came back in on the ed visa that I had originally been staying here on and once I proved I could speak Thai he let me in how is that being too nice or me being lucky ? 

It is not important at all what you think or what you believe.

That is Thai immigration and they do what they think is right. 

[Suradit69]

19 hours ago, wes360 said:

 

I had a month left on my ed visa but had to go back to England for 3 days last week so got a re-entry permit 

Are you talking about an extension of stay and re-entry permit. How would you use a visa and re-entry permit?

 

 

[wes360]

Just now, Suradit69 said:

Are you talking about an extension of stay and re-entry permit. How would you use a visa and re-entry permit?

 

 

Yes I worded it wrong I was on a 3 month extension of stay and had a month left I knew they would not let me come back in on a visa exempt so I got a re-entry permit on my extension, dose that make sense ? 

[The Theory]

I have met even a retired man on ED visa since he could not meet the requirements for retirement extension. Abusing visa is well known by IOs. 

If you want to share your experience with others you better be ready to read opinions or facts from others that you are not aware of. 

Good luck 

Edited September 11, 2019 by The Theory

[wes360]

2 minutes ago, The Theory said:

I have met even a retired man on ED visa since he had neither 800,000 nor monthly fund transfer. Abusing visa is well known by IOs. 

If you want to share your experience with others you better be ready to read opinions or facts from others that you are not aware of. 

Good luck 

I am here on a Ed visa and have done the required amount of lessons set by my school tbf I could of only done 80hrs but paid a little extra to do 20hrs more as I saw it worth the money so how did I abuse the system ? Why is this forum full of so many butt hurts 

[ExpatDraco]

46 minutes ago, cerox said:

Talking about the total cost.

Usually for me:

- around 30k for the school

- 3x extensions around 6k in total

- around 80 USD for consulates (~2500 THB)

- travel trip to the consulate - at least 15k THB

 

Surely possible cheaper. But my main point is there is no big difference to the 50k Elite price - but flexibility is what we liked in the past. Now made impossible unfortunately.

 

Ah, you are comparing vs the 20y Elite.

[darrendsd]

2 hours ago, Captain 776 said:

They know........most use this for a scam to get a Visa when you are not old enough for a Retirement Visa or some other reason.

No one really comes to Thailand solely to learn Thai.

You said you have Ed Visa since 2017..........if that’s the case and you had 2 yrs of Thai..........your Thai should be fluent by now..........is it?

 

If I was him I would talk to you in Thai...........your responses would determine the next move.

It seems your ability to read English is just as bad as those that don't really study Thai

[Myran]

20 hours ago, ThomasThBKK said:

I have friends studying medicine at Mahidol University since years on an ED Visa, they have never been asked once.

These type of visas are meant for that kind of education i would guess...

Are you seriously comparing studying medicine at an actual university with studying Thai at some visa factory?

[darrendsd]

2 hours ago, wes360 said:

I will say the same to you please read the whole thread if your going to comment I have clearly said twice that I have been studying for just under 1 year and that I done a 100 hour course ! Clearly I can speak some Thai otherwise I would have been turnt away ! 

OP please ignore these type of posters

 

They think they are special because they have a 1 year visa

 

What they don't realize is that that's all it is - 1 year and things can and are changing and very soon they could be in the same position as a lot of people - scrambling around for the next visa as they can't meet the requirements for the 1 year i'm special visa they are on now

 

[ThomasThBKK]

3 minutes ago, Myran said:

Are you seriously comparing studying medicine at an actual university with studying Thai at some visa factory?

 

Are you seriously not able to grasp context?

 

Study at real university = no problem

Study at Visamill with the sole purpose to stay in thailand = goodbye

[jacko45k]

1 hour ago, wes360 said:

But if I am going to try live here then at least I'm willing to learn the language, I know guys living here that are over 50 been coming for over 10 years and only know a handful of Thai words don't you think that's abit disrespectful ?

 

And don't worry about all the young studs running around shagging all the girls there is plenty to go around you old boys will still get yours don't worry

So what.. going to become a Buddhist too? To not do so would be disrespectful.

Give Thailand it's own right to decide who it wants living here.

[Just Weird]

20 hours ago, timendres said:

So, almost one year on the ED visa, and 100 hours. At best, 3 hours per week. Not really serious schooling, is it? I believe that this is precisely the "education" that immigration has decided will no longer qualify. I am not judging you at all, just saying that I think immigration is changing their concept of what an ED visa is 

"...just saying that I think immigration is changing their concept of what an ED visa is..."

..or what some people actually use it for!

[Just Weird]

21 hours ago, wes360 said:

He called over another Io who started to question me and asked what I was doing here I told him I had been studying for the last year and he called me a lair,

 

Lucky for me I had really been studying but will admit I only done 100 hours of Thai language

Did he actually use the word "liar" ("lair"?), or is that just how you are choosing to interpret his suspicion and his questions?

 

Even if he did, literally, call you a liar, he wouldn't have been far off the mark as you haven't been "studying for the last year", you only done [sic] 100 hours of study as a sop to appease the visa requirements.

Edited September 11, 2019 by Just Weird

[Caldera]

1 hour ago, Sheryl said:

But the blame IMO lies with immigration for not making a clearcut policy. Either limit it to degree programs or specify a time limit for non-degree courses.

Exactly.

 

On paper, the Ministry of Education is supposed to do quality control on these schools and their programs. To apply for a visa to study at any such informal school, the school needs to apply for a letter of approval to be presented at the consulate as crucial part of the paperwork, after all. It takes many weeks to get that letter, so one could mistake them for actually doing their job.

 

Unfortunately they are completely useless and do a really crappy job (as with pretty much everything else they do, which is why most Thais are denied a quality education).

 

What's annoying is that the Thai authorities don't clean up this mess between themselves and choose to take it out on unsuspecting visa applicants instead. If the Ministry of Education has issued an approval letter, a consulate shouldn't refuse to grant a visa because they don't like the school in question. Consulates shouldn't be in the business of accrediting Thai schools. They should take up their concerns with the Ministry of Education to get their act together.

[cerox]

Really guys, ED visa is like many said here just used to stay here. Some learned Thai in the past, some did not, nobody cares. Including Immigration does not care, because now it is about the next visa.

Nobody is here to study medicine, not talking about small minorities.

 

I am curious why so many people are offended by that. How many of you actually use Elite visa and paid up-front for 20 years?

 

It is good for you if you qualify for retirement visa, but most of us are too young for that. We are happy for you that you get an easy visa for only 1.9k THB yearly - but I would appreciate if people stopped judging those trying to use ED visas to stay here. I and I think many others would happily deposit 800k in a bank and get a visa for free if we could. I am not complaining, just asking to stop judging those who cant.

[Just Weird]

2 hours ago, darrendsd said:

But he didn't tell the I/O about the 100 hours so what's your point?

 

The I/O obviously had a problem from the start that the OP was on a ED Visa - as soon as he was tested on his Thai he was allowed to enter

 

No big deal - this has happened before at the Airports but as usual the TV brigade make a mountain out of a molehill

 

 

It seems that those making mountains out of molehills are, in reality, the posters who start the whinging OPs, and then only when they get caught out (or nearly caught out) for abusing the visa system and forcing them, as in this OP's case, to consider alternatives for next time.

[cerox]

Caldera,

I think the same way. It would be really nice if the MOE just denied the documents. But doing it at the consulate is "too late". Not everyone wants to get a new passport all the time. Apart from the cost and waiting time it just takes too much effort/time. Driving licenses, green/blue books, bank account references, current visa stamps, have to be changed with a new passport. Too much effort only for a 50/50 chance to get a visa, because maybe next week your school is on that blacklist.

[Just Weird]

2 hours ago, wes360 said:

But half a million bhat bypasses that law right ? 

Yes, sort of, except that going the Elite route is not bypassing any law, it is legal, as is investing B10m in Thailand, that would also get you a visa.  The one who is bypassing the law in spirit, if not wholly in practice, is you.

 

Can't you see the difference between those circumstances and someone who "only done" [sic] a few unsuccessful hours in a school for no other reason than to stay here for as long as possible, for as little as possible?

Edited September 11, 2019 by Just Weird

[Just Weird]

2 hours ago, wes360 said:

But if I am going to try live here then at least I'm willing to learn the language, I know guys living here that are over 50 been coming for over 10 years and only know a handful of Thai words don't you think that's abit disrespectful ?

"But if I am going to try live here then at least I'm willing to learn the language..."

Apparently that's not exactly the case according to you, have you learned the language?

 

"I know guys living here that are over 50 been coming for over 10 years and only know a handful of Thai words don't you think that's abit disrespectful ?"

I'd bet that they didn't all come here on the pretence of learning the language to get their visas!  Only being able to speak a handful of Thai words is not disrespectful at all and certainly not as disrespectful as using a non-ED visa to not learn Thai very well in order to stay here.

Edited September 11, 2019 by Just Weird

[London Boy]

13 hours ago, wes360 said:

The problem with the elite visa is what do I get for half a million bhat ? Why should we pay half a million bhat to stay in Thailand just because we are under 50 or not married to a Thai if we was we would only have to pay 10,000 for 5 years, at least with a ed visa I'm getting something for the extra money I'm paying to stay here, like my new visa will cost me 68k bhat but I will get training 2x a day 6x a week for one year and get to stay here for a year a elite visa will cost me 100k a year and I get some free taxis and other stuff I'm not interested in, always makes me laugh how everyone on here (I don't mean you) is always pushing the elite visa like it's worth it how many people on here that is over 50 or married to a Thai have a elite visa ? 

I recently finished a 9 month stint at Chakrit Muay Thai School in Phrom Phong. ฿38,000 for 75 lessons and the Ed visa. By no means staright forward, I saw IO offices occasionaly doing spot checks at the school, and Khun Chakrit often complained how hard they made it for him. They've recently reduced it to a 6 month visa now.

[Myran]

1 hour ago, ThomasThBKK said:

 

Are you seriously not able to grasp context?

 

Study at real university = no problem

Study at Visamill with the sole purpose to stay in thailand = goodbye

The context being that you're dragging university studies into a discussion that has nothing to do with it.

 

ED visas from university studies have always had different rules, like getting one year extensions for multiple years instead of 90 day extensions for a maximum of 1 year before having to apply for a new visa outside of Thailand.

 

Of course people studying for actual degrees at accredited universities aren't going to be bunched up with people "studying" at visa factories – the two are completely unrelated.