Lack of European visitors the cause of Thailand's tourism woes, says hotelier

[lapamita]

i am leaving februaray as planned already a year

 

waht means ( thais cant forward thinking)

 

if one good expat leaving , ist not only one

 

-my familly was comming over 15 yrs here, every year , will be finnished too

- min 3 friends not more

 

and just to tell over 30 years get min over 50 people , first timers to thailand, bcs i was staying here.

 

The money made here from me in the good years,was mostly spend again here, but for the money i made, ten times more was comming in, bcs i get  a lot of people here , spending mnimum 10 time the money i made here.

 

Thats following thinkng.. i drive car the car in front dont brake, but the car before him..what i do i use the brake too, in knowlddge that within second the car in front of me brake *******and thais,what they do**** , every action brings a reaction............

 

 

[Janner1]

On 9/18/2019 at 6:45 AM, petermik said:

This is all well and good BUT the big question is will anyone in the Government here take any notice

Simple honest answer is NO and when it becomes obvious to them and hence too freaking late they still will not accept it.

Thailand does need the Europeans but aspects of the Government racially hate us and the millions of daily baht spend that now does not happen will not break this mindset.

 

The Chinese when they come, do not spend to the same capacity as Europeans and the cheep Charlie Indians who sleep 6 to a room but only pay for one is another story.

 

I do not know the answer of Why they Carry out this self inflicted problem but one thing I do know is that for the first time in my life I have to have my fingerprints taken on arrival and departure and there is no recourse to a refusal, and although I have NEVER committed any criminal offence any where in the world the Thai Government has gone a long way towards making me feel like a criminal.

 

So much so that now every time I arrive at Suvarnabumhi airport because of this and the other stupid unnecessary rules and regulations I am forced to accept I have a serious feeling of trepidation that I could be refused entry because some illiterate IO entered mis - information on my computer record.

 

i am not a criminal and I come to Thailand because I love the country ,culture, food and people so why is the Government demeaning me? 

 

Millions of Brits have gone on holiday this year and have not given a toss about Brexit but they have not come to Thailand, they now go to other S/E Asian countries because there they will not be insulted or forced to comply with mis guided rules and regulation forced upon them

 

But you can not tell the Thai government because they will not listen

[BritManToo]

20 hours ago, Isaanbiker said:

I was there about 15 years ago and hated it. 

I liked Hua Hin, used to sit at the harbour in a pier restaurant hanging over the water.

[Tayaout]

22 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I liked Hua Hin, used to sit at the harbour in a pier restaurant hanging over the water.

I was there this year. The beach is ok. I stayed on a hotel restaurant hanging over water. It was hard to find any Thai food and everything was 3X the price. Cham Am is better for someone who want a "Thai" experience. 

[Tayaout]

22 hours ago, BritManToo said:

let's assume retired expat.

65k x 12 = 800,000 bht.

Then they estimate there's around 1 million expats living here. = 800,000,000,000bht/year.

 

That's 800 Billion Baht/year.

or $25 Billion/year (or 30% of the entire tourist industry).

No need to do any estimate. The numbers are on Wikipedia and excluding ASEAN workers the number of expat is ridiculously small. Probably almost no retired expat once you remove working expat.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Thailand

Edited September 24, 2019 by Tayaout

[AussieBob18]

On 9/24/2019 at 10:15 AM, Tayaout said:

No need to do any estimate. The numbers are on Wikipedia and excluding ASEAN workers the number of expat is ridiculously small. Probably almost no retired expat once you remove working expat.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Thailand

So if Wiki is right, there are about 200,000 'foreigners' in Thailand - retirees, extended tourists, workers.

Using Britmantoo numbers :  800,000 baht x 200,000 equals 160,000,000,000 baht per year.

Plus as many have said and we all know is true - we all spend a lot on property, cars, girls, family, etc etc

And the reality is that we spend more than 800K and that there are more than 200k in Thailand, but lets just say 250,0000 and stick to 800k psent.  Well that still equals 200 Billion Baht a year and a large amount of that is slowing or stopping - for all the reasons mentioned by myself and others. 

 

Then you look at the tourists that are not coming in the same numbers anymore, and the picture gets much worse.  Much worse. According to TAT over 35 million tourists came to Thailand in 2017, and yet the money from tourism is way down, despite TAT claims that more money is coming in.   But they were warned that is a lie:  Despite the increasing number of tourist arrivals, some businesses catering to the tourist trade report declining numbers. Mr Sompoch Sukkaew, chief legal counsel of the Patong Entertainment Business Association (PEBA) in Phuket, said in January 2016 that entertainment businesses are suffering.  PEBA President Weerawit Kuresombat attributed the decline to the rise in Chinese tourism. "...most of them [Chinese tourists] come on complete tour packages....This means they spend very little on extras....They rarely venture out for the nightlife or even visit independent restaurants. They just don't spend much", he said.

 

 

So what is Tourism worth to Thailand?  TAT claims it went from 1 trillion baht in 2013 to 2.53 trillion baht in 2016 because of them - as they do in Thailand.  And yet the evidence is that the revenues from tourism dropped and we know why.  TAT focusssed on the tourism growth from China and India, and neglected the West. But they used the revenue numbers per tourist that were based on a demographic that did not include Chinese and Indian tourists, and applied that to the larger numbers that included the Chinese and Indian.  In 2006 the top 10 incoming tourists were from the following countries (in order): Malaysia, Japan, Sth Korea, China, UK, USA, Singapore, Australia, Germany, Taiwan. In 2017 the top 10 incoming tourists were from the following countries (in order): China (huge), Malaysia, Sth Korea, Laos, Japan, India, Russia, USA, Singapore, Vietnam.  We all know most Malaysians enter down south and visit family/friends - not really tourists. So look at the next 9 countries in 2006 and except for China and Taiwan they are all 'spenders' with local Thai businesses.  Look at the numbers in 2017 and the vast majority of incoming 'tourists' are not 'spenders'.  China went from 900K to 10 million in that time.  As the Patong guy said - without saying it - it is all a big lie (exaggeration).  So now we know the real reason why the head of TAT was sacked - these are public numbers.

 

As the title of the OP says - the economic problems in Thailand is due to BOTH the lack of Western (Europe plus USA, Australia etc) tourists, and the Western retirees, extended tourists and workers, that are not spending money in Thailand as much as they used to.  Add to that the high Baht and the 'crackdown' on Western tourists, retirees and workers, and you have the main reasons for the economic downturn in Thailand.

 

Add to that the potential for the China economy to slow dramatically and you have the recipe for a looming economic disaster in Thailand.  IMO Thailand must change policies to devalue the Baht substantially, and remove all of the unecessary 'immigration' crackdowns, or the economy will continue to crash.  And to all those who think it is not up to the Thai Govt to devalue the Baht - there are many things Thailand (or any Government) can do to either decrease or increase their currency's value.  Government policies regarding interest rates and currency purchases and inflation are a start, as are policies for export and import taxes and subsidies, as is Government debt - and many more.  Some say the current high Baht has been 'encouraged' so that Military purchases are cheaper and they thought it would be 'paid for' by increasing tourism.  If that is true then hopefully they have/will realise their big mistake (no need to admit it) and reverse their currency policy decisions on currency and western foreigners both visiting and living in Thailand.

 

Ooops - I just kept going - sorry for the 'venting'.   It is so unecessary what has happened to the Thai people.

 

[jvs]

I visit Kanchanaburi a few times a year,went there last week also.

For the first time i had a resort almost to myself.

Went to the bridge and for the first time i could take a picture of an empty bridge!!

There was no body except grumpy looking Thai people.

Restaurants closed or empty,talked to a bar owner and he said i was the first customer in three days,one coke is not going to make  things better for him.

No chinese tourists there,not yet any way.

Something is going on and it is not good.

[zydeco]

On 9/20/2019 at 8:03 PM, garyk said:

You must be European?  I live in Texas and grew up on the border.

Yea the gangs are killing other gangs and it is not very safe in places. Same can be said for Thailand.

Stop watching the 10:00 news.  haha

 

No, I grew up and lived off and on in Texas AND Mexico for about 40 years.

[DrTuner]

4 hours ago, jvs said:

I visit Kanchanaburi a few times a year,went there last week also.

For the first time i had a resort almost to myself.

Went to the bridge and for the first time i could take a picture of an empty bridge!!

There was no body except grumpy looking Thai people.

Restaurants closed or empty,talked to a bar owner and he said i was the first customer in three days,one coke is not going to make  things better for him.

No chinese tourists there,not yet any way.

Something is going on and it is not good.

Nice, if it wasn't for grumpy Thais, I'd pay a visit, never been there. The Chinese tourist hordes are insufferable.

[johng]

5 hours ago, jvs said:

Went to the bridge and for the first time i could take a picture of an empty bridge!!

If you get there early.

 

[jvs]

3 hours ago, johng said:

If you get there early.

 

I was there around eleven in the morning.(11 am.)

[SmartyMarty]

when hotels get down to 30% occupancy, as many have reported, things are indeed grim.

[ivor bigun]

I last visited H H over 10 years ago and it was so disgusting I never went back. Horrible place.

We went about 10 yrs ago,it was closed.

Sent from my SM-A720F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[JamJar]

On 9/24/2019 at 12:35 AM, Janner1 said:

Simple honest answer is NO and when it becomes obvious to them and hence too freaking late they still will not accept it.

Thailand does need the Europeans but aspects of the Government racially hate us and the millions of daily baht spend that now does not happen will not break this mindset.

 

The Chinese when they come, do not spend to the same capacity as Europeans and the cheep Charlie Indians who sleep 6 to a room but only pay for one is another story.

 

I do not know the answer of Why they Carry out this self inflicted problem but one thing I do know is that for the first time in my life I have to have my fingerprints taken on arrival and departure and there is no recourse to a refusal, and although I have NEVER committed any criminal offence any where in the world the Thai Government has gone a long way towards making me feel like a criminal.

 

So much so that now every time I arrive at Suvarnabumhi airport because of this and the other stupid unnecessary rules and regulations I am forced to accept I have a serious feeling of trepidation that I could be refused entry because some illiterate IO entered mis - information on my computer record.

 

i am not a criminal and I come to Thailand because I love the country ,culture, food and people so why is the Government demeaning me? 

 

Millions of Brits have gone on holiday this year and have not given a toss about Brexit but they have not come to Thailand, they now go to other S/E Asian countries because there they will not be insulted or forced to comply with mis guided rules and regulation forced upon them

 

But you can not tell the Thai government because they will not listen

 

I don't know about racial hate. Cannot say that I agree with that statement. 

Look at Britain for example. Some will have prejudice against Muslims. Some against Jews etc 

So to suggest that Thai people are somewhat against you as a race, is just wrong.

Of course some will have prejudices, but it is up to you to change them.

 

If, for instance, they are attempting to change the image that Thailand may have internationally, they might target certain sectors. 

No many here complained when they targeted Africans, because in the eyes of many posters, they are all "up to no good". Appalling for those not interested in breaking the law.

But once they began to look at you, you claim racial bias.

 

I agree with you on some points. The uncomfortable experience all the way from applying for a visa until you are actually land-side and then you having to navigate through the scams and corruption.

 

But on the other hand, people are people and to label all Thais because of the actions of a rotten few is unfair.

It's just a shame that the rotten few are setting the example. it's like having bad parents. They can't give you love, so they give you money instead.

You too. Stop talking about everything in terms of money. Make a good impression, so that the people whom you meet can say good things about you.

Slagging off the Chinese and Indians won't stand you in good stead with anyone, other than other hateful people.

 

[thaibeachlovers]

On 10/1/2019 at 3:30 PM, jvs said:

I visit Kanchanaburi a few times a year,went there last week also.

For the first time i had a resort almost to myself.

Went to the bridge and for the first time i could take a picture of an empty bridge!!

There was no body except grumpy looking Thai people.

Restaurants closed or empty,talked to a bar owner and he said i was the first customer in three days,one coke is not going to make  things better for him.

No chinese tourists there,not yet any way.

Something is going on and it is not good.

Nothing for Chinese in Kanchanaburi except maybe the floating resorts. It was the western tourists going to see the Death Railway/ bridge that the town was built on. If less western tourists it follows that less will go there.

[Dnyy]

Thailand just doesn't have to offer much for tourists outside of beach areas. Even places like Hua Hin aren't great at alle. The beach is mediocre at best (horse<deleted> everywhere, dirty water, jellyfish plague) and the city itself is just a road with two malls and some small shops in between. No (local)culture but purely commercial everything.