Army chief Gen Apirat warns Thailand is facing “hybrid warfare”

[30la]

Is this the beginning of a new coup ???

[Caldera]

He's full of as per usual. A living example for the value of the elsewhere long-established principle that the armed forces have no place in politics. What will it take for the Thais to rid Thailand of that evil influence?

Edited October 12, 2019 by Caldera
Typo

[NanLaew]

2 hours ago, Denim said:

Oh.....and grant ourselves immunity from any and all future prosecutions.

You mean grant ourselves CONSTITUTIONAL immunity from any and all future prosecutions.

 

A protection instigated by Boonyaratglin to ensure last weeks usurpers couldn't be banged up by next week's usurpers.

[Burma Bill]

18 hours ago, canopus1969 said:

Reds under beds

Shirts to be precise!

[Burma Bill]

His ultimate aim is another coup and total military rule of this country - watch this space!

[phkauf]

So Aprirat is deathly afraid of Communism and yet he keeps sucking at the teats of China for his new weaponry and advice (and likely enormous "gifts").

His comments are so scary, way beyond the typical nonsense coming from Thai politicians and military in the past.

[scorecard]

20 hours ago, cornishcarlos said:

 

aka politicians with different views to those of the "government"

Or generally called the opposition, in most countries !!!

And he's trying to brand modern attitudes to socialism as communism. 

 

And surely any citizen has the right and the responsibility as an individual or as a political party to suggest reforms in anything including the country's military. But in his view the public (the owners of Thailand) are not allowed to speak on such subjects. 

 

And all at the same time he and the PM try to proclaim they support / aim to improve Thailand's picture of democracy.

 

On top of all of this why is this general making such announcements? Dangerous. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Eligius]

1 hour ago, Caldera said:

He's full of as per usual. A living example for the value of the elsewhere long-established principle that the armed forces have no place in politics. What will it take for the Thais to rid Thailand of that evil influence?

It will take a massive, culture-transforming, international news-making event and series of events.

But the Thais do not have anything like the mettle for it - not in a thousand years. Nor do they even really wish for such change (not really).

'Mai pen rai. Let's take a selfie of me and my noodle soup and put it on Fae-Book.'  That is much more important, don't you know?!

 

Edited October 12, 2019 by Eligius

[Scott Tracy]

He has to justify his position and huge budget. Time for the current PM to clip some wings, as this guy could well be the next coup leader. Twas ever thus....

[bowerboy]

There is a shocking video of an attack on red shirts from 2010 that can be found on Facebook.

 

The rage and hatred and willing ness to attack and kill unarmed protesters is shocking.

 

Given the context of this thread you can guess who is the person attacking. Said person is even being held back by his own soldiers who can see how wrong the situation is.

 

It is the pure rage and hatred of an utter physcopath...if the protesters were armed it would be valiant....considering they are unarmed and very harmless looking it is truly shocking.....very dangerous individual indeed.

[cmsally]

4 hours ago, neeray said:

Thanks cmsally. I've been reading each post carefully trying to sleuth out the justification for using the word "hybrid" by the army chief. (thought that might mean guns and digital propaganda)

But your suggestion of "hydra" might be more correct. I had to do a Wiki on "hydra".

Hydra is a fictional terrorist organization appearing in American comic books published by Marvel Comics.

Well personally I prefer the version from Greek mythology !

Quote

According to Hesiod, the Hydra was the offspring of Typhon and Echidna.^[3] It had poisonous breath and blood so virulent that even its scent was deadly.^[4] The Hydra possessed many heads, the exact number of which varies according to the source. Later versions of the Hydra story add a regeneration feature to the monster: for every head chopped off, the Hydra would regrow two heads.^[5] Heracles required the assistance of his nephew Iolaus to cut off all of the monster's heads and burn the neck using sword and fire.

Strangely when I first read the title , I automatically inserted "hydra" for "hybrid". I had to go and reread to realise it was hybrid. This often happens when I skim read and brings up some interesting results such as this one.

[scorecard]

21 hours ago, Thaiwrath said:

Their ultimate aim is to win elections

 

 

And Prayut's ultimate aim is to make sure they don't win elections at any cost, otherwise, him and all his cronies at the trough are finished, and Thailand can look to move forward !

"... finished at the trough' is just one aspect.

 

I believe their fear is loss of military control of the country, loss of military status, and they will fight however to see that nothing whatever changes in terms of the military control they now have. 

 

I do however wonder how coordinated the army general who just have the lecture and PM really are. They come from totally different and both very powerful factions in the army. 

I also wonder how wise it is for this general to be talking / making comments about the kxxx?

[Srikcir]

1 hour ago, phkauf said:

So Aprirat is deathly afraid of Communism and yet he keeps sucking at the teats of China for his new weaponry and advice (and likely enormous "gifts").

His comments are so scary, way beyond the typical nonsense coming from Thai politicians and military in the past.

Remember also that Communist Laos and Vietnam are part of ASEAN along with Thailand.

How can a democratic monarchy possibly engage in mutual security and trade agreements with Communist China, Laos and Vietnam whose governments should constitute a seditious threat to the Kingdom of Thailand?

But Thailand can and does.

It means that Army chief Gen Apirat is suffering from a “hybrid mentality” that operates in the surreal world.

Excerpt from Communism and Insurrection in Thailand, by Alessandro Casella, published in The World Today Vol. 26, No. 5 (May, 1970), pp. 197-208 (https://www.jstor.org/stable/40394378?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents):

• "fighting communism in Thailand has acquired a metaphysical quality, to such an extent that even the attempts to identify the issue in rational terms are viewed with suspicion. The result is that the fight against Communism ultimately bears little, if any relation, to what Communism really is.
• Stated otherwise, the Thais, for complex political and sociological reasons, created a demon which they chose to call Communism."

Making peace and not war is not a mission for the military.

It is a mission for the civilian politicians who are being demonized by the very military currently in charge of peace talks.

[scorecard]

1 hour ago, Scott Tracy said:

He has to justify his position and huge budget. Time for the current PM to clip some wings, as this guy could well be the next coup leader. Twas ever thus....

Nice idea but I suggest way off realism, in fact I suspect the PM is frightened of this army general and they do come from very different and both very powerful army factions. 

[JAG]

2 hours ago, Burma Bill said:

His ultimate aim is another coup and total military rule of this country - watch this space!

How much longer is he in post for? About another year? knock off 6 months, and there is the date of the coup!

[tabarin]

Funny how he speaks about certain threats in his speech while he and his buddies actually do that with a factor 10. 
Pretty much 97% sure that nothing is going to change in a positive direction, any time soon, in fact, seems it is going to be worse.

Edited October 12, 2019 by tabarin

[zydeco]

16 hours ago, NanLaew said:

Nothing to do with brainwashing of the willfully blind and compliant educated intellectuals.

 

Sloth , indolence, laziness, inertness, and torpor is the national trait that cuts across a whole lot of social strata.

But he is right about the universities and the professors. Remember back in 2014, it was the universities that not only closed for the anti-government protests but actually encouraged students to join them in participating in the pro military coup protests. Where else do you get universities closing down to call upon the military to come out and take over?  Maybe China. That's about it.

[zydeco]

13 hours ago, sunnyboy2018 said:

How many USA citizens own tanks, exocet missiles, artillery batteries and fighter jets? Non. Your suggestion is a specious argument used by the NRA. Its clearly nonsense.

Well, to be fair, the Taliban doesn't own any of those things either, and they seem to be doing a pretty good job against the side that does.

[bowerboy]

4 hours ago, Eligius said:

It will take a massive, culture-transforming, international news-making event and series of events.

But the Thais do not have anything like the mettle for it - not in a thousand years. Nor do they even really wish for such change (not really).

'Mai pen rai. Let's take a selfie of me and my noodle soup and put it on Fae-Book.'  That is much more important, don't you know?!

 

 

So true about the populace not having the mettle for it. 

 

IF (and it’s a big and highly improbable if) anything happens from the people’s side then it will be sparked by something completely out of left field and completely unexpected ...all of the other normal channels are now effectively closed (permanently I would say).

 

One thing I have never understood is why the southern insurgence stays isolated to the south? I have always wondered why they never hit the capital? I think there must be some kind of gentlemen’s agreement happening between both sides.

Edited October 12, 2019 by bowerboy
W

[bowerboy]

But anyway...all of this talk is for absolutely nothing...it really is game over...completely and without any hope whatsoever of anything changing now....they have this place in a complete choke hold now and it is impossible for the country to get out of that grip now....the only change possible is a coup but that will bring something much worse than when have now.

 

They HAVE won. Totally. There is no denying it unfortunately.

[canuckamuck]

9 minutes ago, bowerboy said:

But anyway...all of this talk is for absolutely nothing...it really is game over...completely and without any hope whatsoever of anything changing now....they have this place in a complete choke hold now and it is impossible for the country to get out of that grip now....the only change possible is a coup but that will bring something much worse than when have now.

 

They HAVE won. Totally. There is no denying it unfortunately.

No one likes to admit it, but they have played their hand perfectly. The Thais very unlikely to ever make the changes necessary to get representation in government. A facade of democracy is all they know and everyone knows their place. 

 

[Eligius]

26 minutes ago, bowerboy said:

But anyway...all of this talk is for absolutely nothing...it really is game over...completely and without any hope whatsoever of anything changing now....they have this place in a complete choke hold now and it is impossible for the country to get out of that grip now....the only change possible is a coup but that will bring something much worse than when have now.

 

They HAVE won. Totally. There is no denying it unfortunately.

Sadly, I have to agree with you, Bowerboy (above, and above that): THEY have won. And they have won without even the pretence of a fight, of a kick-back, of resistance, of non-cooperation from the People. Nothing. Zero. Nada (except for a few very, very brave individual souls - mainly young students).

 

When I look back over history and stand in awe at the way whole nations opposed tyranny or were even formed (at huge risk and personal danger) on the entire concept of liberty and freedom of speech and political opinion - and then look at what the Thais have made (or allowed to be made) of their nation: well, you can fill in the rest for yourself ....

       

Edited October 12, 2019 by Eligius

[kingofthemountain]

On 10/11/2019 at 3:33 PM, webfact said:

Army Commander-in-Chief Gen Apirat Kongsompong warned this morning that Thailand is facing what he described as a “hybrid warfare” being waged by a collection of “ill-intentioned politicians”,  remnants of communist ideologues and “foreign forces” against the country’s major establishments.

I wonder if the ''virtual army'' of the risky long term visitors over 50 yo who populate in big numbers the thai visa forum is included in the ''foreing forces''.

After all the tought is sometimes sharper than the sword and all the

harassment against the ''aliens'' in the last years could be make sense in this context.

Edited October 12, 2019 by kingofthemountain

[scorecard]

1 hour ago, bowerboy said:

 

So true about the populace not having the mettle for it. 

 

IF (and it’s a big and highly improbable if) anything happens from the people’s side then it will be sparked by something completely out of left field and completely unexpected ...all of the other normal channels are now effectively closed (permanently I would say).

 

One thing I have never understood is why the southern insurgence stays isolated to the south? I have always wondered why they never hit the capital? I think there must be some kind of gentlemen’s agreement happening between both sides.

Part of the answer is old history about some parts of the far South (high muslim populated parts) belonging to Malaysia and they want their area back under Malaysian territory and culture.

[Caldera]

A Thai citizen is about one million times more likely to get shot by their own army than by the armies of "evil" Burma and Angkor combined.

 

Thai soldiers have neither honor nor shame, always a horrible combination.

[bowerboy]

2 hours ago, Eligius said:

Sadly, I have to agree with you, Bowerboy (above, and above that): THEY have won. And they have won without even the pretence of a fight, of a kick-back, of resistance, of non-cooperation from the People. Nothing. Zero. Nada (except for a few very, very brave individual souls - mainly young students).

 

When I look back over history and stand in awe at the way whole nations opposed tyranny or were even formed (at huge risk and personal danger) on the entire concept of liberty and freedom of speech and political opinion - and then look at what the Thais have made (or allowed to be made) of their nation: well, you can fill in the rest for yourself ....

       

 

I know....the complete and total capitulation of the populace could not be any more pathetic...pure apathy, sloth and laziness. It has very hard to respect anyone who has such complete and utter apathy towards the future of their children and the country they live in....one of the many reasons my time here is limited until I can get relocated out of here. Sadly the events of the last 10 years (and particularly the last 6 to 8 months) have made it very hard for me to respect the people I live amongst and my disdain is becoming increasingly obvious to those I interact with here.

 

Not so much as a squeak from the people. I look forward to the “would you risk it” crowd piping up particularly in light of current events elsewhere in Asia (for far far lesser infringements and from people with much much more to lose).

[tgw]

On 10/11/2019 at 11:39 AM, Eligius said:

The general says of these evil, villainous people: '“Their ultimate aim is to win elections, seize executive power, and to change the Constitution,” he said.

Aiming to win elections, eh? Such hellish, vile, disgusting and diabolical criminals!!!!

(I sometimes wonder if Thailand nowadays is a giant, living satire - it surely must be ...).

yes...

Although one thing becoming apparent in the long period of peace we are having in Western countries since 1945, is that democracy as it is practiced in the West is pulling countries towards some sort of politically correct red-green mainstream totalitarism for "the greater good", instead of towards personal freedom.

My opinion of Thailand is that it has preserved more personal liberties than Western countries, and I tend to weigh personal liberties heavier than many.

[scorecard]

4 minutes ago, bowerboy said:

 

I know....the complete and total capitulation of the populace could not be any more pathetic...pure apathy, sloth and laziness. It has very hard to respect anyone who has such complete and utter apathy towards the future of their children and the country they live in....one of the many reasons my time here is limited until I can get relocated out of here. Sadly the events of the last 10 years (and particularly the last 6 to 8 months) have made it very hard for me to respect the people I live amongst and my disdain is becoming increasingly obvious to those I interact with here.

 

Not so much as a squeak from the people. I look forward to the “would you risk it” crowd piping up particularly in light of current events elsewhere in Asia (for far far lesser infringements and from people with much much more to lose).

'Not a squeak from the people'.

 

But let's not forget the ruthless nasty history of this guy's father also a military general (general sunthorn) and the leader of the coup 20 years ago when 200 young defenceless protesting civilians were shot down and killed in the Soi Aree area of Bkk.

 

He and his 2 coup buddies made it very plain that they were in charge like it or not, and they proven this with the incident just above. Plus the 200 bodies were thrown quickly on army trucks and whisked away, never heard of again to this day. Also to this day every attempt to investigate this matter has quickly hit a massive brick wall with severe harassing warnings to stay away.

 

All of this means that there are 200 families still don't know if their son or daughter who never came home was one of the 200 shot down openly and their body disposed of quickly.

 

I have little doubt there will be plenty of folks (esp. Bkk folks) who have not forgotten this nasty incident and would be well aware of the father and son relationship involved, and they would very strongly fear the son who is now the army Chief and is making it clear that he will ensure the military retains its' own glorious self loving brotherhood, regardless of what's practical or needed for Thailand in terms of a military force and with no concern for basic respect for the good citizens of Thailand.  

 

Very sadly it's very unlikely the parents who lost a defenseless unarmed civilian son or daughter shot down 20 years ago in cold blood or their relatives and even the broad community or their now late teenage kids will ever dare to speak up or argue with the current army general or his ilk, his faction, or any army faction.

[londonthai]

he promised not  to meddle in politics, but he does it again.

he is the next coup maker, when prayuth fails his boss

 

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-thailand-politics/thai-opposition-accuses-army-chief-of-meddling-in-politics-instigating-hatred-idUSKBN1WR0BQ

 

[bowerboy]

Every protester through out history have faced these and bigger risks.

 

No one goes to a protest expecting to die. They know things could get out of control but no one goes into it knowingly expecting to die. When people do die it is normally the beginning of an even stronger movement for justice with those deaths as the rallying call (Bloody Sunday, Amritsar are just a couple of examples). 

 

It is no different than driving here. 200 people is just 3 days death toll. No one expects to die when they drive their vehicle but yet many do. It doesn’t stop them driving. What is the difference? I have protested before and things got very ugly...wrong place at the wrong time is part and parcel of it...no one expects to be in the wrong place at the wrong time but it can happen.

 

Look what is happening elsewhere in Asia and around the world....the risks are the same there (if not greater) then they are here.

 

Also that is the first I have ever heard of 200 civilians being shot down...what is the source of that please? If that had been the case then surely it would be there alongside Thammasat University in the annals of history (far less than 200).