Over to EU on Brexit delay, Johnson says after parliament rejects swift decision

[JAG]

12 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

I strongly suggest you get hold of the book ‘Britannia Unchained’ read the diatribe it’s filled with them take note of who the authors are and where they are now.

 

 

 

9 hours ago, kingdong said:

And I strongly advise you to read the ragged trousersed philanthropists.

There is plenty of reading relevant to Brexit and the current situation.

 

Could I suggest starting with the pamphlet sent by the government to every household in the UK prior to the 2016 referendum. In particular the paragraphs describing how the results will be treated. 

 

Then perhaps one could move on to the 2017 General Election Manifestoes of both the Conservative and Labour parties...

[JAG]

1 hour ago, Victornoir said:

Last but not least, we will finally move forward in the construction of a united and friendly Europe, a democratic area of peace and 
prosperity led to develop quietly on the East, 
maybe someday until the Urals

Yes, your last paragraph, which I have taken the liberty of quoting, does ring some bells! Particularly the line about a United Europe in time extending as far east as the Urals.

 

Can't imagine where I have heard the idea before...

[kingdong]

1 hour ago, JAG said:

 

There is plenty of reading relevant to Brexit and the current situation.

 

Could I suggest starting with the pamphlet sent by the government to every household in the UK prior to the 2016 referendum. In particular the paragraphs describing how the results will be treated. 

 

Then perhaps one could move on to the 2017 General Election Manifestoes of both the Conservative and Labour parties...

Didn,t read the project fear leaflet,not really into fiction.

[kingdong]

1 hour ago, JAG said:

Yes, your last paragraph, which I have taken the liberty of quoting, does ring some bells! Particularly the line about a United Europe in time extending as far east as the Urals.

 

Can't imagine where I have heard the idea before...

Will it extend as far as turkey?what a jewel in the crown that would be for the eu.

[kingdong]

3 hours ago, Victornoir said:

As often, Macron says aloud what others think in a low voice: Go out, now!

The British made the most stupid vote in contemporary history. Then, they created chaos in Europe by their indecision. It is time to suffer the consequences.

We Europeans can not wait to tax the Japanese vehicles assembled in Sunderland to give an advantage to Fiat, Renault, wolswagen and Peugeot.

We are also looking forward to taxing the City's financial services to accelerate the development of this industry in Frankfort.
We will also be happy to create new shipping routes to reconstituted Ireland, avoiding the Dover nightmare.
We will finally be able to let the anglophone "refugees" of Calais pass.

Last but not least, we will finally move forward in the construction of a united and friendly Europe, a democratic area of peace and 
prosperity led to develop quietly on the East, 
maybe someday until the Urals..

You,'ll have enough problems of your own when great britain leaves the eu,good luck( not that I give a tinkers cuss )the eu caused all this now you can get on with it

[luckyluke]

28 minutes ago, kingdong said:

You,'ll have enough problems of your own when great britain leaves the eu,good luck

Sure it is not nice to lose a valuable member,

but it is not as it is something

which will happen suddenly.

 

For more than 3 years now the E.U. is aware of it, sure they had the time to put a plan in place.

 

This can be that the 27 members will have to pay more, the beneficiary countries receiving less, a combination,

or whatever.

 

Not easy, sure.

But sure not impossible.

 

The U.K. will find his proper way without being part  of the E.U.;

The E.U. will continue his way without the U.K. being part of it.

Only fools would think that both parties can not live on their own.

 

 

Edited October 24, 2019 by luckyluke

[sandyf]

On 10/23/2019 at 4:20 AM, katana said:

Why don't they just have a vote on removing democracy from Britain and admit they are a dictatorship?

You mean to confirm what we already know.

The referendum treated the devolved nations like outlying regions of England. What other Union holds referendums across all nations.

The UK is a Union within a Union and as by far the largest percentage of population of the UK, the referendum should have been held in England with devolved referendums to decide if they remained in the UK or the EU.

However we are where we are and the dictatorship has shown it's ugly face, the UK must now face the real possibility of an independent Scotland and reunified Ireland.

[Moonlover]

On 10/23/2019 at 4:20 AM, katana said:

Why don't they just have a vote on removing democracy from Britain and admit they are a dictatorship?

On the contrary, the twists and turns of the last few months clearly demonstrate the the UK is still very much a democracy and will remain so. As well remaining a member of the EU.

[evadgib]

9 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

On the contrary, the twists and turns of the last few months clearly demonstrate the the UK is still very much a democracy and will remain so. As well remaining a member of the EU.

Democracy will be cancelled if they dare...

[SheungWan]

How can no deal be ever off the table when it is law, parliament voted for it. The only people that want no deal off the table are the MPs that don't want to leave the EU, and in doing so have weakened the UKs chance of ever getting a satisfactory deal. Shame on the duplicitous remainers for leaving the UK so vunerable.
 

If something is decided by Parliament it can equally be undone by Parliament and Parliament has made it very clear that it doesn't want a no-deal Brexit. Nor do the markets. Sterling's rise now discounting Hard Brexit.

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[SheungWan]

On the contrary, the twists and turns of the last few months clearly demonstrate the the UK is still very much a democracy and will remain so. As well remaining a member of the EU.

The first part yes. The second part, maybe.

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[SheungWan]

You mean to confirm what we already know.
The referendum treated the devolved nations like outlying regions of England. What other Union holds referendums across all nations.
The UK is a Union within a Union and as by far the largest percentage of population of the UK, the referendum should have been held in England with devolved referendums to decide if they remained in the UK or the EU.
However we are where we are and the dictatorship has shown it's ugly face, the UK must now face the real possibility of an independent Scotland and reunified Ireland.

Contributors on both sides should be somewhat careful with the word "dictatorship".

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[SheungWan]

Democracy will be cancelled if they dare...

Certainly the loony Hard Right fringe parties like to issue dark threats.

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[SheungWan]

Sure it is not nice to lose a valuable member,
but it is not as it is something
which will happen suddenly.
 
For more than 3 years now the E.U. is aware of it, sure they had the time to put a plan in place.
 
This can be that the 27 members will have to pay more, the beneficiary countries receiving less, a combination,
or whatever.
 
Not easy, sure.
But sure not impossible.
 
The U.K. will find his proper way without being part  of the E.U.;
The E.U. will continue his way without the U.K. being part of it.

Only fools would think that both parties can not live on their own.
 
 

Could have saved a lot of time just writing the words "life goes on".

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[SheungWan]

You,'ll have enough problems of your own when great britain leaves the eu,good luck( not that I give a tinkers cuss )the eu caused all this now you can get on with it

Shooting oneself in the foot not so bad if the other guy also wounded. [emoji1782]

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[el torro]

We're all screwed.

 

Parliament has made it very clear that it has no interest in the electorate, and there is no way to actually leave the EU - who are prepared to agree endless extensions.

 

UK MPs are praying that the electorate will have forgiven them when they can no longer stop a GE, in 2022.....

[el torro]

And yet again, Macron has shown himself to be nothing other than a puppet spouting lies - until he is forced (by the EU hierarchy) to 'back off'...

 

Even remainers would find it very hard to argue now that the EU is not doing everything in its power to stop the UK leaving without a beneficial EU deal?

[nauseus]

12 hours ago, tebee said:

 

But we have a complete team of brexiters in charge now and we are still nowhere near finding a workable brexit that all can agree on. They have been trying to resort to tricks and subterfuges to get the current deal past without scrutiny - because they realize that once people examine it in detail they will recognize what steaming old pile of old dog5hit it is.

 

Brexit is OK in woolly theory form, but once you try to flesh out the details you realize it's internal contradictions and people say "that's not the brexit I voted for"

 

Washington post puts it better than I can 

 

Boris Johnson is discovering Brexit works only when it’s a fantasy

 

 https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2019/10/23/boris-johnson-is-discovering-that-brexit-only-works-when-its-fantasy/

 

 

Brexit is a rose with a lot of thorns which offers politicians a precious resource: the ability to claim they are representing the will of the people, as expressed in the 2016 referendum. It is however,almost impossible to deliver while keeping the whole disparate coalition of people who support it on board. Whenever it moves from rhetoric to policy reality, it pricks their fingers.

I do agree that it is dog5hit and I agree that 3 days is insufficient time for debate. But this pile of poo is still largely the 5hit that May managed to achieve and that is because, as a remainer, she allowed the negotiations to be run by the EU from the outset. Boris is too fixated on getting out of the EU by Halloween, his ego is at stake, plus there was no change to renegotiate completely in the time that he has had.

 

You may say that parliament is doing its democratic duty but most of them are remainers who seem happy to drag this out until Brexit fails and they can let the EU take more and more control over the governance of the EU. This possibility is one of the prime drivers of the leave vote. It seems to me that the majority of today's MPs are too lazy or too incompetent to do their own jobs w.r.t lawmaking. Both government and parliament are not functioning and a reset in the form of a general election is required now.

Edited October 24, 2019 by nauseus

[nauseus]

7 hours ago, Victornoir said:

As often, Macron says aloud what others think in a low voice: Go out, now!

The British made the most stupid vote in contemporary history. Then, they created chaos in Europe by their indecision. It is time to suffer the consequences.

We Europeans can not wait to tax the Japanese vehicles assembled in Sunderland to give an advantage to Fiat, Renault, wolswagen and Peugeot.

We are also looking forward to taxing the City's financial services to accelerate the development of this industry in Frankfort.
We will also be happy to create new shipping routes to reconstituted Ireland, avoiding the Dover nightmare.
We will finally be able to let the anglophone "refugees" of Calais pass.

Last but not least, we will finally move forward in the construction of a united and friendly Europe, a democratic area of peace and 
prosperity led to develop quietly on the East, 
maybe someday until the Urals..

Looking for another Stalingrad? And you call the vote stupid!

[nauseus]

7 hours ago, SheungWan said:

I wouldn't give the Hard Brexiteers anything they asked for until no-deal is totally off the table.

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Get the EU to amend Article 50 then.

[SheungWan]

Looking for another Stalingrad? And you call the vote stupid!

Hello! Its WW2 reference time again.

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[nauseus]

53 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

Could have saved a lot of time just writing the words "life goes on".

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You are forgetting freedom of expression - I liked it.

[nauseus]

9 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

Hello! Its WW2 reference time again.

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Hello! This Gaullist nonsense fantasy is dangerous and deserves it.

[spiekerjozef]

On 10/23/2019 at 4:13 AM, Samui Bodoh said:

 It is clear that the UK is leaving the EU.

 

 

You mean this century?

[stevenl]

22 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Hello! This Gaullist nonsense fantasy is dangerous and deserves it.

Where is the danger?

[sandyf]

1 hour ago, SheungWan said:

Contributors on both sides should be somewhat careful with the word "dictatorship".

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Why, "dictatorship" can come in a variety of guises and not just political.

Dictatorship invariably involves the suppression of rights or opinions. Are you suggesting that the right of the Scots to determine their own future is not being suppressed.

[Opl]

1 hour ago, el torro said:

And yet again, Macron has shown himself to be nothing other than a puppet spouting lies - until he is forced (by the EU hierarchy) to 'back off'...

 

Even remainers would find it very hard to argue now that the EU is not doing everything in its power to stop the UK leaving without a beneficial EU deal?

Macron is telling you to make a french leave , where is the problem?  

[SheungWan]

Why, "dictatorship" can come in a variety of guises and not just political.
Dictatorship invariably involves the suppression of rights or opinions. Are you suggesting that the right of the Scots to determine their own future is not being suppressed.

Intellectually sloppy. Sorry, but one should not put up with this nonsense whether coming from Remain or Leave camp.

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[SheungWan]

Hello! This Gaullist nonsense fantasy is dangerous and deserves it.

From Stalingrad to de Gaulle. Fantastic.

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[SheungWan]

You are forgetting freedom of expression - I liked it.

That's alright then.

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