Gulf War veteran, 55, was killed by a single punch from a bouncer in Thailand who claimed he tried to leave go-go bar without paying his bill

[FritsSikkink]

4 hours ago, Orton Rd said:

Not gone down very well in the foreign press with many comments along the lines of don't go to Thailand, Pattaya is just a brothel and there is no justice in Thailand etc. There is no evidence the customer hit anyone first, a swipe in the air with no chance of contact is not a threat or an attack. He was obviously scammed and backing out of the place not attacking when he was killed by the bouncer, or in this case murderer.

There is no proof he was scammed, you are making things up.

[DannyCarlton]

2 minutes ago, yogi100 said:

How did hitting the back of his head which is the part of it that hit the ground when he fell account for the damage to the right frontal lobe which is the injury that the coroner claimed to have killed him.

 

You actually see a blow delivered by the Thai bouncer connecting with the front part of his head. The right frontal lobe is situated at the front of the head.

Yes contact was with left frontal lobe.

 

With a severe blow to the rear of the head, the brain can riccochet forwards (equal and opposite reaction) which then damages the frontal lobe.

[Thomas J]

Hard to believe that a single punch could kill this man unless the bouncer had some sort of brass knuckle type apparatus on his fist or he hit him in the throat breaking his windpipe. 

[atyclb]

4 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

10 minutes ago, yogi100 said:

How did hitting the back of his head which is the part of it that hit the ground when he fell account for the damage to the right frontal lobe which is the injury that the coroner claimed to have killed him.

 

You actually see a blow delivered by the Thai bouncer connecting with the front part of his head. The right frontal lobe is situated at the front of the head.

Yes contact was with left frontal lobe.

 

With a severe blow to the rear of the head, the brain can riccochet forwards (equal and opposite reaction) which then damages the frontal lobe.

 

 

exactly . aka . contrecoup injury

 

 

[FritsSikkink]

2 hours ago, CanterbrigianBangkoker said:

Or maybe you should have gone to Specsavers? ????

 

Seems clear you don't see what I do. In any case, 3 against 1, even if the older man is larger, no cause for this kind of attack. Could and should have been handled better, then an innocent man would still be alive and his family wouldn't be mourning him. This kind of unfair fight is typical here in Thailand - it is well known to be the case too, and that was my point. 

You need to go to specsavers, there is only 1 guy attacking and the other does nothing.

[CharlieH]

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[yogi100]

56 minutes ago, DaveE13 said:

I been in Security industry in uk for 28 years. Have a CP Licence (Close Protection) not worked doors for years but believe me some nasty fellas in their 50s were working them in the 80s in East London and Essex. Just look at Lenny McLean he was head door man at the Hippodrome and punched a drunk tourist who hit his head later died. Got off too.

I think you'll find Lenny McLean was a different kettle of fish to the poor fellow in this story. And from what I've heard he was another liberty taker.

[FritsSikkink]

12 minutes ago, CharlieH said:

Why not go all the way and say " if hadnt visited Thailand he would still be alive" ...55555

Maybe he would have done the same at home or in an other country.

[NoshowJones]

2 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

people with baseball bats and hammer in their car calling other people thugs, rofl

People have been hospitalised in Scotland from being attacked in their car, and killed on their doorsteps, that is why I also had a pick axe handle at my door, but again never had to use it.

Taking precautions to protect themselves does not make them a thug.

[DannyCarlton]

11 minutes ago, CharlieH said:

Why not go all the way and say " if hadnt visited Thailand he would still be alive" ...55555

Because it wouldn't be true. Most people manage to visit Thailand and comport themselves in such a way that they are perfectly safe and have a great time.

[CanterbrigianBangkoker]

48 minutes ago, yogi100 said:

Oi, I go to Pattaya.

 

And I'm on your side!

Hahaha! I go there too mate, it's convenient from BKK. I stay in Pratamnak when I do visit, away from the centre of town. Weekend trips now and again.

I'm making absolutely no judgement on people who like to visit, as I do myself too. It ain't all bad. There's definitely a 'Pattaya type' though, you know the ones, the long-termers. 

[CanterbrigianBangkoker]

18 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

You need to go to specsavers, there is only 1 guy attacking and the other does nothing.

If you say so ????

 

[CharlieH]

Just now, DannyCarlton said:

Because it wouldn't be true. Most people manage to visit Thailand and comport themselves in such a way that they are perfectly safe and have a great time.

wouldnt be true ? so if he hadnt come to the country at all, he still would have died ? sorry dont understand your response at all.

[Nanaplaza666]

15 hours ago, donnacha said:

That he tried calling 911 just minutes before the attack suggests that he was the victim of a billing scam. As certain parts of their tourism industry collapse, desperate bars seem to be resorting to this stuff more frequently, and asking for evermore ridiculous amounts.

These thugs are a tiny minority that ruin it for the vast majority of decent people. Sadly, in Thailand, the entire society is structured along those lines too.

I no longer expect any common sense from the authorities in Thailand, but a smart country that did not take its tourism industry for granted would crack down hard on this stuff. Each of these reports in the victims' home countries sends a deeply negative message about Thailand, reversing millions of dollars of "Amazing Thailand" marketing. Look at that photo, he looks like a decent, happily married guy and is a veteran to boot. This story, including the shameful Thai court verdict, will run in almost every American newspaper and news channel, ten of millions of people will hear about this. These incidents are expensive for Thailand.

On entry, I would give every tourist a welcome card containing 24hr emergency numbers manned by competent English / Mandarin / Korean speakers. Hell, I would even offer an "Emergency Button" app that would instantly send their location to the local police.
 

LOOKS CAN BE DECIEVING

[DannyCarlton]

6 minutes ago, CharlieH said:

wouldnt be true ? so if he hadnt come to the country at all, he still would have died ? sorry dont understand your response at all.

It wasn't because he came to Thailand that he died. It was because he didn't know how to behave once here.

 

Your response is akin to saying that someone wouldn't have been mown down by a drunk driver if they hadn't left the house that day.

[yogi100]

32 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

Yes contact was with left frontal lobe.

 

With a severe blow to the rear of the head, the brain can riccochet forwards (equal and opposite reaction) which then damages the frontal lobe.

So could a whack from a fist damage the frontal lobe especially one holding a weapon like a knuckle duster. 

 

The posture of the one who did the damage did not look like he was preparing to punch someone. He looked more like he had something in his hand and he appeared to thump or club the victim with it rather than punch him.

 

Watch it again and see what you think. When he walks away afterwards it's as if he has something in his hand.

 

I remember years ago a punter getting a clout from a bouncer using a knuckle duster in LKM's Champagne Agogo. I broke his teeth and was totally uncalled for. So it does happen.

[yogi100]

21 minutes ago, CanterbrigianBangkoker said:

Hahaha! I go there too mate, it's convenient from BKK. I stay in Pratamnak when I do visit, away from the centre of town. Weekend trips now and again.

I'm making absolutely no judgement on people who like to visit, as I do myself too. It ain't all bad. There's definitely a 'Pattaya type' though, you know the ones, the long-termers. 

But I'm a long termer!

 

Or I was till I started reading stories like this and the ones about visas and IOs.

[DaveE13]

23 minutes ago, yogi100 said:

I think you'll find Lenny McLean was a different kettle of fish to the poor fellow in this story. And from what I've heard he was another liberty taker.

Yes definitely. I was really saying that he too knocked down a guy and the guy hit his head and died. McLean got off too.

I agree about liberty taking too btw.

 

[DannyCarlton]

3 minutes ago, yogi100 said:

So could a whack from a fist damage the frontal lobe especially one holding a weapon like a knuckle duster. 

 

The posture of the one who did the damage did not look like he was preparing to punch someone. He looked more like he had something in his hand and he appeared to thump or club the victim with it rather than punch him.

 

Watch it again and see what you think. When he walks away afterwards it's as if he has something in his hand.

 

I remember years ago a punter getting a clout from a bouncer using a knuckle duster in LKM's Champagne Agogo. I broke his teeth and was totally uncalled for. So it does happen.

Don't see any signs of a knucleduster. And your description of the punch reinforces my contention that it wasn't the punch that caused the damage. Now you watch the video again and tell me how hard the guy's head hit the ground.

 

There's no way an autopsy, more than a year after the incident, could have difinitively concluded that it was the punch, not his head hitting the ground, that caused the initial injury.

[maprao]

2 hours ago, yogi100 said:

My brother was in the army. The only time he ever fired his gun was on the rifle range. 

 

He was in the Catering Corps and his service experience was typical of that of most so called 'veterans'. He hated and could not wait till his time was up.

Obviously spoken by a non veteran who has never served nor been sent to a war zone.

 

Remember all veterans on November 11. It is because of them that you can exercise your right to speak freely. 

[chuck holmes]

15 hours ago, sanemax said:

I think that you will find that bouncers in all countries can behave violently , not just Thailand  

I agree because l was one for several years with my own team

He shouldn't have gone there go back to the hotel with your wife.

 

[maprao]

1 minute ago, chuck holmes said:

I agree because l was one for several years with my own team

He shouldn't have gone there go back to the hotel with your wife.

 

He was on a business trip his wife was not with him.

[meechai]

From a recent Thai News Topic

 

So???

Wake up Thailand you wonder why your going down the tubes tourism wise??

[DaveE13]

Just now, maprao said:

He was on a business trip his wife was not with him.

That was my understanding too. Was on business trip. 

Gone out for a for a few beers and fun.

 

[spidermike007]

16 hours ago, donnacha said:

That he tried calling 911 just minutes before the attack suggests that he was the victim of a billing scam. As certain parts of their tourism industry collapse, desperate bars seem to be resorting to this stuff more frequently, and asking for evermore ridiculous amounts.

These thugs are a tiny minority that ruin it for the vast majority of decent people. Sadly, in Thailand, the entire society is structured along those lines too.

I no longer expect any common sense from the authorities in Thailand, but a smart country that did not take its tourism industry for granted would crack down hard on this stuff. Each of these reports in the victims' home countries sends a deeply negative message about Thailand, reversing millions of dollars of "Amazing Thailand" marketing. Look at that photo, he looks like a decent, happily married guy and is a veteran to boot. This story, including the shameful Thai court verdict, will run in almost every American newspaper and news channel, ten of millions of people will hear about this. These incidents are expensive for Thailand.

On entry, I would give every tourist a welcome card containing 24hr emergency numbers manned by competent English / Mandarin / Korean speakers. Hell, I would even offer an "Emergency Button" app that would instantly send their location to the local police.


 

You are speaking of progressive, visionary, and intelligent policy. Certainly too much to ask from this administration, who appear to be hellbent on diminishing the lives of millions, by denigrating the tourism industry, and reducing it to low class and lower middle class tourists, who just do not spend much money.

 

My guess would be that the one punch knocked this man to the ground, whereby his skull cracked like an egg. 

 

Lastly, since when is chasing a patron and asking him to pay a bill self defense? Where is there any indication that the bouncer was threatened? And did the lame, weak, incredibly partial Thai courts even consider this, before exonerating him? This kind of thing sends a really, really dark message to the tourists of the world who are considering a trip to Thailand. Just another nail in the coffin of tourism here.

[CanterbrigianBangkoker]

17 minutes ago, yogi100 said:

But I'm a long termer!

 

Or I was till I started reading stories like this and the ones about visas and IOs.

When you said 'I "go" there too' I thought you probably didn't live there. Anyway, not everyone in Pattaya is the same I'm sure, there's gotta be some decent people knocking about!

[rossco1]

excuse me but one punch killed a man but only grieves Bodley  harm no its Called Murder 

[billd766]

15 hours ago, billd766 said:

IMHO he was not murdered which is deliberately setting out to kill a person. Manslaughter possibly but more likely death by misadventure. No I have not seen a video, so I have no idea what really happened.

I tried to watch the video but the Daily Wail found that I have an ad-blocker and wouldn't let me view the video.

[DannyCarlton]

36 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

Where is there any indication that the bouncer was threatened?

The farang quite clearly threw the first punch.

[mauGR1]

1 minute ago, DannyCarlton said:

The farang quite clearly threw the first punch.

The video lasts few seconds, nobody know what happened before.