Rees-Mogg says 'common sense' could have saved Grenfell victims

[beautifulthailand99]

Anyway Tory Central Office have locked him up for the duration as a liability. They are astute enough not to remind the electorate of their true nature. Poor old candle seller Nigel is on a fool's errand with the Brexit Party Ltd - no doubt when it's all over he will scoop what is left in the kitty and begin his lucrative US Trumpian comeback tour. TBH I think the Tories will get a majority and there will be a short term sterling bounce before we continue on our inexorable decline. ????????

[Chomper Higgot]

These remarks by Rees-Mogg were not jus an obscene insult to the victims and their families, it was something else too; a cynical portrayal of the advice given by Fire Brigade (and hence the Fire Brigade officers) being the cause of the deaths.

 

The cause of the deaths was the death trap created by adding flammable cladding that negated the design fire safety features of the building.

 

The root cause will be found in the decisions made to add that cladding.

 

Why for example was it added and was the modification subject to a thorough design safety review?

 

The government chose to use their option written into the Inquiries Act to exclude these wider root cause questions.

 

I am not aware of another UK inquiry into multiple deaths in which the root cause and decision process have been excluded.

[kingdong]

On 11/6/2019 at 10:03 PM, Chomper Higgot said:

Leave me out of your trolling.

Leave out your trolling posts then.

[kingdong]

On 11/6/2019 at 2:47 PM, sanemax said:

Because we feel that their policies are better for the economy which helps us to enrich ourselves and Labour takes everythin   

 

 g that we earned and gives it to other people

Oh come on,they didn,t just give it to other people they did "send out the search parties to rub  the right wings noses in it "

[kingdong]

2 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

These remarks by Rees-Mogg were not jus an obscene insult to the victims and their families, it was something else too; a cynical portrayal of the advice given by Fire Brigade (and hence the Fire Brigade officers) being the cause of the deaths.

 

The cause of the deaths was the death trap created by adding flammable cladding that negated the design fire safety features of the building.

 

The root cause will be found in the decisions made to add that cladding.

 

Why for example was it added and was the modification subject to a thorough design safety review?

 

The government chose to use their option written into the Inquiries Act to exclude these wider root cause questions.

 

I am not aware of another UK inquiry into multiple deaths in which the root cause and decision process have been excluded.

Which government took the responsibility of fire checks away from the fire brigade and into the private sector?

[kingdong]

3 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

These remarks by Rees-Mogg were not jus an obscene insult to the victims and their families, it was something else too; a cynical portrayal of the advice given by Fire Brigade (and hence the Fire Brigade officers) being the cause of the deaths.

 

The cause of the deaths was the death trap created by adding flammable cladding that negated the design fire safety features of the building.

 

The root cause will be found in the decisions made to add that cladding.

 

Why for example was it added and was the modification subject to a thorough design safety review?

 

The government chose to use their option written into the Inquiries Act to exclude these wider root cause questions.

 

I am not aware of another UK inquiry into multiple deaths in which the root cause and decision process have been excluded.

And what organisation was responsible for checking the cladding was safe and up to spec.?

[DannyCarlton]

29 minutes ago, kingdong said:

And what organisation was responsible for checking the cladding was safe and up to spec.?

Kensington and Chelsea Tenant Management Organisation (KCTMO) were responsible for fire safety at Grenfell Tower. They were wholly answerable to Kensington and Chelsea Borough Council, which, by a large majority, is a Conservative held borough council.

 

The fire safety management for properties in the Borrough of Kensinton and Chelsea were handed back directly to the council last year.

Edited November 8, 2019 by DannyCarlton

[transam]

1 minute ago, DannyCarlton said:

Kensington and Chelsea Tenant Management Organisation (KCTMO) are responsible for fire safety at Grenfell Tower. They are a subsidiary of Kensington and Chelsea Borough Council, which, by a large majority, is a Conservative held borough council.

What has "Conservatives" got to do with it....

 

Do they only employ conservative borough engineers....?

[DannyCarlton]

4 minutes ago, transam said:

What has "Conservatives" got to do with it....

 

Do they only employ conservative borough engineers....?

I understand your dislike of facts, so let me clarify. KCTMO were awarded the contract by the Conservative borough council who remained responsible for overseeing the contract and signing off on any major works (like renewing the cladding on Grenfell Tower).

[Henryford]

Despite that people don't like him what he said was correct. Your house is on fire you get OUT as quickly as possible. Even the fire service admit their stay put advice was wrong.

Edited November 8, 2019 by Henryford

[DannyCarlton]

1 minute ago, Henryford said:

Despite that people don't like him what he said was correct. Your house is on fire you get OUT as quickly as possible.

It wasn't a house, it was a tower block. Different rules.

[Jip99]

7 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

It wasn't a house, it was a tower block. Different rules.

 

 

The fire service still admit that the advice was wrong.

[DannyCarlton]

1 minute ago, Jip99 said:

 

 

The fire service still admit that the advice was wrong.

Not exactly. They (and all other fire brigades) would still offer the same advice during  a normal tower block fire. Which is what makes Mogg's comments criminal. They admit that, due to the uniquness of the Grenfell fire, the order to evacuate should have been given sooner. IMO, that was probably due to poor communication between the firefighters at the point of the fire and the commander on the ground. It was no doubt exassipated by said commander, Dany Cotton, who, as head of the London Fire Brigade, put herself in charge of the incident even though she was a complete dick who was only appointed to the post on grounds of political correctness.

[Chomper Higgot]

25 minutes ago, Henryford said:

Despite that people don't like him what he said was correct. Your house is on fire you get OUT as quickly as possible. Even the fire service admit their stay put advice was wrong.

Unless of course ‘your house’ is an apartment located above the fire in a high rise building and the stairwells are filled with smoke.

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

18 minutes ago, Jip99 said:

 

 

The fire service still admit that the advice was wrong.

Link

[ivor bigun]

45 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

It wasn't a house, it was a tower block. Different rules.

why? get out in case of fire ,fast .

[DannyCarlton]

Just now, ivor bigun said:

why? get out in case of fire ,fast .

And be overcome by smoke in the stairwell...and die.

 

Great idea.

[transam]

1 hour ago, DannyCarlton said:

I understand your dislike of facts, so let me clarify. KCTMO were awarded the contract by the Conservative borough council who remained responsible for overseeing the contract and signing off on any major works (like renewing the cladding on Grenfell Tower).

Was the "engineer" who provided the facts for approval a Conservative then...?

[DannyCarlton]

8 minutes ago, transam said:

Was the "engineer" who provided the facts for approval a Conservative then...?

What relevance is that? None, as usual. The engineer was an engineer not a politician. The person who signed off on the work was a Conservative politician. Doh!

[Jip99]

28 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

And be overcome by smoke in the stairwell...and die.

 

Great idea.

 

It has already been admitted that more lives could have been saved.....

 

I have no criticism of the fire brigade who do sterling work - just the idiots of those who jump down the throat of people who say the slightest thing wrong.

[Chomper Higgot]

7 minutes ago, transam said:

Was the "engineer" who provided the facts for approval a Conservative then...?

Where is your evidence that any design safety checks were made?

 

The inquiry was focused on the events of the day and has, by choice of the Government, excluded a full root cause analysis.

 

 

[Jip99]

55 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Link

 

 

Go do your own Googling........................... but start with the report from the enquiry:-

 

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7624015/Official-report-Grenfell-Tower-says-systemic-failures-fire-chiefs-stay-advice.html

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, Jip99 said:

 

It has already been admitted that more lives could have been saved.....

 

I have no criticism of the fire brigade who do sterling work - just the idiots of those who jump down the throat of people who say the slightest thing wrong.

RM’s comments were not ‘the slightest thing wrong’.

[DannyCarlton]

1 minute ago, Jip99 said:

 

It has already been admitted that more lives could have been saved.....

 

I have no criticism of the fire brigade who do sterling work - just the idiots of those who jump down the throat of people who say the slightest thing wrong.

Not exactly the "slightest thing" encouraging the public to ignore firefighters in an emergency. I wonder if you would have called them idiots if a Labour MP had made the same comments. Somehow, I doubt it.

[Jip99]

4 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

Not exactly the "slightest thing" encouraging the public to ignore firefighters in an emergency. I wonder if you would have called them idiots if a Labour MP had made the same comments. Somehow, I doubt it.

 

My criticism is leveled at ANYONE who takes the slightest opportunity to jump down people's throats - it has become far too prevalent. Politics has nothing to with it (although often politically motivated).

[Jip99]

6 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

RM’s comments were not ‘the slightest thing wrong’.

 

He made a mistake and apologised - move on.

 

What he said was not necessarily wrong - the fact that he said it all was wrong.

[Orton Rd]

Fire started by asylum seeker having the fridge plugged into a faulty and over loaded extension socket, then leaving the windows open letting the fire expand onto the cladding, then wanders out knocking on a couple of doors. It's everyone else's fault though!

[DannyCarlton]

3 minutes ago, Jip99 said:

 

My criticism is leveled at ANYONE who takes the slightest opportunity to jump down people's throats - it has become far too prevalent. Politics has nothing to with it (although often politically motivated).

As has been explained to you, it was hardly "the slightest opportunity". Strange that a number of his fellow Conservative MPs have condemned his comments too.

[Chomper Higgot]

14 minutes ago, Jip99 said:

 

 

Go do your own Googling........................... but start with the report from the enquiry:-

 

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7624015/Official-report-Grenfell-Tower-says-systemic-failures-fire-chiefs-stay-advice.html

You made the claim, there is nothing in the article that you have linked that backs your assertion.

 

 

[DannyCarlton]

9 minutes ago, Jip99 said:

 

He made a mistake and apologised - move on.

 

What he said was not necessarily wrong - the fact that he said it all was wrong.

What he said was wrong.

 

His "apology" mainly consisted of making, pathetic, infantile justifications for his comment, ie lies. Not what I would call an apology.

 

 

Edited November 8, 2019 by DannyCarlton