unpaid credit cards

[digibum]

16 hours ago, meand said:

But I do know for a fact you can have as much cc debt as you can pile up in the US and you will not be getting stopped at any airport.

Not for a citizen, no. 

 

But it can complicate visas and citizenship applications. 

 

[newnative]

Let's hope he is stopped and sent home.

[lensta]

Most of the replies to the OP are not answering his question, just say that his friend should have paid etc.  To those that say he would have been reported to immigration, my question is do you actually have any first hand knowledge of this happening or even know someone that has been stopped at immigration because of an unpaid credit card debt or is your reply just your opinion not fact?

[lensta]

23 hours ago, tomazbodner said:

Krungsri is part of MUFG (previously GE Capital) and is very unlikely to let this go. Not only would they have contacted immigration, but they are also continuing to count that 18% interest until full amount and interest are paid off.

Not receiving a response in his favour from the bank does not clear his debt but rather gets him in significant legal challenges.

 

He really should have someone (preferably Thai) to contact the bank on his behalf and arrange a repayment, as that half a million could have become a million by now and growing.

 

Just saw 2 posts before mine: Thanks Donnacha. Yes, forgot to mention that collection agency (which is usually external to the bank) would also have their (not low) fees, and that there would also be legal expenses to cover, which makes even my estimate of double the amount probably too low. Jackdd: Law limits interest to 18% annual plus some credit usage fee, so basically in practical terms 20% per year. But that's compounding, so it would easily reach double the amount when left for 3 years. In other words - the man will spend a lot of time locked up until he coughs up well over a million baht should he return to Thailand. And it is likely (given he literally stole from internationally owned banks) that this won't escape him at his home country either. One day he'll get a visit. When the amount is many times larger than now.

"Not only would they have contacted immigration"

You know this for a fact or is it just your opinion

[lensta]

17 hours ago, Tounge Thaied said:

Usually banks have a cap (by law) and/or expiration date on added interest on unpaid credit cards. Usually, the bank will attempt for a short while to recoup their money, but will ultimately sell the debt off to a collection agency that will use many tactics to attempt get the money back. The banks will for sure have notified immigration authorities and your friends name and passport number will be flagged. If he ever wants to come back to Thailand, he will have to get a Thai The banks will for sure have notified immigration authorities and your friends name and passport number will be flagged.attorney and sort out a payment plan. 

"The banks will for sure have notified immigration authorities and your friends name and passport number will be flagged."

 

Again you have first hand knowledge of this or even know someone this has happened to???

[lensta]

Just did a quick google search and came up with this: The statute of limitations for credit-card debt _ a time limit within which the bank must sue the debtor _ is two years from the date following the debtor's default on payment. Failure by the bank to sue past the expiration date will end its right to enforce the debt and free the debtor from the debt burden. But you would still need to know if the bank had sued.

 

[Pdavies99]

On 12/31/2019 at 7:22 AM, RJRS1301 said:

I am amazed that Visa and the others have not listed him in default affecting his credit  reference lisiting worldwide

 

If he is in management he should be able to live within his means unless he is a serial offender.

 

Having worked for VISA UK he will be in default worldwide and a debt collection will be chasing him and eventually CCJ'S will be effected. As soon as he applies for a VISA anywhere or even Mastercard they will catch him.

 

The “Statute of Limitations” for credit card debt is a USA law limiting the amount of time lenders and collection agencies have to sue consumers for nonpayment.

That time frame is set by each state and varies from just three years (in 11 states) to 10 years (two states) with the other 37 states somewhere in between.

 

In the UK the 6 years rule starts from when they located the person.

 

However a court case re CCJ has no time limit, likewise if a debt is referred to a  debt agency the debt cannot be closed.

Edited January 1, 2020 by Pdavies99

[BestB]

1 hour ago, digibum said:

Not for a citizen, no. 

 

But it can complicate visas and citizenship applications. 

 

Has nothing to do with visa , citizenship may be 

[BestB]

15 minutes ago, Pdavies99 said:

Having worked for VISA UK he will be in default worldwide and a debt collection will be chasing him and eventually CCJ'S will be effected. As soon as he applies for a VISA anywhere or even Mastercard they will catch him.

 

The “Statute of Limitations” for credit card debt is a USA law limiting the amount of time lenders and collection agencies have to sue consumers for nonpayment.

That time frame is set by each state and varies from just three years (in 11 states) to 10 years (two states) with the other 37 states somewhere in between.

 

In the UK the 6 years rule starts from when they located the person.

 

However a court case re CCJ has no time limit, likewise if a debt is referred to a  debt agency the debt cannot be closed.

So very incorrect on all aspects .

 

i had defaulted with Citi bank AU for good reasons , not only I have cards from other banks in AU but had no problem getting one from Citi bank TH

 

agsin, credit cards are unsecured loans with very high interest rates. Banks can not sue or take possession of anything because it’s an unsecured loan. 
 

yes they can take you to court and judgment would be for you to pay . And if you do not , they can not do anything , can not garnish from salary or take house or anything else.

 

this precisely why banks never sue for credit card but sell it off to collections agencies for fraction of what is owed.

 

collection agencies then start with full amount , then reduce it to 80%, 60%, 40% and eventually just give up 

 

unless bank can prove you intended to fraud and default from the start , they have zero chance getting court order or immigration blocks or anything else other than sending threatening letters 

Edited January 1, 2020 by BestB

[oldsalt]

Unless the banks or debt collectors have taken the matter to court, and received a ruling against the defaulter, it remains a civil rather than criminal matter and outside the jurisdiction of police and immigration. By not paying his credit card debts, he has not committed a criminal act.  If he made any payments by cheque and the cheques bounced, that is fraud, and a criminal act.  However, if the bank or collection agency took the debt to court and the court made a judgment against him, there may be a warrant outstanding. And no, I am not a lawyer. 

[digibum]

20 minutes ago, BestB said:

Has nothing to do with visa , citizenship may be 

Actually, one of the questions you MAY be asked when requesting a tourist visa to the United States is whether or not you have a credit card.  The intent of the question is to make sure you have the means to travel. 

 

If your response is no, and you seem like someone who should have at least one credit card, i.e. middle-class'ish UK citizen, then they'll likely ask why.  Then you have two choices:

 

1.  Tell the truth, that you skipped out on some debt and you can't get a credit card. 

 

2.  Lie, and run the risk of deportation if they ever had reason to uncover your lie. 

 

 

[digibum]

23 minutes ago, BestB said:

So very incorrect on all aspects .

 

i had defaulted with Citi bank AU for good reasons , not only I have cards from other banks in AU but had no problem getting one from Citi bank TH

 

I think some of the confusion here is conflating the laws of two different countries. 

 

Quote

agsin, credit cards are unsecured loans with very high interest rates. Banks can not sue or take possession of anything because it’s an unsecured loan. 

 

yes they can take you to court and judgment would be for you to pay . And if you do not , they can not do anything , can not garnish from salary or take house or anything else.

In the US, they can garnish your wages and take whatever actions necessary to collect.  If the bank takes you to court and they win, they can collect what is owed to them using whatever methods that are legal to do so. 

 

It doesn't matter if it's unsecured.  Unsecured just means that there's nothing to repossess. 

 

You can freeze their bank accounts, you can put lien on any real property they own, etc. 

 

It might be different in AU, but in other places, you can't run from your debts.

 

Quote

 

this precisely why banks never sue for credit card but sell it off to collections agencies for fraction of what is owed.

 

collection agencies then start with full amount , then reduce it to 80%, 60%, 40% and eventually just give up 

 

 

The reason they sell off bad debt is because bad debt limits their loan reserves.  They want to get that money out there earning them money again so they'll take .30 on the dollar today and leave it to a collection agency to deal with. 

 

You have to understand that scale a bank is working at.  They might sell tens or hundreds of millions in bad debt in one transaction.  Trying to collect on that would mean creating a large internal entity to handle it and they would still want to get the bad debt off of the books. 

 

I know, because I buy bad mortgage debt from banks (well, I buy from hedge funds that buy multi-million dollar pools and they bid out the stuff that isn't a slam dunk).  I've talked to a lot of "special assets" (i.e. defaulted loans) officers at banks and it's not about the fact that they can't collect, it's that they make more money lending that money back out than they do suing, foreclosing, renovating, and reselling properties. 

 

And the agencies don't just give up.  If all you had to do was avoid the collection agencies for X years and you got to keep everything without paying, everybody would just cancel their phone service and run up their cards to the max. 

 

Like I said, in the US, 1000000% they can go after your wages.  It's a debt, like any other debt.  You owe money.  The courts will give you the ability to collect. 

 

Collection agencies often do give up if it's obvious that the debtor is such a loser that they can't collect.  The person has no money to take, no wages to garnish, nothing.  Especially if it's a relatively small amount. 

 

But if you have any sort of tangible assets, they will not quit. 

 

Quote

unless bank can prove you intended to fraud and default from the start , they have zero chance getting court order or immigration blocks or anything else other than sending threatening letters 

 

Again, *maybe* true in AU (nothing you've said is proof other than you might actually be such a small fish to them that they gave up rather than try to take more expensive collection efforts), but not at all true in other countries. 

[NoshowJones]

20 hours ago, jackdd said:

Yes, but there are also "fees" and other stuff through which they bypass this law.

I once calculated the "total cost" (interest, fees, etc.) of my girlfriend's credit cards, and effectively it's about 30% interest.

In the UK, the debt is cancelled after six years? 

 

Edited January 1, 2020 by possum1931

[Ventenio]

No debt for over a decade but it's fun to read about debt.   Maybe the collection agency can sell the debt and send a letter and keep extending the date on when the OP thinks it will go away.  Too bad they don't have his number or all his friend's numbers, since that would be comical when they sick the auto-caller on him.  Maybe that practice stopped, but who knows.  Anyhow, it would be funny if they let him in and then stopped him from exiting and jail time until fully paid.  10 million baht and then he does a gofundme page and nobody will give him money.

 

banks fight to the very very end, especially in Thailand.

 

I'm 100% sure the system will have something on him.

 

keep us updated!!!  

[lensta]

1 hour ago, digibum said:

Actually, one of the questions you MAY be asked when requesting a tourist visa to the United States is whether or not you have a credit card.  The intent of the question is to make sure you have the means to travel. 

 

If your response is no, and you seem like someone who should have at least one credit card, i.e. middle-class'ish UK citizen, then they'll likely ask why.  Then you have two choices:

 

1.  Tell the truth, that you skipped out on some debt and you can't get a credit card. 

 

2.  Lie, and run the risk of deportation if they ever had reason to uncover your lie. 

 

 

"Actually, one of the questions you MAY be asked when requesting a tourist visa to the United States is whether or not you have a credit card.  The intent of the question is to make sure you have the means to travel. "

 

But he is not trying to go to the United States, is he?

 

[Hayduke]

On 12/30/2019 at 11:56 AM, Jinjo14 said:

A friend of mine (faring) left Thailand after a few years working here with 3 Thai credit cards (limit of around 120k each).

 

Why...is your...'friend'...asking you to get involved?

 

 

[BestB]

1 hour ago, digibum said:

Actually, one of the questions you MAY be asked when requesting a tourist visa to the United States is whether or not you have a credit card.  The intent of the question is to make sure you have the means to travel. 

 

If your response is no, and you seem like someone who should have at least one credit card, i.e. middle-class'ish UK citizen, then they'll likely ask why.  Then you have two choices:

 

1.  Tell the truth, that you skipped out on some debt and you can't get a credit card. 

 

2.  Lie, and run the risk of deportation if they ever had reason to uncover your lie. 

 

 

Actually we not discussing what is needed for tourist visa to America ????

[BestB]

57 minutes ago, digibum said:

 

I think some of the confusion here is conflating the laws of two different countries. 

 

In the US, they can garnish your wages and take whatever actions necessary to collect.  If the bank takes you to court and they win, they can collect what is owed to them using whatever methods that are legal to do so. 

 

It doesn't matter if it's unsecured.  Unsecured just means that there's nothing to repossess. 

 

You can freeze their bank accounts, you can put lien on any real property they own, etc. 

 

It might be different in AU, but in other places, you can't run from your debts.

 

 

The reason they sell off bad debt is because bad debt limits their loan reserves.  They want to get that money out there earning them money again so they'll take .30 on the dollar today and leave it to a collection agency to deal with. 

 

You have to understand that scale a bank is working at.  They might sell tens or hundreds of millions in bad debt in one transaction.  Trying to collect on that would mean creating a large internal entity to handle it and they would still want to get the bad debt off of the books. 

 

I know, because I buy bad mortgage debt from banks (well, I buy from hedge funds that buy multi-million dollar pools and they bid out the stuff that isn't a slam dunk).  I've talked to a lot of "special assets" (i.e. defaulted loans) officers at banks and it's not about the fact that they can't collect, it's that they make more money lending that money back out than they do suing, foreclosing, renovating, and reselling properties. 

 

And the agencies don't just give up.  If all you had to do was avoid the collection agencies for X years and you got to keep everything without paying, everybody would just cancel their phone service and run up their cards to the max. 

 

Like I said, in the US, 1000000% they can go after your wages.  It's a debt, like any other debt.  You owe money.  The courts will give you the ability to collect. 

 

Collection agencies often do give up if it's obvious that the debtor is such a loser that they can't collect.  The person has no money to take, no wages to garnish, nothing.  Especially if it's a relatively small amount. 

 

But if you have any sort of tangible assets, they will not quit. 

 

 

Again, *maybe* true in AU (nothing you've said is proof other than you might actually be such a small fish to them that they gave up rather than try to take more expensive collection efforts), but not at all true in other countries. 

You keep going on about America , that’s totally irrelevant.

 

we are discussing Thailand .

 

one poster claimed to have worked for visa and if you defaulted in one country you are blacklisted all

over the world , which is incorrect.

 

OP defaulted in Thailand , American laws and regulations do not apply.

 

 

[Chongalulu]

On 12/31/2019 at 7:22 AM, RJRS1301 said:

I am amazed that Visa and the others have not listed him in default affecting his credit  reference lisiting worldwide

 

If he is in management he should be able to live within his means unless he is a serial offender.

 

It doesn’t work like that. Visa or MasterCard is just the administrative vehicle. The debt is purely the issuing bank's and credit checks are only run in the country where you apply for credit. 

On a separate note, if he owes such a large sum.much cheaper and safer to holiday other than in thailand.

[lensta]

OP, this might actually help you. It is a post on TV on a similar topic as yours. It is dated 13th November 2013 (Yes, I know it is not recent).

 

Haha i can't believe how many som nam na's there are here....and other <deleted>....trying to get someone thai to understand this on a call would no doubt be challenging.....and all the clever g#ts who say its easy to pay if he wanted to......if the card is cancelled and he has no current thai bank would you clever guys recommend just sending his money to K BANK and hope they deal with it right....those who know the LoS dont to the think so... to reply to OP i racked up quite a bit with a thai bank left 18 mths ago...havent paid it and now im back in thailand no problem...........still cant pay it as i am broke....and i am racked with guilt over it....the poor little bank only getting 20% interest on their cards and they pay such a generous 1% for your savings.....schmucks

[new2here]

On 12/31/2019 at 7:22 AM, RJRS1301 said:

I am amazed that Visa and the others have not listed him in default affecting his credit  reference lisiting worldwide

 

If he is in management he should be able to live within his means unless he is a serial offender.

 

I see your point, but... “visa” is simply a multi-national payment network/clearing entity - they don’t really have any direct customer debt risk per se...  they do have risk in that the amount and number of transactions may fall, but as far as individual consumer default goes, Visa has no liability nor risk exposure.

 

the part about credit references is interesting...  But here too, it’s not as simplistic as that.  Thailand does have one national consolidated credit reporting entity - the National Credit Bureau, but their data is limited to originating from Thai sources (and those that are members of the NBC system) only.

when I first moved to Thailand, it was hard for me to get an unsecured card (ie no collateral or the like - just a pure unsecured card) even with a work permitted job and documented monthly income in excess of B85,000... I had (and still have a US FICO around 820s) a very good US credit score- but what I found out is that these files, scores and reports aren’t really trans-national in nature.

 

Initially each of the big three banks said that I had no credit history in Thailand - only Amex would approve me right away - based on part on my US history with them.. once I got about 6 months of NBC history in my file, THEN it was easy, just the WP, bank book and salary documents.

 

i wish credit histories were portable, because I do think it would cut down on some of these kinds of issues, but my experience really shows me it’s purely on a country by country basis and what happens in one is largely irrelevant to what happens in others. 

[stropper]

do not even worry about it, he would be long forgotton, rip the robbing  bastards off  for as much as you can, got em for $45 k in aus  years ago , been back every year and have hidden money , they can not find you if you have no address here,  they rob us so if you can rob them do it ! ps credit is only for the country you get it, does not matter once you move on !

Edited January 1, 2020 by stropper

[tomazbodner]

3 hours ago, lensta said:

"Not only would they have contacted immigration"

You know this for a fact or is it just your opinion

Fact.

[stropper]

3 minutes ago, tomazbodner said:

Fact.

fact read the rules , banks can not touch you, and what has immigration got to do with it, really ,do you think they care about banks !

 

Edited January 1, 2020 by stropper

[tomazbodner]

1 hour ago, BestB said:

You keep going on about America , that’s totally irrelevant.

 

we are discussing Thailand .

 

one poster claimed to have worked for visa and if you defaulted in one country you are blacklisted all

over the world , which is incorrect.

 

OP defaulted in Thailand , American laws and regulations do not apply.

 

 

He would not get blacklisted outside Thailand. However when bank is an international banking group that either has entity in defaulter's country of residence, or owns a share of a financial institution that does, he could get someone knocking on his door there.

 

It's one thing robbing a local bank. It's another thing robbing a global one. Those do exchange information among their international offices. Had he done this to a purely Thai bank, it's unlikely they could do anything to him once he's outside Thailand.

 

Collection agencies are a different (unpredictable) story though. I remember a friend who's niece failed to pay phone bill to one of telecoms here and ignored it for 3 or 4 years. Her address was registered at friend's place, and when returning home one day, house was found broken into and most of the stuff taken. Went to report to police and was told "Yes, we did it". It was over a 3000 baht debt that grew to over 100,000 by then. Advice was to go to auction to buy the stuff back. And yes, no one was going to pay to repair damage to the house sustained during the break-in. Would they do something like that outside Thailand? I've no idea.

[Chongalulu]

3 hours ago, Pdavies99 said:

Having worked for VISA UK he will be in default worldwide and a debt collection will be chasing him and eventually CCJ'S will be effected. As soon as he applies for a VISA anywhere or even Mastercard they will catch him.

 

The “Statute of Limitations” for credit card debt is a USA law limiting the amount of time lenders and collection agencies have to sue consumers for nonpayment.

That time frame is set by each state and varies from just three years (in 11 states) to 10 years (two states) with the other 37 states somewhere in between.

 

In the UK the 6 years rule starts from when they located the person.

 

However a court case re CCJ has no time limit, likewise if a debt is referred to a  debt agency the debt cannot be closed.

Incorrect, Visa is not the holder of the debt,the issuing bank is. Credit searches throwing up defaults only apply in the country it was issued. I can only assume you had a very lowly position not to realise that.

[tomazbodner]

10 minutes ago, stropper said:

fact read the rules , banks can not touch you, and what has immigration got to do with it, really ,do you think they care about banks !

 

Weird logic you have. So immigration just happily passes known criminals?

 

Immigration doesn't act on its own and stop people at will (though many will argue this), but based on flags in their system which are placed there by other branches of police. I know that works as I've had someone stopped and thrown in IDC before. All it took was a police report and copy of his passport.

 

The particular bank in question will get report made that will flag foreigner at the immigration. It would be extremely foolish of him to visit Thailand before this has been settled. But if he does anyway, I hope OP keeps us posted on his days in the Land of Smiles.

[Suradit69]

On December 30, 2019 at 12:11 PM, ezzra said:

contact the issuing banks, either by himself or someone else on his behalf, preferably a Thai national

I don't think anyone in Thailand should present himself to the banks as if he were acting/negotiating on behalf of the person who defaulted on debt repayment.

 

The sarcastic expression "what could possibly go wrong" (for the intermediary) comes to mind.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 1, 2020 by Suradit69

[stropper]

19 minutes ago, nchuckle said:

Incorrect, Visa is not the holder of the debt,the issuing bank is. Credit searches throwing up defaults only apply in the country it was issued. I can only assume you had a very lowly position not to realise that.

absolute <deleted>. you do not know what your talking about, debt is country or orien only, stop trying to scare people , the debt is only good for where it originated, and after a while they give up !

 

Edited January 1, 2020 by stropper

[Suradit69]

17 minutes ago, stropper said:

absolute <deleted>. you do not know what your talking about, debt is country or orien only, stop trying to scare people , the debt is only good for where it originated, and after a while they give up !

 

You might want to consider editing your comment. 

 

"debt is country or orien only," among other incoherent things you wrote , make it difficult to believe ou have a clue.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 1, 2020 by Suradit69