Action needed now to save "filthy, dangerous, rip-off, vice ridden" Pattaya, says watchdog

[Tom59]

On 1/15/2020 at 11:17 AM, Matzzon said:

Just the thought of that they actually let this be, grow and are doing this to inflict pain and suffering on the tourist industry is unfathomable.

 

However, I can sometimes understand the single Thai incidents and many individual Thai citizens actions. That based on the fact of Pattaya as a magnet for criminality and slime of the earth extremely rotten and unwanted foreigner the city seem to attract. If this comment was only based on them, then they could let Pattaya rot and build an unbreakable dome over the city.

 

Ok, as a good thing. I also personally know a bunch of good guys that have settled down in Pattaya, so that does not go for them or anybody else that knows how to behave. it´s just that the city unfortunately seems to attract to much of the wrong people.

In England we have a saying that says "you can't make a silk purse out of a pig's ear".  Pattaya is what it is and at the moment it's biggest problem is that it doesn't really know what it wants to be. if it wants to be a modern holiday resort city that attracts 'good' tourists then it needs to improve its infrastructure and services. It needs to spend money on capital urban regeneration (and not just build more and more condo blocks to sit empty for years on end). It needs to clean up the beaches and bring water quality up to international standards and then it needs to end its pursuit of 'cheap charlie' tours from China, Russia and the like. OR, it can accept it's origins and go the 'pile it high, sell it cheap' route and continue to seek out the above mentioned 'new farang' but it can't have both!

[Matzzon]

12 minutes ago, Tom59 said:

n England we have a saying that says "you can't make a silk purse out of a pig's ear".  Pattaya is what it is and at the moment it's biggest problem is that it doesn't really know what it wants to be.

Sorry, but I am totally lost here. I would say that the biggest problem is the magnificent intelligence that must hide behind the saying mentioned. ????

Edited January 19, 2020 by Matzzon

[Matzzon]

On 1/15/2020 at 6:18 AM, Orton Rd said:

You could hardly make it's image worse than reality, the reality is it's always been an open air brothel, and now an expensive one. Apart from tattooed over priced prostitutes there is almost no other reason to go there.

I guess we all know what you do in Pattaya now. Keep the confessions coming.

[Tom59]

On 1/15/2020 at 12:17 PM, Matzzon said:

What? How do you know that I took away that information, and left out to mention that? I got everything I wanted to have in my post. You shall not come here and tell me what should have been standing in my post. Write you own one and design it like you want it to be.

 

But ok, let´s go to work:

 

No 1: Don´t know. It can´t be the this people. They are everywhere, but it doesn´t look like this dump in other places. However, there are almost more foreigners in Pattaya than Thais, so I guess it´s the foreigner that created this mess. Time to clean it up!

 

No 2: Out of the info above you already know that. The foreign criminal elements that since decades grown into the core of the city like an terminal disease.

That looks awfully like Thai logic to me. Same Same as foreigner run down crossing the road by pickup with black smoke and loud exhaust doing 80ks an hour with driver chatting on mobile phone. Conclusion, "foreigner to blame. if foreigner not come him not get run over"!

[Rimmer]

Some off topic bickering posts removed

[Leaver]

8 hours ago, Tom59 said:

if foreigner not come him not get run over"!

And so, it would seem, they have stopped coming. 

[thaibeachlovers]

On 1/15/2020 at 5:09 PM, webfact said:

Reasons why in these transparent, social media times savvy tourists are choosing to go elsewhere for beach holidays like Cambodia and Vietnam, and even Bali. 

Silly OP. No farang went to Pattaya for the beach. The reason they went is unknown anywhere else in the world. As a monger paradise it was the best in the world.

The reason Pattaya is in the toilet is because they forgot why Pattaya exists in the first place, and tried to make it "Riviera in LOS". They ended up driving away the mongers and replacing them with zero baht Chinese and cheap Charlie Indians.

On 1/15/2020 at 5:09 PM, webfact said:

Rip offs for transport

Phuket and Chiang Mai are rip offs for transport, not Pattaya.

On 1/15/2020 at 5:09 PM, webfact said:

Terrible traffic including tour buses creating danger entering narrow sois

Situation caused by Thai council allowing unrestricted building of hotels

On 1/15/2020 at 5:09 PM, webfact said:

Holes in uneven sidewalks littered with bricks and breeze blocks - all making tourist injuries common

Been like that for 30 years

On 1/15/2020 at 5:09 PM, webfact said:

They said Pattaya was inconvenient. 

For whom? It's only 2 hours from Bkk.

 

On 1/15/2020 at 5:09 PM, webfact said:

Not nearly enough had been spent on good public utilities - and when money was spent it was done on the cheap. 

Tell us something we haven't known for 20 years.

 

Pattaya needs to be bulldozed and rebuilt, but that's not going to happen, so as long as the council is stuffing it up, nothing is going to change.

If they want to know the problem- look at city hall.

[thaibeachlovers]

17 hours ago, Tom59 said:

In England we have a saying that says "you can't make a silk purse out of a pig's ear".  Pattaya is what it is and at the moment it's biggest problem is that it doesn't really know what it wants to be. if it wants to be a modern holiday resort city that attracts 'good' tourists then it needs to improve its infrastructure and services. It needs to spend money on capital urban regeneration (and not just build more and more condo blocks to sit empty for years on end). It needs to clean up the beaches and bring water quality up to international standards and then it needs to end its pursuit of 'cheap charlie' tours from China, Russia and the like. OR, it can accept it's origins and go the 'pile it high, sell it cheap' route and continue to seek out the above mentioned 'new farang' but it can't have both!

There are plenty of touristy holes in Thailand that they can tart up for the rich tourist. Pattaya should go back to what it was always good at. Back to the 90s would save it.

[Leaver]

14 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

There are plenty of touristy holes in Thailand that they can tart up for the rich tourist. Pattaya should go back to what it was always good at. Back to the 90s would save it.

No argument from me, but try telling the Thai landlords around Pattaya that. 

 

Their big rents get passed onto the consumer, and they have pushed the western tourist market, including the sex tourists, past what they are now prepared to pay, or able to pay. 

 

LK Metro started due to cheaper rents there compared to Walking Street.  When they hike up rents on LK Metro, where will be the next enclave to remain even slightly profitable, Soi Bongkot perhaps, and so the cycle starts again.     

[DannyCarlton]

56 minutes ago, Leaver said:

When they hike up rents on LK Metro

Happened a long time ago. Landlords are the Lengkee family, notorious in Pattaya for hiking rents up and putting people out of business.

[Penefattore]

the problem in Pattaya is that whores prices went so much up and service quality so much down it is not worth the trouble to visit it anymore.

[micmichd]

6 hours ago, Penefattore said:

the problem in Pattaya is that whores prices went so much up and service quality so much down it is not worth the trouble to visit it anymore.

The problem with sex tourists is that they never ever care about Thai ladies' situations. 

About every Thai lady working as a waitress and even those in "Coconut bar" is a single mum and has a hungry mouth to feed. They just don't talk about it, and you never ask them. 

So, if you want sex with them, you also pay for their children. If you can't afford that you better stay at home. 

[LennyW]

On 1/19/2020 at 1:57 PM, Tom59 said:

In England we have a saying that says "you can't make a silk purse out of a pig's ear".  Pattaya is what it is and at the moment it's biggest problem is that it doesn't really know what it wants to be. if it wants to be a modern holiday resort city that attracts 'good' tourists then it needs to improve its infrastructure and services. It needs to spend money on capital urban regeneration (and not just build more and more condo blocks to sit empty for years on end). It needs to clean up the beaches and bring water quality up to international standards and then it needs to end its pursuit of 'cheap charlie' tours from China, Russia and the like. OR, it can accept it's origins and go the 'pile it high, sell it cheap' route and continue to seek out the above mentioned 'new farang' but it can't have both!

In Scotland we improved the saying a little bit, and somewhat more apt in this context, "you can put lipstick on a pig...but it's still a pig" !

 

[jacko45k]

27 minutes ago, micmichd said:

So, if you want sex with them, you also pay for their children. If you can't afford that you better stay at home. 

So why does the price keep going up again?

[micmichd]

1 hour ago, jacko45k said:

So why does the price keep going up again?

Because sex workers get organized now (in the Empower Foundation), and because more and more  single mums bring their children from cheap Issan to more expensive Pattaya (to the EEC). 

[Leaver]

15 hours ago, DannyCarlton said:

Happened a long time ago. Landlords are the Lengkee family, notorious in Pattaya for hiking rents up and putting people out of business.

These Thai landlords not only put people out of business, but have outpriced Pattaya as a tourist destination in the region,  effectively putting Pattaya out of business.   

[Leaver]

6 hours ago, micmichd said:

The problem with sex tourists is that they never ever care about Thai ladies' situations. 

What "care" should be offered in these circumstances?

 

6 hours ago, micmichd said:

So, if you want sex with them, you also pay for their children. If you can't afford that you better stay at home. 

 

So why are the ones with no kids more expensive?  They should be cheaper.  ????

[micmichd]

1 minute ago, Leaver said:

These Thai landlords not only put people out of business, but have outpriced Pattaya as a tourist destination in the region,  effectively putting Pattaya out of business.   

Landlords would still need someone to pay the rent. And since there's not so many super rich left in Pattaya, they would have to rely on the middle-class. 

[Leaver]

Just now, micmichd said:

Landlords would still need someone to pay the rent. And since there's not so many super rich left in Pattaya, they would have to rely on the middle-class. 

I'm talking about commercial premises. 

[micmichd]

9 minutes ago, Leaver said:

I'm talking about commercial premises. 

Makes no difference. There's always consumers in the end that pay the price. Whether for beer, for entertainment, for medical services, or for electronic equipment. If those consumers stay away then the landlords will either have to lower their prices (aka rents) or they face bankruptcy. 

What sense does it make to build skyscrapers when no-one can afford to move in? 

[yogi100]

On 1/16/2020 at 9:03 PM, Traubert said:

I've no idea who she is. She's a woman gossiping in the hairdressers is the extent of my knowledge about her now and forever. Not what I'd call the font of all wisdom.

I think you'd find a Thai business owner no matter how modest that business may be will know a sight more about their livelihood and prosperity and that of their friends, family and acquaintances than any of us.

 

Including yourself and more than any university educated professor or government spokesman who might like to consider himself a 'font of all wisdom'.

[Leaver]

12 minutes ago, micmichd said:

Makes no difference. There's always consumers in the end that pay the price. Whether for beer, for entertainment, for medical services, or for electronic equipment. If those consumers stay away then the landlords will either have to lower their prices (aka rents) or they face bankruptcy. 

What sense does it make to build skyscrapers when no-one can afford to move in? 

A lot of the Thai's that have major real estate holdings in Pattaya are super rich.  They don't care if some of the premises are vacant, in fact, they usually hike the price up on the current tenants to make up for their loses, causing further vacancies.

 

As far as vacant skyscrapers are concerned, look no further then The Base on 2nd Road, so what do the rich do, just make sure there is no enforcement of daily rental.  Now, it's probably the busiest condo, aka hotel, in Central Pattaya.  

 

They own or control everything here, including the police, and officials.   Try telling someone used to such power and privilege to lower their prices so the doors can remain open.  They just don't care.  They will wait and wait for someone who will pay their price. 

 

In many cases, the high rents are set up to make the business fail so these landlords keep turning over key money.  

 

In my opinion, what is different now is, they have finally reached what the western market was willing to pay, or could afford to pay, helped along by the strong baht and some visa changes, but they have pushed the market to breaking point, and beyond, and I think you will see the consequences of this in the next 12 months.  

 

 

 

Edited January 21, 2020 by Leaver

[jacko45k]

16 hours ago, Leaver said:

In many cases, the high rents are set up to make the business fail so these landlords keep turning over key money.  

They may also be involved in the refurbishment business. As you say, the real money may well be made by losing a tenant, and refurbishing, re purposing, and taking key money and deposits and rent up front over and over. 

[lapamita]

The People was comming to Pattaya, for Party  and again Party and te rest is leaflet. ( good to have it, but not necesary)

 

Sell Pattaya as it is and promote it as it is

"Nightlife,Party and Singleparadies"

 

forget all about "pattaya marine paradies" . "High end lady campains" or pattaya sport paraides and all this b***

 

The Girls done more for Pattaya, than eer the goverment do , and they better do nothing,that would already help...........

 

pattaya was good as it was, and when the goverment wuuld leave it like that, only take care ,safety, cleanness a little bit and regualte traffic

 

thats all i want,and the rest PLease better do nothing , you already damage so much from closinghours,to raids up to the biggest mistake, to allow all this high rise condos, who nobody needs,and let the Greed in this sector come in

[lapamita]

 

 

Girls working hard here, to make Pattaya what it was

a Award and a pension for hard working girls in pattaya would be aporopriate , and a hole of shame for the rest

[micmichd]

34 minutes ago, lapamita said:

The People was comming to Pattaya, for Party  and again Party and te rest is leaflet. ( good to have it, but not necesary)

 

Sell Pattaya as it is and promote it as it is

"Nightlife,Party and Singleparadies"

 

forget all about "pattaya marine paradies" . "High end lady campains" or pattaya sport paraides and all this b***

 

The Girls done more for Pattaya, than eer the goverment do , and they better do nothing,that would already help...........

 

pattaya was good as it was, and when the goverment wuuld leave it like that, only take care ,safety, cleanness a little bit and regualte traffic

 

thats all i want,and the rest PLease better do nothing , you already damage so much from closinghours,to raids up to the biggest mistake, to allow all this high rise condos, who nobody needs,and let the Greed in this sector come in

I would recommend to make Pattaya a real hub for affordable medicine also. 

That saying, leave Farangs in their Western social health insurances regardless of where they chose to settle and make their Western social health insurances pay the medical bills in Thailand. It will be cheaper than medical costs in the West. And no expensive unwanted repatriation needed anymore. 

[lapamita]

31 minutes ago, micmichd said:

I would recommend to make Pattaya a real hub for affordable medicine also. 

That saying, leave Farangs in their Western social health insurances regardless of where they chose to settle and make their Western social health insurances pay the medical bills in Thailand. It will be cheaper than medical costs in the West. And no expensive unwanted repatriation needed anymore. 

already prices reach the same ,like many western countrys if you go to bumrungrad or BDS.

 

that would be a dream

 

make their Western social health insurances pay the medical bills in Thailand

 

You will never see this, as most Hospitalbills in western countrys payed by social health ( list price/compensation from state insurances) cheaper than in thailand.....as well a agreement must be made with every single state in the world , forget it

 

20 to 10 years back  BDS and bumrungrad was extremly good and cheap,,, still extremly good, but very expenssive  ( i know USA and some part of the world are more expensive )

[micmichd]

24 minutes ago, lapamita said:

already prices reach the same ,like many western countrys if you go to bumrungrad or BDS.

 

that would be a dream

 

make their Western social health insurances pay the medical bills in Thailand

 

You will never see this, as most Hospitalbills in western countrys payed by social health ( list price/compensation from state insurances) cheaper than in thailand.....as well a agreement must be made with every single state in the world , forget it

 

20 to 10 years back  BDS and bumrungrad was extremly good and cheap,,, still extremly good, but very expenssive  ( i know USA and some part of the world are more expensive )

I mean public hospitals like Banglamung Hospital.

Guess not worse than a NHS hospital (or a German "Poliklinik"), but probably much cheaper. At least German health experts say so. 

Edited January 22, 2020 by micmichd

[DannyCarlton]

18 minutes ago, micmichd said:

Guess not worse than a NHS hospital

555. Much, much worse!

[micmichd]

11 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

555. Much, much worse!

Not sure. I was treated in Banglamung Hospital after an accident, and they did it very well (emergency case with vaccinations) 

While these Germans (who I asked to pay at least for the vaccination shots) confabulated something about repatriation. 

Leaving aside that I could have died from tetanus, it's certainly uneconomic to refuse to pay less than 2,000 THB and demand an expensive intercontinental flight instead (which they would have to pay) 

Edited January 22, 2020 by micmichd