Creating System Image of SATA SSD and Restoring To NVMe SSD

[JetsetBkk]

A friend has Windows 10 installed on a SanDisk SATA M.2 SSD and wants to upgrade to a Transcend NVMe M.2 SSD.

The PC is a Asus "Mini PC" PN30.

I tried using my trusty 64 GB flash drive which boots Acronis 2017 and which is big enough to store a 60 GB System Image.

So I made the Image but, after replacing the SATA SSD with the NVMe SSD, when I start the restore process Acronis displays this message:

"Warning! After operation completion, operating systems will not boot from the destination disk in BIOS."

 

And they are dead right - it didn't boot. So then I discovered that the Asus PN30 PC uses UEFI firmware, not BIOS firmware.

 

So then I decided to try Macrium Reflect backup software which supports both MBR and GPT, i.e. BIOS based systems and UEFI based systems.

I made a bootable "Rescue Media" flash drive using the Macrium software installed on my Windows 10 PC (BIOS) after formatting the flash drive to Fat32 using Minitool Partition Wizard.

 

I made the image of the SanDisk Windows 10 SSD and restored it to the Transcend SSD.

But it didn't boot.

 

I checked that the UEFI firmware was set to "CSM Disabled" and that it recognised the Transcend SSD. But it wouldn't boot.

As a last resort I was going to build the "Rescue Media" flash drive on my friends UEFI PC, not my BIOS PC.

 

If anyone has successfully done this, I'd like to know how and what I am doing wrong.

[andy72]

ok, if your just cloning the bios settings are not changing

 

i recently talked someone through the macrium process 

im not familiar with Acronis

 

First question

this PC can take two SSD's 

https://www.asus.com/Mini-PCs/Mini-PC-PN30/

 

so why are you using a usb ?

 

ok the thing about macrium it appears that you have to put the partitions in the right order for macrium to fill the drive 

if it leaves any empty space it becomes non bootable 

(that may not be 100% accurate but thats my recent experience

 

i think using the usb is muddying the waters if you have an HD Caddy that would also be better

anyway macrium
at the 5 minute mark watch how this guy takes the partitions

 

Edited April 24, 2020 by andy72

[andy72]

forgot the link

 

its at the 5 minute mark you need to watch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZqkYnmDnas

[JetsetBkk]

1 hour ago, andy72 said:

ok, if your just cloning the bios settings are not changing

 

i recently talked someone through the macrium process 

im not familiar with Acronis

 

First question

this PC can take two SSD's 

https://www.asus.com/Mini-PCs/Mini-PC-PN30/

 

so why are you using a usb ?

 

ok the thing about macrium it appears that you have to put the partitions in the right order for macrium to fill the drive 

if it leaves any empty space it becomes non bootable 

(that may not be 100% accurate but thats my recent experience

 

i think using the usb is muddying the waters if you have an HD Caddy that would also be better

anyway macrium
at the 5 minute mark watch how this guy takes the partitions

 

Thanks for your post. I'll reply to it first, before looking at the video.

 

Yes, the Mini PC has two SSD connectors but one is an M.2 connector and the other is a standard SATA connector so I can't clone.

 

His Windows is running on a SanDisk M.2 SATA SSD and he wants to transfer it to a Transcend M.2 NVMe SSD because it should be about 4 or 5 times faster at transferring data, although I think the CPU will be a bottleneck as it is an AMD K16 processor.

 

So with only one M.2 slot available it has to be done by imaging and restoring. The 64GB flash drive I normally use for this on my BIOS-based PCs (all 5 of them) works fine.

 

The USBs (both the 64GB flash drive and the other drive connected by USB) are there for storing the System Image. At first I stored it on the 64GB flash drive - which is NTFS formatted - and then I tried on a FAT32 formatted USB drive. On NTFS, the Image was about 17GB. On FAT32 there were 5 files because of the limit of 4GB per file. But, although Macrium reported a successful restore, neither operation resulted in a bootable NVMe SSD.

 

I'll now watch the video and, after that, will post some not too clear photos I took of the Macrium Reflect screens.

 

[JetsetBkk]

First of all, what an excellent video! Everything up to 4:00 minute mark is exactly what I did to install Macrium and make the Rescue Media - then we differ as I used a USB flash drive and he used a CD (with a bit of sarcasm).

 

Making a clone looks incredibly simple, if only there were two M.2 slots for source and destination disks.

 

However, when he showed how Macrium automatically reduces the size of the 1TB Windows partition when he dragged it onto the smaller SSD, that gave me an idea of how to overcome the problem of having only one M.2 slot. What do you think of this: use the (already installed) 2.5" SATA drive as an intermediate clone. Then clone from it to the new M.2 NVMe SSD.

 

So, instead of:

 

1. making an image and storing it on a USB drive

2. replacing the M.2 SATA SSD (source) with the M.2 NVMe SSD (target)

3. restoring the image to the M.2 NVMe SSD

 

do this:

 

1. make a clone of the M.2 SATA SSD on the (unused) 2.5" SATA drive

2. replace the M.2 SATA SSD (source) with the M.2 NVMe SSD (target)

3. clone the 2.5" SATA SSD to the M.2 NVMe SATA drive.

 

Seems logical to me! The alternative is to find out what went wrong with my Image restore.

 

Another bit of info from Macrium support: "You have to be sure that your system is booting UEFI if your trying to boot with a GPT disk. This applies to the rescue media as well when taking Fix Boot Problems,  When the rescue media is booted UEFI it shows "UEFI" in the application title bar"

 

I think "when taking Fix Boot Problems" should read "when talking about Fix Boot Problems"

 

So the idea of building the "Rescue Media" on the Windows 10 UEFI-based PC (and not my BIOS-based PC) is something I'll do first, if no other ideas are forthcoming.

 

 

[RichCor]

If you can't get a clone or full recover to work you might want to start by doing a fresh setup using an ISO, and once that boots off the m.2 then try just recovering the C partition to the new install.

[JetsetBkk]

5 minutes ago, RichCor said:

If you can't get a clone or full recover to work you might want to start by doing a fresh setup using an ISO, and once that boots off the m.2 then try just recovering the C partition to the new install.

Yes, a reinstall from .iso was my last resort. But I don't understand "recovering the C partition to the new install". Do you mean, having got the NVMe to boot, just replace the new, virgin, Win10 partition with the one from the old system?

 

It may work, but seems a little unlikey.  ???? 

 

[andy72]

so you do have a external ubs that can take the ssd
then leave the original drive in and clone as video

but with macrium its all about the order it dont leave any dead space 

say you put the last partition in and theres a space just drag the last partition to fill the drive the last partition is actually the boot

 

or check your mail ghost64  is there and its simplicity itself 

[ballpoint]

I upgraded the SDD drive on my laptop to a larger one a number of months ago, using the following steps: 

1. I bought a new SDD and a USB enclosure for it from Advice.
2. Place the new SDD in the enclosure and plug into a USB slot.
3. Use 'Minitool Partition Wizard' (free to download) to clone the whole SDD drive, including hidden partitions, to the new one.  Because the new one is larger, it asks if I want to enlarge all partitions accordingly, so they expand to fill the available space, or keep them as the same size.  I chose the latter, which leaves a large unused section on the new drive, but this can be dealt with later.  The cloning takes a while, and the computer will reboot in order to copy the system files.
4. Still using Minitool Partition Wizard, enlarge the 'C' partition to include the unused space, and hide the system partition(s).
5. Place the new drive in the computer and turn on.  The computer booted up as per normal with no problems, and continues to do so.
6. Put the old SDD into the USB enclosure and either reformat it to use it as a portable drive, or keep it as is for a recovery drive.

 

[JetsetBkk]

15 minutes ago, ballpoint said:

I upgraded the SDD drive on my laptop to a larger one a number of months ago, using the following steps: 

<snip>

Interesting. I have Minitool Partition Wizard 12 on my own PC and installed on my friend's PC a few days ago. I've never used it for disk cloning or even data file backups.

 

I'll look into that - thanks for the tip.

[JetsetBkk]

48 minutes ago, andy72 said:

so you do have a external ubs that can take the ssd
then leave the original drive in and clone as video

but with macrium its all about the order it dont leave any dead space 

say you put the last partition in and theres a space just drag the last partition to fill the drive the last partition is actually the boot

 

or check your mail ghost64  is there and its simplicity itself 

Sorry, I saw your message on my phone about Ghost (which I haven't used for 15 years) but forgot about it when I got to the PC.

 

The problems are that I must boot the Rescue Media under UEFI and that I have only one M.2 slot in this small PC. So cloning from one M.2 SSD directly to another is not possible. So that is why I will use a 2.5" SSD as intermediate and do the cloning twice.

 

Whether I use Macrium, Partition Wizard or Ghost is - I think - not important. It is the mechanism of getting the O/S from one M.2 SSD to the other that is tricky, but now hopefully solved.

Edited April 24, 2020 by JetsetBkk

[OneMoreFarang]

1 hour ago, JetsetBkk said:

overcome the problem of having only one M.2 slot. What do you think of this: use the (already installed) 2.5" SATA drive as an intermediate clone. Then clone from it to the new M.2 NVMe SSD.

Sounds good.

Except I would do it a little different:

a) Clone the existing M.2 to a 2.5" SSD. I guess you know how to do that, i.e. with Ghost or other SW.

b) Install the new NVMe SSD in the M.2 slot

c) Make sure the BIOS settings are correct! I just installed a NVMe M.2 in a (big) ASUS motherboard which had a M.2 slot which works with SATA type M.2 and with NVMe. I had to play around with the settings to make sure it uses the NVMe settings. The ASUS documentation was unclear. SATA settings will likely work also on your new NVMe M.2. But it will be a lot slower than with the correct settings.

Make sure it's configured for NVMe!

d) Install the correct drivers in the existing Windows. That is important because you need those drivers after the cloning to the new "disk".

e) Use cloning software in Windows. I used the software which came with my Samsung NVMe M.2, Samsung Data Migration, and it worked perfect.

f) If you like use a test program before and after.

Here is what I saw with my system changing from an Intel SSD 335 to a Samsung 970 EVO Plus.

Edited April 24, 2020 by OneMoreFarang

[RichCor]

I'd suggest using Macrium Reflect booted off of your USB drive and create a BACKUP image of the original M.2 image to it, then swap in the new M.2 and RECOVER the same image.

 

The previous suggestion I made, about doing a fresh install using an ISO then RESTORING the 'C' partition from a BACKUP, was only if you ran into boot problems while doing a normal restore.

[OneMoreFarang]

5 minutes ago, RichCor said:

I'd suggest using Macrium Reflect booted off of your USB drive and create a BACKUP image of the original M.2 image to it, then swap in the new M.2 and RECOVER the same image.

 

The previous suggestion I made, about doing a fresh install using an ISO then RESTORING the 'C' partition from a BACKUP, was only if you ran into boot problems while doing a normal restore.

He needs possibly new BIOS settings (maybe done automatic by ASUS) and a new driver for the new M.2 "disk". And that driver has to be installed before the cloning to the new M.2. Otherwise it won't boot.

[RichCor]

21 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

He needs possibly new BIOS settings (maybe done automatic by ASUS) and a new driver for the new M.2 "disk".

 

Probably true, as the ASUS support website for the PN30 has a BIOS update (2020 MAR)

Interesting that the support specs limit the M.2 storage -- 128GB Up to 512GB M.2 SSD

 

Transcend's support website doesn't make any mention of a special driver being available (unlike Samsung has for it's 970 evo).

 

[JetsetBkk]

13 minutes ago, RichCor said:

 

Probably true, as the ASUS support website for the PN30 has a BIOS update (2020 MAR)

Interesting that the support specs limit the M.2 storage -- 128GB Up to 512GB M.2 SSD

 

Transcend's support website doesn't make any mention of a special driver being available (unlike Samsung has for it's 970 evo).

 

 

That BIOS update information is interesting and a little worrying. This is what Speccy reports:

  
         BIOS
            Brand ASUSTeK COMPUTER INC.
            Version 0318
            Date 5/16/2019
       

 

but the ASUS website says:

 

Version 0318 2020/03/09  4.05 MBytes

PN30 BIOS 0318

 

Version 0317 2019/05/22  4.07 MBytes

PN30 BIOS 0317
PCBA Change!

 

Version 0312 2019/03/15  4.07 MBytes

PN30 BIOS 0312
release BIOS 0312

 

Version 0307 2019/01/18  4.07 MBytes

PN30 BIOS 0307
first BIOS Release

 

Maybe Speccy is wrong.   ????

 

 

 

[RichCor]

The Crucial website, under "Mini PC PN30 Compatible Upgrades", is stating that the "Crucial P1 500GB 3D NAND NVMe PCIe M.2 SSD (CT500P1SSD8)" is "100% compatible with Mini PC PN30".

 

But there are no reviews, nor any working install guide links. So that's good, right? 

[RichCor]

30 minutes ago, JetsetBkk said:

Maybe Speccy is wrong.   ????

If you boot into BIOS and it reports as 0318 then I'd leave it as is.

[JetsetBkk]

45 minutes ago, RichCor said:

If you boot into BIOS and it reports as 0318 then I'd leave it as is.

 

47 minutes ago, RichCor said:

The Crucial website, under "Mini PC PN30 Compatible Upgrades", is stating that the "Crucial P1 500GB 3D NAND NVMe PCIe M.2 SSD (CT500P1SSD8)" is "100% compatible with Mini PC PN30".

 

But there are no reviews, nor any working install guide links. So that's good, right? 

I think I found that Crucial site a while ago when I wanted to make sure the MoBo was compatible with NVMe M.2 SSDs. I'll give the cloning a go before worrying about the BIOS date.

[Eindhoven]

First thing that you should do is a clean install of Windows 10 to the NVMe drive. This to ascertain that it can boot from a NVMe drive in the first instance..

If you cannot, then you can investigate if it is by design, an incorrect setting in the BIOS or a missing Driver, before you waste more time with attempted cloning.

[JetsetBkk]

It's been a l-o-o-o-o-o-ng day! But a successful one.

 

The plan was to clone the Windows disk installed on the SanDisk M.2 SATA disk to my SanDisk 2.5" SATA disk and then clone that disk to the SanDisk NVMe disk.

 

After I'd copied the first three partitions from the M.2 SATA disk to the 2.5" SATA disk without problems, Macrium produced a cloning error when it started copying the fourth partition - the Windows partition. The error reported was "Error 0".

 

After Googling the error, I tried three of the suggested fixes: turning off Windows defender, running "Chkdsk /r" on the target disk and finally - the one that worked - going to the Macrium menu bar and clicking on "Other Tasks / Fix VSS Problems". That fixed it - copying the 4th partition worked without error.

 

So, after making a clone onto my SanDisk 2.5" SATA disk, I removed the SanDisk M.2 SATA disk and installed the Transcend M.2 NVMe disk and did the cloning again, this time from my 2.5" SATA disk to the M.2 NVMe disk.

 

Of course, there was lots of testing and BIOS changing in between these stages, and checking of the newly created clones to make sure Windows booted OK and various applications worked OK.

 

But in the end, it worked. Phew.