PM Prayut threatens return of restrictions if Covid-19 prevention measures not observed

[metisdead]

A post with a link to a questionable source has been removed as well as the replies.

 

Some disruptive bickering posts and the replies have been removed. 

[josephbloggs]

6 hours ago, The Barmbeker said:

About your "get a grip"- statement: so you actually believe the COVID- numbers. coming from the officials?

I have no reason to believe they are making the figures up, nor do I believe they could cover up figures if they were so significantly higher.  If they were going to make up figures why did they allow them to increase significantly a while ago?  Why not just keep them low and get more back slaps?   Why don't they make up the number of tests they are doing so they are much higher and all the TVF super sleuths / pseudo scientists would be off their backs with that criticism?  Vietnam has had zero deaths. why is Thailand reporting 56?  That's more than most countries in this region (Singapore, Vietnam, Cambodia).  If they are going to lie why not say there have been 5 deaths?  Or one?

And anecdotally, I have lived here 25 years and know people all over the country.  Family, extended family, friends.  Absolutely nobody I have asked, not one person, knows anyone, or has heard of anyone (friend of a friend) being infected with Covid 19 or even showing symptoms.  This includes all staff at my company, lots of Thai people.  I was in a hospital last week and it was dead, asked about it, nothing.  One of my staff is from Iran and lost his dad to Covid recently.  I personally know four people in the UK who have had it (all recovered).

How many people do you know here?  Where are they all?  Where is your evidence that they are lying about the numbers?  Lying wouldn't be to protect tourism as the country is closed.  Please explain your thought process.

 

Quote

AFAIK, if you have COVID- symptoms and go to a hospital, but are tested negative, you have to pay for the test, that costs anything from 1.000 to 8.000 THB!

Is that true?  Can you share a link?  

If you want to rock up to a hospital and just ask for a test, yes, you'll pay as well you should.  But if you are sick and the doctor tests you you're saying you'll be charged unless you come back positive?  I don't believe that for a minute.  Evidence please.

[pookondee]

8 hours ago, The Barmbeker said:

How about paying the poorest some >deleted< money, before lecturing everybody on their behavior?

 Thai logic will say that if the people have ample money to buy beer, they dont need handouts.

CTTOI, ts the same thinking as a typical Thai gf. They see a farang drinking 600baht worth of alcohol per day they know he got money.

Edited May 6, 2020 by pookondee

[fraggleRock]

Guess this soldier boy player has never heard of 'Al Capone' etc.. or the 'Prohibition' and the proven results, what did he expect? Even the half wits and village idiots within a sensible parrallel universe to our own could see what carnage would bestow upon 'isle 12! The instore booze cruise aisle of dreams'   - Got to many fancy army uniforms to adorn with magpie shiny medals for achieving? --- winning?  --- saving? --- well they look pretty on the dance floor I guess ...  Dont we have a medicl condtion for this kind of behaviour?-- Narcissistic personality disorder....  I don't drink but was amusing to see people going crazy... Social distancing etc - out the window it pops..... well what do you expect, folks here wear flimsy fake face masks thinking its a barrier (NOt) and seen many a local whizz by on a motor bike adorning such atire minus a helmet.... So if the Chinese Plague does't kill ya, that truck behind you with break failure will, or the drunk doing a sharp left on to his Soi after a major daily day on the lash! -- ???? Thailand.... love it - expect the unexpected, no one cares - everyone for themselves...  -- so many drunks like nowhere I know on Earth....

Edited May 6, 2020 by fraggleRock

[joecoolfrog]

15 hours ago, sandyf said:

I don't know about NK hospitals but my niece is a junior doctor at a large hospital in the centre of Bangkok and she said they about 7 cases in patients and a few in staff. Her friend got it and recovered quite quickly, her contacts were all immediately quarantined for 2 weeks.

I went to my hospital last week, they had no cases and all was working as normal with social distancing.

Of course you are free to believe anything you want, fortunately it doesn't make it fact.

There is a direct correlation between the number of tests performed and the number of infections found. That is a fact , only a fool can dismiss it.

[mikosan]

10 hours ago, stephenterry said:

While that eating behaviour is correct, it is less likely for whole family groups and friends to gather together in the absence of alcohol. That's a behavioural truism, because the incentive to gather together is negated. A party without beer - no, we'll not go and visit. Being teetotal is simply not on the agenda.

 

So, IMO, it's not a pointless exercise by any means, and it's pretty obvious that the PM is more aware of Thai habits than us foreigners. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm sorry, but I disagree.  I see family groups gathering together daily to eat, regardless of whether or not there is alcohol present.  It's not a party, it's a daily family social gathering.

 

Furthermore, the thought that the PM is more aware of Thai habits than us foreigners, makes me laugh.  I would hazard a guess that he has no idea how the average poor Thai lives, certainly less than some of us foreigners.  Like most of the Hi-So's out there, those being the ones that run this country, badly, who wouldn't go to an Isaan village and sit on the floor and share food if their life depended upon it.

[stephenterry]

3 hours ago, mikosan said:

I'm sorry, but I disagree.  I see family groups gathering together daily to eat, regardless of whether or not there is alcohol present.  It's not a party, it's a daily family social gathering.

 

Furthermore, the thought that the PM is more aware of Thai habits than us foreigners, makes me laugh.  I would hazard a guess that he has no idea how the average poor Thai lives, certainly less than some of us foreigners.  Like most of the Hi-So's out there, those being the ones that run this country, badly, who wouldn't go to an Isaan village and sit on the floor and share food if their life depended upon it.

What you see, miko, on a daily basis is a family group who live together - and are self isolating. My point is that a ban discourages friends, neighbours, and relatives from different provinces visiting for a party get together. Why bother to travel huge distances if you can't relax and enjoy a few bottles of whatever when you arrive. No fun in that.  

 

As for the second paragraph, that they don't know how poor Thais live is conjecture, sorry. 

[metisdead]

A post using a music video and the replies have been removed as this is not the topic to post music videos in. 

[Prairieboy]

On 5/6/2020 at 4:05 AM, Canuck1966 said:

If he hadn't laid down these draconian laws in the first place then there wouldn't have been a problem

Also the more you restrict timewise, the more bottlenecks you create

Obtuseness personified 

Perhaps if one could buy alcohol whenever the stores are open instead of only during the restricted hours [11:00 AM to 2:00 PM and after 5;00 pm], many of the bottlenecks would be non-existent!

[loong]

23 hours ago, stephenterry said:

What you see, miko, on a daily basis is a family group who live together - and are self isolating. My point is that a ban discourages friends, neighbours, and relatives from different provinces visiting for a party get together. Why bother to travel huge distances if you can't relax and enjoy a few bottles of whatever when you arrive. No fun in that.  

 

As for the second paragraph, that they don't know how poor Thais live is conjecture, sorry. 

Did you not see the huge traffic jams at the start of the long weekend? The ban was in place then.

Edited May 7, 2020 by metisdead
Please do not modify someone else's post in your quoted reply, either with font or color changes or wording.

[sandyf]

8 hours ago, joecoolfrog said:

There is a direct correlation between the number of tests performed and the number of infections found. That is a fact , only a fool can dismiss it.

Only a fool can think any country can carry out unlimited testing.

In any country testing is a limited resource, even the wealthy west is struggling, but people like you would advocate wasting what resource is available. 

Like many other situations a targeted approach is far more appropriate than any shotgun version.

 

The UK took a targeted approach but bashing them does little for the appetite of the Thai basher.

[sandyf]

2 hours ago, Prairieboy said:

Perhaps if one could buy alcohol whenever the stores are open instead of only during the restricted hours [11:00 AM to 2:00 PM and after 5;00 pm], many of the bottlenecks would be non-existent!

You can buy alcohol during normal hours, just go to a wholesaler.

Those that bought trolleys in the supermarket just didn't want the inconvenience of going somewhere else, easier to inconvenience others.

[loong]

9 minutes ago, sandyf said:

You can buy alcohol during normal hours, just go to a wholesaler.

Those that bought trolleys in the supermarket just didn't want the inconvenience of going somewhere else, easier to inconvenience others.

If, by normal hours, you mean outside of the allowed times to buy alcohol.....

Theoretically you need a license to sell alcohol to be able to buy outside of the allowed times. This has been mentioned several times in this topic already.

If, by normal hours, you mean the allowed times to buy alcohol.....

How is it inconveniencing others to buy your alcohol in a supermarket?

IT is the ridiculous and unnecessary restrictions on the times that alcohol can be sold that is the inconvenience.

When I go to the supermarket to buy food etc, I often also want to buy alcohol. Therefore I time my shopping trip to be between 11am and 2pm. How many others do the same? Without these ludicrous restrictions people's shopping times will be spread out through the day.

[stephenterry]

2 hours ago, loong said:

Did you not see the huge traffic jams at the start of the long weekend? The ban was in place then.

Exactly my point. As expected by Thais, the alcohol ban was lifted on Sunday by all but 4 provinces during this holiday period. It's a human behavioural truism that the availability of alcohol attracts people and the availability of 'Free' alcohol for family visitors attracts even more people. Why posters continue to deny the reality of alcohol attraction beats me.

 

And as a result of the holiday surge and almost rabid buying and stocking up from Sunday onwards by both Thais and foreigners, I await a possible/probable spike in Thai infection rates in the forthcoming week. and that is exactly what the government is trying to avoid - hence their subsequent warning that the ban could be reimposed - possibly until the Covid19 passes us by.

 

 

[Suua]

29 minutes ago, sandyf said:

Only a fool can think any country can carry out unlimited testing.

In any country testing is a limited resource, even the wealthy west is struggling, but people like you would advocate wasting what resource is available. 

Like many other situations a targeted approach is far more appropriate than any shotgun version.

 

The UK took a targeted approach but bashing them does little for the appetite of the Thai basher.

Ahem....South Korea.

You need both blanket testing to isolate the infectious, then targeted to find out who these people had been with and where.

Very simple....South Korea nailed it.

As soon as they got wind of what was happening in China last December they immediately instructed companies to produce test kits.....They knew from previous experiences of the Chinese.

[stephenterry]

10 minutes ago, Suua said:

Ahem....South Korea.

You need both blanket testing to isolate the infectious, then targeted to find out who these people had been with and where.

Very simple....South Korea nailed it.

As soon as they got wind of what was happening in China last December they immediately instructed companies to produce test kits.....They knew from previous experiences of the Chinese.

as did Vietnam.

[Anotify]

Vietnam or Cambodia ? or maybe Laos ? time to rethink my future in Asia. what's next? changing the rule for the 90 days grace period ? 

[johnarth]

the general is in a spot of bother, someone must have told him Thais do not like him any more, this has come from his need to get the Chinese back into the country as soon as possible, and him and anus have decided the first lot will go to Chiang Mai (the home of farangs) just in case they have the virus with them lol

[mikosan]

5 hours ago, stephenterry said:

What you see, miko, on a daily basis is a family group who live together - and are self isolating. My point is that a ban discourages friends, neighbours, and relatives from different provinces visiting for a party get together. Why bother to travel huge distances if you can't relax and enjoy a few bottles of whatever when you arrive. No fun in that.  

 

As for the second paragraph, that they don't know how poor Thais live is conjecture, sorry. 

I believe that is what I said, 'family groups'.

 

[Thomas J]

Put another way if Covid 19 did not kill you or your business we will make sure that we finish the job. 

[mikosan]

1 hour ago, stephenterry said:

Exactly my point. As expected by Thais, the alcohol ban was lifted on Sunday by all but 4 provinces during this holiday period. It's a human behavioural truism that the availability of alcohol attracts people and the availability of 'Free' alcohol for family visitors attracts even more people. Why posters continue to deny the reality of alcohol attraction beats me.

 

And as a result of the holiday surge and almost rabid buying and stocking up from Sunday onwards by both Thais and foreigners, I await a possible/probable spike in Thai infection rates in the forthcoming week. and that is exactly what the government is trying to avoid - hence their subsequent warning that the ban could be reimposed - possibly until the Covid19 passes us by.

 

 

So, if they hadn't banned the sale of alcohol in the first place there wouldn't have been any 'rabid buying' and the urge to stock up, causing the possibility of further infections.  Furthermore, most of those journeys to visit relatives were planned for the long weekend and long before people were aware that the alcohol ban was being lifted.  What they should have done is cancel the long weekend, like they did Songkran, then the booze ban, or its lifting, would have been irrelevant.

[RedPill]

2 hours ago, sandyf said:

You can buy alcohol during normal hours, just go to a wholesaler.

Those that bought trolleys in the supermarket just didn't want the inconvenience of going somewhere else, easier to inconvenience others.

Whats a wholesaler?

 

Makro? Followed by Tesco? In reality. Where do all the retailers buy their stock from?

 

I have seen multiple multiple times staff driving down to 7/11 ... to stock up, if beer runs short during a night (in the old times).

 

Edited May 7, 2020 by RedPill

[RedPill]

13 minutes ago, mikosan said:

So, if they hadn't banned the sale of alcohol in the first place there wouldn't have been any 'rabid buying' and the urge to stock up, causing the possibility of further infections.  Furthermore, most of those journeys to visit relatives were planned for the long weekend and long before people were aware that the alcohol ban was being lifted.  What they should have done is cancel the long weekend, like they did Songkran, then the booze ban, or its lifting, would have been irrelevant.

Who needed a long weekend after being at home and business shut down for weeks?

Just open up would be better.

 

Business owners ran for it, and everyone else, very logically. 

 

Edited May 7, 2020 by RedPill

[HaleySabai]

Thai-beer...overpriced klong-water!

It should be banned for not being "fit for human consumption".

 

 

 

 

 

 

Kunstler said "yo girlfriend has a face like an ol' craw-fish"

[jaideedave]

7 hours ago, johnarth said:

the general is in a spot of bother, someone must have told him Thais do not like him any more, this has come from his need to get the Chinese back into the country as soon as possible, and him and anus have decided the first lot will go to Chiang Mai (the home of farangs) just in case they have the virus with them lol

The general speaks like a true dictator.I s anyone surprised? What a <deleted>!

[joecoolfrog]

13 hours ago, sandyf said:

Only a fool can think any country can carry out unlimited testing.

In any country testing is a limited resource, even the wealthy west is struggling, but people like you would advocate wasting what resource is available. 

Like many other situations a targeted approach is far more appropriate than any shotgun version.

 

The UK took a targeted approach but bashing them does little for the appetite of the Thai basher.

Who mentioned unlimited testing and please show me a single post where I bashed Thais !

The fact remains that without large scale testing it is impossible to collect sufficient data to ascertain the true scope of infection. A targeted approach is fine , but one still needs data to pinpoint the targets.

If Thailand cannot afford extensive testing , which would be odd given its much heralded foreign reserves , then so be it , it must proceed in the dark.

However be under no illusions that the daily confirmed figures mean much of anything , the scale of the lockdown proves that.

 

Edited May 7, 2020 by joecoolfrog

[loong]

19 hours ago, stephenterry said:

Exactly my point. As expected by Thais, the alcohol ban was lifted on Sunday by all but 4 provinces during this holiday period. It's a human behavioural truism that the availability of alcohol attracts people and the availability of 'Free' alcohol for family visitors attracts even more people. Why posters continue to deny the reality of alcohol attraction beats me.

 

And as a result of the holiday surge and almost rabid buying and stocking up from Sunday onwards by both Thais and foreigners, I await a possible/probable spike in Thai infection rates in the forthcoming week. and that is exactly what the government is trying to avoid - hence their subsequent warning that the ban could be reimposed - possibly until the Covid19 passes us by.

 

 

I don't know why you quoted my post

Quote

Did you not see the huge traffic jams at the start of the long weekend? The ban was in place then.

As I said, the alcohol ban was still in place at the start of the weekend, so there was no free alcohol awaiting the travellers at the end of their journey.

 

If there is any spike in infections then it is more likely to be related to the crowded sky trains and platforms than a few people buying alcohol.

When tens of thousands of people returned to their villages with Mochit station and buses tightly packed with people, you could have expected a massive spike in infections. It didn't happen though. Why? We can only guess. Maybe this is not the first wave, maybe cv appeared much earlier, but a weaker strain, maybe Thailand already has herd immunity.

Edited May 7, 2020 by metisdead
Please do not modify someone else's post in your quoted reply, either with font or color changes or wording.

[stephenterry]

1 hour ago, loong said:

If there is any spike in infections then it is more likely to be related to the crowded sky trains and platforms than a few people buying alcohol.

That is very true, but (un)fortunately only BKK would be affected providing infected persons stayed there and not travel to other provinces. As for the alcohol ban countrywide it probably helped contain the risk of becoming infected, as most people stayed at home. 

 

The rush out of BKK could have been reduced, IMO, by the government notifying the public in advance that the alcohol ban would be extended for the whole holiday period. It would have simplified tracking and tracing of any new outbreaks.

 

And yes, I'm amazed at why Thailand has been spared the coronavirus passage through the country -  it's illogical, IMO, that so few new cases are reported. But if that is the actuality, the lockdowns should be relaxed so that people can get back to earning a living. On that note, when I visited Big C on Tuesday, the upstairs food and drink shopping area was quiet - plenty of booze crates available but no buyers - however, people were packed waiting outside all banks, downstairs, presumably to obtain loans to tide them over.

 

That's very sad.    

 

[loong]

4 hours ago, loong said:

I don't know why you quoted my post

As I said, the alcohol ban was still in place at the start of the weekend, so there was no free alcohol awaiting the travellers at the end of their journey.

 

If there is any spike in infections then it is more likely to be related to the crowded sky trains and platforms than a few people buying alcohol.

When tens of thousands of people returned to their villages with Mochit station and buses tightly packed with people, you could have expected a massive spike in infections. It didn't happen though. Why? We can only guess. Maybe this is not the first wave, maybe cv appeared much earlier, but a weaker strain, maybe Thailand already has herd immunity.

Metisdead, I didn't modify Stephenterry's post at all when I quoted it. I don't understand why you needed to edit it.

Quote

Edited 3 hours ago by metisdead
Please do not modify someone else's post in your quoted reply, either with font or color changes or wording.

EDIT: I think that I see what you have done. In the post that I quoted

Quote

Why posters continue to deny the reality of alcohol attraction beats me.

was in bold text and now it isn't so that is what you edited?

That text was in bold in the original post that I quoted.

Mikosan #201 quoted the same post and it is still in bold.

Edited May 8, 2020 by loong
Addition

[sandyf]

22 hours ago, Suua said:

Ahem....South Korea.

You need both blanket testing to isolate the infectious, then targeted to find out who these people had been with and where.

Very simple....South Korea nailed it.

As soon as they got wind of what was happening in China last December they immediately instructed companies to produce test kits.....They knew from previous experiences of the Chinese.

There is no dispute with that, but you have picked on a country outside the norm and one that has been used as a bench mark by many.

South Korea was badly affected by MERS in 2015, not China, and reacted on that experience developing their own test very rapidly. Other countries were not in the same position and had to make the best use of resources available.

The west paid little attention to the early warnings so the subsequent problems over testing were effectively self inflicted and created problems in countries dependent on outside supply.

Germany already had an extensive laboratory facility in place and fared much better than the other European countries.

Global mass testing was a non starter from day one.

 

The criticism comes as the decision to end community testing on 12 March – while other countries continued to track and trace potential victims(a reference to South Korea) – continues to dog the government.

Matt Hancock, the health secretary, has blamed “capacity restraints” at the time, but some experts have warned it allowed the pandemic to take hold and led to unnecessary deaths.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/coronavirus-testing-greg-clark-uk-pandemic-public-health-england-a9503931.html