US Citizen Reporting 800K Baht In Thai Bank

[Captain Monday]

9 hours ago, JetsetBkk said:

He's never done it and the posibility of big hefty fines is keeping him from starting.

 

I started doing it a few years after it was required.

Takes 5 minutes online.

 

It is a big law to use against people who hide larger accounts and income, not average expats and pensioners. Starting with an American who "owns a bar-beer" in Thailand and is essentially a human trafficker and pimp, and his income, ending with major international criminals , drug traders and shady businessmen.

 

He is worrying about nothing.

 

[The Theory]

14 hours ago, JetsetBkk said:

He says he doesn't put 800K in a Thai bank because he has to report any funds over $10,000 deposited in a foreign bank.

Less than $50,000 could be reported annually to FBAR easily online without getting involved with IRS. 

[taxout]

"One poster commented the FBAR report had to be filed by end of June.  As of the 2019 report the filing date coincides with the IRS income tax due date of 15 April.  The date due for the FBAR is not extended beyond that date as with your tax return."

 

The usual dead-wrong bar-stool tax advice which permeates this forum. Just go to the official sites, find the official rules, and read them:

 

"FinCEN grants filers failing to meet the FBAR annual due date of April 15 an automatic extension to October 15 each year. Accordingly, specific requests for this extension are not required."

 

https://www.fincen.gov/news/news-releases/new-due-date-fbars-0

[Why Me]

10 hours ago, soisanuk said:

Previously, Bangkok Bank and some other Thai banks had entered into agreements with the IRS for this reporting, BUT that changed and the obligation to report was taken over by the Bank of Thailand pursuant to a later agreement between the IRS and the Government of Thailand.

Very informative post, thanks. My company invests our Provident Fund amounts (employee + company contributions) with TISCO. So would TISCO fall within the reporting requirement?

[Jaxxper]

I’m not a US citizen , but worked in the US a couple of times. The FBAR reporting requirements are to mitigate money laundering and not related to tax. The companies consultant accountancy firm in the US explained that this was a requirement of anybody with links to the US, and is just a formality. I too was very nervous about submitting it the first time due to world wide tax concerns, but when it was explained It made sense.

I do recall that the penalties for not complying are pretty high.

Hope this helps.

[soisanuk]

14 hours ago, dlclark97 said:

One poster commented the FBAR report had to be filed by end of June.  As of the 2019 report the filing date coincides with the IRS income tax due date of 15 April.  The date due for the FBAR is not extended beyond that date as with your tax return.  Also, as said the report can be done in five (maybe ten) minutes on line and has nothing to do with any taxation. It is related to financial crimes activities only.  The amount required to be reported is the peak value of the account(s) during the year in USD.  Add these amounts for multiple accounts and use the official exchange rate from https://www.fiscal.treasury.gov/reports-statements/treasury-reporting-rates-exchange/current.html to convert Thai baht to USD.  There is no connection or impact on your income tax liability but as has been said there can be extremely heavy fines for failing to report.  Make sure you go to the official government site at site https://bsaefiling.fincen.treas.gov/main.html to file this report on line.  There are many offers available at a high cost to do this report for you but you can easily do the report yourself.

The filing date was changed from June 15 to April 15, but as noted in my earlier post, an automatic 6 month extension has been granted until October 15 without the need to actually request it - in that post, I included the link to the FINCEN website noting the extension.  Also, a poster mentions it is filed with the Justice Dept - that is not correct, the Financial Crimes Enforcement Network (FINCEN) is part the the Treasury Department as is the Internal Revenue Service, but they are two separate agencies within the Department.    The FBAR is required by money lending laws.

 

Also, it appears some are confusing it with FATCA (Foreign Account Tax Compliance Act) as I mentioned in the previous post, but apologies as I used FACTA  which is a different law entirely.  FATCA requires both foreign banks and US Citizen/residents to report on their foreign financial assets - it also has thresholds that must be met before reporting is required.  It is administered by the IRS - here is their webpage and has links to information for individuals as well as financial institutions - https://www.irs.gov/businesses/corporations/foreign-account-tax-compliance-act-fatca. The FATCA law includes more than just bank accounts whereas FBAR deals only with foreign bank accounts. and has the US$10,000 threshold).

[5633572526]

22 hours ago, JetsetBkk said:

I think the boat-rocking is my friend's attitude too.

However, I believe he banks with Bangkok bank so I'd better give him a link to this thread.

I bank with Bangkok bank. Did not fill out any irs form when opening my account. Do not report the 800,000. Thai banking system is not linked to USA systems. Have been with Bangkok bank for 10 years 

[lopburi3]

12 minutes ago, 5633572526 said:

Thai banking system is not linked to USA systems. Have been with Bangkok bank for 10 years 

10 years ago there was no form to fill out - now there is as Thailand does report accounts to USA.  The only information that they might not have provided by form is your SSN so expect it is reported only with name in that case.  You are required to file FBAR if you have more than $10,000 total in foreign accounts at any time during the year regardless of if you filed any additional paperwork with bank or not.

Edited May 22, 2020 by lopburi3

[JackThompson]

1 hour ago, 5633572526 said:

I bank with Bangkok bank. Did not fill out any irs form when opening my account. Do not report the 800,000. Thai banking system is not linked to USA systems. Have been with Bangkok bank for 10 years 

Same with my 1st account there.  But when I opened a 2nd one a couple years ago, they handed me the IRS form to fill out. 

 

I don't keep enough in Thailand to have to do this reporting, but all Americans seem to be required to fill it out.  I don't know if they always submit it to the IRS - or only if your balance exceeds the threshold.

[AgMech Cowboy]

23 hours ago, Pib said:

And since he's not keeping more than $10K in Thailand no annual FBAR is required.

Really? Good to know!!

[soisanuk]

6 hours ago, lopburi3 said:

10 years ago there was no form to fill out - now there is as Thailand does report accounts to USA.  The only information that they might not have provided by form is your SSN so expect it is reported only with name in that case.  You are required to file FBAR if you have more than $10,000 total in foreign accounts at any time during the year regardless of if you filed any additional paperwork with bank or not.

Thailand and the USA signed an Intergovernmental Agreement (IGA) on 4 March 2016 to implement FATCA - Thai banks to report to IRS on US Citizen/residents having accounts and US banks to report on Thai citizens having accounts in USA - pages 1-21 is the basic agreement - there whole document is 66 pages of legalese - https://home.treasury.gov/system/files/131/FATCA-Agreement-Thailand-3-4-2016.pdf.  <removed>

Some Thai banks entered into initial Agreements to file FATCA information with IRS prior to that date and started obtaining Taxpayer Identification Numbers (TIN) which for most individuals is their Social Security Number - once the IGA was signed, the Thai government took the responsibility to report to the IRS for all Thai banks with the banks reporting the info to the Thai Government for the purpose. I opened my first account with Bangkok Bank before the FATCA law went into effect, thus no providing my TIN. But, I opened a 2nd account with them a couple of years ago and they did require that information.

 

As mentioned in the message quoted above he FBAR has to be filed by the individual regardless of any paperwork filed with a Thai bank. Thai banks have no involvement in the FBAR, it is solely the responsibility of the US Citizen/resident.  

Edited May 22, 2020 by ubonjoe
removed link to the Bangkok Post and a quote of it (forum rule)

[hereforgood]

As i have to do the Fbar yearly I have done them in advance for the next 5 years and saved them. The only thing I have to do is put in the new amounts each year. Saves me from doing the whole form yearly