Fauci warns spread of COVID-19 'could get very bad', says no guarantee of vaccine

[Phoenix Rising]

6 minutes ago, yuyiinthesky said:

It would be so nice if the bickering Trump vs democrats/Biden would stop and you guys would focus on the real problems. 

Trump is unfortunately a very real problem.

[Mama Noodle]

23 minutes ago, Phoenix Rising said:

And that's relevant exactly how?

 

Just talking about things that are stupid. 

 

24 minutes ago, Phoenix Rising said:

Stupidity is by no means limited to right wingers but the right has managed to make it their "trademark" during Trump's "presidency". 

 

Tell that to your antivaxx people, make sure they don't seed the third and forth wave for us all, please. They've already gifted us the second wave with all the rioting and 'protesting' they've been doing. 

[johnpetersen]

4 minutes ago, Mama Noodle said:

 

 

 

Tell that to your antivaxx people, make sure they don't seed the third and forth wave for us all, please. They've already gifted us the second wave with all the rioting and 'protesting' they've been doing. 

Because antivaxxers are all or mostly left-wing? Really?

New study finds Trump’s tweets intensify anti-vaccine attitudes among his supporters

"New research has found that Americans who voted for Donald Trump in 2016 are particularly prone to anti-vaccination attitudes and that these attitudes can be exacerbated by the president’s tweets. The findings have been published in the Journal of Experimental Social Psychology."

https://www.psypost.org/2020/04/new-study-finds-trumps-tweets-intensify-anti-vaccine-attitudes-among-his-supporters-56359

[Mama Noodle]

1 minute ago, johnpetersen said:

Because antivaxxers are all or mostly left-wing? Really?

 

I said 'primarily' and that is an undeniable fact. Scour the internet for unapproved and weird links all you want but if I was you if start with PEW research. 

 

[Sujo]

4 minutes ago, johnpetersen said:

Because antivaxxers are all or mostly left-wing? Really?

New study finds Trump’s tweets intensify anti-vaccine attitudes among his supporters

"New research has found that Americans who voted for Donald Trump in 2016 are particularly prone to anti-vaccination attitudes and that these attitudes can be exacerbated by the president’s tweets. The findings have been published in the Journal of Experimental Social Psychology."

https://www.psypost.org/2020/04/new-study-finds-trumps-tweets-intensify-anti-vaccine-attitudes-among-his-supporters-56359

Hahaha. Owned.

 

I hear there is another virus in china but so far contained.

 

Better hope this swine flu in malaysia doesnt materialise.

 

https://www.nst.com.my/news/nation/2020/07/605246/swine-flu-detected-malaysian-livestock

[Sujo]

2 minutes ago, Mama Noodle said:

 

I said 'primarily' and that is an undeniable fact. Scour the internet for unapproved and weird links all you want but if I was you if start with PEW research. 

 

You complain about a link yet you didnt provide one yourself. 

[Phoenix Rising]

4 minutes ago, Mama Noodle said:

 

Just talking about things that are stupid. 

 

 

Tell that to your antivaxx people, make sure they don't seed the third and forth wave for us all, please. They've already gifted us the second wave with all the rioting and 'protesting' they've been doing. 

"Just talking about things that are stupid."

 

And you do that by saying stupid things?

 

"Tell that to your antivaxx people, make sure they don't seed the third and forth wave for us all, please. They've already gifted us the second wave with all the rioting and 'protesting' they've been doing."

 

As usual you don't back up your claims by any credible links. In fact, no links at all.

 

PS. Thanks to Trump's disastrous handling of the crisis we're not seeing a second wave yet as the first wave never went away.

 

[johnpetersen]

19 minutes ago, Mama Noodle said:

 

I said 'primarily' and that is an undeniable fact. Scour the internet for unapproved and weird links all you want but if I was you if start with PEW research. 

 

I think you're about to be owned again. I'm sure you will graciously acknowledge that. This is from Pew January 2020:

 

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2020/01/07/more-americans-now-see-very-high-preventive-health-benefits-from-measles-vaccine/

And, of course, this poll was taken just before Covid hit America. 

 

[Mama Noodle]

7 minutes ago, johnpetersen said:

I think you're about to be owned again.

 

Not really, that’s asking about requiring it for schools, and FYI contrary to popular belief amongst people who don’t know anything, like you, there are a lot of religious groups in the USA that are very liberal. 

[johnpetersen]

1 minute ago, Mama Noodle said:

 

Not really, that’s asking about requiring it for schools, and FYI contrary to popular belief amongst people who don’t know anything, like you, there are a lot of religious groups in the USA that are very liberal. 

Did you see where the questions were broken down by political affiliation? Not by religion?

But thanks for the gratuitous insult "FYI contrary to popular belief amongst people who don’t know anything, like you". I guess when the facts are against you, insults are all you've got left

 

[Mama Noodle]

7 minutes ago, johnpetersen said:

I guess when the facts are against you, insults are all you've got left

What facts? It isn’t asking if you won’t be giving vaccinations it was asking about concerns of side effects. 

[johnpetersen]

4 minutes ago, Mama Noodle said:

What facts? It isn’t asking if you won’t be giving vaccinations it was asking about concerns of side effects. 

And why else would people be opposed to vaccinations? Because they're making a fashion statement? 

[Mama Noodle]

5 minutes ago, johnpetersen said:

And why else would people be opposed to vaccinations? Because they're making a fashion statement? 

You are inferring your own opinions from data that does not support it. 
 

I have concerns of side effects but I still take the shots and I’ll be first in like for a covid one as well, with a high level of concern. 

[johnpetersen]

1 minute ago, Mama Noodle said:

You are inferring your own opinions from data that does not support it. 
 

I have concerns of side effects but I still take the shots and I’ll be first in like for a covid one as well, with a high level of concern. 

Well, even granting your ridiculous assessment, you claimed that it's mostly liberals who oppose vaccination. And you recommended Pew to start the search. Clearly you're wrong.

[Sujo]

10 minutes ago, johnpetersen said:

And why else would people be opposed to vaccinations? Because they're making a fashion statement? 

At the rate you are owning him you better start charging rent.

[yuyiinthesky]

Like everything, vaccinations are not black or white, good or bad. There are different vaccinations, for different reasons, using different methods and technologies, with different risks. Vaccinations can be very different things. A good doctor will inform you about the risks and the benefits, so that you can make an informed decision.

Whatever vaccines are coming up for influenza or for Covid-19, some might have a better benefit / risk ratio than others. I see nothing wrong with being clear and open about it. If the benefit / risk ratio is positive, why not, however if it is negative, then no. 

With different vulnerabilities this is an individual decision. 

Accusing anybody, who has questions or doubts about a new fast tracked and only superficially tested Covid 19 vaccine, to be an anti-vaxxer, is stupid, or malicious. Let the vaccine come, and then let's look at it, and if it has a convincing case, good, but otherwise, no.

And if you add the element of a forced vaccination, then of course no, then you can shove it up your behind. We're not in China, but in democratic countries, or so I thought. Convince me with facts (not with fear) and I'll do it, as I've done before, but if you need guinea pigs, take a volunteer, it seems that there are enough here on TVF, or use Fauci or Trump or Biden.
 

Edited July 2, 2020 by yuyiinthesky

[johnpetersen]

4 minutes ago, yuyiinthesky said:

Like everything, vaccinations are not black or white, good or bad. There are different vaccinations, for different reasons, using different methods and technologies, with different risks. Vaccinations can be very different things. A good doctor will inform you about the risks and the benefits, so that you can make an informed decision.

Whatever vaccines are coming up for influenza or for Covid-19, some might have a better benefit / risk ratio than others. I see nothing wrong with being clear and open about it. If the benefit / risk ratio is positive, why not, however if it is negative, then no. 

With different vulnerabilities this is an individual decision. 

Accusing anybody, who has questions or doubts about a new fast tracked and only superficially tested Covid 19 vaccine, to be an anti-vaxxer, is stupid, or malicious. Let the vaccine come, and then let's look at it, and if it has a convincing case, good, but otherwise, no.

And if you add the element of a forced vaccination, then of course no, then you can shove it up your behind. We're not in China, but in democratic countries, or so I thought. Convince me with facts (not with fear) and I'll do it, as I've done before, but if you need guinea pigs, take a volunteer, it seems that there are enough here on TVF, or use Fauci or Trump or Biden.
 

Can you share with us any of the commonly used vaccines where the negatives outweigh the positives for the population-at-large?

[yuyiinthesky]

11 hours ago, johnpetersen said:

Can you share with us any of the commonly used vaccines where the negatives outweigh the positives for the population-at-large?

That might be an interesting exercise, feel free to do that analysis yourself.
 

My point was exactly not such a generalization, but that it is an individual decision, based on your personal (health) situation, and where “A good doctor will inform you about the risks and the benefits, so that you can make an informed decision”.

[stevenl]

48 minutes ago, yuyiinthesky said:

That might be an interesting exercise, feel free to do that analysis yourself.
 

My point was exactly not such a generalization, but that it is an individual decision, based on your personal (health) situation, and where “A good doctor will inform you about the risks and the benefits, so that you can make an informed decision”.

Your personal decision affects others. Hence in quite a few countries there are consequences, eg don't vaccinate, kids are not allowed at daycare.

[johnpetersen]

47 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Your personal decision affects others. Hence in quite a few countries there are consequences, eg don't vaccinate, kids are not allowed at daycare.

We've seen the consequences of selfishness in regards to public health. In the face of a huge rise in covid hospitalizations , the governor of Texas - who previously forbade requiring the wearing of masks - has now made it mandatory for most Texans.

[Chiphigh]

Meanwhile, away from the liberal progressive promoting draconian lock downs and all the other panic merchants there is this great news:

 

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/michigan/2020/07/02/michigan-henry-ford-health-study-finds-hydroxychloroquine-lowers-covid-19-death-rate/5365090002/

 

This surely will help to ease the leftists fear. But then if the president was for it, your ideology dictates that you must deny this great news. 

Edited July 3, 2020 by Chiphigh

[Chiphigh]

2 hours ago, johnpetersen said:

We've seen the consequences of selfishness in regards to public health. In the face of a huge rise in covid hospitalizations , the governor of Texas - who previously forbade requiring the wearing of masks - has now made it mandatory for most Texans.

Actually, it is only in counties with more than 20 new cases. Using common sense instead of the draconian one size fits all approach that is in effect in the liberal bubble. 

 

And even more importantly, the new cases have hardly any deaths, the hospital system is not at all strained and the fatality rate is dropping closer to the level of the flu. 

 

But this would not fit into the narrative that you are trying to imply. 

 

The large percentage of ICU beds are now occupied by the non covid people who postponed their needed treatment during this overreaction panic period. 

Edited July 3, 2020 by Chiphigh

[Berkshire]

5 minutes ago, Chiphigh said:

Meanwhile, away from the liberal progressive promoting draconian lock down panic merchants there is this great news:

 

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/michigan/2020/07/02/michigan-henry-ford-health-study-finds-hydroxychloroquine-lowers-covid-19-death-rate/5365090002/

 

This surely will help to ease the leftists fear. But then if the president was for it, your ideology dictates that you must deny this great news. 

We would all like to see this drug, and/or any other drug, work.  But since Trump was pushing the drug, there was a lot of skepticism.  We all know Trump to be a liar, wrong on most things, and/or having corrupt intent.  Which is why his claim(s) are typically dubious at best.  From the article, much more research still needs to be done. 

[Chiphigh]

2 minutes ago, Berkshire said:

We would all like to see this drug, and/or any other drug, work.  But since Trump was pushing the drug, there was a lot of skepticism.  We all know Trump to be a liar, wrong on most things, and/or having corrupt intent.  Which is why his claim(s) are typically dubious at best.  From the article, much more research still needs to be done. 

The improvement in recovery from those who took it are clear. 

 

As is your obvious bias against anything that would require agreeing with anything that would not allow you to continue your irrational emotional outrage. 

[johnpetersen]

15 minutes ago, Chiphigh said:

Actually, it is only in counties with more than 20 new cases. Using common sense instead of the draconian one size fits all approach that is in effect in the liberal bubble. 

 

And even more importantly, the new cases have hardly any deaths, the hospital system is not at all strained and the fatality rate is dropping closer to the level of the flu. 

 

But this would not fit into the narrative that you are trying to imply. 

 

The large percentage of ICU beds are now occupied by the non covid people who postponed their needed treatment during this overreaction panic period. 

And the fact is that Abbott not so long ago actually forbade local government from making mask wearing mandatory in public spaces mandatory. How does that fit in with your notion of "draconian one size fits all approach that is in effect in the liberal bubble." Thanks for letting us know that Governor Abbott is your idea of a liberal.

[johnpetersen]

31 minutes ago, Chiphigh said:

Meanwhile, away from the liberal progressive promoting draconian lock downs and all the other panic merchants there is this great news:

 

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/michigan/2020/07/02/michigan-henry-ford-health-study-finds-hydroxychloroquine-lowers-covid-19-death-rate/5365090002/

 

This surely will help to ease the leftists fear. But then if the president was for it, your ideology dictates that you must deny this great news. 

For some reason this piece of information was briefly noted:"  "We also found that using steroids early in the infection associated with a reduction in mortality." 

 

[yuyiinthesky]

6 hours ago, stevenl said:

Your personal decision affects others. Hence in quite a few countries there are consequences, eg don't vaccinate, kids are not allowed at daycare.

So you are saying that vaccinations should be taken even against your doctor’s advice because some countries otherwise don’t allow kids at daycare?

 

I think in such a case the country is doing something wrong.

[yuyiinthesky]

4 hours ago, Berkshire said:

We would all like to see this drug, and/or any other drug, work.  But since Trump was pushing the drug, there was a lot of skepticism.  We all know Trump to be a liar, wrong on most things, and/or having corrupt intent.  Which is why his claim(s) are typically dubious at best.  From the article, much more research still needs to be done. 

Yes, reject anything Trump says just because Trump said it! Very clever! One day he will recommend to breathe, and you start holding your breath, right?

 

Reminds me about the “drinking bleach and putting a UV light into your bottom, sorry, body” speech. As funny as it sounds, who among you would, after finishing laughing, check if there could be something useful behind it. No, he said it, dismiss it right away.

 

If you would have, you might have found that exposing blood to UV light was indeed a tested therapy around 1930-1950, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_irradiation_therapy - with some promising results at sick dogs. And now there are even UV-sticks available, to put into the mouth, to disinfect your throat (http://www.uvaid.com/UV-Aid-Cold-Flu-and-Ear-infection-Prevention_p_8.html). 
(Disclaimer: I’m not endorsing any of these, they might or might not work, they might or might not be harmful, and I’m not saying that Trump is lying or not lying.)

 

 

Edited July 3, 2020 by yuyiinthesky

[johnpetersen]

31 minutes ago, yuyiinthesky said:

So you are saying that vaccinations should be taken even against your doctor’s advice because some countries otherwise don’t allow kids at daycare?

 

I think in such a case the country is doing something wrong.

Yes, because doctors are disinterested guardians of children's welfare:

Some doctors helping anti-vaccine parents get medical exemptions

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/kids-health/some-doctors-helping-anti-vaccine-parents-get-medical-exemptions-n963011

[yuyiinthesky]

6 hours ago, johnpetersen said:

We've seen the consequences of selfishness in regards to public health. In the face of a huge rise in covid hospitalizations , the governor of Texas - who previously forbade requiring the wearing of masks - has now made it mandatory for most Texans.

The head of a country, which successfully got the virus under control, the German chancellor, Misses Merkel, is not wearing a mask and said at her recent meeting with France's Macron publicly that she does not need one because she keeps a 1.5 meter distance. Keep in mind that she gets advised by Germany's famous Robert Koch Institute and by Dr. Drosten, so if she does so, she might know better than you.