Will I Pay Tax in Thailand?

[Jeffrey346]

6 hours ago, Geir Rasch said:

Many expat do not pay tax in Thailand, and many revenue office is not aware of what the law actually is.
When you read about the revenue law you will notice that if you live in Thailand for 180 days or more during a calendar year, you shall pay tax to Thailand. Most countries have tax-agreement with Thailand to avoid double tax.
For a pensioner the only money that are taxable in Thailand are pension transferred to Thailand the same year that they are earned. Other money are savings and already taxed in your home country. 

 

So why pay tax to Thailand when so many does not and revenue offices seam to not care?

1.

When you pay tax to Thailand you get documentation from revenue department that you send to your tax office of your origin that will deduct your tax in the country of your origin. For most expat the tax level in Thailand are lower than in our home country, so there is money to save.

2.

It might be that revenue department will be more aware of possible income from expat. It is possible that revenue department and immigration will cooperate and that immigration will check if you have paid tax before they extend your visa.

 

For the time being it is all up to you if you pay tax or not. My advice is that you should pay tax to Thailand.

The Revenue Dept is very aware of the tax arrangements with every country. But they do not have the resources to track the income of every expat. Revenue and Immigration   do not work together to track expat income.

[Jeffrey346]

3 hours ago, xtrnuno41 said:

As i understood when money comes in from in bankaccount (savings) out of Thailand then they dont tax it.

But if your pension is straight away coming in Thailand, it is taxable, like some other people already wrote.

That's not true. It depends on the agreement your county has with Thailand.

 

My SSA is direct deposited into my Thai bank and is not taxable.

[daejung]

4 hours ago, xtrnuno41 said:

As i understood when money comes in from in bankaccount (savings) out of Thailand then they dont tax it.

But if your pension is straight away coming in Thailand, it is taxable, like some other people already wrote.

As Jeffrey346 wrote:

Quote

That's not true. It depends on the agreement your county has with Thailand.

 

French pensions are always taxable in France if you are a tax resident in Thailand

 

But if, for example, you are a tax resident in Portugal, private pensions are taxable in Portugal, public pensions are taxable in France

 

http://internationaltaxtreaty.com/treaty/thailand

Edited August 29, 2020 by aixois

[Oldie]

3 hours ago, Jeffrey346 said:

If you earn money in Thailand it's taxable. The bank by law deducts 15% of earned income which you can get back by filing for it at the Revenue Dept as long as the earned income is less than B150,000.

My post #18 describes the law in detail written by the government. Some people still prefer to guess and give a false advice based on their assumptions...

[USNret]

6 hours ago, Oldie said:

My post #18 describes the law in detail written by the government. Some people still prefer to guess and give a false advice based on their assumptions...

I read the link you posted.  Starting with the 8 categories of income that is taxed, it is mainly 3 kinds: Salary, royalties, and interested earned inside Thailand.  

My income is 100% pension or capital gains earned outside Thailand. Thus, it sounds like I do not fall into either of the 8 categories that are listed.  My conclusion is, I owe no tax in Thailand.

 

[Oldie]

1 hour ago, USNret said:

I read the link you posted.  Starting with the 8 categories of income that is taxed, it is mainly 3 kinds: Salary, royalties, and interested earned inside Thailand.  

My income is 100% pension or capital gains earned outside Thailand. Thus, it sounds like I do not fall into either of the 8 categories that are listed.  My conclusion is, I owe no tax in Thailand.

 

If you don't transfer the money to the country in the same year when you earned it then not. 

 

From the link:

 

"Taxpayers are classified into “resident” and “non-resident”. “Resident” means any person residing in Thailand for a period or periods aggregating more than 180 days in any tax (calendar) year. A resident of Thailand is liable to pay tax on income from sources in Thailand as well as on the portion of income from foreign sources that is brought into Thailand. A non-resident is, however, subject to tax only on income from sources in Thailand."
 

Edited August 30, 2020 by Oldie

[paddyfield7]

17 hours ago, Jeffrey346 said:

Your Lawyer is a jerk. Thailand has a Tax Agreement with the US.  If you earned money in the US then it is not taxable here as long as it was declared in the US.

 

Think about getting another Lawyer. 

Who tells you I'm a Yankee? Rest assured: I'm aware what I'm doing. Take care!

[khunPer]

9 hours ago, Oldie said:

If you don't transfer the money to the country in the same year when you earned it then not. 

 

From the link:

 

"Taxpayers are classified into “resident” and “non-resident”. “Resident” means any person residing in Thailand for a period or periods aggregating more than 180 days in any tax (calendar) year. A resident of Thailand is liable to pay tax on income from sources in Thailand as well as on the portion of income from foreign sources that is brought into Thailand. A non-resident is, however, subject to tax only on income from sources in Thailand."

When staying 183 days one is tax-resident, and then it's first of all about the Double Taxation Agreement between one's home country and Thailand.

[khunPer]

18 hours ago, Oldie said:

My post #18 describes the law in detail written by the government. Some people still prefer to guess and give a false advice based on their assumptions...

Your post #18 describes tax laws inside Thailand, the important things is however the Double Taxation Agreement between one's home country and Thailand...????

[Oldie]

2 minutes ago, khunPer said:

When staying 183 days one is tax-resident, and then it's first of all about the Double Taxation Agreement between one's home country and Thailand.

In many countries you don't have to pay taxes if you are not a tax resident. For instance I don't have to pay any taxes in my European home country.  So I don't need such an agreement since I have nothing to do with my home country. I am not a tax resident there. But if you are an US citizen for instance then you have to pay taxes in the US independent where you live. They need such an agreement. Also if you are still a tax resident in your home country and earn money in Thailand.

 

In detail the tax laws are more complicated depending on the country and the source of the income. I have interest income in several countries because I lived and worked there and still have accounts there. I have to know the special laws in every country to avoid costly mistakes. For instance if I stay more than 70 days in my home country at a place that is not a hotel but could be classified as an apartment or condo I will have to pay taxes there. Otherwise if I stay in a hotel the 180 day rule will be used. It is complicated... 

[daejung]

1 hour ago, khunPer said:

When staying 183 days one is tax-resident, and then it's first of all about the Double Taxation Agreement between one's home country and Thailand.

 

47 minutes ago, Oldie said:

In many countries you don't have to pay taxes if you are not a tax resident. For instance I don't have to pay any taxes in my European home country.  So I don't need such an agreement since I have nothing to do with my home country. I am not a tax resident there. But if you are an US citizen for instance then you have to pay taxes in the US independent where you live. They need such an agreement. Also if you are still a tax resident in your home country and earn money in Thailand.

 

In detail the tax laws are more complicated depending on the country and the source of the income. I have interest income in several countries because I lived and worked there and still have accounts there. I have to know the special laws in every country to avoid costly mistakes. For instance if I stay more than 70 days in my home country at a place that is not a hotel but could be classified as an apartment or condo I will have to pay taxes there. Otherwise if I stay in a hotel the 180 day rule will be used. It is complicated... 

In addition, the criteria of 180 or 183 days is not the only one. It may be different according to tax treaties. For example, some countries will decide you are a tax resident when your main economic interests are there, no matter you spend less than 180 days a year that country. The main point is to check the relevant tax treaty between both countries.

Edited August 30, 2020 by aixois

[Oldie]

23 minutes ago, aixois said:

 

In addition, the criteria of 180 or 183 days is not the only one. It may be different according to tax treaties. For example, some countries will decide you are a tax resident when your main economic interests are there, no matter you spend less than 180 days a year that country. The main point is to check the relevant tax treaty between both countries.

If you live in several countries you have to be very careful. I never forget the story of Boris Becker (Tennis) when he had to pay a lot of taxes in Germany. I think normally he lived in Switzerland at this time but stayed sometimes in Germany - too long... 

[khunPer]

4 hours ago, aixois said:

 

In addition, the criteria of 180 or 183 days is not the only one. It may be different according to tax treaties. For example, some countries will decide you are a tax resident when your main economic interests are there, no matter you spend less than 180 days a year that country. The main point is to check the relevant tax treaty between both countries.

If you are US citizen, like OP, and decide to live in Thailand, it's one DTA that is of interest, the one between the two states USA and Thailand. And you could be taxed in both states, but you'll not be taxed for the same in both states. That's the idea of a DTA.

[JimGant]

On 8/28/2020 at 6:56 PM, USNret said:

So with all that background...  Will Thailand tax any of my income or money transfers into the country?  After all this time, I've given it little thought and the subject of Thai taxes has never come up.

If I do pay tax in Thailand, is this a deduction from my American taxes?  Thanks. 

Your military pension and social security are exclusively taxed by the US, meaning, no need to report such income to Thai tax authorities. This is explicit in the US-Thai tax treaty.

 

However, private pensions, to include proceeds from IRA's, are first taxable by Thailand per treaty -- if brought into Thailand in the year paid. But, if such payments are into a US bank account, mixing with other payments, like your military pension and social security, because of the fungibility of money, there's no way these private pension inputs to Thailand can be exclusively identified; only if your private pension payments are direct deposited into Thailand would the Thai tax authorities have a hook -- but even then, they really don't care about identifying such payments, for whatever reason, even tho' it really is a loss of revenue to Thailand.... Thus, a periodic transfer into Thailand from your US bank account that has other deposits into it is perfect cover, with nothing illegal, and which has no concern to Thai tax authorities. The bottom line is: The tax treaty says Thailand gets first dibs on taxing these private pensions, with an offsetting tax credit to your US taxes to avoid double taxation. Thailand, however, has their own law that allows money brought into Thailand in "year after paid" as being not taxable -- obviously a nod to the Thai fat cats with earnings abroad. End result: The US gets all the tax on these private pensions to pave potholes; Thailand forgoes this opportunity. You, the US taxpayer, ends up paying the same amount of taxes -- but all to the US, not to Thailand -- whereby you'd get an offsetting credit to your US taxes.

 

I mentioned earlier that the treaty gave first dibs to Thailand for taxing your IRA payout. But since Thailand doesn't seem to want to identify your IRA proceeds as brought into Thailand in "year paid," then because of the US saving clause found in all tax treaties, then you'll pay US taxes on this IRA payout -- after all, the tax treaties are to avoid DOUBLE taxation, not NO taxation by anyone. Seems really fair, when you realize your payments into your IRA were "tax deferred," not tax exempt. Anyway, there maybe a clown US tax preparer in Bangkok who can save you a bundle on IRA payouts. See this thread -- have a glass or two of bubbly as your read a quite detailed thread.

https://forum.thaivisa.com/topic/1008555-tax-specialist-in-chiang-mai/page/2/