Brexit back in crisis as UK threatens to undercut divorce pact

[vogie]

2 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

always 2 versions to a fact....but as always, easy to blame the other side """ it's no me, it's them""" 555

My version is when Boris has the europhiles running around like headless chickens, the man is doing something right and Barnier is the wrong man for such an important job, maybe why he is being side stepped.

 

[Rimmer]

Some off topic posts and replies have been removed

[transam]

2 minutes ago, vogie said:

My version is when Boris has the europhiles running around like headless chickens, the man is doing something right and Barnier is the wrong man for such an important job, maybe why he is being side stepped.

 

I think Barnier is/was the right man for the job, but he had been given a near impossible task to relieve the UK of it's 100% sovereignty..

[david555]

2 minutes ago, vogie said:

My version is when Boris has the europhiles running around like headless chickens, the man is doing something right and Barnier is the wrong man for such an important job, maybe why he is being side stepped.

 

So the E. U. Send Frost a side stepped E.U. person to negotiate ....i think you dont know how to read news papers .....they just made it clear not to give ground..

[Mavideol]

4 minutes ago, vogie said:

My version is when Boris has the europhiles running around like headless chickens, the man is doing something right and Barnier is the wrong man for such an important job, maybe why he is being side stepped.

 

facts please or just your creative imagination

[vogie]

6 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

facts please or just your creative imagination

No need for the patronising remark, although after nearly 4 years of it, I should be used to it.

 

"European Union chief Brexit negotiator Michel Barnier is set to be sidelined by EU leaders in a bid to get a breakthrough in the negotiations about a trade treaty with the UK.

Representatives of the bloc’s 27 member states expect Ursula von der Leyen, the president of the European Commission, to pave the way for heads of state and government to intervene in the deadlocked talks in a September 16 flagship speech."

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/09/04/exclusive-michel-barnier-sidelined-eu-leaders-bid-break-brexit/

 

 

[Mavideol]

24 minutes ago, vogie said:

The EU has already broken international law by not negotiating in good faith.

could it be they were afraid because the UK brought in Tony Abbott 555

[JonnyF]

17 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

always 2 versions to a fact....but as always, easy to blame the other side """ it's no me, it's them""" 555

Isn't that exactly what the Remainers are doing?

 

This amendment reminds me of someone doing 71 mph in a 70 zone. Is it technically illegal? Yes

Does anyone care? Only the vindictive, bitter individuals who dislike the person driving.

 

Anyway the Withdrawal Act that put the bill in states that Parliament is sovereign. If they can enact the bill they can change it. Maybe ????.

 

Anyway, the EU have broken the agreement already by refusing to act in good faith. So now the UK will break it. Tit for Tat.

 

There's an easy out for the EU. Sign a Canada style agreement like they hinted at while writing the withdrawal agreement. Everyone's a winner. Will they grow up and sign it or will they cut off their nose to spite their face? Time will tell. The EU are a spiteful bunch so maybe they'll stick firm and create yet another problem for their failing protectionist racket.

   

 

[Mavideol]

2 minutes ago, vogie said:

No need for the patronising remark, although after nearly 4 years of it, I should be used to it.

 

"European Union chief Brexit negotiator Michel Barnier is set to be sidelined by EU leaders in a bid to get a breakthrough in the negotiations about a trade treaty with the UK.

Representatives of the bloc’s 27 member states expect Ursula von der Leyen, the president of the European Commission, to pave the way for heads of state and government to intervene in the deadlocked talks in a September 16 flagship speech."

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/09/04/exclusive-michel-barnier-sidelined-eu-leaders-bid-break-brexit/

 

 

let's wait and see

[vogie]

2 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

could it be they were afraid because the UK brought in Tony Abbott 555

The EU is telling us now who we can or can't have working for us now, no deal can't come fast enough.555

[david555]

12 minutes ago, transam said:

I think Barnier is/was the right man for the job, but he had been given a near impossible task to relieve the UK of it's 100% sovereignty..

wrong....  hey got the task to stand guard the basket of cherries not become plundered by the English raiders …..

[crobe]

1 hour ago, vogie said:

The EU has already broken international law by not negotiating in good faith.

 

ARTICLE 184
Negotiations on the future relationship
The Union and the United Kingdom shall use their best endeavours, in good faith and in full respect 
of their respective legal orders, to take the necessary steps to negotiate expeditiously the agreements 
governing their future relationship referred to in the Political Declaration of 17 October 2019 and to 
conduct the relevant procedures for the ratification or conclusion of those agreements, with a view 
to ensuring that those agreements apply, to the extent possible, as from the end of the transition period.

 

Yes, that is the text but nowhere, I repeat nowhere, do you provide any proof of any bad faith.

If anything the UK Cummings government has now proved its bad faith in  the extreme,

But why should we believe anything the Brexiteers say anymore, they have been proven to lie and will go back on their word at any point it suits them

 

Edited September 9, 2020 by Sheryl
edited by Moderator for civility

[david555]

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/sep/08/brexit-northern-ireland-us-uk-trade-deal

 

UK plans to change Brexit rules threaten US trade deal, top Democrats say 
Altering terms of withdrawal agreement on Northern Ireland could damage relations under Biden presidency

 

Julian Borger in Washington and Lisa O'Carroll Brexit correspondent
Wed 9 Sep 2020 06.00 BST 

 

Senior Democrats have warned that any attempt by the UK government to backtrack on the Brexit agreement on Northern Ireland would jeopardize a future US-UK free trade deal and could hobble bilateral relations across the board if Joe Biden wins the presidency.

Biden, an Irish American, is a staunch defender of the Good Friday Agreement, of which the US is the guarantor, and which requires an open border between the Republic of Ireland and Northern Ireland.
“[Joe Biden] is committed to preserving the hard-earned peace & stability in Northern Ireland. As the UK and EU work out their relationship, any arrangements must protect the Good Friday Agreement and prevent the return of a hard border,” Biden’s chief foreign policy adviser, Antony Blinken, said on Twitter on Tuesday night.
 

[Justgrazing]

On 9/7/2020 at 11:51 AM, snoop1130 said:

Prime Minister Boris Johnson's government was reportedly planning new legislation to override parts of the Brexit Withdrawal Agreement it signed in January

This has got the slaphead with dodgy eyesight dab's all over it ..

[Loiner]

The EU are up to their old bad faith and cheating negotiating positions again. Well who would have imagined that of a bunch of lying foreigners aided by Remainers weasel words? Errr I would actually.

So if Barnier thinks he can threaten to use the WA block food 'exports' from GB to NI, he only has himself to blame for UK legislating to prevent that. Boris should blow the whole agreement out of the water anyway. It did its' job to get us officially out and now only serves to frustrate the deal or no deal.

[Matzzon]

22 hours ago, transam said:

Well, Winston and Nelson were, but they prevailed

Dead now, aren´t they? You have something that can refer the the 21st century? You know we are over 20 years into it?

Edited September 9, 2020 by Matzzon

[Matzzon]

On 9/7/2020 at 12:51 PM, snoop1130 said:

would tarnish Britain's global prestige and heighten chances of a tumultuous final disentangling from the bloc on Dec. 31.

Prestige? Maybe time to understand that they stand alone, like a single country in Europe. No longer connected to the European Union, but still making demands. I think it will be better to see if there is any countries that will accept their demands. Maybe just have to crawl and take the deals they get.

[RayC]

1 hour ago, vogie said:

The EU has already broken international law by not negotiating in good faith.

 

ARTICLE 184
Negotiations on the future relationship
The Union and the United Kingdom shall use their best endeavours, in good faith and in full respect 
of their respective legal orders, to take the necessary steps to negotiate expeditiously the agreements 
governing their future relationship referred to in the Political Declaration of 17 October 2019 and to 
conduct the relevant procedures for the ratification or conclusion of those agreements, with a view 
to ensuring that those agreements apply, to the extent possible, as from the end of the transition period.

And how exactly has the EU not acted in 'good faith'? It has stated a negotiating position, which the UK has rejected. The negotiations can then either continue or be wound up. Normal practice.

 

In any event, why would the EU not act in 'good faith'? After all, Brexiters are continually telling us that the EU needs a deal more than the UK? Why on earth would they then try to jeopardize a successful outcome?

 

[RayC]

8 hours ago, superal said:

and at any cost / turn the other cheek ?      Most true Brits have had enough of the EC bureaucrats  and finally the worm has turned ? 

So international law does not apply to the UK?

 

I'm British. You can't claim the phrase 'True Brit' for your cause.

Edited September 9, 2020 by RayC
Clarification

[polpott]

6 minutes ago, RayC said:

So international law does not apply to the UK?

Nope. We left the international community on January 1st. Now we're just a lonely little island floating aimlessly in the Atlantic. Did you ever watch "Lost"? We are that island, not on any maps, invisible to the uninitiated.

 

"We want to be alone"

 

 

Edited September 9, 2020 by polpott

[david555]

5 minutes ago, RayC said:

So international law does not apply to the UK?

Only when it fits them English ,???? as the U.K. is populated by many other peoples let us see how those go vote before generalizing Brits….???? as seen now  by so many ashamed reactions , they are not all "Borisians "????

[polpott]

1 minute ago, david555 said:

Only when it fits them English ,???? as the U.K. is populated by many other peoples let us see how those go vote before generalizing Brits….???? as seen now  by so many ashamed reactions , they are not all "Borisians "????

Nearly all. Had an election last year. The Blonde Bimbo won by a landslide.

[david555]

12 minutes ago, polpott said:

Nearly all. Had an election last year. The Blonde Bimbo won by a landslide.

I meant voting or presentation this afternoon in HOC (I presume... ) about latest "braindrain" from Boris about a law breaking int. treaty deliberately  

Edited September 9, 2020 by david555

[Rookiescot]

Pound doing well against the Euro and Dollar. 

Really dont understand why the guys in the financial markets dont just wrap themselves in a union flag and recite a slogan or two. 

It seems to work for some of the guys on here.

[polpott]

1 minute ago, Rookiescot said:

Pound doing well against the Euro and Dollar. 

Really dont understand why the guys in the financial markets dont just wrap themselves in a union flag and recite a slogan or two. 

It seems to work for some of the guys on here.

Its tanked against the Baht in the last few days.

[RayC]

8 hours ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

An unelected head of state making her country break international law. Welcome to the UKSSR. 

The UK is a constitutional monarchy but the Queen is 'above politics'. She is duty bound to sign legislation placed before her. I imagine that a similar situation exists in Belgium and the Netherlands? The major difference, of course, is that the governments of Belgium and the Netherlands abide by international law so would not place the monarch in such an embarrassing position.

[Rookiescot]

2 minutes ago, polpott said:

Its tanked against the Baht in the last few days.

Its tanking against everything.

Will be trading on parity with the Zimbabwean dollar soon ????

[polpott]

3 minutes ago, RayC said:

The UK is a constitutional monarchy but the Queen is 'above politics'. She is duty bound to sign legislation placed before her. I imagine that a similar situation exists in Belgium and the Netherlands? The major difference, of course, is that the governments of Belgium and the Netherlands abide by international law so would not place the monarch in such an embarrassing position.

Prorogation of Parliament? She could have refused.

[polpott]

26 minutes ago, david555 said:

I meant voting or presentation this afternoon in HOC (I presume... ) about latest "braindrain" from Boris about a law breaking int. treaty deliberately  

He has a parliamentary majority of 80. At least 40 of his own would have to vote against him. Not going to happen.

[david555]

4 minutes ago, polpott said:

He has a parliamentary majority of 80. At least 40 of his own would have to vote against him. Not going to happen.

a big number but not enough to win against him would already a nice symbolic gesture …. 

BTW I think the E.U. is only waiting what go result in that , to take their official stance …. as about rumors reacting official is a not advisable action …. so  we shall wait and see ….

Edited September 9, 2020 by david555