Scotland's Sturgeon puts UK on independence warning: We want a referendum soon

[kingdong]

2 hours ago, Albert Zweistein said:

One country ? So why four different national footbal teams ?

Tradition.

[kingdong]

On 11/28/2020 at 11:33 AM, RuamRudy said:

 

For some reason, the English working class are never happier than when they are doffing their caps to rich buffoons who keep them in poverty. Baffling but true. 

Then they voted in " new labour "and found out to their cost they were even worse.

[JonnyF]

On 11/28/2020 at 8:14 PM, Rookiescot said:

 

You know as well as I do that Brexit was built on xenophobia and racism.

Its a sad reflection upon England and Wales that so many voted for it.

In Scotland and ironically Northern Ireland it was rejected.

So how does that square with your claims that Scotland is a bigoted racist and xenophobic nation?

 

Allow me to explain.

 

Scotland rejected Brexit because they dislike the English and would prefer to be lorded over by the French and Germans. Thinking of themselves as "European" makes them feel sophisticated in the land of the Deep Fried Mars Bar.

 

There is nothing racist about the UK wishing to regain control of it's own country. Don't you want exactly the same thing for Scotland? Hypocritical much? ????

 

[JonnyF]

On the referendum question, it would be deeply unfair to have a referendum before the outcome of Brexit is known. The SNP is using Project Fear to whip up the Scottish electorate into wanting Independence. It's deeply cynical and disingenuous.

 

They are terrified that Brexit will be a success while the EU continues with it's internal problems (they can't even pass a budget) and downward trajectory. That's why they're so desperate for a vote now before all of their lies are exposed by a prosperous post Brexit UK.

 

I think it would be fair to wait a decade to see the long term effects of Brexit, then if they still want a referendum, let them have it around 2031.

 

[placeholder]

The Brexiters claim is that once the UK is no longer governed under EU rules, this will be a huge change. The UK will be free again. Well, the last time the Scots voted on union, the UK was allegedly under the yoke of the UK. And that's the UK that the Scots voted to be part of. It's only fair to allow the Scots the opportunity to choose the heavy and cruel hand of the EU over  the benefits of a being part of a fundamentally changed UK.

[kingdong]

2 minutes ago, placeholder said:

The Brexiters claim is that once the UK is no longer governed under EU rules, this will be a huge change. The UK will be free again. Well, the last time the Scots voted on union, the UK was allegedly under the yoke of the UK. And that's the UK that the Scots voted to be part of. It's only fair to allow the Scots the opportunity to choose the heavy and cruel hand of the EU over  the benefits of a being part of a fundamentally changed UK.

Up to them,still if the views on here are representive of the views of scotland then good bye and good riddance,

[Rookiescot]

19 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

 

Allow me to explain.

 

Scotland rejected Brexit because they dislike the English and would prefer to be lorded over by the French and Germans. Thinking of themselves as "European" makes them feel sophisticated in the land of the Deep Fried Mars Bar.

 

There is nothing racist about the UK wishing to regain control of it's own country. Don't you want exactly the same thing for Scotland? Hypocritical much? ????

 

Brexit was voted for because of peoples fear and hatred of immigrants.

Scotland did not vote for it. 

[Rookiescot]

15 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

On the referendum question, it would be deeply unfair to have a referendum before the outcome of Brexit is known. The SNP is using Project Fear to whip up the Scottish electorate into wanting Independence. It's deeply cynical and disingenuous.

 

They are terrified that Brexit will be a success while the EU continues with it's internal problems (they can't even pass a budget) and downward trajectory. That's why they're so desperate for a vote now before all of their lies are exposed by a prosperous post Brexit UK.

 

I think it would be fair to wait a decade to see the long term effects of Brexit, then if they still want a referendum, let them have it around 2031.

 

 

I'm sure the people of Scotland will take what you think on board ????

[JonnyF]

2 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Brexit was voted for because of peoples fear and hatred of immigrants.

Scotland did not vote for it. 

How do you know their reasons for voting?

 

Can you read the minds of 17.4 million people? Very impressive.

[kingdong]

Just now, Rookiescot said:

Brexit was voted for because of peoples fear and hatred of immigrants.

Scotland did not vote for it. 

Understandable when all the migrants want to live in England where they think the streets are paved with gold.

[JonnyF]

3 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

 

I'm sure the people of Scotland will take what you think on board ????

Ah, the old trick of making a flippant, throwaway remark when you can't counter any of the arguments. ????

 

Confirms my suspicions.

[Rookiescot]

1 minute ago, JonnyF said:

How do you know their reasons for voting?

 

Can you read the minds of 17.4 million people? Very impressive.

 

Just now, kingdong said:

Understandable when all the migrants want to live in England where they think the streets are paved with gold.

 

I'll just leave that there. 

[Rookiescot]

Just now, JonnyF said:

Ah, the old trick of making a flippant, throwaway remark when you can't counter any of the arguments. ????

 

Confirms my suspicions.

 

What was to counter? You gave your opinion nothing else.

[kingdong]

4 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Brexit was voted for because of peoples fear and hatred of immigrants.

Scotland did not vote for it. 

Wondered when the race card would be played

[placeholder]

13 minutes ago, kingdong said:

Up to them,still if the views on here are representive of the views of scotland then good bye and good riddance,

Then we agree that the Scots should be allowed to hold another referendum.

[vogie]

2 hours ago, teacherclaire said:

But obviously not the same feelings for each other. 

 

I don't like to see it that way, the unionists in Scotland are the silent majority and wish to remain within our union. It is only the SNP and their bewildered followers who wear their chip on their shoulders like a military major would wear his crown that wish to free themselves from the tyranny that is the English.????

But there again it does seem alien to us how someone from the same island nation can try to blame everything on Westminster and the English for all the mismanagement of the SNP.

[placeholder]

Just now, vogie said:

I don't like to see it that way, the unionists in Scotland are the silent majority and wish to remain within our union. It is only the SNP and their bewildered followers who wear their chip on their shoulders like a military major would wear his crown that wish to free themselves from the tyranny that is the English.????

But there again it does seem alien to us how someone from the same island nation can try to blame everything on Westminster and the English for all the mismanagement of the SNP.

Well, then, a new referendum will confirm that the Scots prefer to remain part of  the hugely changed dispensation adopted by the UK.

[Rookiescot]

3 minutes ago, vogie said:

I don't like to see it that way, the unionists in Scotland are the silent majority and wish to remain within our union. It is only the SNP and their bewildered followers who wear their chip on their shoulders like a military major would wear his crown that wish to free themselves from the tyranny that is the English.????

But there again it does seem alien to us how someone from the same island nation can try to blame everything on Westminster and the English for all the mismanagement of the SNP.

Well lets ask that silent majority shall we?

[kingdong]

4 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Then we agree that the Scots should be allowed to hold another referendum.

Perhaps i do but for differant reasons than yours.still academic,they won,t vote it in,and if in the unlikely event they do que sera.

[JonnyF]

4 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

 

What was to counter? You gave your opinion nothing else.

 

Maybe you could clarify why the British voting for Independence from the EU is racist, bigoted and xenophobic, but the Scottish voting for Independence from the UK is sensible, logical and rational?

 

[vogie]

2 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Well lets ask that silent majority shall we?

They have already been asked, "computer says no"

[kingdong]

5 minutes ago, vogie said:

They have already been asked, "computer says no"

Bit off topic but i remember that advert,showing your age there vogie.

[Rookiescot]

18 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

 

Maybe you could clarify why the British voting for Independence from the EU is racist, bigoted and xenophobic, but the Scottish voting for Independence from the UK is sensible, logical and rational?

 

I suggest you have a talk with your fellow Brexiteers who seem quite proud of the fact they voted for Brexit because of immigration.

[Rookiescot]

19 minutes ago, vogie said:

They have already been asked, "computer says no"

 

So the only way you can keep the union together is to prevent people voting to leave it.

If you truly believe there is a silent majority for the union you should have confidence in the result of another referendum.

But you insist there should not be one. 

[sandyf]

On 11/27/2020 at 4:19 PM, ukrules said:

They may get another referendum as soon as 2050 or perhaps 2060, once in a lifetime is the phrase used so even that would be early.

 

This is merely a distraction, don't fall for it. She's doing a terrible job and attempting to divert attention.

The "once in a generation" phrase was not written into the 2014 referendum, just a comment taken out of context to suit the unionist agenda.

A great deal has changed since 2014 and the people of Scotland have every right to vote again on the issue, isn't that what democracy is all about. After all the people of England voted to walk away from the Union.

 

Were the 65 other countries that have gained independence from the UK wrong to do so?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_that_have_gained_independence_from_the_United_Kingdom

[JonnyF]

7 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

I suggest you have a talk with your fellow Brexiteers who seem quite proud of the fact they voted for Brexit because of immigration.

 

If you think having a sensible, controlled immigration policy makes you racist, you must think that about 99% of the world's countries are inherently racist, including the likes of Japan, Thailand, Australia etc. ????

 

Must be hard work living under the impression that you're surrounded by so many racists.

 

[sandyf]

On 11/27/2020 at 4:48 PM, Liverpoolfan said:

I am no brexiteer but I don't agree with a 2nd referendum on Scottish independence within the space of 5 years..

It would be 7 years, not 5, the same timeframe that is embedded in the Belfast Agreement.

 

2. Subject to paragraph 3, the Secretary of State shall exercise the power
under paragraph 1 if at any time it appears likely to him that a majority of
those voting would express a wish that Northern Ireland should cease to
be part of the United Kingdom and form part of a united Ireland.
3. The Secretary of State shall not make an order under paragraph 1
earlier than seven years after the holding of a previous poll under this
Schedule.

[vogie]

1 minute ago, Rookiescot said:

 

So the only way you can keep the union together is to prevent people voting to leave it.

If you truly believe there is a silent majority for the union you should have confidence in the result of another referendum.

But you insist there should not be one. 

Your logic can be quite illogical at times, you have had your once in lifetime referendum and to quote the Edinburgh Agreement "deliver a fair test and a decisive expression of the views of the people of Scotland and a result that everyone will respect. You cannot be pestering the majority all the time just because the minority didn't like the result of the referendum.

There is nothing more to be said, you have been banged to rights. Case closed.

[JonnyF]

11 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

 

So the only way you can keep the union together is to prevent people voting to leave it.

If you truly believe there is a silent majority for the union you should have confidence in the result of another referendum.

But you insist there should not be one. 

Yeah, let's have one every month until the result is finally YES. Then we can take that result to be the final result and never vote on it again.

 

Brilliant idea! Almost as good as having a 'people's vote' to reverse Brexit. You're clearly a true Democrat. Bravo.

[Barnabe]

So everyone wants EU style “democracy” now.

 

The referendum didn’t go your way? No problem! Vote again and again until the plebs vote the right way.