PFIZER and AZ jabs enjoying spectacular success in UK among elderly.

[ukrules]

On 2/23/2021 at 4:23 PM, mommysboy said:

 

I should have clarified that I meant less serious side effects that are nevertheless quite harsh, such as a high fever and nausea, which are temporary however. There have been reports that health workers in EU have found the AZ vaccine very hard to tolerate, although this could just as easily be a 'nocebo' effect. Thanks for the link.

 

Both my parents were vaccinated many weeks ago, my father got his in mid January, and my mother on Jan 29th.

 

Father reported no side effects at all, literally nothing.

 

My mother on the other hand had a little bit of a sore arm for a couple of days and felt tired / low on energy with a slight fever which she didn't bother measuring but she said she had 'some chills' which is a sure sign of a fever when that happens in a warm room. This lasted for 3 or 4 days before she felt normal again.

 

They're both in their mid 70's and will take the second shot at the first opportunity.

 

It was the AstraZeneca vaccine for both of them.

 

[mommysboy]

5 hours ago, ukrules said:

 

Both my parents were vaccinated many weeks ago, my father got his in mid January, and my mother on Jan 29th.

 

Father reported no side effects at all, literally nothing.

 

My mother on the other hand had a little bit of a sore arm for a couple of days and felt tired / low on energy with a slight fever which she didn't bother measuring but she said she had 'some chills' which is a sure sign of a fever when that happens in a warm room. This lasted for 3 or 4 days before she felt normal again.

 

They're both in their mid 70's and will take the second shot at the first opportunity.

 

It was the AstraZeneca vaccine for both of them.

 

 

Heartening news and I wish them a long and healthy retirement.

[mommysboy]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9307729/Oxford-vaccine-effective-Pfizer-jab-new-figures-show.html

 

 

Further confirmation.  Indeed, AZ jab seems to be particularly effective for very old people. 

 

The article also reveals that 25% of health workers are refusing to take a vaccine.  It tells the story of a doctor's receptionist who blankly refused even after the facts were spelled out.  (mind you it's probably just as well as it is this type of person who would have convinced herself of severe side effects.)  

 

What a turn up for the books!  

 

Elsewhere Canada finally relented. In it's explanation of approval, mention of real world data was made.  Rather cryptically the health body also referenced USA influence as complicating matters.

 

It's unusual for a manufacturer's trial to understate drug efficacy but unwittingly this seems to have happened in AZ's case.  The clinical trial data relates to a sub-optimal dosing strategy. Incredibly, some experts will ignore real world data in favour of original trial data for evermore.  It's a great drug hampered by poor initial presentation.  In AZ's defence I guess it could not have known.

 

The other point of interest is that the AZ vaccine appears to be effective as a one shot option based on the criteria established by Jand J.  I wonder if it will be marketed as such in the future.

 

In my view, it is possible that in fact the AZ vaccine is the best of the best on aggregate performance, and that's before logistical factors are considered.

Edited February 28, 2021 by mommysboy

[cormanr7]

2 hours ago, mommysboy said:

In my view, it is possible that in fact the AZ vaccine is the best of the best on aggregate performance, and that's before logistical factors are considered

But it remains to be seen what will happen when vector vaccines have to be injected regularly. This may lead to 'anti-vector immunity'. People will not have immunity to a chimp cold virus when first injected but this may change after several injections. Sputnik tries to reduce this problem by using different vectors in the first and second shot. However, it may be necessary in the longer term to use a mRNA or protein vaccine after a viral vector vaccine. Whereas a viral vector has been used in a recent Ebola vaccine, there has been a huge failure in the past with Merck's HIV vaccine where (quote) : 'the vaccine appeared to increase the rate of HIV infection in individuals with prior immunity against the adenovirus vector used in the vaccine'. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2234358/. The Merck vaccine used Ad5 as vector,  injected three times. Ad5 is also employed in the second Sputnik shot.

[mommysboy]

1 minute ago, cormanr7 said:

But it remains to be seen what will happen when vector vaccines have to be injected regularly. This may lead to 'anti-vector immunity'. People will not have immunity to a chimp cold virus when first injected but this may change after several injections. Sputnik tries to reduce this problem by using different vectors in the first and second shot. However, it may be necessary in the longer term to use a mRNA or protein vaccine after a viral vector vaccine. Whereas a viral vector has been used in a recent Ebola vaccine, there has been a huge failure in the past with Merck's HIV vaccine where (quote) : 'the vaccine appeared to increase the rate of HIV infection in individuals with prior immunity against the adenovirus vector used in the vaccine'. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2234358/. The Merck vaccine used Ad5 as vector,  injected three times. Ad5 is also employed in the second Sputnik shot.

 

I think rotation will be a key feature in all vaccination programs regardless of the type used.  As yet it is a theoretical consideration though.  For sure, mRNA vaccines are the future- the problem is that from a global perspective they are really for the next pandemic, due to cost and logistical problems.

[Solinvictus]

Well, it seems things are starting to look up. Cases are going down at least in the US.

[tso310]

On 2/24/2021 at 4:38 PM, tso310 said:

I had my AZ first jab last Friday. Other than a sore arm no side effects. I know many people who have had the AZ jab and similar reports.

My wife had her jab on Saturday. She got the Pfizer. 2 Friends were also there for their jabs. So far no side effects reported.

All first jabs.

Edited March 1, 2021 by tso310

[herfiehandbag]

On 2/25/2021 at 11:46 AM, Peter Denis said:

Yes, the Wet Dream for Big Pharma > vaccination for everybody, and to be repeated yearly to combat the new strains. 

Total business-driven madness...

If "big pharma" is allowed to control the process. If governments are prepared to establish "non profit making" production then the wet dream subsides. 

Covid 19 is changing a lot of things to do with the way we as a society do things. Let us hope this is one change.

[GroveHillWanderer]

On 2/25/2021 at 11:46 AM, Peter Denis said:

Yes, the Wet Dream for Big Pharma > vaccination for everybody, and to be repeated yearly to combat the new strains. 

Total business-driven madness...

There's no definitive evidence yet, that new vaccines and/or yearly boosters will be needed.

 

It may turn out to be the case but we don't actually know that yet.

 

The current vaccines still prevent serious illness, hospitalisation or death even with the new variants.

 

So we still need to wait and see how things will pan out.

[mommysboy]

43 minutes ago, GroveHillWanderer said:

There's no definitive evidence yet, that new vaccines and/or yearly boosters will be needed.

 

It may turn out to be the case but we don't actually know that yet.

 

The current vaccines still prevent serious illness, hospitalisation or death even with the new variants.

 

So we still need to wait and see how things will pan out.

 

Yes, indeed. Also in the future it could be the vector vaccines could be deployed as 'one shot'.

 

I spoke to a Turkish doctor today who is studying in the UK. His brother and sister in law have been vaccinated with the AZ jab.  Neither suffered side effects.

[mommysboy]

"Mr Hancock told a Downing Street press conference the study was 'extremely good news'. 'In fact, the detailed data show that the protection that you get from catching Covid 35 days after a first jab is even slightly better for the Oxford jab than for Pfizer, albeit both results are clearly very strong,' he said."

 

"Protection against even developing symptomatic Covid-19 in the first place ranged between 57 and 61 per cent for one dose of Pfizer and between 60 and 73 per cent for the Oxford/AstraZeneca vaccine, the study found."

 

My comment: Pfizer jab is known to kick on after second dose and is best used imo as per manufacturer's recommendations.

 

Real world study using hard data.

 

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9313757/Covid-vaccines-JVT-blasts-EUs-refusal-Oxford-vaccine-65s.html