Initial things to consider when building a house in Thailand - ideas?

[Mister Fixit]

I wonder if anyone can put me on the right track about having a house built here.

About what would it cost to build a two storey house of around 60-70 square metres?   Alternatively, a single story of about 90-100?

 

These figures are very speculative, and may well be different eventually, but just to get a ballpark amount for the building cost.

 

Quick background -

Currently we rent a two-storey semi-detached house (baan faet) and the plot of which is about 82 sq metres and the house about 45-ish.  It was fine for just the two of us when we moved in almost 13 years ago but we have expanded over time.

It’s about 3 kms from the Mall, Ngam Wong Wan, Nonthaburi and we love it here.  Very handy for almost everything and I can be in Bangkok on the MRT in about 45 minutes should I need to.

 

However, the wife and her daughter are trying to get a younger sister to give them about 300-400 sq metres of empty land she owns so that they can build a house.  This is in Banokville in northwest Pathum Thani, very close to the border with Nonthaburi and Ayutthaya, so extremely rural.

 

Basically, I don’t have enough to pay for building a house so the wife’s daughter, 30 and unmarried with a decent job, would have to borrow the money necessary and I would use the money I pay for rent here to help with the repayments.  But this is Thailand …

 

So, some advice please.  Is the house area I mention above about right for two people and the daughter visiting at weekends? 

 

I suppose 3 bedrooms, plus a room of about 3.5 x 5 metres for a man-cave/study/hide from the family room, 2 bathrooms, 1 decent sized living room and a biggish kitchen.  A carport is OK because I don’t run a car (just a couple of motorbikes) and also we'd need a laundry/utility area at the back. 

 

What would that work out approximately given the rural nature of area?  And is it possible to purchase ready-made house plans from an architect or similar?

 

This is all very much beginning thoughts, but any input to help concentrate the mind is much appreciated.

[kingofthemountain]

Hi

 

my advice considering your situation is don't be involved in the project

it's nothing of your business

 

i get the starting idea of puting the same amount of your money you are actualy

giving to the owner of your house for the rent to reimburse a loan on a house you

will not be the owner nor the owner of the land the house will be build on

but trust me, most of the Thais are unable to do a correct budget

and they ALWAYS understimate the costs of any project, the obvious

goal being to drag you in this project. 

 

When you are in and discover the cost is at least 2X what it was supposed to be

usualy it's too late to go back, you are basically trapped.

 

So again, my advice is don't do it

you have 0 interest to do it, it's only a problem's nest and you are going 

to lost a lot of money at the end.

 

if the sister want to borrow money to build a house on her land

why not, and maybe you will rent from her, or maybe not

 

I mean a very rural area is completely different from your actual environement

and everything can change at every moment, particularly in Thailand and 

particularly in these troubled times, lost of job, health problems, couples problems

visa problems and so on, it's urgent to wait and continue to rent, maybe in another

place if you want something more convenient. At least you have a lease in your name

and you can still move at every moment if something goes wrong.

[Mister Fixit]

36 minutes ago, kingofthemountain said:

Hi

 

my advice considering your situation is don't be involved in the project

it's nothing of your business

 

i get the starting idea of puting the same amount of your money you are actualy

giving to the owner of your house for the rent to reimburse a loan on a house you

will not be the owner nor the owner of the land the house will be build on

but trust me, most of the Thais are unable to do a correct budget

and they ALWAYS understimate the costs of any project, the obvious

goal being to drag you in this project. 

 

When you are in and discover the cost is at least 2X what it was supposed to be

usualy it's too late to go back, you are basically trapped.

 

So again, my advice is don't do it

you have 0 interest to do it, it's only a problem's nest and you are going 

to lost a lot of money at the end.

 

if the sister want to borrow money to build a house on her land

why not, and maybe you will rent from her, or maybe not

 

I mean a very rural area is completely different from your actual environement

and everything can change at every moment, particularly in Thailand and 

particularly in these troubled times, lost of job, health problems, couples problems

visa problems and so on, it's urgent to wait and continue to rent, maybe in another

place if you want something more convenient. At least you have a lease in your name

and you can still move at every moment if something goes wrong.

 

Well, thanks for the advice, but I already know all the pitfalls that there can be and how useless Thais are at planning and estimating.  I wouldn't dream of doing anything at all unless I was 100% certain of being completely involved at all stages.  It won't work if I don't put the money down for the monthly repayments so they don't have much choice. 

 

I wouldn't do a thing unless I was granted a usufruct to allow me to stay there for the duration of my life.  Anyway if they booted me they would lose the ability to repay so it's pretty pointless if they do.

 

And I know exactly what the area is like and how different it is from my current area but I will deal with that as and when I need to.  But neither of those are the point of my post.  

 

And I know their idea is half-cocked, because they would need to borrow a couple of million or so for the building costs but we'll still need to live here and continue to pay rent so who pays the instalments after the loan is granted unless they can get a 6 month or so moratorium on repayments?  That's highly unlikely.  

 

But none of those issues are the point of my post, which is - 1) what is a likely ballpark cost, and 2) are my thoughts feasible?

 

It's a shame you couldn't stick with the point, because now I can foresee a whole long list of posts along the same lines with other 'experts' giving off-topic, off the point 'advice'.

 

That's why I am trying to get my own ideas about what is involved so at least someone with more than half a brain (me) can get information that is something like concrete <joke>.
 

All I want is a likely estimate of costs to build it, but as you say, this being Thailand they will probably at least double.  
And I also want to know if my estimate of size, living area etc is about right, or if not, other suggestions. 

 

If you can answer those questions please continue posting.  If not, thank you for you contribution, but it isn't helpful to my OP.

[kingofthemountain]

Ok no problem

 

i have paid to build 2 houses in a very rural area in Thailand

the 2 houses were around 80 sqmand the cost was less than 1 M bahts for each of them, but it was few years ago and i had a lot of luck with few bargain

 

Also keep in mind the cost depend a lot of what sort of house you are building between ''thai style'' and ''farang style'' the total cost can be 2 or 3X

 

80 sqm is ok for a family of 3 persons, a couple with 1 child (2 rooms)

 

You don't indicate the size of your family, nor what style of house you want (Aircon? Windows with double glass? Terracota roof? Wood house or bricks? and so on)

so it's really difficult to answer with precision to your question

i would say something between 1 and 2 millions

 

Just for your information in a rural area on a familial land

your ''usufruct'' means nothing in fact, trust me if they want

you move, you will move, usufruct or not

 

i left the others give their acvice as i don't want to bother you with

few things you know already

 

goodluck anyway

[gunderhill]

1 hour ago, Mister Fixit said:

I wouldn't do a thing unless I was granted a usufruct to allow me to stay there for the duration of my life

useless  in a divorce.

[gunderhill]

ok you want advice. Been there and done it 4 times

1  don't  let a Thai  build  it do it  yourself theyll f$$k it  up and do a way worse  job than you can ever imagine as well as overcharge you.

2 Why  build  2  stories 1 is  easier

3  70m2  is  small I  live in 50m2 and that's 3  rooms and small bathroom

4 I  built  my own houses with  little  experience, it's  really  not hard you don't have to lay 1000 blocks a  day, take  your  time.

5 it's VERY cheap to do it but you  will be quoted stupid money when asking, I  built 50 m2 for way under 200k can send you photos  if you want, half a  million should  be plenty for 70 m2

6 get readymix concrete with waterproofer in for  your BASE it costs almost nothing to add to the mix, you'll thank me later when you dont have tide  marks and peeling paint  on your  house

7 Use preformed  posts get the 5  inch size, its  as  hard as  dig a few  small  holes and line them up, youll need  help to hump them in theyre heavy.

[gunderhill]

1 hour ago, Mister Fixit said:

because they would need to borrow a couple of million

overpriced by 300%

[gunderhill]

1 hour ago, Mister Fixit said:

And I also want to know if my estimate of size, living area etc is about right, or if not, other suggestions. 

way to  small if you want 3  bedrooms

[gunderhill]

2 hours ago, Mister Fixit said:

3.5 x 5 metres

wrong ,standard  sizes are max 4  metres for  column  placement

[carlyai]

As a rough figure allow B2000 per m 2 for the construction, everything. Then plan on having about half that again for extras and fixes.

If you work out paying Labour @ B300 pper day and 4 people, money soon mounts up and they go slow.

If you cost each job (@ B300 each per day) think how long for the job (example estimate 2 weeks), they will go fast and finish in 1 week.

It's a balancing act.

 

[kingofthemountain]

2 hours ago, carlyai said:

As a rough figure allow B2000 per m 2 for the construction, everything. Then plan on having about half that again for extras and fixes.

If you work out paying Labour @ B300 pper day and 4 people, money soon mounts up and they go slow.

If you cost each job (@ B300 each per day) think how long for the job (example estimate 2 weeks), they will go fast and finish in 1 week.

It's a balancing act.

 

Nowadays it's very difficult, even in a rural area, to find Thai people

working for 300\day.

 

If you want someone with some knowledge in building houses and some tools  you will probably have to pay him 500 bahts\day

 

And i agree with you, the costs can explode if the team is slow

but it's not always the case, my advice is to find a good local contractor with solids references in the vicinity and define a fixed price at the start, then it's the contractor problem to pay the team and have the work done with a timing good enough for him to have a benefit at the end.

 

However you need to be on site every time every single day and look at everything as even the contractor will try to cut every corner he can to short his costs.

 

It's really not an easy experience and i don't recomand it to someone with no patience and no any knowledge in building. The language and ''the culture'' barrier'' are also a difficulty.

 

Then there is the administrative side and the vagaries of the climate.

 

Really imo the whole experience is a pain

 

[Mister Fixit]

14 hours ago, kingofthemountain said:

Ok no problem

 

i have paid to build 2 houses in a very rural area in Thailand

the 2 houses were around 80 sqmand the cost was less than 1 M bahts for each of them, but it was few years ago and i had a lot of luck with few bargain

 

Also keep in mind the cost depend a lot of what sort of house you are building between ''thai style'' and ''farang style'' the total cost can be 2 or 3X

 

80 sqm is ok for a family of 3 persons, a couple with 1 child (2 rooms)

 

You don't indicate the size of your family, nor what style of house you want (Aircon? Windows with double glass? Terracota roof? Wood house or bricks? and so on)

so it's really difficult to answer with precision to your question

i would say something between 1 and 2 millions

 

Just for your information in a rural area on a familial land

your ''usufruct'' means nothing in fact, trust me if they want

you move, you will move, usufruct or not

 

i left the others give their acvice as i don't want to bother you with

few things you know already

 

goodluck anyway

 

Apologies if I was a bit testy in my response, but this forum and other social media sites have a lot of posters who don't read discriminately and put their own interpretation on what they think they read.  

 

I did actually indicate my family size in my OP - I said 'Is the house area I mention above about right for two people and the daughter visiting at weekends?'

 

And I also said 'I suppose 3 bedrooms, plus a room of about 3.5 x 5 metres for a man-cave/study/hide from the family room, 2 bathrooms, 1 decent sized living room and a biggish kitchen.  A carport is OK because I don’t run a car (just a couple of motorbikes) and also we'd need a laundry/utility area at the back.'

 

I have given absolutely no thought to construction materials etc because that is way down the line - the first priority is to try to establish an approximate cost and then add 50% or so to cover the usual errors and down pricing to get the job.

 

The land aspect I leave to the family to sort out because it's their land.  However, if I am expected to fund the repayments I need to get an idea of the principal sum borrowed and term of years so we can make a stab at monthly repayment figures.

 

The wife just told me her daughter thought she would borrow 1.5 million - I think that's way too low.  I estimate we'd need about 2.5 million to cover decent fittings, a proper Western kitchen and a bit more up-market materials and a chunk for the usual contingencies.

 

Does that sound about right?  Ball park figure, of course.

 

And yes, I know that if a family REALLY want you out, all the usufructs in the world won't stop them.

However, I have known them 14 years, they are a decent salt of the earth family and they like me & we get on well. 

The older children don't have much higher education, but the younger ones do - one sister has a PhD in biochemistry and travels around Asia and Europe regularly, another has a Master's in Business Admin and a brother seems to be some sort of senior nurse in charge of a local health clinic.

I very much doubt I'll be kicked out because who would then make the monthly repayments?  But of course, TiT ...

 

[Mister Fixit]

Just now, Mister Fixit said:

13 hours ago, gunderhill said:

useless  in a divorce.

Who says we'll divorce?  She's almost 52 and I'm 72 - she relies on me to survive, so she'd be shooting herself in the foot. 

Oh, wait, that's their forte ...

 

It isn't going to happen though, she's been as straight as a die for 14 years 

 

[petermik]

Had this built down south (thai builder) 5 years ago 3 beds/2 baths 120 sq.metres paid builder for labour only bought our own materials....total cost 1.3 million.....QCon block walls CPAC roof tiles and insulated underneath....thai style kitchen.....labour cost 400,000 baht

[edgarfriendly]

im also interested in experienced peoples opinions on this subject.

 

i have been quoted 10,000thb per sq/m for single storey, 15,000thb for 2 storey.

 

apart from not even owning the land yet id appreciate following the thread for as much info as possible!

 

This book by Philip Bryce is interesting and may be of some use to the OP.

 

"How to buy land & build a house in Thailand"

 

 

[petermik]

Tea*do*r...construction in Thailand

 

This website is excellent.

 

[Mister Fixit]

33 minutes ago, petermik said:

Tea*do*r...construction in Thailand

 

This website is excellent.

 

I thought that site had died ages ago.

I'll have to take another  look.

[Mister Fixit]

The wife was sent this photo by her daughter last night.  I don't know if that's the sort of thing she has in mind or just an example.

 

What would that cost ready-built on a housing estate and what would it cost to have built a a one-off?

 

I have no idea of how many bed or other rooms it might have.

[Liverpool Lou]

16 hours ago, Mister Fixit said:

 

Well, thanks for the advice, but I already know all the pitfalls that there can be and how useless Thais are at planning and estimating.  I wouldn't dream of doing anything at all unless I was 100% certain of being completely involved at all stages.  It won't work if I don't put the money down for the monthly repayments so they don't have much choice. 

 

I wouldn't do a thing unless I was granted a usufruct to allow me to stay there for the duration of my life.  Anyway if they booted me they would lose the ability to repay so it's pretty pointless if they do.

 

And I know exactly what the area is like and how different it is from my current area but I will deal with that as and when I need to.  But neither of those are the point of my post.  

 

And I know their idea is half-cocked, because they would need to borrow a couple of million or so for the building costs but we'll still need to live here and continue to pay rent so who pays the instalments after the loan is granted unless they can get a 6 month or so moratorium on repayments?  That's highly unlikely.  

 

But none of those issues are the point of my post, which is - 1) what is a likely ballpark cost, and 2) are my thoughts feasible?

 

It's a shame you couldn't stick with the point, because now I can foresee a whole long list of posts along the same lines with other 'experts' giving off-topic, off the point 'advice'.

 

That's why I am trying to get my own ideas about what is involved so at least someone with more than half a brain (me) can get information that is something like concrete <joke>.
 

All I want is a likely estimate of costs to build it, but as you say, this being Thailand they will probably at least double.  
And I also want to know if my estimate of size, living area etc is about right, or if not, other suggestions. 

 

If you can answer those questions please continue posting.  If not, thank you for you contribution, but it isn't helpful to my OP.

Excellent!  Good for you, just what I wanted to say to his comment also.  Good luck.

[Mister Fixit]

14 hours ago, gunderhill said:

overpriced by 300%

 

It was an estimate with  a hefty add-on for contingencies

[gunderhill]

1 hour ago, petermik said:

Tea*do*r...construction in Thailand

 

This website is excellent.

 

Coolthaihouse also

[gunderhill]

1 hour ago, Mister Fixit said:

 

Apologies if I was a bit testy in my response, but this forum and other social media sites have a lot of posters who don't read discriminately and put their own interpretation on what they think they read.  

 

I did actually indicate my family size in my OP - I said 'Is the house area I mention above about right for two people and the daughter visiting at weekends?'

 

And I also said 'I suppose 3 bedrooms, plus a room of about 3.5 x 5 metres for a man-cave/study/hide from the family room, 2 bathrooms, 1 decent sized living room and a biggish kitchen.  A carport is OK because I don’t run a car (just a couple of motorbikes) and also we'd need a laundry/utility area at the back.'

 

I have given absolutely no thought to construction materials etc because that is way down the line - the first priority is to try to establish an approximate cost and then add 50% or so to cover the usual errors and down pricing to get the job.

 

The land aspect I leave to the family to sort out because it's their land.  However, if I am expected to fund the repayments I need to get an idea of the principal sum borrowed and term of years so we can make a stab at monthly repayment figures.

 

The wife just told me her daughter thought she would borrow 1.5 million - I think that's way too low.  I estimate we'd need about 2.5 million to cover decent fittings, a proper Western kitchen and a bit more up-market materials and a chunk for the usual contingencies.

 

Does that sound about right?  Ball park figure, of course.

 

And yes, I know that if a family REALLY want you out, all the usufructs in the world won't stop them.

However, I have known them 14 years, they are a decent salt of the earth family and they like me & we get on well. 

The older children don't have much higher education, but the younger ones do - one sister has a PhD in biochemistry and travels around Asia and Europe regularly, another has a Master's in Business Admin and a brother seems to be some sort of senior nurse in charge of a local health clinic.

I very much doubt I'll be kicked out because who would then make the monthly repayments?  But of course, TiT ...

 

I answered  all  your  points 70m2 is way too  small 1.5 million is way too  much.

[gunderhill]

1 hour ago, edgarfriendly said:

i have been quoted 10,000thb per sq/m for single storey, 15,000thb for 2 storey.

Way  overpriced you can build very cheap and I also did mention to build single story to the Op but he seems  disinterested in that cheaper  option. Think  more along the lines of 4000 bahtm2

[gunderhill]

30 minutes ago, Mister Fixit said:

What would that cost ready-built on a housing estate and what would it cost to have built a a one-off?

 

I have no idea of how many bed or other rooms it might have.

How anyone can answer that? I don't know because you dont know the size, its  like  how  longs a piece of string.

[BritManToo]

27 minutes ago, Mister Fixit said:

What would that cost ready-built on a housing estate and what would it cost to have built a a one-off?

That's a fairly standard design 3 bed Thai estate house.

Between 2M and 2M5 on an estate in Chiang Mai out of town.

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, Mister Fixit said:

The wife just told me her daughter thought she would borrow 1.5 million - I think that's way too low.  I estimate we'd need about 2.5 million to cover decent fittings, a proper Western kitchen and a bit more up-market materials and a chunk for the usual contingencies.

I bought almost the same house as your photo for 1M8 around 8 years back, 300k deposit, 1M5 mortgage.

Repayments 10,900bht/month. The builders are still building the same design but want 2M4 now (inc land).

 

Without the land, around 1M4, so I'd agree with the wife's daughter.

[Mister Fixit]

I think I need to add some information about me which will help people understand more.

 

There's a reason for my nickname on here - in the UK, after I was made redundant in the 90s, I had to make a living.  I sold specialist books mail order as a sideline, but my nick on here was the name I used for my my main source of income.  I was Mister Fixit, the local repair and maintain anything chappie.

 

I started doing DIY when I first married in 1975, and over the years of doing up about became pretty proficient at most trades.  I was a pretty good plumber (I could wipe lead joints), electrician, chippie, painter and decorator and so on, and over the years became a fairly decent plasterer too.  Not a whole room, but I would take a wall on and once a ceiling.

 

I could do almost anything, from fitting a letterbox or a new lock or a doorbell, to decorating or Artexing ceilings, to installing a new kitchen or bathroom.  I had friends in various trades and if I needed a hand, they would help.  I even installed gas appliances, but a friend who was a gas fitter would do the final connections after checking everything out, and a sparkie friend would check out my rewires and do final hookups.

 

Since coming to Thailand in 2004, I have only ever taught English and have become very de-skilled in building and other things - I used to do all types of car maintenance as well, from routine stuff to rebuilding engines.   Now I just pay the chap in the next soi to service my bike for a few baht.  And I rent my house, so why do any work on it - although I have replaced some sockets and a broken down pipe.

 

I have a few screwdrivers and that's it, nothing to the tools I had in the UK, a whole garage stuffed with Kangos, plumbing and sparkie kits, a whole load of stuff which I gave to my kids.  

Also, I am 17 years older with 2 quite badly arthritic knees so no hopping up scaffolding for me any more.

 

This house is my wife's family's business although I intend to keep an eye on things as best I can from 30 miles away.   And I want some input into it, because in true Thai-style no one will give a second thought to placement of doors, sockets., piping etc.

 

I may have lost the physical skills due to lack of usage, but I haven't lost my knowledge or my brain or planning ability

 

 

 

[Mister Fixit]

12 minutes ago, gunderhill said:

Way  overpriced you can build very cheap and I also did mention to build single story to the Op but he seems  disinterested in that cheaper  option. Think  more along the lines of 4000 bahtm2

I didn't say that at all, so you seem to have just assumed that. Why would you think I would be disinterested in a single story building?  I just haven't got round to replying to your earlier post.  

 

As I posted above just now, I have stage 4 arthritis in both knees so need a double replacement which I can't afford.  Earlier, I suggested a single storey to the wife, but we agree that would take up too much of her sister's land, so we are now considering having a slightly larger ground floor layout just for us and a smaller first floor for the daughter when she visits, probably just a bedroom and bathroom plonked on top.  

 

I don't think you have quite grasped that I have no say whatsoever over all this, it's a family thing and they have lived in the area all their lives and know local people who can do it.  No way am I going to barge in on their business and tell them how to go about things.

 

All I want is a decent sized modern kitchen and a decent sized room for just me where I can go and hide when I want to. 

 

 

[Mister Fixit]

9 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I bought almost the same house as your photo for 1M8 around 8 years back, 300k deposit, 1M5 mortgage.

Repayments 10,900bht/month. The builders are still building the same design but want 2M4 now (inc land).

 

Hmm, excellent information.  So, build for about 1.5 million nowadays?  I can do 10 grand-ish a month.  

 

What was the spec?  How many bedrooms, bathrooms, overall area of plot and of house?

[Mister Fixit]

20 minutes ago, gunderhill said:

How anyone can answer that? I don't know because you dont know the size, its  like  how  longs a piece of string.

 

I was asking for an estimate, not something 100% cast in stone.  ????