Can Thailand beat Malaysia and Singapore in the race to lure wealthy foreigners?

[webfact]

Foreign buyers own 30 per cent of condominiums in Pattaya, according to a property expert. Photo: Xinhua

 

By Jitsiree Thongnoi

 

● To give its economy a shot in the arm, the Thai government is looking to attract 1 million ‘wealthy global citizens’ to settle down in the next five years

 

● It is considering an array of perks such as longer leases to draw them, but analysts are unsure how the scheme compares to those of its regional neighbours

 

Thailand wants wealthy foreigners to settle down in the Southeast Asian nation after the pandemic, and is looking to lure them with possible perks including longer-term leases and tax remittances – but analysts are unsure whether the scheme can rival similar packages from the likes of Malaysia and Singapore

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The latest scheme, approved by the cabinet in September, is aimed at attracting 1 million “wealthy global citizens” within five years by issuing them special long-term resident visas, providing they meet a minimum investment or bond-purchase threshold.

 

The government hopes this category of migrant – as well as pensioners and high-skilled expatriates, including those looking to work from abroad – will generate a cash flow of 1 trillion baht (US$29.5 billion) by 2026, putting it on the pathway to economic recovery after its GDP slumped more than 6 per cent year as tourism ground to a halt amid the pandemic.

 

Full story: https://www.scmp.com/week-asia/economics/article/3152019/can-thailand-beat-malaysia-and-singapore-race-lure-wealthy

 

-- © Copyright South China Morning Post 2021-10-14

 

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[mokwit]

Visa is for five years because they just want their money to help Thailand recover from the pandemic and then they would like them to leave.

 

 

[The Cipher]

Quote

Can Thailand beat Malaysia and Singapore in the race to lure wealthy foreigners?

It depends on what 'wealthy' means. Can Thailand outcompete Singapore for UHNW individuals? Unlikely. Can it outcompete Singapore for folks in the $1-10M asset range? It's possible but will depend on intelligently crafted policy.

 

Should easily outcompete Malaysia at all $1M+ wealth levels.

[ourdon]

                                                                              

 

 

                                                                                                    NO!!!

Edited October 13, 2021 by ourdon
Punctuation

[ourdon]

2 minutes ago, The Cipher said:

It depends on what 'wealthy' means. Can Thailand outcompete Singapore for UHNW individuals? Unlikely. Can it outcompete Singapore for folks in the $1-10M asset range? It's possible but will depend on intelligently crafted policy.

 

Should easily outcompete Malaysia at all $1M+ wealth levels.

As Cipher mentions, it will depend on an intelligently crafted policy.

Thailand is screwed

[RichardColeman]

35 minutes ago, webfact said:

 

● To give its economy a shot in the arm, the Thai government is looking to attract 1 million ‘wealthy global citizens’ to settle down in the next five years

 

Way they are mucking about with opening up, they may not even get 1 million tourists in the next 5 years ! They'd all have to buy a condo each !

[lkn]

57 minutes ago, webfact said:

issuing them special long-term resident visas, providing they meet a minimum investment or bond-purchase threshold

There is already the Thai Elite visa available starting from 500,000 baht, and there is the special investment visa, where I believe real estate is allowed, but most be > 10 million (if I recall correctly).

 

But attracting one million wealthy people within five year is just wishful thinking.

Edited October 13, 2021 by lkn

[sirineou]

Some people became wealthy by winning the lottery, or inheriting their wealth, most became wealthy by being smart. They are not distracted  by smoke and mirrors. 

If Thailand wants to attract those they need to come up with solid plans that offer long term solutions.

 It might attract some of the ones who got their money from reasons other than being smart, but those  will not be wealthy for long anyway, because you know what they say about fools and their money.

[lkn]

2 minutes ago, sirineou said:

If Thailand wants to attract those they need to come up with solid plans that offer long term solutions.

And invest in the country.

 

It’s disappointing to hear someone say “we want a million wealthy people to come, so we get a cash flow” rather than “we want to make our cities so appealing that even wealthy people want to live here”.

[Chad3000]

Malaysia recently sabotaged their retirement program.

 

Only the very wealthy that are not working, living off investments can live in Singapore due to visa restrictions. I wasn't aware Singapore even had a retirement program not linked to wealth and prior employment.

 

Thailand just doesn't get it.

 

1. People earning salary this large usually need to be managing something locally.

 

2. People making huge amounts of money from trading (assuming that even lasts) are not paid monthly as immigration absolutely demands to the day! They are paid quarterly, annually possible 3 5 10 years out on investments. Thailand wouldn't even know this bc it has such little high finance.

 

3. I don't think Hua Hin, Chaing Mai or Bangkok especially post covid are at all appealing to high rollers. That leaves scammy Phuket and Samui. Pattaya could remake itself but it will also need to change it's name.

 

4. Banks insure less than 1m thb but you want some smart guy to deposit 100m lol.

 

5. Can't own land only an overpriced box in the sky. Leases are not only worth little the longer the lease the more tempting it will for landlords to break them and raise rents.

 

6. There is little nice coastal property unlike the US.

 

8. How about no tax? It's not as though the wealthy here pay taxes.

 

9. Healthcare is far more expensive in Thailand for those from western countries on pensions. In US medicare picks up much if not all many hospital bills.

 

11. Covid jail. Get asymptomatic covid - go to hospital jail.

 

12. Until Thailand drops all formalities the human right to frrely travel is greatly chilled. Or...just stay in US. Of course, if you're Chinese you'll feel right at home.

 

13. It's hot. While it might beat out China, northern England for weather most days if the year there are plenty of great places it doesn't.

 

14. Owning toys is a hassle. Storing them, registering them and selling them. Boats are a huge hassle.

 

15. The instability of a feckless, authorization government. You'd think military a government would bring stability. It hasn't nor will it.

 

16. Like Myanmar I think wealthy people need to respond to the question of whether bringing in assets aids and abeits - is it good for the people?

 

17. Cheapness is vanishing fast - not do wealthy people care something this Y price not X. They look for value, experience.

 

18. Back to medical. It's very difficult to find a good dentist in Bangkok they are all thieves. We all know the legally sanctioned three tiered pricing system. Finally, it's not that great. Most dentist and doctors are not to western standard.

 

19. Taxes on imported goods. Car, watches, wine, scotch, any imported foodstuffs. Ridiculous.

 

20. immigration, DLT hassles. All the cards, forms, broken online registrations, Treated as a criminal. Every changing requirements. No, they wouldn't just get an agent and invariably will be forced to report multiple times during the year for some cranky middle aged goon.

 

22. Imagine when cops tell the multi millionaire he can't tend his own garden, work on his vintage car or wash his boat.

 

23. The roads are the most dangerous in the world.

 

24. The cops are not honest. While I've only been hassled once in 30 years we all know the stories. This is quite common.

 

25. Quality of life here will only decline. This is brought on faster and harder by the authoritarian government, the cronyism, corruption. I have said for years Thailand is headed towards becoming the Philippines not Singapore. It is not a prosperous place nor will it be in coming decades. It's no longer a happy place either.

 

26. What's the draw? What EXACTLY is the government selling?? I mean really...

 

27. Back to land. Can't own it despite not being able to take it out if the country. Even if law written into Royal Gazette we know the reality and trustworthiness of Thailand. It will be recinded.

 

28. Back to visas. Of course no citizenship or even PR mentioned. We all know a ten year visa is just a one year visa which will function like any other O extension. This is absolutely nothing.

 

29. Get married? Better not. Money you make abroad which has nothing to do with the new wife is half hers despite not even having a visa to visit the country.

 

30. Destruction of environment. Trash is everywhere and on every shore. Plastic. No hope for this one.

 

Bonus: Endless corruption. Remember the old b500 departure tax that wasn't part of the airport fees? It was incorporated into the ticket. Now, we have another and the balls here is that no one knows what it's for. Ironically, for tourism. My point, this stuff is endless.

 

Bonus: The government is just <deleted> and will be so forever. It's one thing if you're running from an even worse despotism or corrupt nation. But if not...why be in the middle of this nonsense?

 

Maybe the government should ask those already here - would any expat currently here given 100m stay? Then they can abandon this silly project, go to Thong Lor and enjoy themselves.

[mokwit]

Excellent summary Chad3000

 

19. Taxes on imported goods. Car, watches, wine, scotch, any imported foodstuffs. Ridiculous.

 

I get so irritated by not being able to just order something online without having to worry about customs hell/random 100% duties, backing and forthing with the seller to see if he will change postage method/label it correctly etc.

Edited October 13, 2021 by mokwit

[jethro69]

1 hour ago, The Cipher said:

 It's possible but will depend on intelligently crafted policy.

 

Ehhhmmm, I think you answered the question already. ????

 

[sirineou]

17 minutes ago, Chad3000 said:

People making huge amounts of money from trading (assuming that even lasts) are not paid monthly as immigration absolutely demands to the day! They are paid quarterly, annually possible 3 5 10 years out on investments. -

all other things aside, most of which I agree with, I don't think the above is an issue for Thailand. The retirement extension based on income requires a monthly deposit from abroad, it does not require that it is from a monthly income. Even though I have a monthly income from my pension, social security and rentals, Such income is deposited in my US accounts,   I transfer every month sufficient funds  for our expenses in Thailand which for most people should be sufficiently high  for their  visa extensions.  

 

[NanaSomchai]

1 hour ago, mokwit said:

Visa is for five years because they just want their money to help Thailand recover from the pandemic and then they would like them to leave.

 

 

Always remember what they have done with the very first iteration of the Elite visa program then "retired" it for a far lesser attractive one once they had the money boost they needed/sought.

 

This will be the same $hit all over again, make things very attractive at first, lure in the first thousands of suckers in, quick ca$h grab then retire it/put an end to it.

 

Thai style.

[NanaSomchai]

1 hour ago, lkn said:

But attracting one million wealthy people within five year is just wishful thinking.

It's not just wishful thinking anymore, they are day dreaming all awake at this point.

 

As it was stated earlier in this very thread, it's all about stimulating the economy with a quick instant money jab then get rid of us pesky foreigners once the economy has recovered and is somewhat stable again at the first chance they got.

 

Ideally if they could find a way to fleece us as soon as we land in Suvarnabhumi then fly us back immediately to our origin point of departure, rest assured they would.

 

This is Thailand.

[Albert Zweistein]

What about a country wide clean up ?

[NanaSomchai]

1 hour ago, sirineou said:

It might attract some of the ones who got their money from reasons other than being smart, but those  will not be wealthy for long anyway, because you know what they say about fools and their money.

Indeed, this is all a new quick money grab scheme then get rid of us at the first chance they get. Thai style.

[NanaSomchai]

1 hour ago, lkn said:

It’s disappointing to hear someone say “we want a million wealthy people to come, so we get a cash flow” rather than “we want to make our cities so appealing that even wealthy people want to live here”.

With proper management and a safer throughful laid out plan they could have become the new Riviera of the South East Asia region, instead they are still up to their old antics, scamming, gouging and fleecing tourists for a quick buck.

 

Take an example of what Portugal has done in the past 10 years, no taxes for whichever foreigner wishing to inject cash in Portugal's economy, it saved the country and helped it get through a major financial crisis including the COVID-19 crisis.

 

What Thailand really needs is a far less xenophobic properly democratically elected government, that would be the very first stepping stone.

 

Thailand has so much to do, fix, arrange and amend just in order to get back to it's 2000~2010 former glory that I truly doubt it can even be achieved at this point.

 

And yes I know some will disagree with me here but I am strongly convinced the average Thai citizen was much happier and thriving under Thaksin's rules/regime. 

 

Until then nothing will ever change until the Thais take matter in their own hands and succesfully overthrow the current non democratically self-elected junta failure that has been asleep at the wheel for the past 7 years or so.

 

At the end of the day, it is the 99% of the average non-connected Thais that are losing out on this one, they have been robbed blind of 7 years of their lives with no compensation in sight and it's nowhere near ending.

 

Again the Thais have to take matters in their own hands because at the end of the day; YOU need to be the change YOU want to see in the World.

 

Edited October 13, 2021 by NanaSomchai

[The Cipher]

1 hour ago, ourdon said:

As Cipher mentions, it will depend on an intelligently crafted policy.

Thailand is screwed

The Thai government definitely makes some mind-boggling decisions sometimes.

 

But you know, as a person who is the target market for a couple of the new visa classes being mooted, I don't think that they are bad per se. I anticipate applying for one these visas myself, pending the release of finalized details.

 

I think many of the forum posters occasionally get lost in the mystique of wealth and let that mix with an anti-Thailand bias in general. It's important to remember that there's a pretty big difference between the guy with $3B in net worth and the guy with $3M.

 

There are a lot more of the latter than the former, and I believe that the latter segment is more what Thailand is after - and also what they're better positioned to pursue. And I can tell you with certainty that Thailand does have appeal to folks over $1M+ net worth.

 

However, I do think that their goal of a million 'wealthy global citizens' taking up their visa offer is unlikely to happen. Per Credit Suisse there are approx 50 million millionaires in the world. If Thailand were to get a million of them that would be a 2% take rate, a percentage that strikes me as overambitious.

[zzaa09]

Why the competition?

[StayinThailand2much]

2 hours ago, sirineou said:

It might attract some of the ones who got their money from reasons other than being smart, but those  will not be wealthy for long anyway, because you know what they say about fools and their money.

They will probably go for the 'easy' money from China. Some Chinese are keen to 'get their money out of China', for whatever reasons.

[Thaifly88]

3 hours ago, mokwit said:

Visa is for five years because they just want their money to help Thailand recover from the pandemic and then they would like them to leave.

 

 

Five years is long enough for most people - few stay beyond that 

[TheFishman1]

Absolutely not with the CO E and all the hoops you have to go through to get here good luck CIT

[jacko45k]

8 minutes ago, Thaifly88 said:

Five years is long enough for most people - few stay beyond that 

Large retired contingent living here who have been here far longer. 

[henry213]

Your all being used on here by Thailand why? because the country is too stupid and they need your input to help them figure out what to do, Prayut chan-o-cha and his plonkers are all reading this daily Lol............

[TechnikaIII]

Singapore has Raffles and the history.

Thailand has a buffalo with delusions of grandure.

No.

[The Cipher]

5 minutes ago, henry213 said:

Your all being used on here by Thailand why? because the country is too stupid and they need your input to help them figure out what to do, Prayut chan-o-cha and his plonkers are all reading this daily Lol............

Good. As long as they subscribe to my posts, policy will improve.

[SoilSpoil]

Let's face it, Thailand is absolutely stunning. Just a shame you can't see most of it because of pm 2.5 issues 'sponsored' by sugarcane farmers. Rich people prefer to live in Singapore (25% of its population is $millionaire) and hop on a flight to see Phuket or Krabi for a 7 day visit. Flight is just over an hour. Now compare Marina Bay with the Sukhumvit, lol.

[MrMo]

I recall the question posed to farangs on arrival to Thailand forty years back.
How do you become a millionaire in Thailand ?

Come with many million !

[jacko45k]

Just now, MrMo said:

I recall the question posed to farangs on arrival to Thailand forty years back.
How do you become a millionaire in Thailand ?

Come with many million !

Sounds better when using the phrase 'making a small fortune' starting with a big one.