Some hotels now charging extra guest fee

[4MyEgo]

17 minutes ago, robblok said:

You are being irrational because you don't like the rule. If its a commonly accepted rule as the poster said that it was even mentioned on Agoda. This means its an industry standard. Same goes for movie theaters. Same goes for many entertainment parks. Some rules have to be set.

 

If you don't like the rules then go to a place that does not follow those rules. You can't fault people for following an industry standard. When you start deviating and being to flexible you might as well have no rules. Like oh lets do this building inspections this time like this and other time like that. You can't do that you need to set certain rules.

Now if enough people complain about those hotel rules and go to hotels that don't apply those rules then things change. Same goes for airlines at a certain age they will have to pay more. Now if they started to become flexible you would get endless debates and discussions.

 

If you can't see that you probably have never run a business. Your family room for instance, what if you say but a kid and an adult are the same why can't we have 3 there. I mean the debates will rage forever. So there will be some rules that the majority of the industry follows. Some might deviate and if that means they get more customers then maybe the standard will change.

 

The whole reason to follow rules it to not get in endless discussions. That is a different thing from not being flexible. Just imagine the reviews.. i got kid rate.. for my 13 year old.. other person does not get it starts to compain did not know what your circumstances where ect ect. If you can't see that then sorry lets say agree to disagree.

 

Do you ever go to water parks or amusement parks with your kid ? Some use a height as a marker other age. Thing is there has to be some kind of rule. 

 

I am making no statement about how correct the rules are just telling you why rules are in place.

 

Go back and read my post until it sinks in, it has nothing to do with being irrational, it is about common sense prevailing, read it, the room sizes, the amenities it has, and breakfast always included in the price, i.e. (added on to the room rate) because we pressed the tab with breakfast.

 

Theme parks with height restrictions is for safety reasons, we get that, paying adult rates for seats on aircrafts we also get that, but we are talking about the same rooms for the same amount of people for the same price, the only thing that has changed is the number on the child's age, from 11 to 12, that is it, these are not RULES, they are policies and they are flexile.

 

I did move onto a hotel that saw what I was talking about and accepted it.

 

Just because it's an industry standard, doesn't mean it is right, it is accepted by those hotels who form part of or joined the association to make it part of the industry standards for members to benefit from hoodwinkers the unsuspected, and if you can't see that then you would be hoodwinked, but not having kids, I am surprised your even commenting on this as it doesn't really apply to you IMO.

 

 

Edited December 20, 2021 by 4MyEgo

[DaLa]

On 12/18/2021 at 10:40 PM, Led Lolly Yellow Lolly said:

I think you're making this up. If you book a room through an OTA like Agoda and click the cheapest rate, it may be that the rate is for single occupancy. If so, it's entirely reasonable you be charged extra for turning up with someone else.

I've just spent around 20 days away from home (Nonthaburi) exploring the North  ( predominantly Chiang Mai) and booked my several hotels through Booking.com or Agoda and on all the bookings I received a discount as a single traveller.  I was allocated a double room and obviously only consumed 1 breakfast. I readily accept that if I was travelling with my wife  we would have to pay for 1 extra breakfast and if there were 3 of us ....

 

As long as it is made clear then I don't see a problem. Compared to the 'Resort Fees' in the States I would say the pricing of rooms here is relatively transparent.

[Pravda]

14 hours ago, TropicalGuy said:

If you book a room for two with two named people in booking no hotel in the world will ever charge a guest fee.

 

Wrong. Jesus wept how many times do I have to say it. Seen it in Japan all the time. Never seen it in Thailand until this week. Suddenly this thread turned into bringing hookers and cheap backpackers.

 

 

[robblok]

5 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said:

Go back and read my post until it sinks in, it has nothing to do with being irrational, it is about common sense prevailing, read it, the room sizes, the amenities it has, and breakfast always included in the price, i.e. (added on to the room rate) because we pressed the tab with breakfast.

 

Theme parks with height restrictions is for safety reasons, we get that, paying adult rates for seats on aircrafts we also get that, but we are talking about the same rooms for the same amount of people for the same price, the only thing that has changed is the number on the child's age, from 11 to 12, that is it, these are not RULES, they are policies and they are flexile.

 

I did move onto a hotel that saw what I was talking about and accepted it.

 

Just because it's an industry standard, doesn't mean it is right, it is accepted by those hotels who form part of or joined the association to make it part of the industry standards for members to benefit from hoodwinkers the unsuspected, and if you can't see that then you would be hoodwinked, but not having kids, I am surprised your even commenting on this as it doesn't really apply to you IMO.

 

 

No theme parks also change price on height as its sometimes easier to check then age. But there is again a rule. But does that one year matter.. no but still they have those rules.

 

Like i said i never said the rule was right, im just explaining why rules are being followed. I have no opinion. Besides you already did what i suggested when you don't like a rule find an other place that does not have that rule. But if a rule is in place somewhere then it will be upheld for the reasons i gave. To prevent endless discussions just like what we are doing now.

 

Im commenting on this because I understand the need of rules, and i said many times in my post that i don't make a statement about the right or wrong of this rule. 

 

I also told you that if you don't like rules move. But to expect them to break them for you is stupid. Then they might not have them at all.

 

You keep coming back how bad the rule is, i never said it was good or have an opinion of it. Just telling you why and how it also protect employees from these kind of discussions. I am pretty sure they accept that they lose business at times from the use. 

[TropicalGuy]

You were not clear. That “practice”, as I defined it, is straight Cheating & Wrong. like passing over a ten dollar bill and getting change for a five.  
It’s clearly Illegal Theft / Fraud. Resolve at once at Gen. Mgr level. Then report hotel to its Board & Media. Care to explain your bizarre “ whores & backpackers” remark ? 

[treetops]

5 hours ago, robblok said:

Sorry but on this point i must disagree, the line has to be drawn somewhere and if you look at agoda you can see that is 12. 

 

What is next, my kid is sick so they don't eat and so I dont want to pay for breakfast.

 

Sometimes you have to stick to certain rules otherwise you have to make constant changes and things become arbitrair. 

I agree with most of what you say regarding rules/guidelines etc and the reasons behind them, but in this specific example the hotel could have done much better.

 

When 4MyEgo made the request a good operator would have responded with something along the lines of "as you're a regular customer, and we know your kids, we'll do it on this one occasion only as a goodwill gesture, but to be fair to all our guests, for any further stays we must follow the regular procedure".

 

4MyEgo feels good, the hotel wins, no real precedent is set, no biteback on social media and no potential anger or embarrassment as any potential future requests have been dealt with too.

 

The 5 star hotel may have made a rod for it's back for the very reasons you say, and some customers may still be trying at at age 13 or 14 and that would be wrong (not saying 4MyEgo is likely to do that) but a good hotel will find a solution that works for them and the customer.  Shame some hoteliers don't see that.

[robblok]

1 minute ago, treetops said:

I agree with most of what you say regarding rules/guidelines etc and the reasons behind them, but in this specific example the hotel could have done much better.

 

When 4MyEgo made the request a good operator would have responded with something along the lines of "as you're a regular customer, and we know your kids, we'll do it on this one occasion only as a goodwill gesture, but to be fair to all our guests, for any further stays we must follow the regular procedure".

 

4MyEgo feels good, the hotel wins, no real precedent is set, no biteback on social media and no potential anger or embarrassment as any potential future requests have been dealt with too.

 

The 5 star hotel may have made a rod for it's back for the very reasons you say, and some customers may still be trying at at age 13 or 14 and that would be wrong (not saying 4MyEgo is likely to do that) but a good hotel will find a solution that works for them and the customer.  Shame some hoteliers don't see that.

I made no comments about if this is a good or a bad rule. However if you make exceptions and those exceptions see the light of day in like a review. Then others can try to claim it too. Then you have to explain to others why they can't and other can. 

 

That is the problem with making exceptions its all fine as long as it stays hidden. But you really put yourself open for problems. Because they can lie and say but employee... xxx said it could. If you have a policy and enforce it you wont be put in those kind of situations. You either have a policy and follow it or you don't. 

[treetops]

37 minutes ago, robblok said:

However if you make exceptions and those exceptions see the light of day in like a review. Then others can try to claim it too. Then you have to explain to others why they can't and other can.

So maybe you grant it (verbally) with a rider that it is not publicised or will be denied.  If you know the recipient well enough to grant it you know him well enough to know whether he would go along with that.  There is almost always a solution that makes it a win/win, you just have to find it.

Edited December 20, 2021 by treetops

[Led Lolly Yellow Lolly]

 

 

1 hour ago, treetops said:

When 4MyEgo made the request a good operator would have responded with something along the lines of "as you're a regular customer, and we know your kids, we'll do it on this one occasion only as a goodwill gesture, but to be fair to all our guests, for any further stays we must follow the regular procedure

Actually the staff should be commended for sticking to their guns. I appreciate front of house staff that exude confidence and don't let guests bully them into a free lunch.

 

I guess you think the customer is alway right (snigger).

[BritManToo]

6 minutes ago, Led Lolly Yellow Lolly said:

I guess you think the customer is alway right (snigger).

How's your hotel business doing at the moment?

Just wondering.

Edited December 20, 2021 by BritManToo

[Pravda]

9 minutes ago, Led Lolly Yellow Lolly said:

 

 

Actually the staff should be commended for sticking to their guns. I appreciate front of house staff that exude confidence and don't let guests bully them into a free lunch.

 

I guess you think the customer is alway right (snigger).

 

Customer is always right on platforms like amazon. I used to be Amazon seller and it's really hard. You have to refund for orders, no question asked. And amazon will sometimes refund a 3 year order just to "delight" a customer.

 

I am assuming, but of course I don't know for certain is if you list yourself with Expedia, for example and you get too many complaints regardless of if you think they are legitimate or not you may be kicked off the platform?

[Led Lolly Yellow Lolly]

41 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

How's your hotel business doing at the moment?

Just wondering.

If that's a sincere question I'll answer sincerely. We shut down completely for most of this year, but fully reopened a couple of months ago due to increased demand from the government sector (much of our business is servicing government offices locally and regionally, they like our nice meeting facilities). Also, all of the inventory we put onto OTAs is sold already for New Year.

 

One of the reasons we survive is we're debt free and have the support of a much larger parent company. Our family business is a large construction company HQd in Bangkok and this sector has not been affected much by covid (beyond the swathes of construction workers we employ being Covid pools)

 

Our businesses are diverse. I also run an IT consultancy which has seen growth in the last couple of years.

 

35 minutes ago, Pravda said:

 

I am assuming, but of course I don't know for certain is if you list yourself with Expedia, for example and you get too many complaints regardless of if you think they are legitimate or not you may be kicked off the platform?

We are 'Preferred Partners' on Agoda/Booking and you are correct in your assumption that there are strict criteria to participate. The comparison to Amazon doesn't really work. If a customer turns up without a passport and we turn them away, Agoda etc etc will stay on our side. If the customer wants to get all 'legal' (usually Americans) they can go get all 'legal' if they want, it's their time they're losing. Rules are rules, and it only works well when everyone follows the rules. The side that wins is the side that adheres to the booking conditions. It's not hard to understand.

 

Quote

I think you must work in 3 star because you certainly come across as someone who doesn't live in the real world, because no matter how much one try's to explain to you how it works, you still keep the blinkers on.

I see what you're doing, I guess I'll bite. I'll be ambiguous so you don't try to ID us, but we're more than 3 stars. I'm very hands on, I enjoy meeting some of the guests, and this is reflected in our online profile. On Booking.com, our guest score has been >=9.0 forever and I don't think it ever dropped below 8.5 on Agoda. What do you think I'm doing so wrong???

We don't work with Expedia/Hotels.com, not worth it for us.

 

 

 

Edited December 20, 2021 by Led Lolly Yellow Lolly

[Fat is a type of crazy]

11 minutes ago, Led Lolly Yellow Lolly said:

If that's a sincere question I'll answer sincerely. We shut down completely for most of this year, but fully reopened a couple of months ago due to increased demand from the government sector (much of our business is servicing government offices locally and regionally, they like our nice meeting facilities). Also, all of the inventory we put onto OTAs is sold already for New Year.

 

One of the reasons we survive is we're debt free and have the support of a much larger parent company. Our family business is a large construction company HQd in Bangkok and this sector has not been affected much by covid (beyond the swathes of construction workers we employ being Covid pools)

 

We are 'Preferred Partners' on Agoda/Booking and you are correct in your assumption that there are strict criteria to participate. The comparison to Amazon doesn't really work. If a customer turns up without a passport and we turn them away, Agoda etc etc will stay on our side. If the customer wants to get all 'legal' (usually Americans) they can go get all 'legal' if they want, it's their time they're losing.

 

I see what you're doing, I guess I'll bite. I'll be ambiguous so you don't try to ID us, but we're more than 3 stars. In the 7 years we worked with Booking.com, our guest score has been >=9.0 and I don't think it ever dropped below 8.5 on Agoda. What do you think I'm doing so wrong???

We don't work with Expedia/Hotels.com, not worth it for us.

 

 

 

Just out of interest why is Hotels.com not so good as compared to the others. I assume they charge the hotel more. I have liked them because they price match other websites then have a stay 10 get one free so you get a further 9 per cent off. They have kept my credits going over covid whereas the Agoda ones expired. Hotels.com has  a better call centre than Agoda too but otherwise Agoda is good. Agoda tends to be cheaper before price match. 

I have found sometimes there is a discount for single travel and it normally relates to if it has a decent breakfast but often the price is the same for 1 or 2. For what it's worth, I put my girlfriends name on the booking at the first hotel in a trip, so there's no issues if I get  there at a different time. 

 

[Led Lolly Yellow Lolly]

Trip.com and Hotels/Expedia (same company) never made it worth while for us to invest the time. I think they're bigger in the Americas but I don't know much about that market. I focus on what makes us money. In our case it's Agoda/Booking (same company)

[The Hammer2021]

On 12/19/2021 at 3:15 PM, Mac Mickmanus said:

Even worse when she's still wearing the same clothes as the night before .

   Wet hair , basic make-up , high heels and a short skirt and chevage showing looking worse for wear and trying to pretend she isn't a prostitute and the male partner trying to avoid eye contact with anyone 

Snobbery combined with virtue signalling and judgement based on appearances. Just look away if it's such a problem

[The Hammer2021]

This discredited  ripp off is only practiced by a tiny minority of hotels. Single travelers already pay for two people so they don't need to pay 'guest' or 'joiner' fees. If hotels have a 'morality tax' that is quite another matter. If they adjudged all women visitors to be prostitutes and wish to profit from this perceived prostitution then this is quite another issue. But don't be foolish into thinking such sharp practices are about ethics, morality or fairness. Additionally charging single people in double rooms for their guests who have already paid double is just exploitation. I have never experienced it but have read I about on Thai based forums.

[Led Lolly Yellow Lolly]

5 hours ago, DaLa said:

As long as it is made clear then I don't see a problem. Compared to the 'Resort Fees' in the States I would say the pricing of rooms here is relatively transparent.

I agree with this. When bookings are made, the booking conditions are listed on both customer and hotel copies. If you book directly in the hotel, you should be honest about all the people in your party and their ages. This is just common sense. To suggest, as has been the case in this topic, that I am somehow not living in the real world is laughable. If you think you'll be able to dodge hotel policy forever, it is you that is divorced from reality. You wouldn't argue with an airline, why would you argue with a hotel? Cheap? Miscalibrated Principleometer? I'll go with miscalibrated Principleometer™

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 20, 2021 by Led Lolly Yellow Lolly

[Led Lolly Yellow Lolly]

36 minutes ago, The Hammer2021 said:

But don't be foolish into thinking such sharp practices are about ethics, morality or fairness.

It's business. You book a room, you pay for a room, not half a room. DUH. You invite unregistered gusts, you waive any single occupancy rights and you must pay. The hotel doesn't care if it's your wife or a whore.

 

 

 

Edited December 20, 2021 by Led Lolly Yellow Lolly

[treetops]

1 hour ago, Led Lolly Yellow Lolly said:

Actually the staff should be commended for sticking to their guns. I appreciate front of house staff that exude confidence and don't let guests bully them into a free lunch.

I don't think the staff would make that decision - it needs someone senior who would be expected to understand that win/win is better than lose/lose - and there was no suggestion of bullying (or dishonesty) in the case in question.  The potential drawbacks such as those described by robblok can be addressed but it needs someone with the right  attitude and know-how so as not to cause future issues.  Possible solutions were given in posts subsequent to the one you quoted, but you conveniently haven't responded to these.

 

 

1 hour ago, Led Lolly Yellow Lolly said:

I guess you think the customer is alway right (snigger).

Why the assumption?

 

I have already agreed that adherence to rules should pretty much be the default, but when an opportunity arises that could be good for both parties, such as that being discussed, then strict adherence to the rules ends up with only losers.

 

And why the snigger?

[Led Lolly Yellow Lolly]

I find it funny that the phrase exists. The only customer that got me angry was a family from Hong Kong. I liked them, I enjoyed discussing my own life in Hong Kong with them. They were given a nice upgrade and I paid for their meal too. Later someone came to tell me they'd stolen boxes of tissues from the restaurant. I checked the security records and sure enough they'd helped themselves to boxes to tissue stock and stuffed them in their bags. You could see them looking around for staff to make sure no one saw them. Our cameras are hidden. It really pjssed me off after we'd been so accommodating. Boxes of tissues that you can buy from a 7Eleven for a few Baht. It also surprised me, it's the sort of behaviour I'd normally only expect from Mainland Chinese.

 

Some Customers in hotels feel entitled to everything and anything. Towels, amenities taken from the maid's trolley etc etc. In my experience, might is right, rules are right, laws are right. It's worked very well for me. You're entitled to what you pay for. You're entitled to what's on the booking conditions. . . then you're right. Sometimes you're lucky and you get a free upgrade. We hand those out liberally, guaranteed good review and generally costs us nothing. Think of it like approaching an airline desk. You're more likely to get an upgrade if you have the right attitude and dress the right way. It's the same in a hotel.

 

 

 

Edited December 20, 2021 by Led Lolly Yellow Lolly

[gearbox]

On 12/19/2021 at 1:21 AM, bbko said:

Those low-life mo-fos, how dare they charge extra when someone uses their towels, soap, and sleep in their beds?  Should be free right? 

I usually book a room for 2 even when I stay alone, but don't remember any hotel offering me 2 breakfasts because I have a 2 people booking.

[BritManToo]

3 minutes ago, gearbox said:

I usually book a room for 2 even when I stay alone, but don't remember any hotel offering me 2 breakfasts because I have a 2 people booking.

Tell them your invisible 'ghost' friend would like breakfast as well, else they'll stay and haunt the hotel.

[The Hammer2021]

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/advice/Single-supplements-how-to-avoid-them/

[The Hammer2021]

5 hours ago, Led Lolly Yellow Lolly said:

I find it funny that the phrase exists. The only customer that got me angry was a family from Hong Kong. I liked them, I enjoyed discussing my own life in Hong Kong with them. They were given a nice upgrade and I paid for their meal too. Later someone came to tell me they'd stolen boxes of tissues from the restaurant. I checked the security records and sure enough they'd helped themselves to boxes to tissue stock and stuffed them in their bags. You could see them looking around for staff to make sure no one saw them. Our cameras are hidden. It really pjssed me off after we'd been so accommodating. Boxes of tissues that you can buy from a 7Eleven for a few Baht. It also surprised me, it's the sort of behaviour I'd normally only expect from Mainland Chinese.

 

Some Customers in hotels feel entitled to everything and anything. Towels, amenities taken from the maid's trolley etc etc. In my experience, might is right, rules are right, laws are right. It's worked very well for me. You're entitled to what you pay for. You're entitled to what's on the booking conditions. . . then you're right. Sometimes you're lucky and you get a free upgrade. We hand those out liberally, guaranteed good review and generally costs us nothing. Think of it like approaching an airline desk. You're more likely to get an upgrade if you have the right attitude and dress the right way. It's the same in a hotel.

 

 

 

Calm down please. Try and inform yourself.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/advice/Single-supplements-how-to-avoid-them/

[Led Lolly Yellow Lolly]

13 minutes ago, The Hammer2021 said:

Try and inform yourself

LOL, seriously?

[The Hammer2021]

Just now, Led Lolly Yellow Lolly said:

LOL, seriously?

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/advice/Single-supplements-how-to-avoid-them/

[Led Lolly Yellow Lolly]

Anything from Thailand? The European market is very, very different.

 

All these "How to avoid" click bait type articles are all very well. Do they work in practise? No.

Next you'll be telling me how to get an upgrade to first class. The hotel, the airlines, they just laugh at you.

 

It's funny. I wouldn't go into a hospital, or an accountants, and tell them how to do their job. As I said at the beginning of this topic, threads like this provide me with a never ending stream of funny. You think you can walk into a hotel and tell the staff or the management how to do their their job. Hilarious.

"Inform myself" ROFL.

 

 

 

Edited December 20, 2021 by Led Lolly Yellow Lolly

[The Hammer2021]

7 minutes ago, Led Lolly Yellow Lolly said:

Anything from Thailand?

 

All these "How to avoid" click bait type articles are all very well. Do they work in practise? No.

Next you'll be telling me how to get an upgrade to first class. The hotel, the airlines, they just laugh at you.

 

 

 

Your explore your fantasy but it's not mine. Now calm down! I reiterate. Fair treatment for single people with regards to room charges. SAY NO TO JOINER FEES AND GUEST CHARGES on top of unfair 'singleton' taxes..

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/advice/Single-supplements-how-to-avoid-them/

[Led Lolly Yellow Lolly]

Put on a sandwich board. Stand outside a hotel. Protest, PROTEST! ????

[BritManToo]

On 12/20/2021 at 10:34 AM, 4MyEgo said:

Theme parks with height restrictions is for safety reasons, we get that, paying adult rates for seats on aircrafts we also get that,

Airline seats should be priced on the combined weight of the passengers and their luggage.

In a logical world.