jdinasia Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 "I think many are confused as to why some want a particular color, creed or race to do certain things. In the 40's and 50's everyone in the USA wanted a black nanny."Care to back that up? There you go again, fallacy after fallacy seems to be your preferred composition style! LOL ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 (edited) So corrupt baht bus drivers favor farang passengers over Thais because they can get more money from farangs, as a generalization. Well, this is simple economic self interest. Why make this noble with rationalizations about how Thais are punishing us for insulting their culture? It is not noble, nor is it the worse thing in the world. Simple, garden variety greed. Who among us can say we haven't indulged in it ourselves? Brown skinned corrupt baht bus drivers are most certainly not idealized natives defending their pure culture against the pale devils. Even in Bangkok, where most taxi drivers do indeed turn on their meters, I presume some will favor farang passengers because of a greater chance of being tipped. Edited June 22, 2007 by Jingthing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LinkPopularity Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 let's get real, we're all racists ! Yes, even you, you and you ! or do you want to say that you're not proud of your race ... I am ! is it wrong to be proud ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chicagogato Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 let's get real, we're all racists ! Yes, even you, you and you !or do you want to say that you're not proud of your race ... I am ! is it wrong to be proud ? No it's not. But we are not all racist. Is it not possible to be proud but not racist? I really don't understand why you would make a statement like this. Please explain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwertz Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Paul, if you're black, so what? Good news, it's not a hot racist issue any more. Get over it. I don't know what company you keep over there, I don't have any trouble with Thais pulling the race card. Many of my friends are also complaint free in this matter. I see more discrimination among farangs when I'm there: examples: Teacher bashing by farangs Expat bashing tourist Tourist bashing expat Farang bashing Thai Farang men bashing farang women I can't claim to have understood much of this snobbery but Thais are pretty low on my list of culprits Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulUSA302 Posted June 22, 2007 Author Share Posted June 22, 2007 What are you talking about? The original purpose of this post was to share with you and others the complaints I hears from some of the Thai people I come in contact with. If the complaints were isolated then I would not think anything of it, but it seems to be a growing resentment... If the board wants to turn it into a racial thing... Fine... Go for it.... Although I talked to some in this topic on a racial level, it was not my desire to make it a racial post.. I simply wanted to add my 2 cent.... So enjoy... I am going to back out of this thread. Anything worth learning is lost on this crowd. Maybe because no group wants to know that their treatment of others is seen differently through the eyes of those who are growing tired of their treatment. Paul, if you're black, so what?Good news, it's not a hot racist issue any more. Get over it. I don't know what company you keep over there, I don't have any trouble with Thais pulling the race card. Many of my friends are also complaint free in this matter. I see more discrimination among farangs when I'm there: examples: Teacher bashing by farangs Expat bashing tourist Tourist bashing expat Farang bashing Thai Farang men bashing farang women I can't claim to have understood much of this snobbery but Thais are pretty low on my list of culprits Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdinasia Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Paul ... the whole thread is a racial thing ... duh! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulUSA302 Posted June 22, 2007 Author Share Posted June 22, 2007 Tempted to reply but I pass..... Paul ... the whole thread is a racial thing ... duh! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdinasia Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 One day when I was in Pattaya. I was walking with my camera to take pictures of anything I found interesting. I saw an older Thai lady waiting to catch a Baht-Bus. Can you imagine how much damage this does to the Thai / Visitor relationship? Already they are paid less in many cases, and then to hear stories of service workers ignoring and or being rude to them because of the chance if getting a few baht more?And with American music and movies spreading the word to fight the power..... I only see bigger problems coming. Race ..... Farang/Thai One complaint was about the "Farang" using the baht in ways that degraded the people and the culture. They also made it clear to me that "Farang" are charged more because of this.... They used basic language, I am trying to pick my words to stay inside the board guidelines. Race ..... It is about Thai/Farang because Jsut as Rosa Parks was not a story about the Bus's in Montgomery... Race .. AND Rosa Parks ..... 2 doctors, one Thai and One British. Who gets paid the most in Bangkok? Race .... and these are just your posts from the first page! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uptou Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 when you say "growing resentment",are you talking about a few people down at the local food place or a wider group of people? i think the subject,& people are too complicated to be firmly labeled one way or the other. to be honest in the time ive been in thailand ive hardly ever heard thais talk negatively about anything around me. i watched a movie called crash today (yes old movie,havent really got my finger on the pulse),but the racist characters in the movie were very real for me as they were struggling with their identity,& not out & out bad people,but largely predjudice due to bad experiences,paranoia & fear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwertz Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 You see, Paul, this resentment you post about only grows in importance in proportion to the amount of press it's given. It might surprise you to learn how little interest most people have for the issue of race nowadays. As for colour in Thailand, most people there only get excited if it's the colour of your money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulUSA302 Posted June 22, 2007 Author Share Posted June 22, 2007 It is a big issue the world over.... Not so much as race but non-citizens versus citizens... Some turn it into a racial thing when others want to debate the foreigner/citizen thing. Even here.... This has become a race topic when it was a topic about Thai citizens voicing anger over foreigners (Non citizens). (I wrote more but took it out.... No need for all that drivel.....) when you say "growing resentment",are you talking about a few people down at the local food place or a wider group of people?i think the subject,& people are too complicated to be firmly labeled one way or the other. to be honest in the time ive been in thailand ive hardly ever heard thais talk negatively about anything around me. i watched a movie called crash today (yes old movie,havent really got my finger on the pulse),but the racist characters in the movie were very real for me as they were struggling with their identity,& not out & out bad people,but largely predjudice due to bad experiences,paranoia & fear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lannarebirth Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 It is a big issue the world over.... Not so much as race but non-citizens versus citizens... Some turn it into a racial thing when others want to debate the foreigner/citizen thing.Even here.... This has become a race topic when it was a topic about Thai citizens voicing anger over foreigners (Non citizens). (I wrote more but took it out.... No need for all that drivel.....) when you say "growing resentment",are you talking about a few people down at the local food place or a wider group of people?i think the subject,& people are too complicated to be firmly labeled one way or the other. to be honest in the time ive been in thailand ive hardly ever heard thais talk negatively about anything around me. i watched a movie called crash today (yes old movie,havent really got my finger on the pulse),but the racist characters in the movie were very real for me as they were struggling with their identity,& not out & out bad people,but largely predjudice due to bad experiences,paranoia & fear. Paul, there are more Thais residing in Los Angeles County alone, than there are Americans in all of Thailand. It doesn't bother me, it probably doesn't worry you, and I don't hear anyone else complaining about it either. That's the world we live in today. As long as travellers or immigrants comply with the laws of the nation they're in, where is the harm? It sounds to me like your friends hold many prejudices based on ignorance, limited contact with a broad spectrum of tourists/expats or harbor great bitterness. I'm sure you know how harmful such ignorance can be. Did you take the opportunity to help your friends see a broader view? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calibanjr. Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 This whole thread reminds me of the Seinfeld show, a series vehemently about nothing! "Not that there's anything wrong with that!" Anybody? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gburns57au Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Replace the word Thai with African American and the word farang with White American Now I understand it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulUSA302 Posted June 22, 2007 Author Share Posted June 22, 2007 No... It was not a debate setting in most cases. How it would start would be that someone would bring up something a Farang said or did and then another person would chime in and then another person would complain about something a farang did or said and then someone would comment and on and on... So did I argue the positives of the Farang? No... I was there learning about Thailand... When they ask for my input I gave it. But most times I preferred to see how they saw things when their hair was down.... It is a big issue the world over.... Not so much as race but non-citizens versus citizens... Some turn it into a racial thing when others want to debate the foreigner/citizen thing.Even here.... This has become a race topic when it was a topic about Thai citizens voicing anger over foreigners (Non citizens). (I wrote more but took it out.... No need for all that drivel.....) when you say "growing resentment",are you talking about a few people down at the local food place or a wider group of people?i think the subject,& people are too complicated to be firmly labeled one way or the other. to be honest in the time ive been in thailand ive hardly ever heard thais talk negatively about anything around me. i watched a movie called crash today (yes old movie,havent really got my finger on the pulse),but the racist characters in the movie were very real for me as they were struggling with their identity,& not out & out bad people,but largely predjudice due to bad experiences,paranoia & fear. Paul, there are more Thais residing in Los Angeles County alone, than there are Americans in all of Thailand. It doesn't bother me, it probably doesn't worry you, and I don't hear anyone else complaining about it either. That's the world we live in today. As long as travellers or immigrants comply with the laws of the nation they're in, where is the harm? It sounds to me like your friends hold many prejudices based on ignorance, limited contact with a broad spectrum of tourists/expats or harbor great bitterness. I'm sure you know how harmful such ignorance can be. Did you take the opportunity to help your friends see a broader view? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdinasia Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 (edited) Again ... could be what you think it was ... and could be people preaching to the choir Having no idea except from your other posts about Pattaya, Phuket Chiang Mai, Bangkok etc .... I have no idea where you are coming from or what type of people you met that spoke English so fluently and would trash 'farang' in front of you ... or why they would do it edit: PS .. if you would put your responses to posts you are replying to UNDER the quoted material it would be easier for people to understand Edited June 22, 2007 by jdinasia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulUSA302 Posted June 22, 2007 Author Share Posted June 22, 2007 It is easy. Most of my Thai freinds are made over the internet... When I am in Thailand I hang out with them and I make new ones when I go out. When I go to the dance clubs I meet other Thai who tend to speak very good english, why? Many different reasons why. And they made their feelings clear.. There was no need for me to try to ponder what they were saying. They told me... And I am not trying to get banned... I post what was said a few times and it was removed. I am not going to repost it when it is obvious that it will be removed again. Again ... could be what you think it was ... and could be people preaching to the choir Having no idea except from your other posts about Pattaya, Phuket Chiang Mai, Bangkok etc .... I have no idea where you are coming from or what type of people you met that spoke English so fluently and would trash 'farang' in front of you ... or why they would do it edit: PS .. if you would put your responses to posts you are replying to UNDER the quoted material it would be easier for people to understand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 (edited) I suppose its a related topic, but don't you think non-white foreigners in Thailand are treated differently by Thais than white ones? I think it is so, and I also think you can't really divorce this topic from racial issues. Even in my greed example, driver sees white person, he sometimes sees baht signs. I once traveled around Thailand with an ambiguous looking American, half Asian, half American white Hillbilly, with a scruffy beard, and we both agreed he wasn't a farang in Thai eyes. Edited June 22, 2007 by Jingthing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulUSA302 Posted June 22, 2007 Author Share Posted June 22, 2007 I know it to be just as you said. When I came to Thailand with a friend of mine who resembled a typical Farang Business man... much like the ones you see on TV.... If you can imagine a Older, heavier balding JR Ewing... That is my friend. The Thai treated him differently than they treated me. They were more relaxed with me... With him they were not so relaxed... Even with our other friend who is a quiet guy, same race as me... They were more comfortable and more willing to share their thoughts and feelings... Not only about Thailand and Farangs but about other Thai also. I suppose its a related topic, but don't you think non-white foreigners in Thailand are treated differently by Thais than white ones? I think it is so, and I also think you can't really divorce this topic from racial issues. Even in my greed example, driver sees white person, he sometimes sees baht signs. I once traveled around Thailand with an ambiguous looking American, half Asian, half American white Hillbilly, with a scruffy beard, and we both agreed he wasn't a farang in Thai eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdinasia Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Again ... could be what you think it was ... and could be people preaching to the choir Having no idea except from your other posts about Pattaya, Phuket Chiang Mai, Bangkok etc .... I have no idea where you are coming from or what type of people you met that spoke English so fluently and would trash 'farang' in front of you ... or why they would do it edit: PS .. if you would put your responses to posts you are replying to UNDER the quoted material it would be easier for people to understand It is easy. Most of my Thai freinds are made over the internet...When I am in Thailand I hang out with them and I make new ones when I go out. When I go to the dance clubs I meet other Thai who tend to speak very good english, why? Many different reasons why. And they made their feelings clear.. There was no need for me to try to ponder what they were saying. They told me... And I am not trying to get banned... I post what was said a few times and it was removed. I am not going to repost it when it is obvious that it will be removed again. are we to suppose that you never discussed race issues etc with your 'internet' friends? (I don't know that is why I am asking ... So ... what we now DO know is that you say you are meeting people you have met from the internet, and that they are fluent enough in English to discuss involved topics with you. Congrats .. you have met some of the 5-10% that really CAN! Cool beans! We also know that these Thai folks you met are comfortable going out to public places with you and that the addition people you meet are comfortable meeting/ being seen with someone of another race there as well! This further limits the pool of people. Adding it all up the only conclusion I can come to (and it may be VERY wrong) is that you are meeting people that have issues with reality in Thailand (not a bad thing .. I have some issues with it too ... but I am pretty clear on what is real and what is not!). OR you or they are responding with a social context you or they want you to hear! Again .. spend some time in Thailand .. learn the language .. drop the preconcieved notions and THEN tell us PS: If I got this right ... the quoted material is now chronological ..... posting UNDER what you reply to makes it easier for readers to follow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulUSA302 Posted June 22, 2007 Author Share Posted June 22, 2007 I spend 4 weeks in Thailand every year. And by your statement that only a few would want to be seen with me in public only says that you have some preconceived notions that are not reality. Maybe you should spend time in Thailand and get to know the people Again ... could be what you think it was ... and could be people preaching to the choir Having no idea except from your other posts about Pattaya, Phuket Chiang Mai, Bangkok etc .... I have no idea where you are coming from or what type of people you met that spoke English so fluently and would trash 'farang' in front of you ... or why they would do it edit: PS .. if you would put your responses to posts you are replying to UNDER the quoted material it would be easier for people to understand It is easy. Most of my Thai freinds are made over the internet...When I am in Thailand I hang out with them and I make new ones when I go out. When I go to the dance clubs I meet other Thai who tend to speak very good english, why? Many different reasons why. And they made their feelings clear.. There was no need for me to try to ponder what they were saying. They told me... And I am not trying to get banned... I post what was said a few times and it was removed. I am not going to repost it when it is obvious that it will be removed again. are we to suppose that you never discussed race issues etc with your 'internet' friends? (I don't know that is why I am asking ... So ... what we now DO know is that you say you are meeting people you have met from the internet, and that they are fluent enough in English to discuss involved topics with you. Congrats .. you have met some of the 5-10% that really CAN! Cool beans! We also know that these Thai folks you met are comfortable going out to public places with you and that the addition people you meet are comfortable meeting/ being seen with someone of another race there as well! This further limits the pool of people. Adding it all up the only conclusion I can come to (and it may be VERY wrong) is that you are meeting people that have issues with reality in Thailand (not a bad thing .. I have some issues with it too ... but I am pretty clear on what is real and what is not!). OR you or they are responding with a social context you or they want you to hear! Again .. spend some time in Thailand .. learn the language .. drop the preconcieved notions and THEN tell us PS: If I got this right ... the quoted material is now chronological ..... posting UNDER what you reply to makes it easier for readers to follow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lannarebirth Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 So, it's thread about nothing.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulUSA302 Posted June 22, 2007 Author Share Posted June 22, 2007 Just about... So, it's thread about nothing.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdinasia Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 So, it's thread about nothing.... 100% about nothing ..... but right now I am busy doing the "4 weeks" math ...... ok ... got it if Paul has been coming for 91 years he's about even with me (that is if he speaks Thai and is literate ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulUSA302 Posted June 22, 2007 Author Share Posted June 22, 2007 I am still waiting for you to explain why you said only a few Thai would want to be seen with me in public??? So, it's thread about nothing.... 100% about nothing ..... but right now I am busy doing the "4 weeks" math ...... ok ... got it if Paul has been coming for 91 years he's about even with me (that is if he speaks Thai and is literate ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwertz Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 The OP is maybe a nice guy. But why do I get the feeling feeling he's: 1. Trying to invite discrimination against him. 2. Inviting discriminating comments from others, or 3. Stirring up the usual suspects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulUSA302 Posted June 22, 2007 Author Share Posted June 22, 2007 A poster made a comment comment that only a few Thai's would want to be seen with me in public. I asked him why he said that. Now his has vanished? He was full of opinion on my opinions and facts but when I ask him one question he vanishes.... Was he about to say something racist? Insulting and discriminatory? The OP is maybe a nice guy.But why do I get the feeling feeling he's: 1. Trying to invite discrimination against him. 2. Inviting discriminating comments from others, or 3. Stirring up the usual suspects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwertz Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Maybe he switched it to a more relevant thread, Paul. How's the weather in Delaware? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulUSA302 Posted June 22, 2007 Author Share Posted June 22, 2007 No, he was haunting this thread.... Here in Delaware.. The weather is PERFECT! Not too hot, Not too cold Maybe he switched it to a more relevant thread, Paul.How's the weather in Delaware? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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