Ugly Bangkok

[chanchao]

Recently I bussed into Bangkok from Bang Na on to Sukhumvit, and EVERY TIME the abysmal Third World appearance strikes me. This allegedly is multi-billion baht property-area, but you see one sad dirty dilapidated slab of black crumbling concrete after another. Sure on street level are bright glass & chromium facades, shops that you'd think ARE making enough money to buy a bucket of TOA paint occasionally?

What are they thinking?

Why doesn't the city care? Like: " If you want to have a shophouse: PAINT IT and keep it tidy or else we remove it for you! "

I'm relatively fortunate to not actually live in Bangkok, but it does seem strange to me that Bangkok is actually WORSE than other places in Thailand even though for sure more money gets made in Bangkok. Why are 10 million people (or actually, the x00,000 who own very valuable street front property) content to live in such an armpit?

GO BUY PAINT! It's not even expensive.

Rant over.

[colino]

and while out buying the paint throw your rubbish in a bin please tidy bkk up

[geoffphuket]

So which story is true?

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...=130137&hl=

[chanchao]

So which story is true?

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...=130137&hl=

Mine, obviously. Some really interesting statistics & surveys get into TAT sponsored magazines, yet I think everyone who has eyes can see what Bangkok looks like.

Alternatively, they could remove the windows on tour buses and replace them with LCD TV panels. Then TAT's lala-land can actually be shown before group tours are dropped off at the Grand Palace.

And of course I'm not saying Bangkok is without merits, just that cleanliness & building upkeep aren't part of them. Could this come from a traditional mindset of centuries of largely wooden residential construction, where temples and religious structures receive ALL the attention in architecture, design, construction craftmanship and maintenance, and residential and other structures are by definition of a temporary nature, which get erected from posts & beams and merely 'remain' until they fall apart to then be replaced with a new structure, and so on? If that's the case then this philosophy DOESN'T WORK when building in concrete. It doesn't fall apart reliably enough so if you don't do maintenance then you end up living in a city that looks like Mogadishu.

Edited July 11, 2007 by chanchao

[Carmine6]

Recently I bussed into Bangkok from Bang Na on to Sukhumvit, and EVERY TIME the abysmal Third World appearance strikes me. This allegedly is multi-billion baht property-area, but you see one sad dirty dilapidated slab of black crumbling concrete after another. Sure on street level are bright glass & chromium facades, shops that you'd think ARE making enough money to buy a bucket of TOA paint occasionally?

What are they thinking?

Why doesn't the city care? Like: " If you want to have a shophouse: PAINT IT and keep it tidy or else we remove it for you! "

I'm relatively fortunate to not actually live in Bangkok, but it does seem strange to me that Bangkok is actually WORSE than other places in Thailand even though for sure more money gets made in Bangkok. Why are 10 million people (or actually, the x00,000 who own very valuable street front property) content to live in such an armpit?

GO BUY PAINT! It's not even expensive.

Rant over.

Busing in and taking a taxi in are 2 different experiences in my opinion. In a taxi on the expressway you see the shiny tops of the buildings. On the ground level you see the same as walking the street. Buses put your view into the overhangs, roofs, security bars, etc. I'm not sure paint would help all that much given how much dirt and trash sticks at that level.

Oddly, this is what I was thought of London when I went there 10 years ago. Interiors looked fantastic and then you walked outside and wanted them to brush off the dirt.

[JetsetBkk]

GO BUY PAINT! It's not even expensive.

My local doctor's clinic: dirty finger prints and hand marks around every door handle and on the walls. They haven't been cleaned off in months. "Not my job" is what the staff clearly think. Maybe I'll take a bucket of soapy water and sponge next time.

No I won't. Not my job.

[chanchao]

My local doctor's clinic: dirty finger prints and hand marks around every door handle and on the walls. They haven't been cleaned off in months. "Not my job" is what the staff clearly think. Maybe I'll take a bucket of soapy water and sponge next time.

Clinics, schlinics! Don't get me started on the noodle shops with thick black cobwebs that have become de-facto decorative features. Also the places that do absolutely stellar business, where the owner drives a Benz and their kids go to school in England.

"...And open a #$(&(* Cotto brochure and note they currently bake a lot more than just the cheapest white bathroom tiles that been on your walls since 1964, and that perhaps your dirty black concrete floor is ALSO a very -if not more- appropriate place for some fancy tiling!"

Edited July 11, 2007 by chanchao

[eek]

My local doctor's clinic: dirty finger prints and hand marks around every door handle and on the walls. They haven't been cleaned off in months. "Not my job" is what the staff clearly think. Maybe I'll take a bucket of soapy water and sponge next time.

No I won't. Not my job.

Is this your clinic too? Id think twice before attending a clinic that has no decent level of cleanliness.

[Luckydog]

Recently I bussed into Bangkok from Bang Na on to Sukhumvit, and EVERY TIME the abysmal Third World appearance strikes me. This allegedly is multi-billion baht property-area, but you see one sad dirty dilapidated slab of black crumbling concrete after another. Sure on street level are bright glass & chromium facades, shops that you'd think ARE making enough money to buy a bucket of TOA paint occasionally?

What are they thinking?

Why doesn't the city care? Like: " If you want to have a shophouse: PAINT IT and keep it tidy or else we remove it for you! "

I'm relatively fortunate to not actually live in Bangkok, but it does seem strange to me that Bangkok is actually WORSE than other places in Thailand even though for sure more money gets made in Bangkok. Why are 10 million people (or actually, the x00,000 who own very valuable street front property) content to live in such an armpit?

GO BUY PAINT! It's not even expensive.

Rant over.

Here Bluddy Here ! I recently visited my GFs many brothers and sisters in the Chonterbury area and not one had put a drop of paint on there quite nice houses?

Just plain lazy if you ask me Sport.......

[qwertz]

It's civic pride or the lack of it IMO.

Our home is our castle; for many Thais the home is a place to crash.

But I must say fair, I've visited a good few Thais who, though obviously poor, keep a clean house.

[Heng]

Why are 10 million people (or actually, the x00,000 who own very valuable street front property) content to live in such an armpit?

GO BUY PAINT! It's not even expensive.

!insight alert!

We keep the houses we live in painted every 3 years or so, costs around 200,000 Baht a time to do the 3 main homes we live in on our propety. And yes, paint is "expensive."

If we chose to paint everything (which we actually do choose to paint some units regularly) else we owned every 3 years, it'd cost roughly a little less/little more than a million Baht every 3 years. Okay, so it's not a lot of money per se, but it more often than not does not warrant increases in rent that we charge our tenants. Those who operate shops will often take care of the paint work themselves. Paint only buys you 3-4 years at a time in this climate... and seeing that we're going to own these properties forever anyway, there's no need to "add value" for resale.

[Mid]

and seeing that we're going to own these properties forever anyway, there's no need to "add value" for resale.

falang alert

it's called civic pride , it's a good thing .

[JetsetBkk]

My local doctor's clinic: dirty finger prints and hand marks around every door handle and on the walls. They haven't been cleaned off in months. "Not my job" is what the staff clearly think. Maybe I'll take a bucket of soapy water and sponge next time.

No I won't. Not my job.

Is this your clinic too? Id think twice before attending a clinic that has no decent level of cleanliness.

It's not my usual doctor's clinic, but my g/f wanted to try it as it is local, always busy and looks clean from the outside. The doctor does speak very good English too and I chatted to him for quite a while about his businesses - he has many clinics - and how much his laser skin treatment machine cost - about 3 mil. baht.

We'll go once more and if the filthy walls and doors are still filthy I may ask him why he doesn't get his staff or the cleaner to clean them. I'll ask him after my g/f has finished with him.

And I'll get ready for a minor "Thai explosion" before I ask.

[AlexLah]

The paint is not expensive, I am sure you not purchase a million Bath worth of paint.

For that you can buy the whole stock of latex paint of a Homepro.

Just calculate the amount of meters you have to paint and divide by what the average 25 liter can cover.

I guess the cost of labor is much higher then the cost of paint.

Cheers,

Alex

[Livinginexile]

Recently I bussed into Bangkok from Bang Na on to Sukhumvit, and EVERY TIME the abysmal Third World appearance strikes me. This allegedly is multi-billion baht property-area, but you see one sad dirty dilapidated slab of black crumbling concrete after another. Sure on street level are bright glass & chromium facades, shops that you'd think ARE making enough money to buy a bucket of TOA paint occasionally?

What are they thinking?

Why doesn't the city care? Like: " If you want to have a shophouse: PAINT IT and keep it tidy or else we remove it for you! "

I'm relatively fortunate to not actually live in Bangkok, but it does seem strange to me that Bangkok is actually WORSE than other places in Thailand even though for sure more money gets made in Bangkok. Why are 10 million people (or actually, the x00,000 who own very valuable street front property) content to live in such an armpit?

GO BUY PAINT! It's not even expensive.

Rant over.

That's an easy answer.

Paint costs money

[canuckamuck]

My first comment upon arrival to Thailand was, “why don’t they paint anything?” My hosts had no idea what I was talking about because they had been here so long it looked normal to them. They may think paint is expensive but it is about 4 times more expensive in Canada and most people seem to be able to keep there property tidy and well kept up. Lack of paint generally signals abandonment or total lack of personal and civic pride. Most people keep up their places so they don’t look like they are down on their luck.

I guess in Thailand it is not about the property, it’s about the car. I know my neighbor’s 6 month old car must be nearly scrubbed down to the base coat by the continual soapy rubdowns it gets week after week. But then people here will spend more on a car than they will on a house. Different priorities I guess.

Heng, unless you guys are living in sprawling mansions, you are getting seriously ripped off on the paint bill. 250 – 500 liters ought to do a big house, bought in bulk that should be between 10 -20,000 baht, times by three max 60,000. Labour: Five men, five days for each house, 1000 baht per man/day, only 75,000 baht.

[Heng]

The paint is not expensive, I am sure you not purchase a million Bath worth of paint.

For that you can buy the whole stock of latex paint of a Homepro.

Just calculate the amount of meters you have to paint and divide by what the average 25 liter can cover.

I guess the cost of labor is much higher then the cost of paint.

Cheers,

Alex

The cost of paint is more than the cost of labor, Alex. We use our own painters @ 250 Baht a day. A million Baht paints about 40 houses, labor and paint. I know because we've been building a neighborhood in Pattaya for about 2 years now.

For our Bangkok shophouses, it costs about 15-40,000 to paint a unit, depending on the size and difficulty (some locations take much longer... some places you can't set up scaffolding, have to hang guys over the side, things like that....). And that's even considering that we often get our paint at near cost because one of our tenants runs a paint retail/wholesale shop (xxxxxxxx on Sukapibal 3 Rd... check'em out... good prices that are just below Home Pro's and great variety/service). Sometimes our tenants take care of painting, sometimes we do. Sometimes we consider it unneccessary. Sometimes we consider that the tradeoff for some faded paint on our properties is that we can use that capital to buy land out in the middle of nowhere that in 10-20 years will have some buildings, factories, or warehouses that some folks will be scratching their heads wondering why they aren't being painted regularly.

edit: took the advertising out.

Edited July 11, 2007 by Heng

[Heng]

Heng, unless you guys are living in sprawling mansions, you are getting seriously ripped off on the paint bill. 250 – 500 liters ought to do a big house, bought in bulk that should be between 10 -20,000 baht, times by three max 60,000. Labour: Five men, five days for each house, 1000 baht per man/day, only 75,000 baht.

Not sprawling, Canuck. Just three modest regular sized homes. The detached garages, warehouse, iron work, and wall around 13 rai takes up a lot of the bill though. The labor is way less than your estimate. 250 Baht a day per man. Takes about 2 weeks (part of the land is swamp so that slows them down a bit, also some non-house structures are fragile Thai style houses so that takes some extra care and time) with 15 guys.

But anyway, my point was why some folks choose not to paint everything they own every few years.

[sukanyacondo]

My first comment upon arrival to Thailand was, "why don't they paint anything?" My hosts had no idea what I was talking about because they had been here so long it looked normal to them. They may think paint is expensive but it is about 4 times more expensive in Canada and most people seem to be able to keep there property tidy and well kept up. Lack of paint generally signals abandonment or total lack of personal and civic pride. Most people keep up their places so they don't look like they are down on their luck.

I guess in Thailand it is not about the property, it's about the car. I know my neighbor's 6 month old car must be nearly scrubbed down to the base coat by the continual soapy rubdowns it gets week after week. But then people here will spend more on a car than they will on a house. Different priorities I guess.

Heng, unless you guys are living in sprawling mansions, you are getting seriously ripped off on the paint bill. 250 – 500 liters ought to do a big house, bought in bulk that should be between 10 -20,000 baht, times by three max 60,000. Labour: Five men, five days for each house, 1000 baht per man/day, only 75,000 baht.

I think they're too dim to realise if they took care of their houses and environment people would want to live in their neighbourhood and prices would increase for once. But hang on this is Thailand!!!!!!

[tuky]

Why are 10 million people (or actually, the x00,000 who own very valuable street front property) content to live in such an armpit?

GO BUY PAINT! It's not even expensive.

!insight alert!

We keep the houses we live in painted every 3 years or so, costs around 200,000 Baht a time to do the 3 main homes we live in on our propety. And yes, paint is "expensive."

If we chose to paint everything (which we actually do choose to paint some units regularly) else we owned every 3 years, it'd cost roughly a little less/little more than a million Baht every 3 years. Okay, so it's not a lot of money per se, but it more often than not does not warrant increases in rent that we charge our tenants. Those who operate shops will often take care of the paint work themselves. Paint only buys you 3-4 years at a time in this climate... and seeing that we're going to own these properties forever anyway, there's no need to "add value" for resale.

Wow, we paid 20,000 to paint our 320 sqm house. That included paint and that pattern stuff they do internally with a layer on top of the base coat.

I guess I was just lucky that I didn't book van goh to do it otherwise it might have come out at 200k like yourself.

[jcgodber]

As you speak my wife is outside power washing my house and soon will have new paint. We haven't painted for 3 0r 4 years now and are now due

[canuckamuck]

Tell me when your wife is done. I need her to change the oil and rotate the tires on my truck

[lopburi3]

My first comment upon arrival to Thailand was, "why don't they paint anything?" My hosts had no idea what I was talking about because they had been here so long it looked normal to them. They may think paint is expensive but it is about 4 times more expensive in Canada and most people seem to be able to keep there property tidy and well kept up. Lack of paint generally signals abandonment or total lack of personal and civic pride. Most people keep up their places so they don't look like they are down on their luck.

I guess in Thailand it is not about the property, it's about the car. I know my neighbor's 6 month old car must be nearly scrubbed down to the base coat by the continual soapy rubdowns it gets week after week. But then people here will spend more on a car than they will on a house. Different priorities I guess.

Heng, unless you guys are living in sprawling mansions, you are getting seriously ripped off on the paint bill. 250 – 500 liters ought to do a big house, bought in bulk that should be between 10 -20,000 baht, times by three max 60,000. Labour: Five men, five days for each house, 1000 baht per man/day, only 75,000 baht.

I think they're too dim to realise if they took care of their houses and environment people would want to live in their neighbourhood and prices would increase for once. But hang on this is Thailand!!!!!!

There is no real value added if you do not sell - and most Thai will never sell.

[Heng]

Exactly. Although I'd say 'most Thai who own the bulk of Thai real estate' rarely sell. I wouldn't say never because there's always that deal that some people can't resist (like selling 1 rai on Ekkamai to buy 100 high potential rai in Ladkrabang or some parts of Chonburi, etc.).

Average Thais of course do buy and sell regularly, although probably in less frequency than a lot of other places in the world.

[Mid]

There is no real value added if you do not sell - and most Thai will never sell.

surprised at the blindness on display .

civic pride , less crime , improved lifestyle , higher rents ..............................................

mirror anyone ?

[rafval]

less crime

and I thought the Thais were superstitious

[Mid]

looks that way taken out of context ,

let me help , one leads to the next ....................................

[tijnebijn]

Why they don't like paint ? They do not feel to spend 20-30 thousand baht on that . they keep the money and when they feel the house is getting old , they break the old one , and erase a new one . With ofcourse the one in a life time new paint for the house . I think that in the centre of Bangkok and also Chiangmai the local government should paint all the houses in the main centre . To make it look more fashionable , clean or whatever more attractive to walk in . Also traffic in the main centres should be banned and allow only public transport . All that smog and fumes coming in everyday will not make the paint any useful anyway .

[Dr. Burrito]

Every time I start feeling this way, and I do, I remember my all too regular trips to Mumbai, New Dehli and Karachi. Then I look around and it seems like heaven. :-)

Dr. B

[tijnebijn]

Every time I start feeling this way, and I do, I remember my all too regular trips to Mumbai, New Dehli and Karachi. Then I look around and it seems like heaven. :-)

Dr. B

Thats right