GOP memo argues direct payments to President Biden not needed to show corruption

[ozimoron]

On Friday morning, MSNBC host Joe Scarborough led his panel piling on Republican lawmakers who are obsessed with Hunter Biden for cashing in on his father's name while ignoring Trump's children who made fortunes while working in the White House.

The "Morning Joe" host kicked off the discussion by mock-weighing the importance of Hunter Biden's laptop compared to Trump son-in-law Jared Kushner's $2 billion deal with the Saudis by joking, "Let's see, $2 billion, laptop. I don't think it's the same."
 

 

https://www.rawstory.com/jared-kushner-saudis/

[BangkokReady]

15 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

It makes perfect sense.

How so?

 

15 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

Put the attack dogs away.

What attack dogs?  What are you talking about?  How does such a comment apply to what I said in the slightest?

[BangkokReady]

1 hour ago, billd766 said:

If there is no proof, and so far nobody, not you or even the GOP oversight committee appears to have any, how can anybody take it to a prosecutor and say this is the case, we have no proof, but take it to court anyway.

 

No prosecutor could or would take it to court and put it before a jury and tell them that here is the case, we have no evidence but try it anyway.

I have no idea how this relates to anything I have said.  I guess you're just trying to deflect?

[ozimoron]

2 minutes ago, BangkokReady said:

How so?

 

What attack dogs?  What are you talking about?  How does such a comment apply to what I said in the slightest?

I'm sick of people dumping on Tug's limited literacy skills.

[BangkokReady]

1 hour ago, heybruce said:

And through out this investigation there have been many promises and lots of speculation, but still zero evidence implicating President Biden.

Not completely true.  There have been some claims that relate Biden sr to Biden jr when it comes to business dealings.

 

And the investigation isn't concluded yet.

[BangkokReady]

9 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

I'm sick of people dumping on Tug's limited literacy skills.

So explain then... ???? 

 

(You're also not making much sense yourself.)

Edited August 11, 2023 by BangkokReady

[ozimoron]

10 minutes ago, BangkokReady said:

So explain then... ???? 

 

(You're also not making much sense yourself.)

It's not my job to improve either Tug's or your literary skills.

[billd766]

2 hours ago, BangkokReady said:

Not completely true.  There have been some claims that relate Biden sr to Biden jr when it comes to business dealings.

 

And the investigation isn't concluded yet.

Claims, allegations or proof?

 

There have been a few claims, a lot of allegations but no proof that President Biden was involved in Hunter Biden's business.

 

In fact Devon Archer, the oversight committee's star witness, who WAS present at many of the phone calls in person, has repeatedly denied that that President Biden was involved at all.

[placeholder]

As for this:

 “President Biden’s defenders purport a weak defense by asserting the Committee must show payments directly to the President to show corruption,” the memo said. “This is a hollow claim no other American would be afforded if their family members accepted foreign payments or bribes. Indeed, the law recognizes payments to family members to corruptly influence others can constitute a bribe.” 

More B.S. 

The law that is referred to is the Foreign Corrupt Practices Act. Here's a link to a document from the Justice Dept. that exhaustively explains the law.

https://www.justice.gov/criminal-fraud/file/1292051/download

 

And here's a brief explanation of why the Committee's claim about the law is nonsense The "it" in the following quote refers to the linked-to document:

It offers examples of family members receiving payments, gifts and jobs in exchange for having work steered to their benefactors. What Comer’s evidence shows, though, so far extends no further than Hunter Biden giving the impression that he might be able to influence his father. The other half of the FCPA equation cited by Comer is simply missing.

https://archive.ph/Sg4ny

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2023/08/09/comer-biden-analysis/

 

 

[ozimoron]

So, it appears that Manchin may flee the coop, financed by the dark money No Names party. This could be interesting because it may amount to Biden's impeachment. Initially, both sides would like this. The dems because they can't challenge a sitting president and the Republicans because reasons.

 

If that happens, Kamala Harris becomes president and the world gets to hear a whole lot more of her. And nothing will change in America because the dems aren't about personality politics. That said, she would not turn out to be the dem nominee because she would be the vp of an impeached president. The dems would get what they really want and the republicans would get a disaster.

 

Be careful what you wish for.

 

https://apnews.com/article/manchin-democrat-independent-party-ce8dfbaeb2d562a408e4960b72b08a7f

Edited August 11, 2023 by ozimoron

[Hanaguma]

Amidst the finger pointing, one basic question remains unanswered;

 

WHY would assorted scumbags of Eastern Europe pay in excess of $20 million to the Biden family?  Oh, and several millions from China. Money that was shuffled through various shell corporations and accounts to cover up its origins on the way to several Biden family member bank accounts. 

 

Why was this money paid in the first place?

[placeholder]

10 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

Amidst the finger pointing, one basic question remains unanswered;

 

WHY would assorted scumbags of Eastern Europe pay in excess of $20 million to the Biden family?  Oh, and several millions from China. Money that was shuffled through various shell corporations and accounts to cover up its origins on the way to several Biden family member bank accounts. 

 

Why was this money paid in the first place?

Exaggerating much? Show where the Biden family got in excess of 20 million from eastern european oligarchs?

 

As Devon Archer repeatedly said, Hunter Biden was selling the impression that he had influence with his father. Hunter Biden explicitly told Archer this wasn't the case. Republicans repeatedly tried to get Archer to say that Hunter Biden had brought his father over to Ukraine. Archer also said that members of the firm said that it was actually bad news for the company when Shokin got fired. That the CEO of Burisma had Shokin under control. This actually comports with what is known about Shokin's inaction in prosecuting oligarchs.

 

And, apparently, to your way of thinking, if your last name is Biden then you are linked in some kind of criminal conspiracy theory. I got news for you: it's not a crime to have Biden as your last name.

[Hanaguma]

7 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Exaggerating much? Show where the Biden family got in excess of 20 million from eastern european oligarchs?

 

As Devon Archer repeatedly said, Hunter Biden was selling the impression that he had influence with his father. Hunter Biden explicitly told Archer this wasn't the case. Republicans repeatedly tried to get Archer to say that Hunter Biden had brought his father over to Ukraine. Archer also said that members of the firm said that it was actually bad news for the company when Shokin got fired. That the CEO of Burisma had Shokin under control. This actually comports with what is known about Shokin's inaction in prosecuting oligarchs.

 

And, apparently, to your way of thinking, if your last name is Biden then you are linked in some kind of criminal conspiracy theory. I got news for you: it's not a crime to have Biden as your last name.

https://nypost.com/2023/05/10/nine-biden-family-members-who-allegedly-got-foreign-money-identified-by-house-gop/

 

They got the money. Why?

[placeholder]

Just now, Hanaguma said:

https://nypost.com/2023/05/10/nine-biden-family-members-who-allegedly-got-foreign-money-identified-by-house-gop/

 

They got the money. Why?

Your claim was 20 million. That's false.

 

As for why, what don't you understand about Devon Archer's testimony that Hunter Biden acknowledged that he was selling the impression that he had pull with his father, but that he didn't actually have it.

[ozimoron]

4 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

https://nypost.com/2023/05/10/nine-biden-family-members-who-allegedly-got-foreign-money-identified-by-house-gop/

 

They got the money. Why?

When the NY Post says "alleged" you know it's BS.

 

Hunter Biden and first brother James Biden were well-known for years for seeking millions from nations including China, Mexico, Romania, Russia and Ukraine — but the involvement of other family members was only more recently alleged by Comer.

[Hanaguma]

2 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Your claim was 20 million. That's false.

 

As for why, what don't you understand about Devon Archer's testimony that Hunter Biden acknowledged that he was selling the impression that he had pull with his father, but that he didn't actually have it.

Twenty million dollars.

 

https://nypost.com/2023/08/09/hunter-biden-linked-foreign-haul-at-20m-with-russia-ukraine-kazak-transfers-comer/

[placeholder]

Just now, Hanaguma said:

Twenty million dollars.

 

https://nypost.com/2023/08/09/hunter-biden-linked-foreign-haul-at-20m-with-russia-ukraine-kazak-transfers-comer/

 "President Biden’s family and their allies brought in at least $20 million from foreign sources, including first son Hunter Biden’s business associates in Russia, Kazakhstan and Ukraine — some of whom dined with the current commander-in-chief, the House Oversight Committee revealed Wednesday."

 

What does "and their allies" mean to you? Nothing?

[candide]

40 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

Amidst the finger pointing, one basic question remains unanswered;

 

WHY would assorted scumbags of Eastern Europe pay in excess of $20 million to the Biden family?  Oh, and several millions from China. Money that was shuffled through various shell corporations and accounts to cover up its origins on the way to several Biden family member bank accounts. 

 

Why was this money paid in the first place?

As already replied by placeholder, the 20 million figure includes money paid to his associates.

If you want to know how they made money, you can read the beginning of Archer's testimony, which provides some information about their business, including for Burisma, I.e. in Kazakhstan.

[placeholder]

18 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

Twenty million dollars.

 

https://nypost.com/2023/08/09/hunter-biden-linked-foreign-haul-at-20m-with-russia-ukraine-kazak-transfers-comer/

Looks to me that you, like lots of other right-wingers, got suckered by the gutter right wing media. Here's a link to the Comer Committee's memoranda. From what I can construe, it doesn't look as though the Biden family got anywhere close to the 20 million or so that they want you to believe they did. If the real numbers are so damning then why did they choose to mislead?

 

And once again, the question of why Hunter Biden got paid so much (although a pittance to oligarchs) was, as Devon Archer testified, because he sold the impression that he had pull with his father. Hunter Biden explicitly told Devon Archer that this was not the case. The VP's action were not due to the influence of his son.son.

[Hanaguma]

...so the theory is that Hunter, the mastermind, was able to dupe various oligarchs and others into just THINKING that he had influence over his father. Similarly, Hunter, the mastermind, was able to pull the wool over his father's eyes about the whole situation.

 

For his part, Joe Biden was a helpless and incurious party, who was fooled by his son the mastermind.   Hunter said, "hey dad, can I catch a ride to China with ya?" and Joe said yes without bothering to ask why. Hunter said, "hey dad, can ya say hi to some of my buddies?" and Joe said yes without bothering to ask why. 

 

It IS possible, I grant you. But it doesn't say much about Joe Biden. You really want a guy in the White House who is so clueless? Who is so easily manipulated by his crackhead son?  

 

Even Glenn Kessler of the Washington Post, no fan of the GOP, gives the President a rating of "four pinnochios" for his lies and evasions.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2023/08/01/biden-said-his-son-earned-no-money-china-his-son-says-otherwise/

[heybruce]

2 hours ago, Hanaguma said:

Amidst the finger pointing, one basic question remains unanswered;

 

WHY would assorted scumbags of Eastern Europe pay in excess of $20 million to the Biden family?  Oh, and several millions from China. Money that was shuffled through various shell corporations and accounts to cover up its origins on the way to several Biden family member bank accounts. 

 

Why was this money paid in the first place?

That question has been answered over and over.  It has been answered so often it has become incredibly tedious.  And yet the Maga crowd keep asking it.

 

The people making the payments were conned.  Not by President Biden, but by Hunter Biden and associates.

 

Got it?  Is the answer too difficult for you to grasp?

[riclag]

8 hours ago, Hanaguma said:

...so the theory is that Hunter, the mastermind, was able to dupe various oligarchs and others into just THINKING that he had influence over his father. Similarly, Hunter, the mastermind, was able to pull the wool over his father's eyes about the whole situation.

 

For his part, Joe Biden was a helpless and incurious party, who was fooled by his son the mastermind.   Hunter said, "hey dad, can I catch a ride to China with ya?" and Joe said yes without bothering to ask why. Hunter said, "hey dad, can ya say hi to some of my buddies?" and Joe said yes without bothering to ask why. 

 

It IS possible, I grant you. But it doesn't say much about Joe Biden. You really want a guy in the White House who is so clueless? Who is so easily manipulated by his crackhead son?  

 

Even Glenn Kessler of the Washington Post, no fan of the GOP, gives the President a rating of "four pinnochios" for his lies and evasions.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2023/08/01/biden-said-his-son-earned-no-money-china-his-son-says-otherwise/

The headline from your source,

“Biden said his son earned no money from China. His son says otherwise”.

“In court testimony last week, the younger Biden acknowledged that he in fact had been paid substantial sums in China — the first official confirmation that this was the case”.your source

 

Lying Joe  biden along with many in his family will be under subpoenas to appear in front of the House Oversight committees .

https://nypost.com/2023/08/10/comer-says-he-plans-to-subpoena-the-bidens-putting-together-a-case/

The ex drug addicted son, hunter by his own admissions will prove that his Dad as Vice President was involved in the scheme to get money from Americas foreign adversaries, its a clear violation of the  Foreign Corrupt Practices Act .

His emails from the laptop to another family member,said he paid his dads bills.  

“I hope you all can do what I did and pay for everything for this entire family for 30 years,” Hunter Biden groused to daughter Naomi in January 2019. “It’s really hard. But don’t worry, unlike pop, I won’t make you give me half your salary.”

https://nypost.com/2022/04/09/hunter-biden-frequently-covered-family-expenses-texts-reveal/

 

Edited August 12, 2023 by riclag

[placeholder]

6 minutes ago, riclag said:

The headline from your source,

“Biden said his son earned no money from China. His son says otherwise”.

“In court testimony last week, the younger Biden acknowledged that he in fact had been paid substantial sums in China — the first official confirmation that this was the case”.

 

Lying Joe  biden along with many in his family will be under subpoenas to appear in front of the House Oversight committees .

https://nypost.com/2023/08/10/comer-says-he-plans-to-subpoena-the-bidens-putting-together-a-case/

The ex drug addicted son, hunter by his own admissions will prove that his Dad as Vice President was involved in the scheme to get money from Americas foreign adversaries, its a clear violation of the  Foreign Corrupt Practices Act .

His emails from the laptop to another family member,said he paid his dads bills.  

“I hope you all can do what I did and pay for everything for this entire family for 30 years,” Hunter Biden groused to daughter Naomi in January 2019. “It’s really hard. But don’t worry, unlike pop, I won’t make you give me half your salary.”

https://nypost.com/2022/04/09/hunter-biden-frequently-covered-family-expenses-texts-reveal/

 

A lie is a falsehood that is known to be false by the person who says it. What Biden says was definitely false, but that doesn't prove it was a lie.

As for Hunter Biden's quote, it's clearly someone engaging in a hyperbolic complaint about their expenditures on behalf of the family.  Given the Hunter Biden was 49 in 2019, going back thirty years would make him 19 yeas old. Are you seriously suggesting that Hunter Biden was corruptly paying his father when he was 19 years old? Got any more nonsense to share with us?

[billd766]

4 hours ago, riclag said:

The headline from your source,

“Biden said his son earned no money from China. His son says otherwise”.

“In court testimony last week, the younger Biden acknowledged that he in fact had been paid substantial sums in China — the first official confirmation that this was the case”.your source

 

Lying Joe  biden along with many in his family will be under subpoenas to appear in front of the House Oversight committees .

https://nypost.com/2023/08/10/comer-says-he-plans-to-subpoena-the-bidens-putting-together-a-case/

The ex drug addicted son, hunter by his own admissions will prove that his Dad as Vice President was involved in the scheme to get money from Americas foreign adversaries, its a clear violation of the  Foreign Corrupt Practices Act .

His emails from the laptop to another family member,said he paid his dads bills.  

“I hope you all can do what I did and pay for everything for this entire family for 30 years,” Hunter Biden groused to daughter Naomi in January 2019. “It’s really hard. But don’t worry, unlike pop, I won’t make you give me half your salary.”

https://nypost.com/2022/04/09/hunter-biden-frequently-covered-family-expenses-texts-reveal/

 

If I were to say that I believe that you are telling lies, would that be the truth, an allegation, an opinion or a lie.

 

Of course I would have no proof of what I said, but that does not seem to matter to the GOP oversight committee.

[placeholder]

12 hours ago, Hanaguma said:

...so the theory is that Hunter, the mastermind, was able to dupe various oligarchs and others into just THINKING that he had influence over his father. Similarly, Hunter, the mastermind, was able to pull the wool over his father's eyes about the whole situation.

 

For his part, Joe Biden was a helpless and incurious party, who was fooled by his son the mastermind.   Hunter said, "hey dad, can I catch a ride to China with ya?" and Joe said yes without bothering to ask why. Hunter said, "hey dad, can ya say hi to some of my buddies?" and Joe said yes without bothering to ask why. 

 

It IS possible, I grant you. But it doesn't say much about Joe Biden. You really want a guy in the White House who is so clueless? Who is so easily manipulated by his crackhead son?  

 

Even Glenn Kessler of the Washington Post, no fan of the GOP, gives the President a rating of "four pinnochios" for his lies and evasions.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2023/08/01/biden-said-his-son-earned-no-money-china-his-son-says-otherwise/

First off, no one denies that Biden knew who his business partners were? The question is does that constitute knowledge of Hunter's business dealings? If I meet socially with someone whom I know is a partner of a friend, do I know anything about that friend's business dealings?

We know that when Hunter Biden approached his father about joining his Chinese enterprise the response was an "emphatic no". Since you have indulged in creating imaginary dialog between the Bidens, allow me to do the same. In this case the "emphatic no" went something  like this" "No, as I've said before, I don't want to know anything about your business."

 

As for the Pinocchio case, Kessler established that Biden told a falsehood. Not all falsehoods are lies.