Israel’s missile defense system is remarkable, but it is not enough: Hamas must be defeated

[Social Media]

 

Israel’s missile defense system is highly sophisticated, demonstrating state-of-the-art rocket science and breathtaking ingenuity. But one can argue that the missile defense system has become so effective that it rendered the Hamas rocket threat a mere nuisance. That may have led to a certain nonchalance. 

The well-known Iron Dome is the world’s best system for intercepting short-range rockets, artillery shells and mortars. 

 

In 2006, Hezbollah fired 4,500 rockets into Israel during a six-week war, killing 55 people and wounding hundreds. Since becoming operational in 2011, Iron Dome has intercepted more than 6,000 rockets with a success rate approaching 95 percent. 

Iron Dome is but one part of a Multi-Layer Missile Defense System that protects Israel. It is the lowest layer in the system, intercepting threats with ranges of up to some 50 miles. We learned about this tiered system firsthand in February 2023 during a congressional tour to Israel led by USIEA. In fact, it was USIEA’s very first congressional tour to Israel back in 2011 that resulted directly in the declassification of the Iron Dome and, consequently, U.S. support for installations across Israel. 

The second layer, David’s Sling, intercepts rockets with a greater range. The third layer is covered by Arrow-2, which intercepts targets at the edge of the atmosphere, and Arrow-3, which intercepts rockets in outer space. 

David’s Sling (DS) first became operational in 2016. However, it didn’t see its first operational intercepts until May of this year, when it intercepted rockets launched from Gaza toward Tel Aviv and Jerusalem. 

Iron Dome’s Tamir interceptor has a range of less than 10 miles, meaning that its batteries must be located very near the population centers it is tasked to protect. On the other hand, the DS interceptor (Stunner) has a significantly greater range. 

In Israel, there is only one DS battery, but owing to the superior range of the system, this battery can provide defense to more than two-thirds of the country.

 

 FULL STORY

 

[SiSePuede419]

Hamas must be defeated

 

Yes, why won't the Palestinians go back to where they come from and just leave the peaceful Zionist colonizers alone. 😁

Edited October 23, 2023 by SiSePuede419

[novacova]

The US is deploying upgraded Patriot systems to Israel and the region to counter the Iranian cruise missiles. I’m sure things will start rolling once the battery systems are ready.

[eisfeld]

Hamas fired a few thousand rockets and dozens actually hit targets. Now think what will happen if Hezbollah fires their 150,000 rockets.

 

There can only be peace once the people of Palestine throw out the Hamas. And the people of Iran need to topple their extremist leaders that even kill their own people for not adhering to the strict dresscode. Those iranian maniacs are the main reason for all the hate and fighting in the middle east through all their proxies like Hamas, Hezbollah, Houthis and whatnot.

[thaibeachlovers]

11 hours ago, eisfeld said:

Hamas fired a few thousand rockets and dozens actually hit targets. Now think what will happen if Hezbollah fires their 150,000 rockets.

 

There can only be peace once the people of Palestine throw out the Hamas. And the people of Iran need to topple their extremist leaders that even kill their own people for not adhering to the strict dresscode. Those iranian maniacs are the main reason for all the hate and fighting in the middle east through all their proxies like Hamas, Hezbollah, Houthis and whatnot.

You dreamer you. The people of Gaza are probably 100% supporters of Hamas by now and the PLO has proven itself to be so incompetent in the West Bank that Hamas may make gains there politically.

 

Hamas can not be defeated as it's an idea, not an army. They can kill every man woman and child in Gaza and it will live on in the hearts of every Palestinian living outside Palestine, and there are millions of them, and right now they probably all want revenge on israelis.

 

[Hanaguma]

11 hours ago, eisfeld said:

Hamas fired a few thousand rockets and dozens actually hit targets. Now think what will happen if Hezbollah fires their 150,000 rockets.

 

There can only be peace once the people of Palestine throw out the Hamas. And the people of Iran need to topple their extremist leaders that even kill their own people for not adhering to the strict dresscode. Those iranian maniacs are the main reason for all the hate and fighting in the middle east through all their proxies like Hamas, Hezbollah, Houthis and whatnot.

The people of Gaza have happily lived under Hamas rule for 15 years. If they wanted to throw Hamas out, they would have done so by now.  And Israel has lived beside these rabid animals for years, accepting that they will be bombed and civilians will die as a result of Hamas terror attacks. But now is different. A line was crossed and Hamas will be destroyed. As for how to deal with the survivors, that is a difficult question. But first to the business of killing Hamas.

[Wobblybob]

6 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

You dreambzer you. The people of Gaza are probably 100% supporters of Hamas by now and the PLO has proven itself to be so incompetent in the West Bank that Hamas may make gains there politically.

 

Hamas can not be defeated as it's an idea, not an army. They can kill every man woman and child in Gaza and it will live on in the hearts of every Palestinian living outside Palestine, and there are millions of them, and right now they probably all want revenge on israelis.

 

A nice touch to that puerile drivel would have been adding 'allahu akbar' at the end, and whether you like it or not Israel has a right to defend itself and its first concern is to its own citizens and not to to its neighbour that constantly fires missiles onto their citizens. Never again must these barbaric terrorists be allowed to inflict their butchery on innocents, they have crossed the Rubicon! 

[Morch]

43 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

You dreamer you. The people of Gaza are probably 100% supporters of Hamas by now and the PLO has proven itself to be so incompetent in the West Bank that Hamas may make gains there politically.

 

Hamas can not be defeated as it's an idea, not an army. They can kill every man woman and child in Gaza and it will live on in the hearts of every Palestinian living outside Palestine, and there are millions of them, and right now they probably all want revenge on israelis.

 

 

You have little insight as to what Gazans thing, or how they feel. Let's start by putting things in perspective - Hamas get's 50% support on a good day. These aren't good days. If people were as supportive as Hamas as you are, they'd stay put in North Gaza. Most did not. Maybe they didn't like this coming from leaders living in luxury far away.

 

Hamas will need to survive this in order to reap any 'benefits'. Obviously, for you, the death toll this political point scoring entails, is nothing.

 

Hamas can be defeated in the sense it will not present a serious threat. I don't think there's any illusions as to what you falsely keep implying. That you co-opt all Palestinian people for the Hamas cause is cute, but not supported by much.

[eisfeld]

10 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

You dreamer you. The people of Gaza are probably 100% supporters of Hamas by now and the PLO has proven itself to be so incompetent in the West Bank that Hamas may make gains there politically.

 

Hamas can not be defeated as it's an idea, not an army. They can kill every man woman and child in Gaza and it will live on in the hearts of every Palestinian living outside Palestine, and there are millions of them, and right now they probably all want revenge on israelis.

 

I would consider myself a hopeless optimist at times 🙂

 

But the fish is rotten from the head. Look at the Nazis. Their ideaology was very similar in the sense that it was driven by hate towards others and triggered by social issues. Once they got hold of a critical mass of society nobody was allowed to dissent. Get rid of their leaders and show the people that this isn't the way and there is a chance that they will get rid of it. But they need a chance. They can't do it themselves under the current conditions. If you are a Palestinian in Gaza and are speaking out against Hamas you'll probably end up with very serious issues. They need to get the opportunity for change and crucially they also need a chance for a decent future. If they have no future then of course they'll resort to extreme actions. Can keep people in a corner only for so long.

[eisfeld]

10 hours ago, Hanaguma said:

The people of Gaza have happily lived under Hamas rule for 15 years. If they wanted to throw Hamas out, they would have done so by now.  And Israel has lived beside these rabid animals for years, accepting that they will be bombed and civilians will die as a result of Hamas terror attacks. But now is different. A line was crossed and Hamas will be destroyed. As for how to deal with the survivors, that is a difficult question. But first to the business of killing Hamas.

I don't think that one can describe their lives as happily but yes. They do have also to take blame for letting Hamas take over Gaza. That's on them. Now it's way too late for that and everyone around there pays the price.  I agree Hamas has to be destroyed if there's to be any hope for peace. It's a purely evil entity. But even removing Hamas will not result in peace by itself. It's juse one out of a handful of similar issues in the region.

[rickudon]

Israel has rejected all peace deals which meant returning land to the Palestinians (except for Gaza, which is more of a prison, hard to get out). And Jewish settlers are slowly ethnically cleansing the West bank of Palestinians. For 50 or 70 years, many Palestinians have been refugees - they want their land back. Peace comes at a price. Netanyahu has offered Nothing.

[Morch]

1 hour ago, rickudon said:

Israel has rejected all peace deals which meant returning land to the Palestinians (except for Gaza, which is more of a prison, hard to get out). And Jewish settlers are slowly ethnically cleansing the West bank of Palestinians. For 50 or 70 years, many Palestinians have been refugees - they want their land back. Peace comes at a price. Netanyahu has offered Nothing.

 

That is not correct. There were at least two offers initiated by Israeli Prime Ministers, they were rejected by Palestinian leadership. There were also the Oslo Accords, which de-facto (not talking about how pear shaped it became) gave the Palestinians self rule in a limited territory, and were supposed to be the basis of a permanent peace agreement.

 

But since 1949, and up until the Oslo Accords, the Palestinian position was centered on rejection (check the Khartoum Resolution for a prime example).

 

What you may refer to is the so-called Arab Peace Initiative of 2002. And yes, Israel sadly and stupidly (IMO) rejected this. But in effect so did the Hamas (which chose the exact time to carry out a massive terrorist attack).

 

For sure, Israeli government, especially right wing dominated ones, weren't much into that (due to a mix of ideological and political factors). At the same time, it's not the case that the Palestinians were ready and willing either.

[Jingthing]

On 10/23/2023 at 4:20 PM, SiSePuede419 said:

Hamas must be defeated

 

Yes, why won't the Palestinians go back to where they come from and just leave the peaceful Zionist colonizers alone. 😁

Because the Arab world where most of them come from either doesn't want them at all or if they come they're stuck in refugee camps for generations. 

The faction that have old keys to houses in Israel generally have keys to nothing now.

They should have accepted the UN partition.

Edited October 24, 2023 by Jingthing

[MrMojoRisin]

On 10/23/2023 at 9:05 PM, eisfeld said:

Hamas fired a few thousand rockets and dozens actually hit targets. Now think what will happen if Hezbollah fires their 150,000 rockets.

 

There can only be peace once the people of Palestine throw out the Hamas. And the people of Iran need to topple their extremist leaders that even kill their own people for not adhering to the strict dresscode. Those iranian maniacs are the main reason for all the hate and fighting in the middle east through all their proxies like Hamas, Hezbollah, Houthis and whatnot.

If only the US and British didn’t instigate a coup against the democratically elected leader of Iran in 1953 - perhaps none of the Iranian problems would exist.

 

If only Netanyahu hadn’t spent the last 15 years supporting Hamas in order to stall the peace process - perhaps none of the Gaza problems would exist.

 

What could the common theme possibly be for pretty much all the problems in the Middle East?

[thaibeachlovers]

8 hours ago, eisfeld said:

I would consider myself a hopeless optimist at times 🙂

 

But the fish is rotten from the head. Look at the Nazis. Their ideaology was very similar in the sense that it was driven by hate towards others and triggered by social issues. Once they got hold of a critical mass of society nobody was allowed to dissent. Get rid of their leaders and show the people that this isn't the way and there is a chance that they will get rid of it. But they need a chance. They can't do it themselves under the current conditions. If you are a Palestinian in Gaza and are speaking out against Hamas you'll probably end up with very serious issues. They need to get the opportunity for change and crucially they also need a chance for a decent future. If they have no future then of course they'll resort to extreme actions. Can keep people in a corner only for so long.

If they have no future then of course they'll resort to extreme actions. Can keep people in a corner only for so long.

 

Thank you for pointing out the reasons that Hamas was created in the first place.

The israelis created them by occupying and oppressing the Palestinians, keeping them in a corner and removing any hope for a future.

Somewhat ironic then that the israelis now complain about the inevitable reaction to oppression.

Hamas was created in 1987, according to google, and that was long after the israelis illegally occupied Palestinian land.

[thaibeachlovers]

1 hour ago, MrMojoRisin said:

If only the US and British didn’t instigate a coup against the democratically elected leader of Iran in 1953 - perhaps none of the Iranian problems would exist.

 

If only Netanyahu hadn’t spent the last 15 years supporting Hamas in order to stall the peace process - perhaps none of the Gaza problems would exist.

 

What could the common theme possibly be for pretty much all the problems in the Middle East?

What could the common theme possibly be for pretty much all the problems in the Middle East?

 

Indeed. Now the result of their actions have come back to bite them, they don't like it, they don't like it at all, no siree.

If only those lesser people in the Middle East knew their place in the world order, everything would be peachy, wouldn't it?

( sarcasm alert for the one eyed )

[thaibeachlovers]

5 hours ago, rickudon said:

Israel has rejected all peace deals which meant returning land to the Palestinians (except for Gaza, which is more of a prison, hard to get out). And Jewish settlers are slowly ethnically cleansing the West bank of Palestinians. For 50 or 70 years, many Palestinians have been refugees - they want their land back. Peace comes at a price. Netanyahu has offered Nothing.

Not quite right. Netanyahu has offered suffering and death, and has given a lot of it.

[thaibeachlovers]

9 hours ago, eisfeld said:

I don't think that one can describe their lives as happily but yes. They do have also to take blame for letting Hamas take over Gaza. That's on them. Now it's way too late for that and everyone around there pays the price.  I agree Hamas has to be destroyed if there's to be any hope for peace. It's a purely evil entity. But even removing Hamas will not result in peace by itself. It's juse one out of a handful of similar issues in the region.

Destroy Hamas, even at the cost of hundreds of thousands of dead civilians, and as long as israel continues to oppress the Gazans, another organisation will take it's place. Humans don't like to be oppressed. One can ignore history, but it is inevitable.

[thaibeachlovers]

9 hours ago, eisfeld said:

I would consider myself a hopeless optimist at times 🙂

 

But the fish is rotten from the head. Look at the Nazis. Their ideaology was very similar in the sense that it was driven by hate towards others and triggered by social issues. Once they got hold of a critical mass of society nobody was allowed to dissent. Get rid of their leaders and show the people that this isn't the way and there is a chance that they will get rid of it. But they need a chance. They can't do it themselves under the current conditions. If you are a Palestinian in Gaza and are speaking out against Hamas you'll probably end up with very serious issues. They need to get the opportunity for change and crucially they also need a chance for a decent future. If they have no future then of course they'll resort to extreme actions. Can keep people in a corner only for so long.

Get rid of their leaders and show the people that this isn't the way and there is a chance that they will get rid of it. But they need a chance. They can't do it themselves under the current conditions.

 

and your solution for getting rid of the "leaders" is?

Is it the israeli option of just killing a lot of people and hoping to kill the current leaders, then  repeating the process every 30 years or so?

Or, should they just ask nicely?

 

How about giving them a country of their own and democracy? Oppression hasn't worked, so how about trying something different?

Edited October 24, 2023 by thaibeachlovers

[Morch]

6 hours ago, MrMojoRisin said:

If only the US and British didn’t instigate a coup against the democratically elected leader of Iran in 1953 - perhaps none of the Iranian problems would exist.

 

If only Netanyahu hadn’t spent the last 15 years supporting Hamas in order to stall the peace process - perhaps none of the Gaza problems would exist.

 

What could the common theme possibly be for pretty much all the problems in the Middle East?

 

It would seem that, according to your take (above and elsewhere), the common theme would be an underlying argument that certain nations and people cannot ever be held accountable for anything. Basically, it's a variation of the white-man's-burden.

[Morch]

4 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Destroy Hamas, even at the cost of hundreds of thousands of dead civilians, and as long as israel continues to oppress the Gazans, another organisation will take it's place. Humans don't like to be oppressed. One can ignore history, but it is inevitable.

 

Hamas itself is an oppressive regime. Leave Hamas in place and intact - nothing changes. The population will be oppressed by both Hamas and Israel.

[Morch]

4 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Get rid of their leaders and show the people that this isn't the way and there is a chance that they will get rid of it. But they need a chance. They can't do it themselves under the current conditions.

 

and your solution for getting rid of the "leaders" is?

Is it the israeli option of just killing a lot of people and hoping to kill the current leaders, then  repeating the process every 30 years or so?

Or, should they just ask nicely?

 

How about giving them a country of their own and democracy? Oppression hasn't worked, so how about trying something different?

 

I don't see you having much issue with this being the Hamas's way, or indeed the Palestinians' way for most of their history.

How about the Palestinian do something toward building a trust that would facilitate such a move? Say, not carry out attacks like 7/10? Or mobilizing to condemn Hamas? Plenty of imaginary options there.

 

And what does 'give them democracy' even mean? Last time the Palestinian held elections it ended up with one side (Fatah) not accepting results, the other side (Hamas) throwing Fatah people from rooftops. No agreement of how to settle this or even carry out new elections since. Democracy is not something that can simply be 'given'.

[Danderman123]

On 10/24/2023 at 7:50 AM, Hanaguma said:

The people of Gaza have happily lived under Hamas rule for 15 years. If they wanted to throw Hamas out, they would have done so by now.  And Israel has lived beside these rabid animals for years, accepting that they will be bombed and civilians will die as a result of Hamas terror attacks. But now is different. A line was crossed and Hamas will be destroyed. As for how to deal with the survivors, that is a difficult question. But first to the business of killing Hamas.

I don't think the Gazans had much choice in who governed them.

 

But now, the Rubicon has been crossed - Hamas committed acts so evil that they must be destroyed. And once they are gone, they will be forgotten.

[Celsius]

USA probably has the tech to intercept nuclear strikes. Now would be the time to hit russia, iran, north korea and other pests

[Morch]

37 minutes ago, Celsius said:

USA probably has the tech to intercept nuclear strikes. Now would be the time to hit russia, iran, north korea and other pests

 

Got to love the 'probably'. Can just imagine POTUS pressing the Red Button, then turn to his Chief of Staff - 'we do have a way to interce...oh, we don't?"

[thaibeachlovers]

4 hours ago, Celsius said:

USA probably has the tech to intercept nuclear strikes. Now would be the time to hit russia, iran, north korea and other pests

LOL. Perhaps Reagan's Star Wars worked after all .

[thaibeachlovers]

4 hours ago, Danderman123 said:

I don't think the Gazans had much choice in who governed them.

 

But now, the Rubicon has been crossed - Hamas committed acts so evil that they must be destroyed. And once they are gone, they will be forgotten.

Hamas isn't an army, and is an idea in the minds of those oppressed by the israelis. As long as one oppressed Palestinian lives Hamas ( or it's successor ) will live on.

Is it your wish for all Palestinians to be exterminated? Hmmmm, where have I heard something like that before?

[Danderman123]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Hamas isn't an army, and is an idea in the minds of those oppressed by the israelis. As long as one oppressed Palestinian lives Hamas ( or it's successor ) will live on.

Is it your wish for all Palestinians to be exterminated? Hmmmm, where have I heard something like that before?

Hamas has an army. That army will be destroyed.

 

Hamas has a political structure in Gaza. That structure will be destroyed.

 

Once they are gone, they will be forgotten, like the Baathist party in Iraq.

 

Meanwhile, Israel has allowed the vast majority of civilians in North Gaza to escape to the safety of the south.

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, Danderman123 said:

Hamas has an army. That army will be destroyed.

 

Hamas has a political structure in Gaza. That structure will be destroyed.

 

Once they are gone, they will be forgotten, like the Baathist party in Iraq.

 

Meanwhile, Israel has allowed the vast majority of civilians in North Gaza to escape to the safety of the south.

Hamas fighters have no uniform, they have no structure, they are a collection of men that want to kill israelis armed with rifles and RPGs. They have no artillery, no medical corps, no catering corps, no armoured vehicles, no military police, no helicopters, no heavy weapons. They have no parades, no medals.  Strange sort of army then.

 

Short of extermination of every Palestinian, the resistance will live on under occupation and oppression, whatever it is called.

 

The dead, the dying, those trapped under the rubble will never leave the north and there is no safety in the south. There is no safety anywhere in Gaza.

One wonders where some get their information from.

 

Hatred for israelis grows every day the bombing and the seige continue.  Millions of Palestinians live outside Palestine, safe from israeli bombs. They will never forget. No Muslim will forget. No one that looks on in horror at the israeli massacre will forget.

 

The world is watching. The world is starting to react, and not for israel.

[Morch]

6 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Hamas isn't an army, and is an idea in the minds of those oppressed by the israelis. As long as one oppressed Palestinian lives Hamas ( or it's successor ) will live on.

Is it your wish for all Palestinians to be exterminated? Hmmmm, where have I heard something like that before?

 

Hamas is a multi-faceted organization. It certainly does have a military 'wing', possessing arms and structure like every other military organization. This can certainly be destroyed. Other elements of Hamas (such as the political 'wing') may be harder to dismantle, but not impossible. The other elements, relating more to social issues - not one intends to do anything about.

 

Hamas can be handled the same way other outfits were handled - IS, AQ, Fatah...