UK State pension frozen when residing in Thailand

[Nick Carter icp]

2 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said:

Obviously low level crime.

 

Had you been s murder suspect, they would have found out where you were/are.

 

   His crimes are somewhere in-between , between benefit fraud and murder 

[scottiejohn]

50 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

    You still need to file a tax return, even if you don't have to pay any tax .

Although you can contact them and ask to be exempt from filing a return 

BS!

If you are under the threshold there is no need to file a UK tax return unless they ASK for one!

Edited December 27, 2023 by scottiejohn

[Nick Carter icp]

15 minutes ago, scottiejohn said:

BS!

If you are under the threshold there is no need to file a UK tax return unless they ASK for one!

 

  Its nothing to do with your income, if you are paying tax on your income under the PAYE scheme , then you don't need to file a tax return , for those who are self employed and have complicated tax issue, they need to fill out a self assessment , even if their income is below the threshold

[Mutt Daeng]

13 hours ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

    You still need to file a tax return, even if you don't have to pay any tax .

Although you can contact them and ask to be exempt from filing a return 

That's what I did a few years ago. I contacted HMRC via their app and requested to be taken off the self assessment scheme as my only incomes were the state pension and 2 other pensions which are taxed at source. My request was granted.

[Paris333]

Thailand tax law

The end of the cheap life? Thailand unsettles German emigrants

So far, German retirees in Thailand have not only been able to escape the German winter, but also the tax authorities. But now a change in the law is causing unrest in the tax haven.

Flawless sandy beaches, tropical temperatures, excellent food: retirees who want to emigrate will find many good reasons for moving to Thailand - including financial ones. The Southeast Asian holiday destination has not only attracted foreigners with its comparatively low cost of living, but has also presented itself as a tax haven : those who did it cleverly could escape the cold German winters under the Thai palm trees as well as escape the tax authorities.

But that should be over from January 1st: Then Thailand wants to close a tax loophole that has allowed pensioners and wealthy private individuals residing in Thailand to live a largely tax-free life for decades.

Source:https://www.handelsblatt.com/politik/international/thailand-eine-gesetzesaenderung-sorgt-fuer-unruhe-im-steuerparadies/100003995.html

 

Joe Dassin "Salut", 1979

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6Qc2Y1_bic

 

[Mike Lister]

On 12/27/2023 at 6:15 PM, scottiejohn said:

BS!

If you are under the threshold there is no need to file a UK tax return unless they ASK for one!

Well, sort of!

 

You must send a tax return if, in the last tax year (6 April to 5 April), any of the following applied:

• you were self-employed as a ‘sole trader’ and earned more than £1,000 (before taking off anything you can claim tax relief on)
• you were a partner in a business partnership
• you had a total taxable income of more than £100,000
• you had to pay the High Income Child Benefit Charge

You may also need to send a tax return if you have any untaxed income, such as:

• some COVID-19 grant or support payments
• money from renting out a property
• tips and commission
• income from savings, investments and dividends
• foreign income

https://www.gov.uk/self-assessment-tax-returns/who-must-send-a-tax-return

[Tiber]

On 12/27/2023 at 9:32 AM, beautifulthailand99 said:

Bragging on an open forum about committing pension fraud isn't as clever as you think it is.

 

Defrauding the UK state pension, or engaging in pension fraud, is considered a serious offense. The penalties for such fraudulent activities can include both criminal and civil consequences. As of my last knowledge update in January 2022, here are potential penalties for defrauding the UK state pension:

1. Criminal Charges: Individuals involved in defrauding the state pension may face criminal charges. If convicted, they could be subject to fines and imprisonment. The severity of the penalties may depend on the nature and extent of the fraud.

2. Civil Penalties: The UK government has mechanisms in place to impose civil penalties for pension fraud. The Pensions Regulator has the authority to take action against individuals or organizations that breach pension law. Civil penalties may involve financial sanctions.

3. Repayment of Illegally Obtained Benefits: Individuals found guilty of pension fraud may be required to repay any state pension benefits obtained through fraudulent means. This could include a requirement to return the funds received improperly.

It's important to note that laws and penalties can change, and new developments may have occurred since my last update in January 2022. If you have concerns or suspicions about pension fraud, it is advisable to report them to the relevant authorities. In the UK, this may include reporting the matter to the Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) or other law enforcement agencies.

 

On 12/27/2023 at 9:20 AM, beautifulthailand99 said:

The police may well not have access to the Border Force data on a regular basis but they probably easily could if they had to. A computer somewhere knows who you are and when you entered and exited the country. The DWP has details of your pension and eligibility. It would not be difficult to join up those 2 data sets and indeed would be surprised if they didn't at some point. The reason Thai authorities are going after overseas remittances is probably that they can now that the tech and processor power required to crunch that data is now here.

Well written, but basically a load of rubbish.   A read of DWP regulations would set you straight, especially Benefit Fraud.  There are two words associated with State Pension,those are 1 Not-Sanctionable and 2,Disqualified    No,punshments,no payback,no nothing                                                     There are other statements made as "impossible to defraud your own pension"  Read regulations                                                                                                                                                                         As for going overseas, the SP is payable in full for many countries, they know you are going in and out of UK,but not where,but makes no difference as Non_sanctionable and Disqualifying come into play

[NE1]

Has anybody been able to get through to the Pensions office on the number provided :-Telephone: +44 (0) 191 218 7777

I tried 3 times yesterday and once today , I get as far as welcome to the blah blah , first time I got as far as the press a number then complete silence for  a minute , the other 3 times it is " welcome to the etc " then complete silence for as long as you choose to keep the line open.

[Tiber]

On 12/27/2023 at 9:32 AM, beautifulthailand99 said:

Bragging on an open forum about committing pension fraud isn't as clever as you think it is.

 

Defrauding the UK state pension, or engaging in pension fraud, is considered a serious offense. The penalties for such fraudulent activities can include both criminal and civil consequences. As of my last knowledge update in January 2022, here are potential penalties for defrauding the UK state pension:

1. Criminal Charges: Individuals involved in defrauding the state pension may face criminal charges. If convicted, they could be subject to fines and imprisonment. The severity of the penalties may depend on the nature and extent of the fraud.

2. Civil Penalties: The UK government has mechanisms in place to impose civil penalties for pension fraud. The Pensions Regulator has the authority to take action against individuals or organizations that breach pension law. Civil penalties may involve financial sanctions.

3. Repayment of Illegally Obtained Benefits: Individuals found guilty of pension fraud may be required to repay any state pension benefits obtained through fraudulent means. This could include a requirement to return the funds received improperly.

It's important to note that laws and penalties can change, and new developments may have occurred since my last update in January 2022. If you have concerns or suspicions about pension fraud, it is advisable to report them to the relevant authorities. In the UK, this may include reporting the matter to the Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) or other law enforcement agencies.

Indeed, dutifully followed your explicit and your most remarkable knowledge instructions, a big thank you from all pensioners I m sure

 

 "  If you have concerns or suspicions about pension fraud, it is advisable to report them to the relevant authorities. In the UK, this may include reporting the matter to the Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) or other law enforcement agencies."

 

Yes indeed I visited my local police station, and as you state "A serious offense" no less, so serious I was interviewed apart from the custody suite and furnished them with, not only my knowledge, but also your "knowledge pre and post 2022"
 All grateful and awaiting further instructions     A big  THANK YOU

[Tiber]

On 1/5/2024 at 1:28 PM, Tiber said:

Indeed, dutifully followed your explicit and your most remarkable knowledge instructions, a big thank you from all pensioners I m sure

 

 "  If you have concerns or suspicions about pension fraud, it is advisable to report them to the relevant authorities. In the UK, this may include reporting the matter to the Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) or other law enforcement agencies."

 

Yes indeed I visited my local police station, and as you state "A serious offense" no less, so serious I was interviewed apart from the custody suite and furnished them with, not only my knowledge, but also your "knowledge pre and post 2022"
 All grateful and awaiting further instructions     A big  THANK YOU

 No nothing from you, this cannot be right, internet protocol apart from this web site demands some form of intelligent response. However I can shorten your quest  for The Truth  by directing you to Freedom of Information  request from DWP,its free      "how many pensioners have been sanctioned for receiving  non frozen pension in frozen country"? or words similar, that's half a million plus pensioners      NIL I can tell you                                                                                                                                                                      I can understand the ill feeling created by the frozen bunch directed to the unfrozen lol jealousy ,disbelief , def a sinking feeling losses are horrendous, but that's life  Hope this answers any doubt

[Stevey]

18 hours ago, Tiber said:

 No nothing from you, this cannot be right, internet protocol apart from this web site demands some form of intelligent response. However I can shorten your quest  for The Truth  by directing you to Freedom of Information  request from DWP,its free      "how many pensioners have been sanctioned for receiving  non frozen pension in frozen country"? or words similar, that's half a million plus pensioners      NIL I can tell you                                                                                                                                                                      I can understand the ill feeling created by the frozen bunch directed to the unfrozen lol jealousy ,disbelief , def a sinking feeling losses are horrendous, but that's life  Hope this answers any doubt

I thought you were dead. 

[Tiber]

 

On 1/7/2024 at 11:28 AM, Stevey said:

I thought you were dead. 

" I is risen"  Is it Easter yet?    Once the NHS gets hold of you there is no letting go, Cert if remained in Th I would be

  There are 38 pages on pensions, half of it pure bunkum,a few frozen pensioners are filled with pure hatred of unfrozen crowd,   jealousy,envy,loathing,bitterness,you name it,spiteful comment pours  forth relentlessly

    Nobody has been disciplined,nobody sanctioned,had a frozen pension forced on them ,only making voluntary statements has it happened  .It give jobs there to the boys and girls at international pensions, lobbing out proof of life forms, they all want sacking

 

The amount of pure lying is absurd  "£1000 fines" when £50  maximum is levied on similar cases, "I know someone" brigade, sure right  but for years the frozen pit is awaiting and boy is it cold

 

Read regulations it is all there, not the boundless nonsensical statements that sprout forth

 

   Anyway to the unfrozen bunch enjoy your 8.5 % rise,you deserve it after being barraged for years of bluffing and lying   

    Chin Chin   Happy New Year

lol

[MartinL]

On 12/28/2023 at 7:23 AM, Mutt Daeng said:

That's what I did a few years ago. I contacted HMRC via their app and requested to be taken off the self assessment scheme as my only incomes were the state pension and 2 other pensions which are taxed at source. My request was granted.

 

+1 but by phone.

[hotandsticky]

On 1/7/2024 at 6:28 PM, Stevey said:

I thought you were dead. 

 

Reincarnated................

 

[BritManToo]

12 hours ago, Tiber said:

Anyway to the unfrozen bunch enjoy your 8.5 % rise,you deserve it after being barraged for years of bluffing and lying   

    Chin Chin   Happy New Year

lol

Plus 500 pounds fuel allowance + 10 pounds Xmas bonus.

[Foresttrump]

I know this is an old thread and the legalities of not telling the DWP you have moved to another country is breaking the law! But surely the UK government are equaly guilty for not fulfilling the entitlement of a UK citizens pension.  As I will alway's be a UK citizen and contributed 46 years full NI payments, I am only a guest in Thailand so technically not a resident.

[Tiber]

5 minutes ago, Foresttrump said:

I know this is an old thread and the legalities of not telling the DWP you have moved to another country is breaking the law! But surely the UK government are equaly guilty for not fulfilling the entitlement of a UK citizens pension.  As I will alway's be a UK citizen and contributed 46 years full NI payments, I am only a guest in Thailand so technically not a resident.

  But it is not,for pension purposes

[Stevey]

On 1/9/2024 at 9:55 PM, Tiber said:

 

" I is risen"  Is it Easter yet?    Once the NHS gets hold of you there is no letting go, Cert if remained in Th I would be

 

    Chin Chin   Happy New Year

lol

 

Ah. Well you seem in great spirits Tiber. Where was your residence in Thailand. So you need anything from the house. I’m coming back from the land of lies in a few weeks. It’s the least anyone can do, who has been entertained by your international saga of death awhile back.

[Tiber]

10 hours ago, Stevey said:

 

Ah. Well you seem in great spirits Tiber. Where was your residence in Thailand. So you need anything from the house. I’m coming back from the land of lies in a few weeks. It’s the least anyone can do, who has been entertained by your international saga of death awhile back.

To be told I've 6 months to live at outset was upsetting to say the least, then 12 hour operation could save me,(all my innards removed),then another op to stich me up again, gave up at that point, elected for radiation, knocked me sideways, still does . Months and months of treatment, every day, have 6 hospital visits this month alone, but seem ok,add months or years to life span,so im told

 

   Lived close to Patts,liked it really did

[Stevey]

On 2/6/2024 at 12:06 AM, Tiber said:

To be told I've 6 months to live at outset was upsetting to say the least, then 12 hour operation could save me,(all my innards removed),then another op to stich me up again, gave up at that point, elected for radiation, knocked me sideways, still does . Months and months of treatment, every day, have 6 hospital visits this month alone, but seem ok,add months or years to life span,so im told

 

   Lived close to Patts,liked it really did

So what’s the situation now ? You sound like you’ve given up on going back , you you ‘did ‘ like it as opposed to ‘ do ‘ like it ? 

[Tiber]

3 minutes ago, Stevey said:

So what’s the situation now ? You sound like you’ve given up on going back , you you ‘did ‘ like it as opposed to ‘ do ‘ like it ? 

 Not completely, but do not think Ill be going back permanently. Was ideal, but being stuck in Thailand with illness likened to being in a boat without a paddle. Would be only a matter of time before something else cropped up I'm sure. Was a fantastic place to live tho

  Still undergoing treatment, finishing soon I hope. Those bi-annual trips to Calcutta surely saved my skin for the short time, see how it pans out medium time.

 

 Joining hands with Charlie boy, makes it more comforting

[OJAS]

On 12/27/2023 at 6:33 PM, Nick Carter icp said:

 

  Its nothing to do with your income, if you are paying tax on your income under the PAYE scheme , then you don't need to file a tax return , for those who are self employed and have complicated tax issue, they need to fill out a self assessment , even if their income is below the threshold

 

On 12/28/2023 at 7:23 AM, Mutt Daeng said:

That's what I did a few years ago. I contacted HMRC via their app and requested to be taken off the self assessment scheme as my only incomes were the state pension and 2 other pensions which are taxed at source. My request was granted.

 

I have only opted to pay tax through my tax code on my Civil Service pension. I make direct tax payments on my State Pension to HMRC, and have decided not to include these in my tax code instead (hence removing the need to file tax returns), even though I no longer have any income in addition to these 2 pensions following the sale of my UK property a couple of years ago. What was my main motivation for this decision were various reports on here of HMRC seeking to add insult to injury by taxing frozen pensions through tax codes on the basis of the latest triple-lock increases (non-existent in our case, of course). Nothing can IMHO beat the stress (not to mention considerable expense) of having to phone those buffoons in HMRC back in the UK each year in order to get the triple-lock element reversed, not even filing a tax return!

 

That all said, your mileage may vary, of course!

 

Edited February 8 by OJAS

[Stevey]

On 2/7/2024 at 11:52 PM, Tiber said:

 Not completely, but do not think Ill be going back permanently. Was ideal, but being stuck in Thailand with illness likened to being in a boat without a paddle. Would be only a matter of time before something else cropped up I'm sure. Was a fantastic place to live tho

  Still undergoing treatment, finishing soon I hope. Those bi-annual trips to Calcutta surely saved my skin for the short time, see how it pans out medium time.

 

 Joining hands with Charlie boy, makes it more comforting

 

Sounds like you’re settling nicely in the UK . How long did you live in Thailand. 
 

Joining hands with Charlie ? How do you mean ? 

[Tiber]

7 hours ago, Stevey said:

 

Sounds like you’re settling nicely in the UK . How long did you live in Thailand. 
 

Joining hands with Charlie ? How do you mean ? 

King Charles

 

Close on 15 years,5 in India. Was ideal, everything about it, Spas ,massages, boom boom and all, robbed thru cancer. Had girl friend there, old one, really got on well, like to bring her over, but visa a problem now and need place to live with her. 

 

  Was in army then fire brigade, funny enough they know I'm ill, and offers of help coming thick and fast. I know I have not long to go, accept it now.

 

   Like the food here, blackberries my fav,even now can buy them.

Still send money over for her and to take care of my dogs

[Stevey]

4 hours ago, Tiber said:

King Charles

 

Close on 15 years,5 in India. Was ideal, everything about it, Spas ,massages, boom boom and all, robbed thru cancer. Had girl friend there, old one, really got on well, like to bring her over, but visa a problem now and need place to live with her. 

 

  Was in army then fire brigade, funny enough they know I'm ill, and offers of help coming thick and fast. I know I have not long to go, accept it now.

 

   Like the food here, blackberries my fav,even now can buy them.

Still send money over for her and to take care of my dogs

Well I suppose that’s all our fate if you are not loaded. I’m 49 just and have the step boy 6 and the Isaan harridan to support for my natural. Plus 7 dogs. 
 

It’s a real shame how things have worked out for you, being fixed up at the taxpayers expense and charities trying to help you but you have be away from the dogs. 
 

One thing I forgot about when I was away for 2& 1/2 years was how green England is. Getting out to Worcestershire and the Welsh borders and Staffordshire, pretty much anywhere is breathtaking scenery in the summer. 
 

well hope things turn out well for you. 

[kimamey]

On 1/5/2024 at 3:14 PM, NE1 said:

Has anybody been able to get through to the Pensions office on the number provided :-Telephone: +44 (0) 191 218 7777

I tried 3 times yesterday and once today , I get as far as welcome to the blah blah , first time I got as far as the press a number then complete silence for  a minute , the other 3 times it is " welcome to the etc " then complete silence for as long as you choose to keep the line open.

I've used that number a few times, but not since the end of July last year. I don't think it took too long to get through, but it's a while ago so I may be wrong. 

I hope you've manged to speak to them by now.

[NE1]

19 minutes ago, kimamey said:

I've used that number a few times, but not since the end of July last year. I don't think it took too long to get through, but it's a while ago so I may be wrong. 

I hope you've manged to speak to them by now.

Thank you  , I have.

I explained to them how much of a problem i had getting through .

Apology given etc. got everything sorted just about and also received an e mail apologising for the inconvenience etc.

[kimamey]

On 2/20/2024 at 8:41 AM, NE1 said:

Thank you  , I have.

I explained to them how much of a problem i had getting through .

Apology given etc. got everything sorted just about and also received an e mail apologising for the inconvenience etc.

 

When I first used it they told me to contact the DWP, who then told me to contact the IPC again. I asked where I could find the rules regarding frozen pensions as I couldn't find them on gov.uk and I was told "It will be on there somewhere". Not particularly helpful.

Before phoning them, and because they are obviously busy I tried looking on the website with the results I mention above. I also used their online enquiry form, twice with no reply. I suspect that's their to avoid phone calls in the hope people give up. It certainly isn't a way to get information.

[beautifulthailand99]

On 2/5/2024 at 5:06 PM, Tiber said:

To be told I've 6 months to live at outset was upsetting to say the least, then 12 hour operation could save me,(all my innards removed),then another op to stich me up again, gave up at that point, elected for radiation, knocked me sideways, still does . Months and months of treatment, every day, have 6 hospital visits this month alone, but seem ok,add months or years to life span,so im told

 

   Lived close to Patts,liked it really did

Just read that, sorry to hear it  - I hope you confound the doctors and everything goes fine. My brother-in-law has a heart condition and 5 years ago was told he could go anytime, but he is still with us and thriving. I'm always humbled by the kindness of medical staff I hope that's the same for you.

[Tiber]

3 hours ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

Just read that, sorry to hear it  - I hope you confound the doctors and everything goes fine. My brother-in-law has a heart condition and 5 years ago was told he could go anytime, but he is still with us and thriving. I'm always humbled by the kindness of medical staff I hope that's the same for you.

Thanks for that, still here, feel bit better actually but is certainly something to think about to say the least