Risk Management or lack thereof

[Photoguy21]

A friend of mine recently asked me if I could help as he wants medical insurance but is not great using computers, so I agreed.

I went into this thinking the Insurance was basically Risk Management but was I wrong. I had several insurance companies send me application forms having explained the situation of my friend. Not one company had any interest in knowing if he had health problems, drank, took drugs, smoked etc.

Can anyone explain how you can perform a Risk Management assessment when, and they made this obvious, they are not interested in your current habits or current health status. It appears you could be 5' 6" weigh 300 lbs, smoke 100 cigarettes a day, drink 20 pints and never exercise, yet if you are 30 you still have the same premium.

My opinion is Insurance companies have no interest in your health but base everything on age, and the chances are if you claimed for anything they would find a way of getting out of payment.

Like to hear others opinions on this.

[worgeordie]

They will find ways to weasel out of honouring the claim once you make it,

it's all in the fine print , which almost no one reads....

 

regards worgeorde

[Celsius]

You think too mutt

[scubascuba3]

22 minutes ago, Photoguy21 said:

My opinion is Insurance companies have no interest in your health but base everything on age, and the chances are if you claimed for anything they would find a way of getting out of payment

Bingo, they don't want to know about pre existing, they want to find out about them later and deny the claim and cancel the policy if necessary 

[tomazbodner]

32 minutes ago, Photoguy21 said:

A friend of mine recently asked me if I could help as he wants medical insurance but is not great using computers, so I agreed.

I went into this thinking the Insurance was basically Risk Management but was I wrong. I had several insurance companies send me application forms having explained the situation of my friend. Not one company had any interest in knowing if he had health problems, drank, took drugs, smoked etc.

Can anyone explain how you can perform a Risk Management assessment when, and they made this obvious, they are not interested in your current habits or current health status. It appears you could be 5' 6" weigh 300 lbs, smoke 100 cigarettes a day, drink 20 pints and never exercise, yet if you are 30 you still have the same premium.

My opinion is Insurance companies have no interest in your health but base everything on age, and the chances are if you claimed for anything they would find a way of getting out of payment.

Like to hear others opinions on this.

Strange. Prudential sent me to hospital for a full checkup, and wanted my entire hospital file before deciding on what I had to pay for it or how much they would cover. AIA did the same a long while back, when I was in 20s.

[FritsSikkink]

45 minutes ago, Photoguy21 said:

A friend of mine recently asked me if I could help as he wants medical insurance but is not great using computers, so I agreed.

I went into this thinking the Insurance was basically Risk Management but was I wrong. I had several insurance companies send me application forms having explained the situation of my friend. Not one company had any interest in knowing if he had health problems, drank, took drugs, smoked etc.

Can anyone explain how you can perform a Risk Management assessment when, and they made this obvious, they are not interested in your current habits or current health status. It appears you could be 5' 6" weigh 300 lbs, smoke 100 cigarettes a day, drink 20 pints and never exercise, yet if you are 30 you still have the same premium.

My opinion is Insurance companies have no interest in your health but base everything on age, and the chances are if you claimed for anything they would find a way of getting out of payment.

Like to hear others opinions on this.

They can send you for a health checkup before accepting you later in the process.

[Photoguy21]

On 1/16/2024 at 10:18 AM, Celsius said:

You think too mutt

You think so? You should be paying a fair price based on your situation i.e. if you have a chronic illness or if you have 100% illness free. These prices should not be the same. For me I consider the insurance companies are adopting the stance that they will decide if they want to pay out in the event of a claim and will no doubt say the insured should have made them aware the they have liver problems and a bad heart when they took the policy out, hence will not pay. This bordering on criminal. No initial checks upon which a assessment can be made but having received your money decide later if they want to pay or now. The only risk management is on the part of the insurance customer.

[Photoguy21]

On 1/16/2024 at 10:35 AM, tomazbodner said:

Strange. Prudential sent me to hospital for a full checkup, and wanted my entire hospital file before deciding on what I had to pay for it or how much they would cover. AIA did the same a long while back, when I was in 20s.

It is reasonable that they should know any existing conditions before agreeing to insure you.

[Celsius]

3 minutes ago, Photoguy21 said:

You think so? You should be paying a fair price based on your situation i.e. if you have a chronic illness or if you have 100% illness free. These prices should not be the same. For me I consider the insurance companies are adopting the stance that they will decide if they want to pay out in the event of a claim and will no doubt say the insured should have made them aware the they have liver problems and a bad heart when they took the policy out, hence will not pay. This bordering on criminal. No initial checks upon which a assessment can be made but having received your money decide later if they want to pay or now. The only risk management is on the part of the insurance customer.

 

Like I said. I think you know the answer and think too much.

[Photoguy21]

Just now, Celsius said:

 

Like I said. I think you know the answer and think too much.

Impossible to know too much but it is a problem to know too little.

[scubascuba3]

On 1/16/2024 at 10:47 AM, FritsSikkink said:

They can send you for a health checkup before accepting you later in the process.

but most don't, which Thai ones do that?

[FritsSikkink]

44 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

but most don't, which Thai ones do that?

As mentioned by tomasbodner before:

"Prudential sent me to hospital for a full checkup, and wanted my entire hospital file before deciding on what I had to pay for it or how much they would cover. AIA did the same a long while back"

[scubascuba3]

47 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

As mentioned by tomasbodner before:

"Prudential sent me to hospital for a full checkup, and wanted my entire hospital file before deciding on what I had to pay for it or how much they would cover. AIA did the same a long while back"

Prudential isn't Thai

[FritsSikkink]

46 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

Prudential isn't Thai

Most insurance companies are multinationals.

[Photoguy21]

22 hours ago, FritsSikkink said:

Most insurance companies are multinationals.

Yes they are but that only suggests more awareness of a customers conditions before they agree to insuring them.

[FritsSikkink]

1 minute ago, Photoguy21 said:

Yes they are but that only suggests more awareness of a customers conditions before they agree to insuring them.

Sending in an application form doesn't make you insured yet. More processes could be following.

[Photoguy21]

3 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

Sending in an application form doesn't make you insured yet. More processes could be following.

I did ask a couple of the companies and both said the same thing "We don't take such things into account any more" and they want us to consider them as professional?

[BigStar]

54 minutes ago, Photoguy21 said:

I did ask a couple of the companies and both said the same thing "We don't take such things into account any more" and they want us to consider them as professional?

 

Take into account for what, exactly? To submit an initial application? To issue a policy--whoa. If they don't ask you about pre-existing conditions, you should tell them anyway up front. They may have a list of things they won't cover that are somehow related to the pre-existing condition, not the condition itself. Know what you're paying for, best you can. 

[FritsSikkink]

1 hour ago, Photoguy21 said:

I did ask a couple of the companies and both said the same thing "We don't take such things into account any more" and they want us to consider them as professional?

What did you ask, if there where follow up procedures like a health check?

[Sheryl]

It sounds like you only looked into Thai companies, and not very professional ones at that.

 

These will have been "moratorium" based policies rather than  "full medical underwriting". With these -- and especially with these from a Thai company --  there is no telling what conditions will actually be covered as the insurer is, in effect, reserving the right to decide later on if something was related to a pre-exsiting condition.

 

There are plenty of internationally based expatriate policies available (though fewer if he is already aged over 65) that will cover him in Thailand. These will require  a detailed medical history.

[noobexpat]

On 1/16/2024 at 10:00 AM, Photoguy21 said:

A friend of mine recently asked me if I could help as he wants medical insurance but is not great using computers, so I agreed.

I went into this thinking the Insurance was basically Risk Management but was I wrong. I had several insurance companies send me application forms having explained the situation of my friend. Not one company had any interest in knowing if he had health problems, drank, took drugs, smoked etc.

Can anyone explain how you can perform a Risk Management assessment when, and they made this obvious, they are not interested in your current habits or current health status. It appears you could be 5' 6" weigh 300 lbs, smoke 100 cigarettes a day, drink 20 pints and never exercise, yet if you are 30 you still have the same premium.

My opinion is Insurance companies have no interest in your health but base everything on age, and the chances are if you claimed for anything they would find a way of getting out of payment.

Like to hear others opinions on this.

 

The same approach is used when creating a group health insurance scheme for an employer.

 

They have been risk-assessed using averages. You take 100 people ...20 will be obese, 10 will drink too much etc etc