Morch Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 10 minutes ago, WDSmart said: If you're referring to my "in the first place" post, I only said there have been many, many attacks by both sides over the years (and decades and centuries). Oct 7 and the SUBSEQUENT bombing of Gaza are only the last two. These topics aren't about 'what took place decades or centuries ago. You want to make excuses for the 7/10 attack, go right ahead. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morch Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 (edited) 9 minutes ago, WDSmart said: On Oct 7, Hamas were the perpetrators, and Israelis the victims. Ever since, with the indiscriminate bombing of Gaza, the Israeli IDF has been the perpetrators and the Palestinians the victims. It just goes on and on and on. 😔 Hamas could have and can, stop the war at any time. Somehow, you seem to feel that Israel is responsible for that as well. Hamas leaders are on record saying the casualties in Gaza are 'necessary sacrifices' for 'the cause'. Guess that's on Israel as well, eh? Edited February 3 by Morch 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wobblybob Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 5 minutes ago, WDSmart said: On Oct 7, Hamas were the perpetrators, and Israelis the victims. Ever since, with the indiscriminate bombing of Gaza, the Israeli IDF has been the perpetrators and the Palestinians the victims. It just goes on and on and on. 😔 Only in your eyes, you need things repeating time after time and still you don't get it, you are impervious to the obvious. There would be no bombing, there would be very few deaths, can you not link Oct 7th with what's happening now, most people can. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post WDSmart Posted February 3 Popular Post Share Posted February 3 8 minutes ago, Morch said: These topics aren't about 'what took place decades or centuries ago. You want to make excuses for the 7/10 attack, go right ahead. I'm not making excuses for the Oct 7 attack. I'm just telling you this didn't happen in a vacuum. This was the most violent attack by either side in a long time, but it was just a continuation of the constant fighting between the two sides, at least of the militant factions of both sides. 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morch Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 Just now, WDSmart said: I'm not making excuses for the Oct 7 attack. I'm just telling you this didn't happen in a vacuum. This was the most violent attack by either side in a long time, but it was just a continuation of the constant fighting between the two sides, at least of the militant factions of both sides. How is that not an excuse? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WDSmart Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 10 minutes ago, Morch said: Hamas could have and can, stop the war at any time. Somehow, you seem to feel that Israel is responsible for that as well. Hamas leaders are on record saying the casualties in Gaza are 'necessary sacrifices' for 'the cause'. Guess that's on Israel as well, eh? How do you think Hamas could "stop this (phase) of the war at any time"? And I'm sure the IDF says the same about the Israeli soldiers that are lost during this conflict. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozimoron Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 1 minute ago, WDSmart said: I'm not making excuses for the Oct 7 attack. I'm just telling you this didn't happen in a vacuum. This was the most violent attack by either side in a long time, but it was just a continuation of the constant fighting between the two sides, at least of the militant factions of both sides. Any admissions of a history before October 7th is to release the kraken - the matter of a Palestinian state or lack thereof - and the steps taken to prevent a Palestinian state - and the the refugees - and the settlements. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WDSmart Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 10 minutes ago, Wobblybob said: Only in your eyes, you need things repeating time after time and still you don't get it, you are impervious to the obvious. There would be no bombing, there would be very few deaths, can you not link Oct 7th with what's happening now, most people can. Yes, I can directly link Oct 7 to what's happening now. I think the IDF has gone overboard with their response, but I do know there is a direct link to Oct 7. But, again, I say this is just another crisis, a very horrible one, in a series of exchanges that have gone on for a long, long time. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WDSmart Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 5 minutes ago, Morch said: 7 minutes ago, WDSmart said: I'm not making excuses for the Oct 7 attack. I'm just telling you this didn't happen in a vacuum. This was the most violent attack by either side in a long time, but it was just a continuation of the constant fighting between the two sides, at least of the militant factions of both sides. How is that not an excuse? That's not an "excuse" because I am not justifying the Oct 7 attack. I'm just saying AGAIN! that it did not happen in a vacuum. It did not "come out of a clear, blue sky." Or however you want to phrase it. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozimoron Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Wobblybob Posted February 3 Popular Post Share Posted February 3 8 minutes ago, WDSmart said: Yes, I can directly link Oct 7 to what's happening now. I think the IDF has gone overboard with their response, but I do know there is a direct link to Oct 7. But, again, I say this is just another crisis, a very horrible one, in a series of exchanges that have gone on for a long, long time. If the IDF do not finish their operation there will be other Oct 7th, and neither of us want that I'm sure. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bkk Brian Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 4 minutes ago, ozimoron said: We can all go to Dem senators and Rep STATEMENT FROM SENATOR FETTERMAN ON ISRAEL WASHINGTON, DC – Pennsylvania U.S. Senator John Fetterman on Wednesday released the following statement: “Innocent Israelis were the victims of a terrorist attack that resulted in the largest loss of Jewish lives since the Holocaust. Now we know that the tragedy at the Gaza hospital was not caused by Israel. I grieve for every innocent person and brave Israeli soldier killed since Hamas started this war. If not for the horrific attacks by Hamas terrorists, thousands of innocent Israelis and Palestinians would still be alive today. “Now is not the time to talk about a ceasefire. We must support Israel in their efforts to eliminate the Hamas terrorists who slaughtered innocent men, women, and children. Hamas does not want peace, they want to destroy Israel. We can talk about a ceasefire after Hamas is neutralized. https://www.fetterman.senate.gov/press-releases/statement-from-senator-fetterman-on-israel/ 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WDSmart Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 17 minutes ago, Wobblybob said: If the IDF do not finish their operation there will be other Oct 7th, and neither of us want that I'm sure. I agree with the latter part of your statement above, but not the former. IMO, the IDF will NEVER believe they have "finished their operations" there. The only way to prevent another Oct 7, again, IMO, is to negotiate a two-state solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozimoron Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 1 minute ago, WDSmart said: I agree with the latter part of your statement above, but not the former. IMO, the IDF will NEVER believe they have "finished their operations" there. The only way to prevent another Oct 7, again, IMO, is to negotiate a two-state solution. Not one of the usual suspects agrees that Palestinians should have their own country. Not one. Zionists one and all. 1 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Carter icp Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 (edited) 11 minutes ago, WDSmart said: I agree with the latter part of your statement above, but not the former. IMO, the IDF will NEVER believe they have "finished their operations" there. The only way to prevent another Oct 7, again, IMO, is to negotiate a two-state solution. If there was a Palestinian state with them controlling the borders , Iran would fill Gaza up with missiles and Hamas would keep fighting until there was just one state , a Palestinian state and No Israel Edited February 3 by Nick Carter icp 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Carter icp Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 39 minutes ago, WDSmart said: Yes, I can directly link Oct 7 to what's happening now. I think the IDF has gone overboard with their response, but I do know there is a direct link to Oct 7. But, again, I say this is just another crisis, a very horrible one, in a series of exchanges that have gone on for a long, long time. Yes, there have been fighting between the two in the past , but the Oct 7 th terror attack was the action that caused the 2 nd Yom Kippur war . The Oct 7 th Hamas invasion of Israel is the event that began the current war , this was started on October 7 th 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WDSmart Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 2 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said: If there was a Palestinian state with them controlling the borders , Iran would fill Gaza up with missiles and Hama would keep fighting until there was just one state , a Palestinian state and No Israel I don't dismiss that possibility. But, If there is not a Palestinian state, the Hamas-like attacks on Israel will never cease, unless...the IDF keeps fighting until there is just one state, an Israeli state and no Palestine. That's the problem in a nutshell. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wobblybob Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 1 minute ago, WDSmart said: I agree with the latter part of your statement above, but not the former. IMO, the IDF will NEVER believe they have "finished their operations" there. The only way to prevent another Oct 7, again, IMO, is to negotiate a two-state solution. We have been down that road so many times now, Hamas wants Israel and nothing less, stop moving the goal posts at every opportunity. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Carter icp Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 1 minute ago, WDSmart said: I don't dismiss that possibility. But, If there is not a Palestinian state, the Hamas-like attacks on Israel will never cease, unless...the IDF keeps fighting until there is just one state, an Israeli state and no Palestine. That's the problem in a nutshell. The solution is to build a wall around Gaza and for Israel to control the borders and stop any weapons entering into Gaza 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozimoron Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 3 minutes ago, WDSmart said: I don't dismiss that possibility. But, If there is not a Palestinian state, the Hamas-like attacks on Israel will never cease, unless...the IDF keeps fighting until there is just one state, an Israeli state and no Palestine. That's the problem in a nutshell. Maybe that might not happen if their adversary were not armed to the teeth by the US? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WDSmart Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 2 minutes ago, Wobblybob said: We have been down that road so many times now, Hamas wants Israel and nothing less, stop moving the goal posts at every opportunity. Yes, I agree! I have always agreed! What I have been also saying, though, is the militant factions in Israel (I refer to them as "Zionists") want the same thing! They want all of this land and want to push the Palestinians out. What is there about that statement that you either don't understand or don't agree with? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bkk Brian Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 15 minutes ago, ozimoron said: Not one of the usual suspects agrees that Palestinians should have their own country. Not one. Zionists one and all. Who are these usual suspects and which ones don't agree to a 2 state solution? What does being a Zionist have to do with it. Zionists can also want a 2 state solution. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wobblybob Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 Just now, WDSmart said: Yes, I agree! I have always agreed! What I have been also saying, though, is the militant factions in Israel (I refer to them as "Zionists") want the same thing! They want all of this land and want to push the Palestinians out. What is there about that statement that you either don't understand or don't agree with? Hamas wants the destruction of Israel and the Israeli's, let's see who pushes the hardest then, I know who my money is on, you cannot negotiate with these monsters! 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WDSmart Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 4 minutes ago, Wobblybob said: Hamas wants the destruction of Israel and the Israeli's, let's see who pushes the hardest then, I know who my money is on, you cannot negotiate with these monsters! If I were betting on this, yes, I, too, would bet on Israelis over Palestinians. But, since I am a hopeful man, I will hope for a two-state solution that each side will eventually accept, even if only reluctantly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Carter icp Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 1 minute ago, WDSmart said: If I were betting on this, yes, I, too, would bet on Israelis over Palestinians. But, since I am a hopeful man, I will hope for a two-state solution that each side will eventually accept, even if only reluctantly. Do you know which side has accepted a two state solution and which side has vowed to NEVER accept a two state solution ? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Wobblybob Posted February 3 Popular Post Share Posted February 3 Just now, WDSmart said: If I were betting on this, yes, I, too, would bet on Israelis over Palestinians. But, since I am a hopeful man, I will hope for a two-state solution that each side will eventually accept, even if only reluctantly. Hamas has stated it does not want a two state solution, it wants Israel, what can be clearer than that. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Carter icp Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 3 minutes ago, Wobblybob said: Hamas has stated it does not want a two state solution, it wants Israel, what can be clearer than that. They do know that , I think that they are just trying to trick Israel into being lenient and allowing Palestinians to arm themselves so they can attack Israel 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WDSmart Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 8 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said: Do you know which side has accepted a two state solution and which side has vowed to NEVER accept a two state solution ? Yes, I do. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Carter icp Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 Just now, WDSmart said: Yes, I do. How would you force the Palestinians to accept a two state solution ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WDSmart Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 18 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said: How would you force the Palestinians to accept a two state solution ? I'd try to "convince" the Palestinians to accept a two-state solution by offering them a fair and equitable share of the land. Read my Proposed Two-State Solution in the link below: Rung & Bill: Israel/Palestine Proposed Resolution (billsmart.com) 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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