Jailed Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny dead, prison service says

[rattlesnake]

2 hours ago, frank83628 said:

Putin is far greater leader than Biden and of the sellout western ones and even Trump!... Go Putin!
try and arrest him and see what happens... how many countries would actually even follow through with the warrant....lets see the  Hypocrite USA, biggest war crimes violators on the planet get arrested first. 

 

All one needs to do is listen to his speeches to see what a great leader sounds like. No wonder he is supported by the vast majority of Russians.

 

If only we had someone like him in France, instead of the little Rothschild employee who openly despises the French people and precipitates us further down the abyss every single day…

[heybruce]

5 hours ago, frank83628 said:

Putin is far greater leader than Biden and of the sellout western ones and even Trump!... Go Putin!
try and arrest him and see what happens... how many countries would actually even follow through with the warrant....lets see the  Hypocrite USA, biggest war crimes violators on the planet get arrested first. 

 

2 hours ago, rattlesnake said:

 

All one needs to do is listen to his speeches to see what a great leader sounds like. No wonder he is supported by the vast majority of Russians.

 

If only we had someone like him in France, instead of the little Rothschild employee who openly despises the French people and precipitates us further down the abyss every single day…

Wow!

 

I am genuinely at a loss on this one.  I have no idea where they are coming from, but I'm certain it is not a good place.

 

Can one of the other sane posters handle this one?

[rattlesnake]

1 hour ago, heybruce said:

 

Wow!

 

I am genuinely at a loss on this one.  I have no idea where they are coming from, but I'm certain it is not a good place.

 

Can one of the other sane posters handle this one?

 

Please handle it yourself. Have you ever listened to – or read a transcript of – a Putin speech?

[frank83628]

7 hours ago, heybruce said:

 

Wow!

 

I am genuinely at a loss on this one.  I have no idea where they are coming from, but I'm certain it is not a good place.

 

Can one of the other sane posters handle this one?

not understanding people have differing opinions is the problem.  do you need a safe space to process it?



 

[dhupverg]

Meanwhile,back to the topic of Navalny dying from a blood clot, not Putin nor incarceration.

[frank83628]

7 minutes ago, dhupverg said:

Meanwhile,back to the topic of Navalny dying from a blood clot, not Putin nor incarceration.

that will be unacceptable for some

[transam]

7 hours ago, rattlesnake said:

 

Please handle it yourself. Have you ever listened to – or read a transcript of – a Putin speech?

Think avoiding expected BS from there is normal, but you could tell me/us if land grab was mentioned...😂

[transam]

13 minutes ago, dhupverg said:

Meanwhile,back to the topic of Navalny dying from a blood clot, not Putin nor incarceration.

Yeh, riiiiiiight.............🤭

[rattlesnake]

2 hours ago, transam said:

Think avoiding expected BS from there is normal, but you could tell me/us if land grab was mentioned...😂

 

He refers, among other things, to the Donbass and the way the US-backed Ukrainian government has been treating people there since Maidan. Here is a 2014 article which might help you grasp the reality of what is at stake in this region:

 

For months, the US-backed regime in Kiev has been committing atrocities against its own citizens in southeastern Ukraine, regions heavily populated by Russian-speaking Ukrainians and ethnic Russians. While victimizing a growing number of innocent people, including children, and degrading America’s reputation, these military assaults on cities, captured on video, are generating intense pressure in Russia on President Vladimir Putin to “save our compatriots.” Both the atrocities and the pressure on Putin have increased even more since July 1, when Kiev, after a brief cease-fire, intensified its artillery and air attacks on eastern cities defenseless against such weapons.

 

https://www.thenation.com/article/archive/silence-american-hawks-about-kievs-atrocities/

 

 

 

[candide]

1 hour ago, rattlesnake said:

 

He refers, among other things, to the Donbass and the way the US-backed Ukrainian government has been treating people there since Maidan. Here is a 2014 article which might help you grasp the reality of what is at stake in this region:

 

For months, the US-backed regime in Kiev has been committing atrocities against its own citizens in southeastern Ukraine, regions heavily populated by Russian-speaking Ukrainians and ethnic Russians. While victimizing a growing number of innocent people, including children, and degrading America’s reputation, these military assaults on cities, captured on video, are generating intense pressure in Russia on President Vladimir Putin to “save our compatriots.” Both the atrocities and the pressure on Putin have increased even more since July 1, when Kiev, after a brief cease-fire, intensified its artillery and air attacks on eastern cities defenseless against such weapons.

 

https://www.thenation.com/article/archive/silence-american-hawks-about-kievs-atrocities/

 

 

 

Stephen Cohen is considered as being one-sided on this matter. If I remember well, he even acknowledged it.

[heybruce]

1 hour ago, rattlesnake said:

 

He refers, among other things, to the Donbass and the way the US-backed Ukrainian government has been treating people there since Maidan. Here is a 2014 article which might help you grasp the reality of what is at stake in this region:

 

For months, the US-backed regime in Kiev has been committing atrocities against its own citizens in southeastern Ukraine, regions heavily populated by Russian-speaking Ukrainians and ethnic Russians. While victimizing a growing number of innocent people, including children, and degrading America’s reputation, these military assaults on cities, captured on video, are generating intense pressure in Russia on President Vladimir Putin to “save our compatriots.” Both the atrocities and the pressure on Putin have increased even more since July 1, when Kiev, after a brief cease-fire, intensified its artillery and air attacks on eastern cities defenseless against such weapons.

 

https://www.thenation.com/article/archive/silence-american-hawks-about-kievs-atrocities/

 

So....evidence that Ukraine was repressing dissidents in a rebellious region.  How does Russia deal with dissidents?

 

Oh yeah, that's what this topic is about.

[heybruce]

4 hours ago, dhupverg said:

Meanwhile,back to the topic of Navalny dying from a blood clot, not Putin nor incarceration.

Right.  The lingering effects of a near fatal assassination attempt using the Novichok nerve agent, brutal incarcerations, grossly inadequate medical care had nothing to do with it.

 

If you believe that I have a bridge I'd like to sell you.

[heybruce]

11 hours ago, rattlesnake said:

 

Please handle it yourself. Have you ever listened to – or read a transcript of – a Putin speech?

I have not read a single speech by Putin, Stalin, Hitler, Mao, Pol Pot, or other tyrants.  I judge them by their deeds.

[heybruce]

5 hours ago, frank83628 said:

not understanding people have differing opinions is the problem.  do you need a safe space to process it?
 

Idolizing Putin is not opinion, it's psychosis.

[NativeBob]

5 minutes ago, heybruce said:

assassination attempt using the Novichok nerve agent

yeah, in his underwear, right?

Edited March 3 by NativeBob
too long.

[frank83628]

3 minutes ago, heybruce said:

Idolizing Putin is not opinion, it's psychosis.

Demonising Putin is not an opinion, its brainwashing

[frank83628]

3 minutes ago, NativeBob said:

yeah, in his underwear, right?

military grade WMD was carried in small bottle, sure. Oh, I forgot, it is BINARY so must be 2 bottles "mix before use" type, right? No, I think should be three bottles to mix and measure. Whole lab. Wouldn't be easier just to shoot in da head?

take 2 bottles into the prison..not me i just kill n go!! (hope you know the advert)

 

Edited March 3 by frank83628
edit

[heybruce]

7 minutes ago, NativeBob said:

yeah, in his underwear, right?

Correct.  https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-55395683

[NativeBob]

Quote

take 2 bottles into the prison.. not me i just kill n go!! (hope you know the advert)

I didn't get it. 

Novichok is WMD to be used in battlefields, not as Bruce Willis did in "Jackal" movie. Well, whatever 

[heybruce]

7 minutes ago, frank83628 said:

Demonising Putin is not an opinion, its brainwashing

I never called him a demon, but he is clearly a bloody autocrat.

[rattlesnake]

3 hours ago, heybruce said:

So....evidence that Ukraine was repressing dissidents in a rebellious region.  How does Russia deal with dissidents?

 

Oh yeah, that's what this topic is about.

 

Evidence that the Ukrainian government, backed by the Western establishment after the removal of President Yanukovych, has been relentlessly repressing, humiliating and killing the Donbass population, the vast majority of which is culturally Russian and speaks Russian as a first language. From that same article:

 

Considering those preceding events, but above all the country’s profound historical divisions, particularly between its western and eastern regions—ethnic, linguistic, religious, cultural, economic and political—the rebellion in the southeast, centered in the industrial Donbass, was not surprising.

 

[...]

 

But by declaring an “anti-terrorist operation” against the new protesters, Kiev signaled its intention to “destroy” them, not negotiate with them.

 

[...]

 

Zealous, barely trained and drawn mostly from central and western regions, Kiev’s new recruits have escalated the ethnic warfare and killing of innocent civilians. (Episodes described as “massacres” soon also occurred in Mariupol and Kramatorsk.)

[rattlesnake]

4 hours ago, candide said:

Stephen Cohen is considered as being one-sided on this matter. If I remember well, he even acknowledged it.

 

The facts reported in this article were confirmed by multiple other independent sources on the ground, such as Anne-Laure Bonnel.

[frank83628]

3 hours ago, heybruce said:

Correct.  https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-55395683

oh, the bbc, must be true then!

[candide]

5 minutes ago, rattlesnake said:

 

The facts reported in this article were confirmed by multiple other independent sources on the ground, such as Anne-Laure Bonnel.

Quite possible. But the article ignores plenty of other facts that don't support Cohen's stance.

He said something like he knew his articles were one-sided, but articles are too short to show contradicting facts.

He's from the old "peace" mouvement and has always been naive re Soviet Union and Russia.

 

Anyway, too bad he's dead.

 

[transam]

Just now, frank83628 said:

Oh, the BBC, must be true then!

More so than that that comes out of Moscow...........🤠

[frank83628]

14 minutes ago, transam said:

More so than that that comes out of Moscow...........🤠

how would you know, you clearly don't listen to anything other than your main 4 channels in the uk.. 

 

Edited March 3 by frank83628

[transam]

4 minutes ago, frank83628 said:

how would you know, i you clearly don't listen to anything other than your main 4 channels in the uk.. 

 

Sorry, try again.........

[frank83628]

56 minutes ago, transam said:

Sorry, try again.........

sorry, should i include channel 5?

[heybruce]

1 hour ago, rattlesnake said:

 

Evidence that the Ukrainian government, backed by the Western establishment after the removal of President Yanukovych, has been relentlessly repressing, humiliating and killing the Donbass population, the vast majority of which is culturally Russian and speaks Russian as a first language. From that same article:

 

Considering those preceding events, but above all the country’s profound historical divisions, particularly between its western and eastern regions—ethnic, linguistic, religious, cultural, economic and political—the rebellion in the southeast, centered in the industrial Donbass, was not surprising.

 

[...]

 

But by declaring an “anti-terrorist operation” against the new protesters, Kiev signaled its intention to “destroy” them, not negotiate with them.

 

[...]

 

Zealous, barely trained and drawn mostly from central and western regions, Kiev’s new recruits have escalated the ethnic warfare and killing of innocent civilians. (Episodes described as “massacres” soon also occurred in Mariupol and Kramatorsk.)

At the time your source was published the eastern regions of Ukraine, with substantial support and encouragement from Russia, and been at war with the central government of Ukraine for months.

 

"In March 2014, following Ukraine's Revolution of Dignity, anti-revolution and pro-Russian protests began in Ukraine's Donetsk and Luhansk oblasts, collectively 'the Donbas'. These began as Russia invaded and annexed Crimea. Armed Russian-backed separatists seized Ukrainian government buildings and declared the Donetsk and Luhansk republics (DPR and LPR) as independent states, leading to conflict with Ukrainian government forces.^[27] Russia covertly supported the separatists with troops and weaponry. It only admitted sending "military specialists",^[28][29] but later acknowledged the separatists as Russian combat veterans.^"   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_in_Donbas

 

There probably were atrocities committed; after all the Ukraine government at that time was very much a product of Russian dominance.  However the atrocities were trivial compared to how Russia deals with rebellious regions. 

 

"The First Chechen War began in 1994, when Russian forces entered Chechnya on the premise of restoring constitutional order. Following nearly two years of brutal fighting, with a death toll exceeding 100,000 by some estimates, the 1996 Khasavyurt ceasefire agreement was signed and Russian troops were withdrawn from the republic.^[42]"  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Chechen_War

 

Ukraine isn't perfect, but it is much better than Russia.

[heybruce]

1 hour ago, frank83628 said:

oh, the bbc, must be true then!

You can find confirmation in multiple other sources.  Probably not RT though.