Poll - New Tax Rule, What Will YOU Do?

[Mike Teavee]

2 hours ago, rickudon said:

lso get a civil service pension which should be tax exempt in Thailand under the UK dta. Only issue is proving the provenance of where the money comes from

I'm assuming you get an annual P60 (or equivalent) for your Civil Service Pension which should be all the proof you need to show TRD even if it is in comingled funds. 

 

[JimGant]

On 5/3/2024 at 9:42 AM, connda said:

If Thailand suddenly says that they have a right to tax my US income that has already been filed with the IRS (i.e., "taxed" in the US) - then I'll begin a letter writing campaign to my State Senators

Get a grip. Read the technical explanation of the US-Thai tax treaty, if you need tighter explanations. Yes, govt pensions and social security payments are exclusively taxable by the US. But, for payouts of standard (vice Roth) IRAs, Thailand -- per DTA -- has primary taxation rights, and the US secondary taxation rights (due to the savings clause). Big deal. So you pay tax on your IRA distribution to Thailand, then pay tax to the US on same, but taking a tax credit. Result: No net gain in taxation, but Thailand finally gets to collect taxes it's owed via the tax treaty. You, the US taxpayer, are no worse off financially -- it's just your tax money is now fixing roads in Utapao, not East Jesus, Iowa. Oh, based on a later post of yours, there is NO confusion about where you're a tax resident -- 180 days plus in Thailand, you're solely a tax resident of Thailand, per the DTA. You confused the language "treated as if a tax resident" for actually being treated as a legal resident of the US.

 

By the way, you'll know what your Thai tax credit will be -- for future inclusion on your US tax return -- since you need to file your Thai tax return by March, I believe. Plenty of time before your US tax return is due in June to plug in that tax credit. Hey, relax. For Yanks, these new rules have little to no effect on our total tax bill between countries. Only, maybe, having to take time to file a Thai tax return. Ho hum.

[JimGant]

On 5/3/2024 at 10:56 AM, gamb00ler said:

Of course I haven't examined every type of income in the USA, but there is at least one income source that is not taxed in the US but may be assessable income for Thai tax residents.  Income earned in a US Roth account is never taxed by the IRS if taken as a qualified distribution.  It is probably assessable in the eyes of the TRD.  I don't think you can state that such income is "taxed" in the USA and thus shouldn't be taxed in Thailand.

 

The OECD is working on this in their new Model tax treaty publication. Some treaties have already incorporated language to treat tax exempt income the same in both treaty countries. Others have adopted protocols (treaty amendments) to accomplish the same. Here is a blurb from the technical explanation of the US-UK DTA:

 

Quote

However, the State of residence, under subparagraph (b), must exempt from tax any
amount of such pensions or other similar remuneration that would be exempt from tax in the State in which the pension scheme is established if the recipient were a resident of that State. Thus, for example, a distribution from a U.S. "Roth IRA" to a U.K. resident would be exempt from tax in the United Kingdom to the same extent the distribution would be exempt from tax inthe United States if it were distributed to a U.S. resident.

https://home.treasury.gov/system/files/131/Treaty-UK-Protocol-TE-7-22-2002.pdf

 

Yes, nothing like this in the US-Thai DTA. But we see what the OECD community thinks about this. And Thailand is petitioning to join the OECD community. You think they might be sympathetic to me not including a Roth remittance to Thailand as assessable income?

 

Anyway, I've might have gone too far with the above hint, as I've been banned, under threat of expulsion, from giving any tax advice on this forum.

[scotsman]

After using a calculator I don't have any tax to pay so I will wait and see what they do when we don't file a tax return.  If you don't have any tax to pay then a fine for not filing a return is not going to happen if  they do issue a fine then i will pay it. as it will not be a big fine.  they will have to fine Thai people as well.  but I don't want to file a long winded tax form in english to show them I don't have any tax to pay i have paid my tax in the UK.  they will not refuse a visa extension as they know you can just get a visa agent to get you one   now they will not stop the visa agents or the immigration police will have no money to pay there car payments.  

Now if you did file a tax return there is thousands of us and its a voluntary system the odds of them picking me for a audit is very small so for me I will wait and see.   When this government finds out that the economy is losing money from us as we stop sending for so much money transfers and spend less money they will stop this policy as we don't have that much tax to pay to make it worth collecting. so many complicated tax rules for double tax treaties for them to waist time in there tax office to get so little tax out of it.    I have been here over 20 years i know how they can do something so stupid then change there mind when it backfires this will be the same

[Dogmatix]

On 5/3/2024 at 9:31 AM, Mike Lister said:

I am told the person responsible for the new interpretation of the tax law, is the new incoming Minister of Finance, that should give you a clue as to whether it will be cancelled or not.

That is not correct. The new finance minister was chairman of the stock exchange in September 2023. The DG of the RD who signed P. 161/2566 is now permanent secretary for finance. 

[Mike Lister]

1 minute ago, Dogmatix said:

That is not correct. The new finance minister was chairman of the stock exchange in September 2023. The DG of the RD who signed P. 161/2566 is now permanent secretary for finance. 

Ah, thank you for the correction.

[KhunHeineken]

The should have had had another option.

 

"I am remaining in Thailand but will access funds in the most tax free effective manner."