Understanding Putin’s Motivations Behind the Ukraine Invasion

[scottiejohn]

3 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

Now maybe you would have the decency to answer my question. NATO expanding into Ukraine poses a major threat to Russia. Agree or disagree?

NATO does not "expand" into another country the way Russia has expanded into Ukraine!

NATO does not "expand" into another country as countries ask to join NATO and IF all NATO countries agree then they are able to join!

[Gweiloman]

13 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

 

I think Tuckers an idiot but have you ever met Tucker to have that opinion because according to your initial post that would be essential.

Sigh… you really lack mental acuity if you can’t see the difference between the two.

 

I said what I said about Tucker Carlson because I heard the words he said from his own mouth. I will feed your addiction for links by including one that supports my view. There are hundreds of other such links, just google it.

https://edition.cnn.com/2023/05/03/media/tucker-carlson-text-message-analysis/index.html

 

Horowitz on the other hand is conjecturing, drawing his own, erroneous I should add, conclusions about Putin’s motives. I have not seen any credible supporting evidence for his ridiculous claims.

[Bkk Brian]

Just now, Gweiloman said:

Sigh… you really lack mental acuity if you can’t see the difference between the two.

 

I said what I said about Tucker Carlson because I heard the words he said from his own mouth. I will feed your addiction for links by including one that supports my view. There are hundreds of other such links, just google it.

https://edition.cnn.com/2023/05/03/media/tucker-carlson-text-message-analysis/index.html

 

Horowitz on the other hand is conjecturing, drawing his own, erroneous I should add, conclusions about Putin’s motives. I have not seen any credible supporting evidence for his ridiculous claims.

Sigh… you really lack mental acuity if you can’t see the difference between the two.

 

Oh the irony............

[Gweiloman]

19 minutes ago, scottiejohn said:

NATO does not "expand" into another country the way Russia has expanded into Ukraine!

NATO does not "expand" into another country as countries ask to join NATO and IF all NATO countries agree then they are able to join!

Do you really believe this? Or are you just posting for likes?

 

Maybe these might enlighten you 

https://www.npr.org/2008/04/02/89300373/bush-calls-for-nato-expansion-at-his-last-summit#:~:text=Speaking in an ornate bank,gains and cement their independence.

 

https://time.com/6294499/nato-summit-vilnius-asia/

 

For your sake, I will put the question another way. Is Ukraine joining NATO a threat to Russia? Yes or no?

 

[Gweiloman]

10 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Sigh… you really lack mental acuity if you can’t see the difference between the two.

 

Oh the irony............

You prove once again you don’t have the intellectual capacity to be taken seriously.

[scottiejohn]

Just now, Gweiloman said:

For your sake, I will put the question another way. Is Ukraine joining NATO a threat to Russia? Yes or no?

NO!

No NATO country is a threat to Russia  unless Russia invades a NATO country!

[Bkk Brian]

Just now, Gweiloman said:

You prove once again you don’t have the intellectual capacity to be taken seriously.

You prove once again that when you have nothing all you can do is make personal inflammatory trolling posts

[scottiejohn]

Just now, Gweiloman said:

You prove once again you don’t have the intellectual capacity to be taken seriously.

Insults are not required in a proper discussion but if you are going to make them I assume that you are describing yourself!

[scottiejohn]

6 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

Do you really believe this? Or are you just posting for likes?

 

Maybe these might enlighten you 

https://www.npr.org/2008/04/02/89300373/bush-calls-for-nato-expansion-at-his-last-summit#:~:text=Speaking in an ornate bank,gains and cement their independence.

 

https://time.com/6294499/nato-summit-vilnius-asia/

 

For your sake, I will put the question another way. Is Ukraine joining NATO a threat to Russia? Yes or no?

 

The word "expansion" in the link is not mentioned in the article!

Dis you bother to read it
 

This is the main thrust of the article;

""NATO should welcome Georgia and Ukraine into the membership action plan, and NATO membership must remain open to all of Europe's democracies that seek it," the president said."

Note the last four words "democracies that seek it"!

[Gweiloman]

4 minutes ago, scottiejohn said:

Insults are not required in a proper discussion but if you are going to make them I assume that you are describing yourself!

Assume away..

[scottiejohn]

Just now, Gweiloman said:

Assume away..

So you do not deny it!

[scottiejohn]

12 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

 

 

https://time.com/6294499/nato-summit-vilnius-asia/

 

For your sake, I will put the question another way. Is Ukraine joining NATO a threat to Russia? Yes or no?

As for your second link did you bother to read that in any detail?

Obviously not as you missed this little gem from it;

 

"Courtesy of Russian President Vladimir Putin’s disastrous invasion of Ukraine, NATO has re-discovered its original purpose: the collective defense of its member states on the European continent. NATO approved new defense plans this week for the first time since the end of the Cold War. Enhancing deterrence against a near-peer rival in Russia is now NATO’s first, second, and third priority."

[Gweiloman]

3 minutes ago, scottiejohn said:

The word "expansion" in the link is not mentioned in the article!

Dis you bother to read it
 

This is the main thrust of the article;

""NATO should welcome Georgia and Ukraine into the membership action plan, and NATO membership must remain open to all of Europe's democracies that seek it," the president said."

Note the last four words "democracies that seek it"!

Title of article:

Bush Calls for NATO Expansion at His Last Summit

Is English your first language? It isn’t mine but I understand it enough to know the meaning of an article.

 

[transam]

1 minute ago, Gweiloman said:

Title of article:

Bush Calls for NATO Expansion at His Last Summit

Is English your first language? It isn’t mine but I understand it enough to know the meaning of an article.

 

At least you didn't write that in Russian BIG letters................🤔

[Gweiloman]

4 minutes ago, scottiejohn said:

As for your second link did you bother to read that in any detail?

Obviously not as you missed this little gem from it;

 

"Courtesy of Russian President Vladimir Putin’s disastrous invasion of Ukraine, NATO has re-discovered its original purpose: the collective defense of its member states on the European continent. NATO approved new defense plans this week for the first time since the end of the Cold War. Enhancing deterrence against a near-peer rival in Russia is now NATO’s first, second, and third priority."

It seems like English isn’t your first language. Or maybe it’s your comprehension that is the issue.

 

We were (or I was, at any rate) talking about NATO expansion and not why they were expanding.

 

If you still want to hold on to the fallacy that Nato merely considers applications without seeking new members, be my guest. 

[Wobblybob]

2 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

It seems like English isn’t your first language. Or maybe it’s your comprehension that is the issue.

 

We were (or I was, at any rate) talking about NATO expansion and not why they were expanding.

 

If you still want to hold on to the fallacy that Nato merely considers applications without seeking new members, be my guest. 

Without Russia there wouldn't be NATO, it is not difficult for most to understand! 

[Gweiloman]

5 minutes ago, transam said:

At least you didn't write that in Russian BIG letters................🤔

You remind me of some blue collared workers I encountered back in ol’ Blighty. Didn’t give them the time of day. Good policy then, reinstated as of now.

[scottiejohn]

5 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

Title of article:

Bush Calls for NATO Expansion at His Last Summit

Is English your first language? It isn’t mine but I understand it enough to know the meaning of an article.

 

You state; The word "expansion" in the link is not mentioned in the article!

Did you bother to read it,  The phares is in the link & therefore the headline but is not stated implied or quoted in the article!

Give up with your false claims!

You are just proving that your insults above really are describing yourself!

[transam]

Just now, Gweiloman said:

You remind me of some blue collared workers I encountered back in ol’ Blighty. Didn’t give them the time of day. Good policy then, reinstated as of now.

Was that working for the Morning Star......?  😒

[Gweiloman]

2 minutes ago, Wobblybob said:

Without Russia there wouldn't be NATO, it is not difficult for most to understand! 

Totally clueless. 
 

NATO’s new Asia-Pacific mission is remarkable for several reasons. When the alliance was formed in 1949 amid the looming post-war threat posed by the Soviet Union, it had a clear-cut purpose: protect Western Europe from the threat of Soviet expansionism. Once the Soviet Union collapsed in December 1991, NATO lost its raison d’être. Expanding to Central and Eastern Europe was no longer an obstacle, and the alliance has nearly doubled in size from its Cold War peak. With its geopolitical adversary dead and buried, NATO increasingly looked outside of Europe, in places like Libya, Afghanistan, and Iraq, to maintain relevance.

https://time.com/6294499/nato-summit-vilnius-asia/

[scottiejohn]

Just now, transam said:

Was that working for the Morning Star......?  😒

Would even they take him on?

[transam]

Just now, scottiejohn said:

Would even they take him on?

Weeeeeell, he has the right credentials.........🤗

[scottiejohn]

Just now, transam said:

Weeeeeell, he has the right credentials.........🤗

He  has already proved that with his self descriptive insults but not necessarily the understanding of topics and that when "in a whole stop digging"!

[Gweiloman]

37 minutes ago, scottiejohn said:

NO!

No NATO country is a threat to Russia  unless Russia invades a NATO country!

So since Russia didn’t invade any NATO country, it isn’t a threat to NATO, right?

 

So what’s all these NATO generals and European leaders warnings about a Russian threat to NATO?

[Gweiloman]

8 minutes ago, scottiejohn said:

He  has already proved that with his self descriptive insults but not necessarily the understanding of topics and that when "in a whole stop digging"!

It’s hole, not whole. Guess English isn’t your first language after all.

[Wobblybob]

26 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

Totally clueless. 
 

NATO’s new Asia-Pacific mission is remarkable for several reasons. When the alliance was formed in 1949 amid the looming post-war threat posed by the Soviet Union, it had a clear-cut purpose: protect Western Europe from the threat of Soviet expansionism. Once the Soviet Union collapsed in December 1991, NATO lost its raison d’être. Expanding to Central and Eastern Europe was no longer an obstacle, and the alliance has nearly doubled in size from its Cold War peak. With its geopolitical adversary dead and buried, NATO increasingly looked outside of Europe, in places like Libya, Afghanistan, and Iraq, to maintain relevance.

https://time.com/6294499/nato-summit-vilnius-asia/

Yes let's us all thank Putin for the new vigour and interest countries are now showing in NATO, before his illegal invasion of Ukraine NATO was all but dead and buried. Putin has done more to revitalise NATO than any other person, for which we'll be eternally grateful. 

[frank83628]

1 hour ago, Wobblybob said:

Yes let's us all thank Putin for the new vigour and interest countries are now showing in NATO, before his illegal invasion of Ukraine NATO was all but dead and buried. Putin has done more to revitalise NATO than any other person, for which we'll be eternally grateful. 

iif it was 'all but dead and buried' then why was everyone running round like headless chickens when trump said he wanted to Pull out?

 

the US interference in the region and the threat of nato missiles on Putins border has created this war, a war which could have ended in April 22, but the US & UK put a stop to it.

Hillary Killton being interviewed a while back said  basically, the war should be drawn out to cripple Russias economy! 

 

imaning how the US would react it Putin suddenly  was Putting missiles into Venezuela?.. wait, didnt something similar happen back in 1962?!

Hypocrisy . com 

 

[Wobblybob]

17 minutes ago, frank83628 said:

iif it was 'all but dead and buried' then why was everyone running round like headless chickens when trump said he wanted to Pull out?

 

the US interference in the region and the threat of nato missiles on Putins border has created this war, a war which could have ended in April 22, but the US & UK put a stop to it.

Hillary Killton being interviewed a while back said  basically, the war should be drawn out to cripple Russias economy! 

 

imaning how the US would react it Putin suddenly  was Putting missiles into Venezuela?.. wait, didnt something similar happen back in 1962?!

Hypocrisy . com 

 

Because the US was pumping the lions share of wonga into the NATO kitty.

Again you don't have a clue what you're talking about, could have been stopped in April 22, of course it could if Ukraine had agreed to surrender the territory that the Russians had already stolen, and then the lying Russians would have returned at a later date to take the rest of Ukraine.

Keep pumping Putin propaganda, it's all you understand!

[frank83628]

2 hours ago, Wobblybob said:

Because the US was pumping the lions share of wonga into the NATO kitty.

Again you don't have a clue what you're talking about, could have been stopped in April 22, of course it could if Ukraine had agreed to surrender the territory that the Russians had already stolen, and then the lying Russians would have returned at a later date to take the rest of Ukraine.

Keep pumping Putin propaganda, it's all you understand!

so,  i don't know what i'm talking about, but then you proceed to and invent a version of something that never happened?🤡
 

lying Russians? humm, now.... wasn't there an agreement back in 97 to not expand nato Eastward?,  who went back on that? lets take a guess. 

other countries are wising up and seeing the US for what it is, they are making firmer ties elsewhere for themselves. good on them

didn't Saudi make huge deals with China rather than the US?
 

 

 

Edited May 23 by frank83628

[Wobblybob]

1 minute ago, frank83628 said:

so, i don't know what i'm talking about, but then you go and invent a version of something that never happened?
 

lying Russians? humm, now.... wasn't there an agreement back in 97 to not expand nato Eastward?,  who went back on that? lets take a guess. 

other countries are wising up and seeing the US for what it is, they are making firmer ties elsewhere for themselves. good on them

didn't Saudi make huge deals with China rather than the US?

 

 

 

Points to note:- NATO doesn't move, countries join NATO out of necessity to protect themselves from the monster that is Russia. 

Why are you so protective of an authoritarian regime that treats Ukrainians as second class citizens and rapes, kills, tortures, and is in the process of destroying every bit of infrastructure they can bomb, this says so much about your mindset and it's not nice!