I'm planning to stay in Thailand over 6 months. Would Thai government try to tax me?

[KhunHeineken]

16 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

At last, a statement which indicates a bit of common sense. In fact I've been beating this same drum ever since this topic came to prominence in September last year. An article in the Thai Enquirer which opened with the alarming and somewhat misleading headline: Thai government to tax all income from abroad for tax residents starting 2024.

 

However in the body of that article we find, if we care to look, the following:

 

 'Also exempt will be those who have been taxed in a foreign country that has a standing Double Tax Agreement with Thailand'.

 

Why that all important sentence has been ignored, even dismissed as irrelevant by some pseudo experts I have no idea, but from my point of view it is the one anchoring point in a whole sea of disinformation and I'm sticking with it unless and until some more informative and credible information comes along.

 

 

So, what do you think will be their threshold then?  1 million, 2 million, 3 million, 4 million, 5 million baht?  Who sets the figure of what will be chased and what will not be chased? 

 

Given computers will be doing all the work, why wouldn't they chase every baht off every person, just like western countries do? 

 

I have posted a youtube video about the myth that a DTA only ensures your money is taxed in one country only.  I suggest you watch it. 

[chiang mai]

31 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

At last, a statement which indicates a bit of common sense. In fact I've been beating this same drum ever since this topic came to prominence in September last year. An article in the Thai Enquirer which opened with the alarming and somewhat misleading headline: Thai government to tax all income from abroad for tax residents starting 2024.

 

However in the body of that article we find, if we care to look, the following:

 

 'Also exempt will be those who have been taxed in a foreign country that has a standing Double Tax Agreement with Thailand'.

 

Why that all important sentence has been ignored, even dismissed as irrelevant by some pseudo experts I have no idea, but from my point of view it is the one anchoring point in a whole sea of disinformation and I'm sticking with it unless and until some more informative and credible information comes along.

 

https://www.thaienquirer.com/50744/thai-government-to-tax-all-income-from-abroad-for-tax-residents-starting-2024/

 

I don't know what the long term answer is to the current tax issues but I'm certain that you don't understand tax or the issue being discussed in these threads. You keep demanding proof of things from external sources, despite those links being supplied many times, the TRD, PWC, Sherrings etc, they've all been shown here many times yet you insist on relying on what's  written in an English language Thai based paper. If you were in the UK or US, would you use similar sources for your information! You see what's said here as disinformation, which is bizarre at best given the sources that you read.  

[Dan O]

1 hour ago, Moonlover said:

At last, a statement which indicates a bit of common sense. In fact I've been beating this same drum ever since this topic came to prominence in September last year. An article in the Thai Enquirer which opened with the alarming and somewhat misleading headline: Thai government to tax all income from abroad for tax residents starting 2024.

 

However in the body of that article we find, if we care to look, the following:

 

 'Also exempt will be those who have been taxed in a foreign country that has a standing Double Tax Agreement with Thailand'.

 

Why that all important sentence has been ignored, even dismissed as irrelevant by some pseudo experts I have no idea, but from my point of view it is the one anchoring point in a whole sea of disinformation and I'm sticking with it unless and until some more informative and credible information comes along.

 

https://www.thaienquirer.com/50744/thai-government-to-tax-all-income-from-abroad-for-tax-residents-starting-2024/

 

The DTA situation has been discussed numerous times on this forum. There is some protection with DTA's but each country is different and what they cover or exempt is not all inclusive. Its up to each person to inform themselves properly and not rely on media articles in Thailand to give you accurate information.  Media outlets tend to go for sensationized headlines to get readership with little research or fact checking and almost no investigation here. They quote anyone that will comment as if they are the proper source of information

[EvetsKram]

I'm sending my money to Thai bank before I land in Thailand, it should have no tax implications for me

[newbee2022]

On 8/23/2024 at 7:25 PM, ppatrick said:

Hi,

I've been visiting and staying Thailand every year, normally 3 months of every year, for the last 6-7 years. This year I already did 3 months around the beginning of the year. I'm planning to visit and stay again from September to end of the year. So that would be the total of 7 months for this year. Not sure whether this would trigger the "residency rule" (an individual is considered a resident when staying in a country for 6 months or more) and qualify me to be taxed as a Thai resident. I think it's kind of an international rule, including Thailand. The question is whether Thailand enforce it? Would they check the entry visa (two 90 day visa in my case) and go after people who stay in Thailand more than 6 months out of  a year? Please share your experiences or opinions. Thank you.

Yes 

[Dakhar]

On 8/23/2024 at 7:41 PM, ukrules said:

 

Nobody's taxing you on 5k of cash.

 

But lets say you bought large amounts of cash in on a regular basis and went to one of the surrounding countries twice a week for a year and then attempted to change it all into Baht - how are you going to do that without raising an eyebrow?

When you change money they ask for your passport for a reason and it all goes into a computer.
 

I knew a couple of guys who were successfully attempting to convert a lot of illicit funds from GBP into Euro in England until the day when they were confronted about all their other transactions at diffferent branches around the region - it's all tracked, and this was more than 15 years ago.

At this point it becomes laundering and tax evasion which is highly illegal and something to be avoided at all costs.

 

 

I don't think Hong Kong asks for your passport when you exchange money 

[Moonlover]

3 hours ago, chiang mai said:

Because the Thai Enquirer is not the best source of tax law information, the Thai Revenue Code or the Big 4 accountancy firms are..

I do not consider the opinions of posters on this forum to be any better informed than the Thai Enquirer, unless they can prove that they are qualified to give such opinions.

 

But what about Baan Thai, are they any better qualified than the Thai Enquirer? (or you for that matter)

 

'Upon the revised law’s announcement, retirees were understandably concerned about their pensions being taxed. So, will they? It depends on the factors mentioned earlier: your country’s DTA with Thailand and whether your pension was already taxed in your home country. I want to stress this again—if your pension was taxed at home, it’s unlikely to be taxed again in Thailand'.

 

https://btisolutions.co/will-you-be-impacted-by-thailands-revised-tax-code/

 

Once again I invite you to come up with your sources of information.

[Moonlover]

2 hours ago, Dan O said:

The DTA situation has been discussed numerous times on this forum. There is some protection with DTA's but each country is different and what they cover or exempt is not all inclusive. Its up to each person to inform themselves properly and not rely on media articles in Thailand to give you accurate information.  Media outlets tend to go for sensationized headlines to get readership with little research or fact checking and almost no investigation here. They quote anyone that will comment as if they are the proper source of information

Did you read the quote properly? 

 

2 hours ago, Dan O said:

 'Also exempt will be those who have been taxed in a foreign country that has a standing Double Tax Agreement with Thailand'.

 

If that does indeed come to pass then the wording of the DTAs will be irrelevant won't it.

[chiang mai]

2 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

I do not consider the opinions of posters on this forum to be any better informed than the Thai Enquirer, unless they can prove that they are qualified to give such opinions.

 

But what about Baan Thai, are they any better qualified than the Thai Enquirer? (or you for that matter)

 

'Upon the revised law’s announcement, retirees were understandably concerned about their pensions being taxed. So, will they? It depends on the factors mentioned earlier: your country’s DTA with Thailand and whether your pension was already taxed in your home country. I want to stress this again—if your pension was taxed at home, it’s unlikely to be taxed again in Thailand'.

 

https://btisolutions.co/will-you-be-impacted-by-thailands-revised-tax-code/

 

Once again I invite you to come up with your sources of information.

Why should I reinvent the wheel, based on your whim, there's zero mileage in that for me. Your failure to learn is your loss.

[Moonlover]

1 minute ago, chiang mai said:

Why should I reinvent the wheel, based on your whim, there's zero mileage in that for me. Your failure to learn is your loss.

Once again I will interpret your response as 'can't', not 'won't'.

[chiang mai]

7 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

Once again I will interpret your response as 'can't', not 'won't'.

You'll need far better bait than that.

[chiang mai]

In case anyone should need it to help formulate and substantiate an argument, the TRD Code is here:

 

https://www.rd.go.th/english/37748.html

 

[paahlman]

On 8/24/2024 at 3:53 PM, chiang mai said:

Yes.. Sure.. I only commented on this from that article.. and i did not say i was sure where the steps kick in.. but here they are..

0 – 150,000 Exempt 

150,000 – 300,000  5% 

300,000 – 500,000 10% 

500,000 – 750,000 15% 

750,000 – 1,000,000 20% 

1,000,000 – 2,000,000 25% 

2,000,000 – 5,000,000  30% 

Over 5,000,000  35% 

On 8/24/2024 at 3:53 PM, chiang mai said:

 

 

[paahlman]

On 8/24/2024 at 3:49 PM, Presnock said:

wrong - the Thai revenue Department set the number at 180 days in a calendar year makes one a Thai Tax Resident.  In the written (converted to English too) on the thai revenue depart webb site.  Easy enough for anyone to find and shouldn't need somebody draw you a picture!

Thanks for the clarification.. I might mix my home countrys law about 183 days. They reckon i have moved if more than 6 months outcountry which they say is 183 days or more.

[chiang mai]

2 minutes ago, paahlman said:

0 – 150,000 Exempt 

150,000 – 300,000  5% 

300,000 – 500,000 10% 

500,000 – 750,000 15% 

750,000 – 1,000,000 20% 

1,000,000 – 2,000,000 25% 

2,000,000 – 5,000,000  30% 

Over 5,000,000  35% 

 

Yes, thank you, did you have a point you wanted to make?

 

Ah, it looks like the editor is screwed up and your post to me appears as my post....gottit.

Edited August 26 by chiang mai

[Deerculler]

Just come to Thailand.

Enjoy your time here and don’t think about tax.

[Bday Prang]

9 hours ago, Yumthai said:

This is your opinion.

nothing written on this subject is anything other than peoples opinions  

 

[chiang mai]

9 minutes ago, Bday Prang said:

nothing written on this subject is anything other than peoples opinions  

 

The following is fact:

 

https://www.rd.go.th/english/37748.html

[J Branche]

Again Thai Revenue Department Order 162 2023 , or Google "Foreigners Pay Tax 2024 pdf"

States assessable income available prior to January 1, 2024 may be remitted 2024 or any following years paying 0% tax.

[Lorry]

5 hours ago, EvetsKram said:

I'm sending my money to Thai bank before I land in Thailand, it should have no tax implications for me

Not sure whether you are serious or joking. 

 

Very wrong.

It doesn't matter when you remit the money. 

TRD looks at one calendar year, eg 2024.

In this calendar year,  were you in Thailand more than 179 day?  If yes, you are a tax resident and have to pay taxes on all remittances during this year,  no matter where you were at the time of the remittance. 

 

 

[Bday Prang]

14 minutes ago, chiang mai said:

The following is fact:

 

https://www.rd.go.th/english/37748.html

My mistake , I should have written   " nothing written by any AN Forum members on this subject is anything other than opinion "

[chiang mai]

1 minute ago, Bday Prang said:

My mistake , I should have written   " nothing written by any AN Forum members on this subject is anything other than opinion "

...UNLESS it is quoted fact.

[J Branche]

4 minutes ago, Lorry said:

Not sure whether you are serious or joking. 

 

Very wrong.

It doesn't matter when you remit the money. 

TRD looks at one calendar year, eg 2024.

In this calendar year,  were you in Thailand more than 179 day?  If yes, you are a tax resident and have to pay taxes on all remittances during this year,  no matter where you were at the time of the remittance. 

 

 

Depending on the amount he could show was assessable income prior to 2024 Order 162 2023 would allow income before 2024 to remitted at 0% tax.  Better English version when Google "Foreigners Pay Tax 2024 pdf"

[donmuang37]

On 8/23/2024 at 7:30 PM, ukrules said:

It's 180 days or more for Thailand that makes you a tax resident.

But you will only be taxed on money you remit into the country at the moment, maybe that changes in the future - they said they want to change it so they can tax your global income after 180 days which is how a lot of countries operate but who knows if they manage to get that through parliament.

 

Only two countries tax your global income: the USA and Eritrea.  That's it, not "a lot of countries."

[chiang mai]

Here's some quoted fact that may help some:

 

Section 41

 

"A taxpayer who in the previous tax year derived assessable income under Section 40 from an employment, or from business carried on in Thailand, or from business of an employer residing in Thailand, or from a property situated in Thailand shall pay tax in accordance with the provisions of this Part, whether such income is paid within or outside Thailand.

 

A resident of Thailand who in the previous tax year derived assessable income under Section 40 from an employment or from business carried on abroad or from a property situated abroad shall, upon bringing such assessable income into Thailand, pay tax in accordance with the provisions of this Part.

 

Any person staying in Thailand for a period or periods aggregating 180 days or more in any tax year shall be deemed a resident of Thailand".

 

https://www.rd.go.th/english/37749.html#section41

 

 

[ukrules]

1 hour ago, donmuang37 said:

Only two countries tax your global income: the USA and Eritrea.  That's it, not "a lot of countries."

 

I already explained elsewhere on this forum why this is nonsense, it was in another thread a few days ago and I'm not going to post it again.

 

But I will do a one liner.

The US and Eritrea are the only 2 countries to tax globally while the citizen is NON RESIDENT - nearly all other western nations tax people who are tax residents on their global earnings.

You are mistaken, I once thought this myself....like you, I too was wrong.

 

Edited August 26 by ukrules

[Dan O]

23 hours ago, Moonlover said:

Did you read the quote properly? 

 

If that does indeed come to pass then the wording of the DTAs will be irrelevant won't it.

Yes I read it and my reply was accurate. DTA's don't exempt you from taxation across the board. An example is the ss benefits in the USA can not be taxed in another jurisdiction but allows taxation of other benefits.

 

You can be taxed in your home country on some income areas but if the income tax threshold is higher in thailand then you get a credit for what you've paid already and if you owe more you pay the difference in Thailand.  This is the dumbed down explanation. you need to read your country's dta to actually see what it says and what it covers to know. 

[Presnock]

4 minutes ago, Dan O said:

Yes I read it and my reply was accurate. DTA's don't exempt you from taxation across the board. An example is the ss benefits in the USA can not be taxed in another jurisdiction but allows taxation of other benefits.

 

You can be taxed in your home country on some income areas but if the income tax threshold is higher in thailand then you get a credit for what you've paid already and if you owe more you pay the difference in Thailand.  This is the dumbed down explanation. you need to read your country's dta to actually see what it says and what it covers to know. 

DTA with US also says US government Pension can only be taxed by the US also.  Also heard one of the experts included North Korea together with the US and Eritria on worldwide taxation...but afterthe OECD agreement, FACTA, and CRS will be getting  a lot more money from some folks that have managed to avoid such programs.  In my opinion and those that still scheme and manage to avoid taxes, will probably see some changes in the future about tax residency as countries will not leave any monies hidden under any stone eventually.

[Dan O]

2 minutes ago, Presnock said:

DTA with US also says US government Pension can only be taxed by the US also.  Also heard one of the experts included North Korea together with the US and Eritria on worldwide taxation...but afterthe OECD agreement, FACTA, and CRS will be getting  a lot more money from some folks that have managed to avoid such programs.  In my opinion and those that still scheme and manage to avoid taxes, will probably see some changes in the future about tax residency as countries will not leave any monies hidden under any stone eventually.

Every DTA is different depending on country and what is exempted from taxation varies as well.  Their main purpose isn't to stop taxation altogether but make it an "equitable" situation that you are not taxed twice for the same monetary level. They also spell out what is taxable income and what is not taxable in other tax jurisdictions. 

[TroubleandGrumpy]

On 8/25/2024 at 10:30 PM, KhunHeineken said:

As we all know, "Opinions are like a**holes, we've all got one." 

You have your opinion, I have my opinion, and everyone else has there opinion, and we are ALL entitled to our own opinion. 

What I am about to post is a "statement" and not an opinion. 

Statement start: "The Thai government announced these tax changes, so they must have a plan for them."  Statement end.

I have already commented on my statement in previous posts. 

I re-post my statement for the purpose of drawing attention to the FACT that anything and everything is possible come the 31st March 2025.  That could be anywhere from NOTHING, all the way to SCREWING foreigners.  

Time will tell.   

Mate - you are right - but it does seem to me that you need to calm down a little.

IMO you should tone down the statements a bit - using CAPS is an example of your 'over extension' of your opinion, and so is finishing by making a derisive comment with a laughing emoji (and you do those two a lot).

Just saying. Asking for a friend. It was Bart (Simpson).