Brawl on Bangla Road, Transgender Woman Assaults Tourist

[StandardIssue]

9 hours ago, Docno said:

"There's no way these biases are as entrenched in the general population as they are in sex tourism centers like Pattaya and Phuket"

Fallacious reasoning. You're missing the key confound in your logic which is that it is mostly in these places where Thais will come into direct contact with these people so they are just as liable to form these impressions on their own without any prompting from Caucasians as you seem to suggest. I spend a lot of time in Singapore where there is a large South Asian worker population and only a relative handful of Caucasians, and the girls here (local, Filipina, Thai, Indonesian etc) will all talk about some of these issues re Indians (and not all Indian, mind you). So these 'stereotypes' are more the product of experience than the 'evil influence' of Westerners, as you would like to think.  

Just my point. The workings girls attitudes and Thai attitudes towards these guys are out of experience and gossip. Nobody is rounding up freelance girls and bringing them to special "india man/ middle eastern / arab man" bashing classes. My own experience living in Pattaya confirms some of these stereotypes. It's unfortunate but there are enough common traits to form some general conclusions about these guys.

Edited September 17 by StandardIssue

[AhFarangJa]

23 hours ago, Gandtee said:

We don't have to. B******s to them.😉

Nice play on words, 10 out of 10 Sir....

[Gandtee]

3 minutes ago, AhFarangJa said:

Nice play on words, 10 out of 10 Sir....

At least you caught it and it wasn't wasted.😉

[spidermike007]

It makes one wonder why are so many of these robberies and assaults committed by ladyboys, what is the issue?

 

Is it a cultural thing? Are they just a particularly maladjusted group? I hesitate to pass judgment here but it does make one curious. 

[hotandsticky]

6 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

It makes one wonder why are so many of these robberies and assaults committed by ladyboys, what is the issue?

 

Is it a cultural thing? Are they just a particularly maladjusted group? I hesitate to pass judgment here but it does make one curious. 

 

Try doing some research on who controls the prisons.

 

Obviously, not all khatoeys are law breakers………but many are - and Pattaya does tend to attract the worst of all breeds.

[Bundooman]

On 9/16/2024 at 7:21 AM, KhunLA said:

Crossdressing men, as they are neither ladies nor boys 

That photo does not look like a 'cross-dressing' man.

That photo looks like a woman.

That is a Ladyboy!

 

A duck wearing an eagle hat, doesn't make it an Eagle!

Why try to dress it up?

[Scouse123]

17 hours ago, Elkski said:

My wife was a dental receptionist for 20 years.   They dislike Indian customers because always arguing and asking for a discount.   And some smelling so bad or using so much scent it fumigated the waiting room.    If I get bad BO she says I smell like India man.  I've smelled my share of this in Thailand and here in the US.   

 

 

My family, who I took on a tour of Cambodia, Vietnam and Thailand, were astonished in the breakfast room one day by a Sikh family.

 

This occurred in Hanoi, but could have been anywhere.

 

This particular family were extremely loud, rearranging the breakfast room, scraping the tables across the floor, to sit together, and snappy, demanding and authoritative with the waiting staff.

 

The men kept clicking their fingers for staff to service their needs.

 

We were slightly shocked, as we had always had the opinion in the UK, that the Sikh people were very polite and friendly.

 

After they left, the receptionist told us that they were always like that when they stayed at this particular hotel, and treated the staff like servants.

 

This group didn't smell, but I understand the above post, as I used to get in plenty of Asian taxis in the UK where the BO was overwhelming.

 

I no longer ride with them. Back in the UK, I do a deal with family members to pick me up and drop me off, and I compensate them for their time and trouble, via petrol and gifts.

[Scouse123]

32 minutes ago, hotandsticky said:

 

Try doing some research on who controls the prisons.

 

Obviously, not all khatoeys are law breakers………but many are - and Pattaya does tend to attract the worst of all breeds.

 

I agree with the second paragraph, but Ladyboys certainly do not control prisons, there aren't enough of them.

 

And there are far worse criminal gangs in the prisons, than there are Ladyboys.

 

Lady boys earn their keep in prison doing the obvious, with a side line of washing and cleaning as well.

[Scouse123]

45 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

It makes one wonder why are so many of these robberies and assaults committed by ladyboys, what is the issue?

 

Is it a cultural thing? Are they just a particularly maladjusted group? I hesitate to pass judgment here but it does make one curious. 

 

 

I think it's twofold.

 

1. There are not enough clients interested in Ladyboys for the oversupply.

 

2. They are criminals and enjoy the violence, drama and tantrums, as well as the easy money from stealing.

[MalcolmB]

16 hours ago, theblether said:

 

Yes, also known for being extremely passive aggressive and it sometimes boiled over. I watched Israelis being evicted from a hotel in Vientiane as they had taken ownership of the kitchen area. Very hard-nosed people but I will say the Vientiane incident was IDF that had just completed their service period, I could understand why they were highly wound up. 

 

There was also organised repatriation missions by the Israeli government in Goa, and to a lesser extent, Thailand, as quite a few former IDF lost the plot and descended into opiate use.  Their families were flown in at government expense to persuade them to come home. 

Yep, utter scumbags.

[MalcolmB]

51 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

It makes one wonder why are so many of these robberies and assaults committed by ladyboys, what is the issue?

 

Is it a cultural thing? Are they just a particularly maladjusted group? I hesitate to pass judgment here but it does make one curious. 

They are on female hormones which put them in a constant state similar to being pre menstrual.
 

And the ones causing the trouble you see in the news are mostly sex workers who are on yaba and ice.

 

Add that to having a job where you are sodomised by many men.

 

How do think that combined would be for your mood.

[spidermike007]

1 hour ago, MalcolmB said:

They are on female hormones which put them in a constant state similar to being pre menstrual.
 

And the ones causing the trouble you see in the news are mostly sex workers who are on yaba and ice.

 

Add that to having a job where you are sodomised by many men.

 

How do think that combined would be for your mood.

I don't think I would enjoy any aspect of that lifestyle for a nanosecond. Sometimes I wake up and look in the mirror and say what a blessing it is to be content with my sexuality and with whom I am as a person.

 

I can only imagine the horror show that being very uncomfortable in your own body could create. 

[NorthernRyland]

 

On 9/16/2024 at 7:46 AM, Gecko123 said:

racial minority groups

 

Minorities? pretty sure there's more Indians alone than all white people in the world combined.

[Scouse123]

Just now, NorthernRyland said:

 

 

Minorities? pretty sure there's more Indians alone than all white people in the world combined.

 

I think they have now overtaken the Chinese.

[NorthernRyland]

On 9/16/2024 at 10:00 AM, Gecko123 said:

I think you're making my point that Caucasian men's racial and ethnic prejudices have to a significant degree played a role in inculcating these same prejudices in Thais.

This is crazy. Thai's are far more racist than any white country in 2024 with the exception of Eastern Europe maybe.

 

[NorthernRyland]

2 hours ago, Scouse123 said:

After they left, the receptionist told us that they were always like that when they stayed at this particular hotel, and treated the staff like servants.

 

This group didn't smell, but I understand the above post, as I used to get in plenty of Asian taxis in the UK where the BO was overwhelming.

 

 

My boss is Indian-American and he always remarked how even the middle class in Indian all have servants. Appears to part of the culture.

 

Come to think of it when I travel last month I was in line with an Indian girl and she had the most intense BO I ever smelled. This was inside an air conditioned airport mind you. Maybe the claims are true? I do hear it often but I've not been around many Indians.

[NorthernRyland]

4 hours ago, StandardIssue said:

Nobody is rounding up freelance girls and bringing them to special "india man/ middle eastern / arab man" bashing classes. My own experience living in Pattaya confirms some of these stereotypes. It's unfortunate but there are enough common traits to form some general conclusions about these guys.

I've seen multiple times Thai people show disgust towards Indians and Arabs. They simply do not like them. Surely this has been going on long before any farang showed up anywhere in Thailand. Its makes sense does it not? How many Thai people are moving to India vs the America or Germany for example. Probably none and that tells you what they think about the people.

[theblether]

22 hours ago, Gecko123 said:

I think you're in denial. I think you know there's a lot of racism in the expat community, and that there's a lot of truth in what I wrote, but people are trying to fob it off as just long established racial biases held by Thais which have nothing to do with racial attitudes promulgated by Western men.

 

The reason this is particularly amplified in red-light districts is because Western men are very territorial about their sexual playgrounds. Seeing racial minorities indulging in sexual activities alongside them diminishes their sense of sexual conquest, and, historically, white men have felt entitled to dictate who gets to indulge in the sexual pleasures of the women they are indulging in sexual pleasure with. I think over the years a lot of this has become engrained in the red light culture here, as evidenced by the segregation in these establishments. I'm not saying there's racial apartheid here, but there are places which cater to white Westerners, while others cater to middle Easterners, and still others to Indian tourists.

 

Trying to claim Thai racial attitudes are strictly homegrown which have developed over the millennia and to claim that Westerners have absolutely nothing to do with their evolution, is the same as trying to claim that Thailand's prostitution is strictly a homegrown cultural phenomenon which foreign sex tourism has played no part in helping to shape. 

 

I don't think there's any question that Western men have played a role in "signal boosting" and reinforcing negative attitudes towards racial minorities amongst Thais, and to claim otherwise is to be less than honest about the part we play. Just look at the racial biases expressed on this forum whenever Indians, Middle-Easterners, Africans or virtually any racial minority is mentioned.

 

@theblether

 

Hold on, wait - you tagged me in this delusional post? Wow. And there was me trying to be polite. Lets try again. 

 

You are talking utter cra*p, you are an embarrassment. You are of the opinion that mass sex tourism by Caucasian males which only started in any type of numbers in the 1980's and soared through the '90's infected the Thai populace with a new racist disdain of Indian people? 

 

I swear to Gawd, I have never heard such drivel on this topic in my life. Are you aware that one of the former moderators of this forum was a Thai-Indian? Their family arrived in the Kingdom in the 1880's. Are you aware that many of the properties in the Nana area are owned by dynastic Thai-Indian families? Do you know the local nickname for the Sois in Lower Suk? 

 

Are you aware that the Indian community ran sex shops and brothels decades before the Vietnam War began? I mention that as you can use that period as Year Zero for the establishment of the LBFM trope. Man, one of best and most reliable mates in Thailand was of Indian heritage, the man was born in the Kingdom and died in his mid-70's. Thai and Middle Eastern people have traded in the Kingdom since the days or Marco Polo. 

 

Islam, introduced by Middle-Eastern traders, was introduced to Siam in the 13th Century. The Portuguese followed Indian and ME sailing routes to Siam in 1508/9. There's a compelling argument that the arrival of the Portuguese introduced the word "farang" to Siam, as the Middle Easterners used a similar word to describe Europeans, a word rooted in the time of the CRUSADES. 

 

And here's you persisting in an argument that a few bar owners in the 1990's caused Thais to be racist to Indians. It is utter stupidity. The aforementioned people were in the Kingdom hundreds of years before a single Western sex tourist arrived. Thais had long since decided their attitude to both. 

 

Just give it up. Your beat. And you should know better to mix it with people here that actually know what they are talking about. 

[MalcolmB]

1 hour ago, theblether said:

You are talking utter cra*p, you are an embarrassment. You are of the opinion that mass sex tourism by Caucasian males which only started in any type of numbers in the 1980's and soared through the '90's infected the Thai populace with a new racist disdain of Indian people? 

I think the Gecko was talking about violent confrontations in Pattaya. 

Since most of them come from Issan, not Bangkok, I think he might have a valid point. There are not too many Indians who settled up there, they were mainly in Bangkok. 

 

The Thai muslims only represent a small minority and mostly in the south. Let’s not forget the Thais mostly worship the Buddha, who was racially an Indian from what is now Nepal. 

If I was a smelly Indian sex tourist in Pattaya I would be using the line that I am a direct descendant of the Buddha to try and get some freebies. 

[theblether]

1 hour ago, MalcolmB said:

I think the Gecko was talking about violent confrontations in Pattaya. 

Since most of them come from Issan, not Bangkok, I think he might have a valid point. There are not too many Indians who settled up there, they were mainly in Bangkok. 

 

The Thai muslims only represent a small minority and mostly in the south. Let’s not forget the Thais mostly worship the Buddha, who was racially an Indian from what is now Nepal. 

If I was a smelly Indian sex tourist in Pattaya I would be using the line that I am a direct descendant of the Buddha to try and get some freebies. 

 

He wasn't talking about that. He was trying to indicate that anti-Indian racism originated with Westerners and spread to Thais. 

 

It's a laughable contention. 

[AhFarangJa]

17 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

It makes one wonder why are so many of these robberies and assaults committed by ladyboys, what is the issue?

 

Is it a cultural thing? Are they just a particularly maladjusted group? I hesitate to pass judgment here but it does make one curious. 

I think it is most likely the medications they are on.

[Gandtee]

17 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

I don't think I would enjoy any aspect of that lifestyle for a nanosecond. Sometimes I wake up and look in the mirror and say what a blessing it is to be content with my sexuality and with whom I am as a person.

 

I can only imagine the horror show that being very uncomfortable in your own body could create. 

At 90, I wake up in the mornings, look in the mirror, and am pleasantly surprised  that I'm still here. 😉

[cdemundo]

On 9/16/2024 at 7:46 AM, Gecko123 said:

I am becoming increasingly convinced that transgender and female prostitutes alike think that they can get away with targeting Indian, middle-Eastern and other non-white tourists for mistreatment (drugging, rip-offs, price gouging, non-performance, thefts, pickpocketing, verbal abuse, and physical assaults, etc.).

 

I'm not saying there are never any cultural differences which might explain underlying tensions, but I strongly suspect that racial and ethnic prejudices towards these groups voiced by Caucasian bar owners and Caucasian sex tourists that these racial minority groups are less desirable and oftentimes made to feel unwelcome have filtered down to the local population. and may go a long way towards explaining this recurring pattern.

 

The complaint I have heard about Indians from Thai women is that they have poor personal hygiene.

That comes from the Thai women's olfactory sense, not from Caucasian influence.

[Gecko123]

17 hours ago, theblether said:

 

Hold on, wait - you tagged me in this delusional post? Wow. And there was me trying to be polite. Lets try again. 

 

You are talking utter cra*p, you are an embarrassment. You are of the opinion that mass sex tourism by Caucasian males which only started in any type of numbers in the 1980's and soared through the '90's infected the Thai populace with a new racist disdain of Indian people? 

 

I swear to Gawd, I have never heard such drivel on this topic in my life. Are you aware that one of the former moderators of this forum was a Thai-Indian? Their family arrived in the Kingdom in the 1880's. Are you aware that many of the properties in the Nana area are owned by dynastic Thai-Indian families? Do you know the local nickname for the Sois in Lower Suk? 

 

Are you aware that the Indian community ran sex shops and brothels decades before the Vietnam War began? I mention that as you can use that period as Year Zero for the establishment of the LBFM trope. Man, one of best and most reliable mates in Thailand was of Indian heritage, the man was born in the Kingdom and died in his mid-70's. Thai and Middle Eastern people have traded in the Kingdom since the days or Marco Polo. 

 

Islam, introduced by Middle-Eastern traders, was introduced to Siam in the 13th Century. The Portuguese followed Indian and ME sailing routes to Siam in 1508/9. There's a compelling argument that the arrival of the Portuguese introduced the word "farang" to Siam, as the Middle Easterners used a similar word to describe Europeans, a word rooted in the time of the CRUSADES. 

 

And here's you persisting in an argument that a few bar owners in the 1990's caused Thais to be racist to Indians. It is utter stupidity. The aforementioned people were in the Kingdom hundreds of years before a single Western sex tourist arrived. Thais had long since decided their attitude to both. 

 

Just give it up. Your beat. And you should know better to mix it with people here that actually know what they are talking about. 

 

Let's get something out of the way first: don't ever tell me I need to be quiet again. Your posts have a thuggish, loud-mouthed, and condescending tone which in all likelihood explains your poor community rating. I suggest you work on this going forward. 

 

Talk about drivel. What do any of the above factoids have to do with racial attitudes by Thais towards Indians and Middle-Eastern tourists? Answer: absolutely nothing. If anything, you make the case for how well these communities are integrated into Thai culture. You tell me I need to shut up, and then proceed to pompously "school" me about the cultural and religious ties between India and Thailand? Indo-China. Hello? Thanks for the elementary school geography lesson and for sharing your profound insights on how Buddhism spread from India to Thailand. You're the one who needs to give me a break. I do not believe there are these smoldering animosities between the Indian community and Thais, and all of the examples you cited above about their integration into the Thai business community only serve to support this contention.

 

I never said that all racial or cultural tensions between Thais and Indian and Middle-Eastern tourists in red-light districts could be traced solely back to the white ex-pat community. In fact, I acknowledged that to a certain degree these tensions probably do exist. I said however that these tensions might have to more with them being less affluent, holding less promise of a better life back in India, and being less susceptible to manipulation than a fresh-off-the-boat tourist from the West than it has anything to do with personal hygiene or fear of being gang-raped after being lured back to the hotel. And let's not forget the white ex-pat community's reputation in these areas isn't exactly pristine, now is it? And while we're on the subject of body hygiene, from what I've seen, most of those Indian and Middle-Eastern men are younger and more physically fit and probably more enjoyable in the sack from the standpoint of a working girl than someone with a huge beer belly, toe fungus, and a mouth full of rotting teeth. Can I get an Amen from my brothers in Mumbai?

 

All I was saying is that in my close to 40 years of coming to Thailand, I have observed a great deal of prejudice directed at the Indian and Middle-Eastern communities from the English speaking community and in my opinion, the inculcation and reinforcing of these racial attitudes have at the very least helped legitimize, normalize, and in some cases may have helped create a climate where mistreatment of these tourist groups is subtly more tolerated and condoned than it would otherwise be.

 

Over the years, I have also seen multiple examples of white expats indoctrinating and encouraging their Thai girlfriends and wives and other acquaintances to share their racial prejudices towards other racial groups, whether you're talking about Indians, Middle-Eastern, Chinese, Africans or sharing their resents about being displaced back home and how demographic changes make it unlikely they will ever return home again.

 

When I cited the level of racism you encounter on line on forums such as this one, it wasn't to suggest that Thais are reading Aseannow. I cited this as a stand-in barometer for the racial attitudes towards Indians and Middle-Easterners in red-light expat dense communities such as Pattaya, Phuket, Hua Hin, etc. Do you really think that someone bashing Indians or Middle-Easterners or Africans every time one of them commits a misdeed on line isn't doing the same thing over the dinner table when they're talking to their wife or girlfriend?  

 

What I found most ironic and REVEALING is that the same people on this thread who have been most triggered by my comments are (with perhaps one or two exceptions) the very same people who on a regular basis make derogatory comments on this forum about racial minorities, bleat on about the great replacement theory, love Donald Trump, hate BLM, squawk on and on about woke-ism and political correctness, etc. It's like they are desperate to believe that Thais are as racist, if not more so, as they are in order to validate their beliefs and absolve themselves of any responsibility for the role they play in promulgating these prejudices and beliefs.

Edited September 18 by Gecko123