K bank E-mail with Tax Forms attached ?

[Gobbler]

1 hour ago, anrcaccount said:

IMO - you misinterpret this part of the form.

 

 

I am not a US person. I am a citizen of the USA. There is a difference. 

 

หากท่านไม่ให้ข้อมูลที่จ าเป็นต่อการพิจารณาสถานะความเป็นบุคคลอเมริกัน (U.S. person) และ/หรือ ผู้มีถิ่นที่อยู่เพื่อวัตถุประสงค์ในการเก็บภาษีอากรของประเทศอื่น หรือข้อมูลที่จ าเป็นต้อง รายงานให้แก่กลุ่มธุรกิจทางการเงินธนาคารกสิกรไทยหรือไม่สามารถจะขอให้ยกเว้นการบังคับใช้กฎหมายที่ห้ามการรายงานข้อมูลได้ กลุ่มธุรกิจทางการเงินธนาคารกสิกรไทยมีสิทธิใช้ดุลยพินิจแต่ เพียงฝ่ายเดียวที่จะยุติความสัมพันธ์ทางการเงิน/ทางธุรกิจกับท่านไม่ว่าทั้งหมดหรือบางส่วนตามที่กลุ่มธุรกิจทางการเงินธนาคารกสิกรไทยเห็นสมควร If you fail to provide the information required to determine whether you are a U.S. person and/or a resident for tax purpose of another country, or to provide the information required to be reported to KASIKORNBANK FINANCIAL CONGLOMERATE, or if you fail to provide a waiver of a law that would prevent reporting, KASIKORNBANK FINANCIAL CONGLOMERATE shall be entitled to terminate, at its sole discretion, the entire banking/business relationship with you or part of such relationship as KASIKORNBANK FINANCIAL CONGLOMERATE may deem appropriate.

[crazykopite]

Just got mine via email this morning you would think they would send the forms out hard copy as they have our address and what happens if you ignore the email it’s a pain in the backside . As yet I haven’t had anything from my other thai banks 

[newbee2022]

10 minutes ago, JohnnyBD said:

My Thai wife has accts at Kasikorn also, and she has not received this email.

Yes, every!!! customer get this email. All other banks will follow soon

[Chivas]

You can bet your bottom Dollar that where one bank starts the rest will swiftly follow

[sandyf]

On 11/23/2024 at 9:55 PM, Bazle said:

Yes. I'm in the UK.

The forms seem quite US tax orientated. The W-9 and W-8BEN are IRS forms, which are not applicable to me, but the FATCA form I will need to complete. Most of the questions there are US-related, but not all. In particular, it asks for my Thai Tax Identification Number (TIN), a  mandatory question if I have taxable income in Thailand. I do have, as I have bank interest. But there is a section in which I have to explain why I don't have a TIN.

 

If I am not a resident of Thailand or the US, it also asks for my non-Thai address and my overseas TIN.

The forms are US orientated, W-8 & W-9 have been around for a long time, I am from UK and can remember having to submit them over 20 years ago. Think the IRS wanted info on any funds held in the US.

FATCA is also to do with the US citizens and been around a long time, now that CRS is about it is probably an update to the name of the FATCA form.

Best to wait for something HMRC related.

[Gobbler]

Almost 18 years ago the wife opened an account at BB. She is Thai.  They gave her a questionnaire in Thai and English and she still didn't understand why they were asking her all these intrusive question. 

 

I took the paper and ripped it to shreds before the BB employee.  She said nothing. 

[kingstonkid]

On 11/23/2024 at 9:42 PM, ukrules said:

Has anyone who's not from the US received this email...so far?

I see they mention CRS as well which is a non US thing.

yes

[Freddy42OZ]

On 11/23/2024 at 9:14 PM, G_Money said:

The OP never mentioned these forms,  Only emails.

 

Regardless I would still go to the bank with the forms already filled out.

 

You are free to do it your way 

 

 

The OP said "As anybody had an E-mail from Kbank asking to fill out 3 forms and return to them" 

I also received this email asking me to fill out the three forms they attached. 

The email has this line in it "The CRS aims to combat tax evasion by individuals residing outside Thailand and to ensure compliance with international taxation standards. In light of these requirements, we kindly request your cooperation in completing the following steps:" 

I replied to Kbank and pointed out that I am resident in Thailand and asked them why they want me to fill out forms for people who are not resident here.
 

 

Still waiting for a response.
 

[jesimps]

On 11/23/2024 at 9:42 PM, ukrules said:

Has anyone who's not from the US received this email...so far?

I see they mention CRS as well which is a non US thing.

Yes I've received it plus the attachments which all look US related. I can't even provide a TIN because the Jomtien tax office refused to issue me with one. 

[Gobbler]

I just had an extensive colliquay with ChatGPT which is programmed with a lot of crap. I will post ChatGPT's answer when cornered by me, a legal professional. 

 

Conclusion and Clarification

There is no formal statute or regulation that defines "US person" without periods in the same way it defines "United States person" within the Internal Revenue Code (IRC) or other core legal sources like the Securities Exchange Act.

The shorthand "US person" is commonly used in regulatory and compliance contexts, but it is not explicitly defined in the same way "United States person" is in the IRC.

While the two terms refer to the same category of individuals and entities, the term "US person" is shorthand and widely used in regulatory texts. However, the precise legal definition for "US person" without periods appears only in regulatory frameworks like the Bank Secrecy Act (BSA).

To answer your core concern: There is no statutory or regulatory definition explicitly uniting the shorthand "US person" and "United States person"; instead, the term "US person" is a shorthand commonly used in practice to refer to the same group of individuals and entities defined by the term "United States person".

[Gobbler]

Definitions are different in every title of United States Law. 

 

[JohnnyBD]

35 minutes ago, newbee2022 said:

Yes, every!!! customer get this email. All other banks will follow soon

Not every customer. I didn't get this email, most probably because I am a US citizen and have already filled out these forms when I opened my accts. After reading most of the posts, it appears the emails are being sent mostly to non-US citizens.

[Freddy42OZ]

On 11/23/2024 at 9:14 PM, G_Money said:

The OP never mentioned these forms,  Only emails.

 

Regardless I would still go to the bank with the forms already filled out.

 

You are free to do it your way 

 

 

The OP said "As anybody had an E-mail from Kbank asking to fill out 3 forms and return to them" 

I also received this email asking me to fill out the three forms they attached. 

The email has this line in it "The CRS aims to combat tax evasion by individuals residing outside Thailand and to ensure compliance with international taxation standards. In light of these requirements, we kindly request your cooperation in completing the following steps:" 

I replied to Kbank and pointed out that I am resident in Thailand and asked them why they want me to fill out forms for people who are not resident here.
 

 

Still waiting for a response.

On 11/23/2024 at 9:42 PM, ukrules said:

Has anyone who's not from the US received this email...so far?

I see they mention CRS as well which is a non US thing.

 

 

I'm not from the US and I received it.   

It appears that all the forms are for Americans.
 

[mrbojangles]

19 minutes ago, Freddy42OZ said:

 

 

The OP said "As anybody had an E-mail from Kbank asking to fill out 3 forms and return to them" 

I also received this email asking me to fill out the three forms they attached. 

The email has this line in it "The CRS aims to combat tax evasion by individuals residing outside Thailand and to ensure compliance with international taxation standards. In light of these requirements, we kindly request your cooperation in completing the following steps:" 

I replied to Kbank and pointed out that I am resident in Thailand and asked them why they want me to fill out forms for people who are not resident here.
 

 

Still waiting for a response.
 

 

I also responded to K Bank asking why they require me to complete. I'm a UK citizen residing in Thailand.  Awaiting response also

[CallumWK]

Just now, JohnnyBD said:

Not every customer. I didn't get this email, most probably because I am a US citizen and have already filled out these forms when I opened my accts. After reading most of the posts, it appears the emails are being sent mostly to non-US citizens.

I'm also a non-US citizen, and didn't receive the email, as I have filled in those documents (including those for US) at every bank I have accounts, when opening the accounts.

[steven.g]

I have received the email as well. I have another account with Krungthai Bank and am waiting to hear from them before proceeding. The forms themselves seem to be for US citizens

[mrbojangles]

Has anyone been into Kasikorn to check if this is a genuine email? I'm going to pop into my local one today.

 

I also opened the attachments,  which I never normally do unless I'm convinced it's real. Hope no malware was in it.

[cdnvic]

Removed a post that was just a really long AI creation..

 

You can find articles out there with the same info in them. I suggest posting a short synopsis and linking to the full article.

 

Posting in really long articles in full makes a topic difficult to read.

[Gobbler]

1 minute ago, steven.g said:

I have received the email as well. I have another account with Krungthai Bank and am waiting to hear from them before proceeding. The forms themselves seem to be for US citizens

Exactly.  What is a US citizen? Not me. I was born in the United States of America.

 

 

[10000Baht]

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

My Thai wife doesn't have a TIN, and she's lived here nearly 50 years.

Every Thai citizen (also your wife) has a Thai TIN, because it's their ID number!

Edited 1 hour ago by 10000Baht
forget

[Nid_Noi]

Nothing to be excited about. I receive the same documents (and more) from my foreign banks (US, French, Spanish, Thai) where I have or had accounts. I declare to the Canada Revenue Agency I own foreign bank accounts. In 40 years I never received any request for additional informations and never paid any taxes on my foreign holdings.

Canada does not care about what you own overseas as long as you don’t make an income from your overseas holdings. 
Many « snowbirds » own properties in the US, Mexico, Costa Rica, etc…and they list their properties for rent on internet or through real estate agents. For decades these landlords did not declare the rental income or got paid in cash. Now they need to prove taxes have been paid to either the country where the rental unit is or to the Canada Revenue Agency if Canadian resident.

I think this is the next step for foreigners being home owners in Thailand. Do you get any income from your home or condo?
Regarding the IRS forms they are standard reporting forms if you receive income, dividends, etc…from a US corp. Either you chose to add these incomes to your Canadian declaration or you may chose the withholding tax by the IRS. Not a big deal as long you can prove taxes have been paid.

In conclusion these procedures were the results of wealthy foreign investors (either European but mostly Chinese) buying big chunks of properties, land, houses and condos and getting rental incomes in order to pay the local taxes, maintenance fees and mortgages. But they did not declare the rental incomes. It started by housing relative students studying in North America; once the students graduated, they would rent the units to other foreign students (or fake students) through a network of very elaborate connections. They would even « sell » their cars to the next wave of « students ».

If you are not part of these « suckers » nothing to be worried about.

[Wrwest]

On 11/24/2024 at 5:09 AM, Chomper Higgot said:

It’s applicable to US Citizens and non U.S. citizens with taxable income from the U.S.

Interesting. I have not received but would reply with referring them to the Embassy of the United States to the Kingdom of Thailand, Bangkok.

[thailandsgreat]

I got three forms via email from Kasikorn and they ask for reply via email. I can't fill and sign via email. I am European and it looks like I maybe can fill out only the "FATCA" form. I guess I will best print it out, fill out and return it at a K office? Or maybe take a picture of it and email it back?

Edited 1 hour ago by thailandsgreat

[kingstonkid]

9 hours ago, Funkymover said:

Did everyone get these or just those that are living outside thailand ? In which case, how do they know we are living outside of the country 

I think it is safe to say that anyone with a Kasikorn account got this, whether we are Ameri cannot or not.

 

Just the IRS and U.S. government being a point in the asset.

[Wrwest]

On 11/24/2024 at 10:57 AM, Jingthing said:

Knock on wood I (US citizen) have accounts at three different Thai banks including kbank opened 20 years ago and haven't heard a peep. Of course I file FBARs. If the banks aren't going after me I will do nothing. 

While I file FBAR some years, if I do not hold over $10,000.00 usd in an account at any time during the year, I am not required to file FBAR. As to FACTA ... required only if over $50,000.00 usd so does not apply to me.

[UWEB]

6 minutes ago, kingstonkid said:

I think it is safe to say that anyone with a Kasikorn account got this, whether we are Ameri cannot or not.

 

Just the IRS and U.S. government being a point in the asset.

I guess it's a scam. On FAB 103 a guy reported this morning he has got the mail last night from "Kasikorn" but he doesn't even has an Account with the Bank.

[thailandsgreat]

Banks are scammers but this looks like Kasikorn all right to me.

[chang50]

Just been at  kbank for help with FACTA paperwork it was too easy.All they wanted was my name nationality passport number place of birth.They only want a Thai TIN number if you work in Thailand.Said tick no for all the US questions and ignore the tax resident in another country bit.Sign and date and the jobs a good 'un.Took 2 minutes.

[EvetsKram]

I received it yesterday. I'm Aussie and in Australia until first half of next year. I'm going to email them and ask if I can just bring my documents to them when I get back there

[turgid]

MIne was in junk mail so thanks for the heads up.

I spoke to the Kbank call centre this morning. Weary but kind.

Everyone must complete.

Non US citizens/ residents/ tax payers only need to complete part 2 of the form .

The email  said it must be returned by 20th Dec 2024

I pointed out that a TIN is mandatory on the form but i've been unable to get get a TIN even though I am resident for Thai Tax purposes.  I've been told that i can only get a TIN in Q1 2025.   She started down a holier than though track of you've had an account for 10 years how is that possible.

I responded with how many times have you asked and we agreed there might be some procedural problems related to administration and tax changes

They are going to call back later on whether i can wait until Q1.