Tax files

[newbee2022]

I went today to the tax office and collected attached forms.

It was interesting that the Lady was surprised to see me. Though I can understand it was about paying taxes.

The day before she explained that explicit "state" pensions are tax-free, but "private" pensions are taxable.

Chiang Mai.

[Will B Good]

 

 

Any mention of government pensions?

[Will B Good]

Second page, item 7.....do not like the look of that!!!!

[oldcpu]

1 hour ago, newbee2022 said:

I went today to the tax office and collected attached forms.

It was interesting that the Lady was surprised to see me. Though I can understand it was about paying taxes.

The day before she explained that explicit "state" pensions are tax-free, but "private" pensions are taxable.

Chiang Mai.

 

 

 

 

 

 That looks like the year 2023 tax return form.

 

Its not the year 2024 tax return form.

 

So when she stated "state" pensions are tax-free to you, I assume by that she meant, they are not to be included on the tax return form as they are non-assessable income.

 

The nation of your pension ? (apologies if you told me earlier and I forgot).  A lot as to what is tax exempt depends  on the source country of one's income.

 

Edit: The year 2023 tax forms can also be downloaded from here: https://www.rd.go.th/english/65308.html

[newbee2022]

7 minutes ago, oldcpu said:

 

 That looks like the year 2023 tax return form.

 

Its not the year 2024 tax return form.

 

So when she stated "state" pensions are tax-free to you, I assume by that she meant, they are not to be included on the tax return form as they are non-assessable income.

 

The nation of your pension ? (apologies if you told me earlier and I forgot).  A lot as to what is tax exempt depends  on the source country of one's income.

 

Edit: The year 2023 tax forms can also be downloaded from here: https://www.rd.go.th/english/65308.html

If you know everything please don't ask me. And your comments about the remarks of the officer are senseless

[Digitalbanana]

1 hour ago, Will B Good said:

Second page, item 7.....do not like the look of that!!!!

It says "by the Thai Embassy located in Thailand"?

[oldcpu]

1 hour ago, Will B Good said:

Second page, item 7.....do not like the look of that!!!!

 

I'm not surprised too much there ... if they are to process a tax return form from a foreigner, they prefer the language of any supporting documentation to be in Thai language (and to keep one honest they wish the translation to be certified).

 

Pardon me if I laugh a bit ... but this is going to be most interesting to watch all of this unfold ...

 

I think it drives home the point ... check one's DTA and be certain one needs to pay tax to Thailand (for if tax exempt in Thailand it may not be appropriate to put in a Thai tax return).

 

... and also understand the implications of Thai RD ministerial interpretation por.161/162 and whether one can make the case that remitted money to Thailand in year 2024 was actually pre-1-Jan-2024 savings/income, only recently in 2024 tax year remitted (and hence tax exempt and hence not appropriate for a Thai tax return).

[newbee2022]

10 minutes ago, oldcpu said:

I'm not surprised too much there ... if they are to process a tax return form from a foreigner, they prefer the language of any supporting documentation to be in Thai language (and to keep one honest they wish the translation to be certified).

That's wrong what you write. The tax office accept eg your bank statement in Thai or English.

A certified translation of supporting documents is not required.

[Will B Good]

Just now, newbee2022 said:

That's wrong what you write. The tax office accept eg your bank statement in Thai or English.

A certified translation of supporting documents is not required.

 

But that's not what item 7, page two says????

[oldcpu]

24 minutes ago, newbee2022 said:

And your comments about the remarks of the officer are senseless

 

What part of the reply I made don't you understand?

 

There is a discussion going on in this forum about whether non-taxable (ie tax free) remitted foreign income should be treated as assessable tax exempt income (and hence included on a tax form) , or treated as non-assessable income (and hence not included on a tax form).

 

I interpret the RD official , by stating that "state pensions" are tax free, she means it should not be included on a Thai tax return.  But you did not type that and I am curious if she stated that.  If she did, that would support the view that such a state pension is non-assessable and should not be included on a tax return.

[oldcpu]

6 minutes ago, newbee2022 said:

That's wrong what you write. The tax office accept eg your bank statement in Thai or English.

A certified translation of supporting documents is not required.

 

Its possible whether a non-Thai language statement is accepted could be up to the local RD office. 

 

Frankly I don't know, but I suspect each RD office has flexibility in its requirements and hence by having such in print it means if they are short of staff and don't have enough staff familiar with English language, they can insist on only Thai language.

 

[Guavaman]

21 minutes ago, oldcpu said:

Frankly I don't know, but I suspect each RD office has flexibility in its requirements and hence by having such in print it means if they are short of staff and don't have enough staff familiar with English language, they can insist on only Thai language.

 

This is the second report of a tax office providing the document titled: Case: Taxation of Foreigners; this time from Chiang Mai, while the first report did not mention the province.

 

This might indicate that this document with these instructions are the RD's handout provided to the local tax offices for distribution to foreign tax payers.  Could this be the long-awaited (by some) additional details provided by the RD?

 

[newbee2022]

27 minutes ago, oldcpu said:

 

What part of the reply I made don't you understand?

 

There is a discussion going on in this forum about whether non-taxable (ie tax free) remitted foreign income should be treated as assessable tax exempt income (and hence included on a tax form) , or treated as non-assessable income (and hence not included on a tax form).

 

I interpret the RD official , by stating that "state pensions" are tax free, she means it should not be included on a Thai tax return.  But you did not type that and I am curious if she stated that.  If she did, that would support the view that such a state pension is non-assessable and should not be included on a tax return.

Sorry, I can only repeat what the officer told me. For you, I suppose it's the best to go by yourself. Then you don't need to use assumptions which will lead to nowhere 

[newbee2022]

Just now, Guavaman said:

 

This is the second report of a tax office providing the document titled: Case: Taxation of Foreigners; this time from Chiang Mai, while the first report did not mention the province.

 

This might indicate that this document with these instructions are the RD's handout provided to the local tax offices for distribution to foreign tax payers.  Could this be the long-awaited (by some) additional details provided by the RD?

 

I can tell you that the officer did not expect many farangs

[4myr]

2 hours ago, newbee2022 said:

I went today to the tax office and collected attached forms.

It was interesting that the Lady was surprised to see me. Though I can understand it was about paying taxes.

The day before she explained that explicit "state" pensions are tax-free, but "private" pensions are taxable.

Chiang Mai.

 

If I understand you correctly, you came the second time to collect the tax forms, because of what the lady explained the day before, you need to file a tax return as your pension is taxable.

 

Did she explained also that some income is not taxable, like if you send savings from before 2024, it is tax free? Because page 2, item 3 assumes any money you send, is seen as non tax free.

[newbee2022]

7 minutes ago, 4myr said:

 

If I understand you correctly, you came the second time to collect the tax forms, because of what the lady explained the day before, you need to file a tax return as your pension is taxable.

 

Did she explained also that some income is not taxable, like if you send savings from before 2024, it is tax free? Because page 2, item 3 assumes any money you send, is seen as non tax free.

She told me, only the money what came into Thailand in 2024 is taxable. If this source is state pension only it's tax free

[KhunHeineken]

1 hour ago, Digitalbanana said:

It says "by the Thai Embassy located in Thailand"?

Yes, and when you find it, can you post on here where it is so we will all know where it is.

[oliverphoenix2]

In the box at the bottom of page 2 it says "In the case of a country with a double tax treaty. There is no need to present a tax return in Thailand. Except in cases where it is necessary to show it to the agency that needs it only."   Surely that flat out means that you do not need to file a tax return if your home country has a dta unless the RD specifically asks for one e.g. they audit you (even though you never filed a return for them to audit!).

[OJAS]

23 hours ago, newbee2022 said:

I can tell you that the officer did not expect many farangs

 

She's clearly not up to speed on what one of her big bosses in Bangkok has been saying recently, then, is she?

 

https://aseannow.com/topic/1347864-revenue-department-boss-calls-on-tax-residents-in-thailand-to-file-2024-returns-by-march-31

 

 

23 hours ago, newbee2022 said:

If this source is state pension only it's tax free

 

There are state pensions and state pensions. Depends on what the relevant DTA with Thailand has to say in particular circumstances.

 

[MangoKorat]

On 1/20/2025 at 12:27 PM, newbee2022 said:

The day before she explained that explicit "state" pensions are tax-free, but "private" pensions are taxable.

From the information I've read, under the DTA between Thailand and the UK, UK state pensions are assessable income whereas Government pensions are not. That does not necessarily mean you will pay tax on a UK state pension - the allowances are not too bad. All it means is that such income will be added to any other income and assessed for tax.

[NORDO]

More than 180 days present in Thailand in the year2024.

 

would this be the total of days on TV visa and Non O visa,

 

or

 

just the total of days present in Thailand on Non O visa?

[PomPolo]

On 1/20/2025 at 7:27 PM, newbee2022 said:

It was interesting that the Lady was surprised to see me. Though I can understand it was about paying taxes.

I'm not surprised I think you are probably the only one to do it so far!

[anchadian]

On 1/20/2025 at 7:27 PM, newbee2022 said:

I went today to the tax office and collected attached forms.

It was interesting that the Lady was surprised to see me. Though I can understand it was about paying taxes.

The day before she explained that explicit "state" pensions are tax-free, but "private" pensions are taxable.

Chiang Mai.

Why have your created a further tax thread when there are many already running?

[newbee2022]

31 minutes ago, PomPolo said:

I'm not surprised I think you are probably the only one to do it so far!

You can be next. Not overcrowded

[PomPolo]

1 minute ago, newbee2022 said:

You can be next. Not overcrowded

I thought about going and its the thought that counts

maybe next decade just in case there is a rush 🤪

[newbee2022]

2 hours ago, MangoKorat said:

From the information I've read, under the DTA between Thailand and the UK, UK state pensions are assessable income whereas Government pensions are not. That does not necessarily mean you will pay tax on a UK state pension - the allowances are not too bad. All it means is that such income will be added to any other income and assessed for tax.

Well, I watched a webinar with Carl Turner. He got with him 3 Thai experts. If you have a low income in 2024 you don't need to have a tax ID and don't need to fill in the tax form.

Also it only considers the income remitted to Thailand.

[newbee2022]

3 minutes ago, PomPolo said:

I thought about going and its the thought that counts

maybe next decade just in case there is a rush 🤪

I thought you're grown up and can decide by yourself to follow law or not.

[PomPolo]

5 minutes ago, newbee2022 said:

I thought you're grown up and can decide by yourself to follow law or not.

I have made my thoughts clear on this in many other forums.
In the UK the majority of the tax money spent goes to welfare the next highest amount goes to the NHS closely followed by others such as pensions, defence etc
I would be happy to pay tax here should I become eligible for social security, income support, pensions or free health care.  Can't see that happening, I can't even buy a house here!
And I haven't been called a 'grown up' for a while 🙂

[TigerandDog]

On 1/20/2025 at 9:27 PM, oldcpu said:

 

What part of the reply I made don't you understand?

 

There is a discussion going on in this forum about whether non-taxable (ie tax free) remitted foreign income should be treated as assessable tax exempt income (and hence included on a tax form) , or treated as non-assessable income (and hence not included on a tax form).

 

I interpret the RD official , by stating that "state pensions" are tax free, she means it should not be included on a Thai tax return.  But you did not type that and I am curious if she stated that.  If she did, that would support the view that such a state pension is non-assessable and should not be included on a tax return.

I refer you to my post last week about "My experience obtaining my tax refund".  In that post I mentioned that the manager of my district revenue office considered my state pension (Australian Aged pension) to be a social security payment, and therefore not assessable. She obtained confirmation from CM Revenue Office that govt/state pensions are not assessable and as such there was no need to declare them. I also mentioned in replies to comments that individuals should seek advice from their respective TRD as like most things in Thailand interpretations can & will differ from office to office and between officers within the same office.

[newbee2022]

43 minutes ago, PomPolo said:

I have made my thoughts clear on this in many other forums.
In the UK the majority of the tax money spent goes to welfare the next highest amount goes to the NHS closely followed by others such as pensions, defence etc
I would be happy to pay tax here should I become eligible for social security, income support, pensions or free health care.  Can't see that happening, I can't even buy a house here!
And I haven't been called a 'grown up' for a while 🙂

"And I haven't been called a 'grown up' for a while"

 

Well, every day a new surprise in the Land of Smile🤗.

No social security

No free health care

No "income support" (what is that?)

Not allowed to buy a house (of course you can)

 

Then, why you are here? UK seems to be a Paradise, isn't it? 😳