Trump’s Bold Proposal to End Gaza’s Cycle of Suffering

[Nick Carter icp]

7 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

It doesn’t beg any questions.

 

This is a thread discussing a single topic.

 

Your attempt at whataboutary is noted.

I am genuinely curios as to why everyone takes such an interest in the Palestinians cause and has no interest about any other groups in similar situations 

[Bkk Brian]

13 minutes ago, candide said:

They don't want them in tneir country. They want them in Palestine.

 

The Arab Peace Initiative (Arabic: مبادرة السلام العربية; Hebrew: יוזמת השלום הערבית), also known as the Saudi Initiative (Arabic: مبادرة السعودية; Hebrew: היוזמה הסעודית), is a 10 sentence proposal for an end to the Arab–Israeli conflict that was endorsed by the Arab League in 2002 at the Beirut Summit and re-endorsed at the 2007 and at the 2017 Arab League summits.[1] The initiative offers normalisation of relations by the Arab world with Israel, in return for a full withdrawal by Israel from the occupied territories (including the West Bank, Gaza, the Golan Heights, and Lebanon), with the possibility of comparable and mutual agreed minor swaps of the land between Israel and Palestine, a "just settlement" of the Palestinian refugee problem based on UN Resolution 194, and the establishment of a Palestinian state with East Jerusalem as its capital.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_Peace_Initiative

The Arab Peace Initiative included Iran as a signatory. The head of the snake. Besides which even though Israel were discussing talks Hamas then took over Gaza, all they wanted to do was strive for power and violence.

[Chomper Higgot]

1 minute ago, Nick Carter icp said:

I am genuinely curios as to why everyone takes such an interest in the Palestinians cause and has no interest about any other groups in similar situations 

Maybe because it’s the subject of the thread.

 

Just a thought.

[Chomper Higgot]

Meanwhile in Washington, Trump’s Gaza real estate dreams aren’t winning much support:

 

 

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/5129173-trump-gaza-proposal-reaction/amp/

[candide]

7 minutes ago, theblether said:

 

Comical answer proving you know nothing about Arab culture. 

 

If Arabs truly wanted that it would have happened already. 

I posted facts (whatever one may think about this initiative). You are posting vague allegations.

[Bkk Brian]

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

The two most prominent nations opposing the two state solution are Israel and Iran.

 

Edit: Text highlighted for clarity.

 

 

This topic is not about a two state solution by the way, have you actually read it? 

[Briggsy]

 Two state solution is the answer but Israel are currently not interested.

[Eloquent pilgrim]

28 minutes ago, Briggsy said:

 Two state solution is the answer but Israel are currently not interested.

And Hamas are ? 

[Briggsy]

3 minutes ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

And Hamas are ? 

Two state solution is the answer.

[Eloquent pilgrim]

10 minutes ago, Briggsy said:

Two state solution is the answer.

You’ve already said that and that Israel are not interested in it.

 

 I asked you if Hamas are interested in it ?

 

 

[Eloquent pilgrim]

1 hour ago, Briggsy said:

 Two state solution is the answer but Israel are currently not interested.

 

You are saying that a two state solution is the answer, but that Israel are not interested, so obviously blaming Israel with your statement; but when asked if Hamas are interested in a two state solution, you have no answer.

 

Might it be that you don’t want to answer because you know that the eradication of all jews, not just in Israel, but throughout the world, is in the founding charter of Hamas, so a two state solution is the last thing in the world they would want.

 

 

[CG1 Blue]

11 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

How about asking the Palestinians what they think about foreigners deciding their fate and the fate of their homelands?

 

 

And yet further down here you said the following: 

 

"Yes the restructuring needs to start with recognition of the Palestinian State.

That’s the internationally accepted solution."

 

So do you think the Palestinians should accept what foreigners want, or shouldn't? 

[Chomper Higgot]

11 minutes ago, CG1 Blue said:

And yet further down here you said the following: 

 

"Yes the restructuring needs to start with recognition of the Palestinian State.

That’s the internationally accepted solution."

 

So do you think the Palestinians should accept what foreigners want, or shouldn't? 

Are you pretending not to understand Palestinians right to self determination within their own State? 

[candide]

39 minutes ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

 

You are saying that a two state solution is the answer, but that Israel are not interested, so obviously blaming Israel with your statement; but when asked if Hamas are interested in a two state solution, you have no answer.

 

Might it be that you don’t want to answer because you know that the eradication of all jews, not just in Israel, but throughout the world, is in the founding charter of Hamas, so a two state solution is the last thing in the world they would want.

 

 

Hamas may not be, but the PA (Fatah) is.

[Bkk Brian]

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Are you pretending not to understand Palestinians right to self determination within their own State? 

I am sure he does, however most Palestinians do not want a two state solution

 

New poll reveals most Palestinians don’t want two-state solution — support for two states plunging especially in Gaza

Despite an aggressive push by U.S. President Joe Biden and other world leaders for Israel to accept the creation of a sovereign Palestinian state when the October 7th war ends, it is clear that most Palestinians do not support a two-state solution anymore.

Only 32% of Palestinians support a two-state solution at this point, according to a new poll conducted by Dr. Khalil Shikaki, director of the well-respected Palestinian Center for Policy and Survey Research (PCPSR) based in Ramallah, the effective capital of the Palestinian Authority in the West Bank.

Today, fully 65% of Palestinians oppose a two-state solution, the new survey revealed.

https://allarab.news/new-poll-reveals-most-palestinians-dont-want-two-state-solution-support-for-two-states-plunging-especially-in-gaza/

 

Dim Outlook for Peace in the Middle East
Hopes for resolution, two-state solution equally low in Israel, West Bank and East Jerusalem

In the West Bank and East Jerusalem, enthusiasm for the two-state solution is equally as low among respondents as it is in Israel. Slightly over a quarter (28%) support it, compared with 64% who do not. This is largely unchanged compared with 2023, just before the Oct. 7 attacks and subsequent escalation.

https://news.gallup.com/poll/650636/dim-outlook-peace-middle-east.aspx

 

[Nick Carter icp]

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Are you pretending not to understand Palestinians right to self determination within their own State? 

 

   They do not have a right to that privilege 

[CG1 Blue]

2 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Are you pretending not to understand Palestinians right to self determination within their own State? 

And yet you say they should accept an 'Internationally accepted' solution rather than decide themselves? 

Make your mind up

[Eloquent pilgrim]

9 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Are you pretending not to understand Palestinians right to self determination within their own State? 

 

They flushed that right down the gurgler on 7 October 2023; and only a raging antisemite would not understand that.

 

 

[Bkk Brian]

The man with the plan. Professor Joseph Pelzman is the guy that sent the rebuilding of Gaza proposal to Trump. Its now been published online and its very interesting.

 

Bit more about it here:

 

DC prof sent Trump study on Gaza relocation, development in July

An expert in economics and international relations and head of the university’s Center of Excellence for the Economic Study of the Middle East and North Africa (CEESMENA), Pelzman authored the plan and submitted it to Trump’s team as early as July 2024.

“I figured, well, why don’t I write sort of an out-of-the-box perspective on how to fix Gaza after the war is finished,” Pelzman told Barda. “The paper went to the Trump people because they were the ones who initially had an interest in it – not the Biden people. I was asked [by Trump’s team] to think outside the box on what do we do after [the war], as nobody was really talking about it.”

Moreover, because of the war that erupted following Hamas’s attack on Israel on October 7, 2023, the destruction in Gaza has become so extensive that it is beyond repair or reconstruction, according to the professor. In fact, according to Pelzman, no private or international investment entity would enter Gaza as things stand. “You have to restart it from scratch,” he told Barda.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/the-man-with-the-plan-dc-prof-sent-trump-gaza-relocation-development-study-in-july/

 

An Economic Plan for Rebuilding Gaza: A BOT Approach

The Hamas experiment, since Israel’s unilateral withdrawal from Gaza in 2005, has proven to be a complete failure. The reconstruction of Gaza after the October 7th Hamas invasion of Israel and year-long war between Israel and Hamas creates an opportunity to approach Gaza from a new paradigm based on a purely economic analysis. A computable general equilibrium (CGE) model presented in the paper is used to track a three-sector Gaza economy (tourism, agriculture and high tech) and will address alternative pathways for the development of this sovereign non-militarized green economy.  

https://www.skytopstrategies.com/capitalism-today-articles/an-economic-plan-for-rebuilding-gaza-a-bot-approach

 

Plan/Study download

https://ceesmena.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/10/An-Economic-Plan-for-Rebuilding-Gaza__A-BOT-Approach-_FINAL_July-21_2024.pdf

 

 

[Eloquent pilgrim]

17 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Not quite.

 

I have in the past absolutely accused you of lying when you made statements, always grossly prejudiced, that were lies.

 

And then only after giving you multiple opportunities to back up or withdraw your false statements.

 

I don’t care if you believe me, I have banked the rewards.

 

Now back to the topic of discussion please.

 

 

There you go again with your insidious double standards; willing to pursue calling me a liar over several comments, but when called out for lying yourself, you immediately bleat “back on topic” this is something you do every time you don’t like the way an exchange is going.

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

1 hour ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

 

They flushed that right down the gurgler on 7 October 2023; and only a raging antisemite would not understand that.

 

 

Back to using your baseless ‘antisemite’ slur again.

 

’Raging’ even.

 

[Chomper Higgot]

1 hour ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

 

 

There you go again with your insidious double standards; willing to pursue calling me a liar over several comments, but when called out for lying yourself, you immediately bleat “back on topic” this is something you do every time you don’t like the way an exchange is going.

 

 

Feel free to call out any lies you believe I post, but do it by demonstrating with facts. (Not differences of opinion).

 

And not by simply screaming ‘lie’.

Now please do return back to the topic of discussion.

 

[Eloquent pilgrim]

13 hours ago, Nick Carter icp said:

I am genuinely curios as to why everyone takes such an interest in the Palestinians cause and has no interest about any other groups in similar situations 

 

 

I think it’s because it is the most fashionable platform for moralising and virtue signalling, and certainly the one that has had the greatest publicity and management; that is certainly the case in the UK, where it gives Tiffany, Sebastian and Aphrodite an opportunity to wear the latest organically made keffiyeh, and chant student union slogans before enjoying a bottle or two of Prosecco at Pinkies.

 

They won’t of heard of the persecution of the Ahmadis, and the Uyghurs and Yazadis are so, so yesterday, don’t ya know.

 

At some of the protests in London, stalls had been set up where protesters could buy a Keffiyeh and different banners; one young lad was interviewed and asked what the banner he was holding up meant and he said “I don’t know, I just bought it from that stall over there”   ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

 

 

[Eloquent pilgrim]

30 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Back to using your baseless ‘antisemite’ slur again.

 

’Raging’ even.

 

 

 

There are several posters on here that are openly antisemitic, which they are free to be if they so choose; however, you now try to shut down the  use of the word by calling it a slur.

 

You, however, recently accused me of spreading Islamophobic hatred, and you didn’t seem to think using Islamophobic was a slur, and have been happy to throw it around like confetti, but to use antisemitic is now a slur.

 

Once again you demonstrate your double standards in true left wing fashion; with the burgeoning hypocrisy of each comment you make, you further diminish any credibility that you started out with.

 

 

 

 

[FruitPudding]

Make Gaza Great.

[Chomper Higgot]

1 minute ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

 

 

There are several posters on here that are openly antisemitic, which they are free to be if they so choose; however, you now try to shut down the  use of the word by calling it a slur.

 

You, however, recently accused me of spreading Islamophobic hatred, and you didn’t seem to think using Islamophobic was a slur, and have been happy to throw it around like confetti, but to use antisemitic is now a slur.

 

Once again you demonstrate your double standards in true left wing fashion; with the burgeoning hypocrisy of each comment you make, you further diminish any credibility that you started out with.

 

 

 

 

My goodness where to start.

 

I think you’ll find if I’ve called you Islamophobic, I don’t recall having done so, then I will have made specific reference to ‘Islamophobic’ remarks.

 

By all means challenge me when/if I have done so within the thread in which the statements are made and with actual quotes so we can both refer to the full context.

 

Now please can you get back to the topic of discussion.

 

 

 

[Eloquent pilgrim]

38 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Feel free to call out any lies you believe I post, but do it by demonstrating with facts. (Not differences of opinion).

 

And not by simply screaming ‘lie’.

Now please do return back to the topic of discussion.

 

 

 

Nope, you said “Having lived and worked in the region for many years I’d be surprised if any locals voiced their opinions in the matter to you”

 

I think this was a lie, and was said just to try and give your comments more weight; it is not for me to disprove, it is for you to prove.

 

When I posted about my personal experiences you called me a liar and asked me for evidence, now you want to completely reverse that procedure … more hypocrisy and double standards from you.

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

 

 

Nope, you said “Having lived and worked in the region for many years I’d be surprised if any locals voiced their opinions in the matter to you”

 

I think this was a lie, and was said just to try and give your comments more weight; it is not for me to disprove, it is for you to prove.

 

When I posted about my personal experiences you called me a liar and asked me for evidence, now you want to completely reverse that procedure … more hypocrisy and double standards from you.

 

 

Let me see if you can grasp this:

42 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Feel free to call out any lies you believe I post, but do it by demonstrating with facts. (Not differences of opinion).

 

And not by simply screaming ‘lie’.

Now please do return back to the topic of discussion.

 

You said it yourself:

“I think this was a lie”

 

Oh look, it’s your opinion again.

 

 

Now please do return to the topic of discussion, refer top of the thread.

 

 

 

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

29 minutes ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

 

 

I think it’s because it is the most fashionable platform for moralising and virtue signalling, and certainly the one that has had the greatest publicity and management; that is certainly the case in the UK, where it gives Tiffany, Sebastian and Aphrodite an opportunity to wear the latest organically made keffiyeh, and chant student union slogans before enjoying a bottle or two of Prosecco at Pinkies.

 

They won’t of heard of the persecution of the Ahmadis, and the Uyghurs and Yazadis are so, so yesterday, don’t ya know.

 

At some of the protests in London, stalls had been set up where protesters could buy a Keffiyeh and different banners; one young lad was interviewed and asked what the banner he was holding up meant and he said “I don’t know, I just bought it from that stall over there”   ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

 

 

Or it’s just because this is a thread discussing an inflammatory proposal on Gaza and the Palestinians.

[Eloquent pilgrim]

13 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

My goodness where to start.

 

I think you’ll find if I’ve called you Islamophobic, I don’t recall having done so, then I will have made specific reference to ‘Islamophobic’ remarks.

 

 

You said this to me on 6 Feb at 09.21

 

“No evidence just pure Islamophobic hate mongering”

 

You don’t think this is a slur, but using the word antisemite is a slur; as I have had to remind you on many occasions, the hypocrisy of your double standards is breathtaking.