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Sumud Flotilla Leaders Linked to Hamas and Muslim Brotherhood

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3 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

If as you state, when Israel are shown to be wrong they admit it, then I have not made a false statement and I shall not be retracting my correct statement.

 

I’m not convinced Israel admit all their false statements, but that’s another issue.

 

   I did not say that Israel frequently  makes false claims .

Being wrong about something and frequently making false statements are two very different things .

    If Israel reports something which is later found to incorrect , they will correct that .

  That is very different to frequently making false claims 

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7 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Does any rational person believe anything Israel says anymore?

Funny how Hamas attacked Israel, not the other way around but when Israel retaliates they are the ones in the wrong. The mentality that thinks like that is the mind of a very sick individual. I suggest you see a doctor immediately.

9 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   I did not say that Israel frequently  makes false claims .

Being wrong about something and frequently making false statements are two very different things .

    If Israel reports something which is later found to incorrect , they will correct that .

  That is very different to frequently making false claims 

I didn’t say you did.

 

 

16 minutes ago, Photoguy21 said:

Funny how Hamas attacked Israel, not the other way around but when Israel retaliates they are the ones in the wrong. The mentality that thinks like that is the mind of a very sick individual. I suggest you see a doctor immediately.

Given this thread is not discussing attacks by Hamas on Israel or attacks by Israel on Hamas I’m left wondering what on earth you are banging on about.

 

’see a doctor immediately’ you say!

 

You might want to take your own advice.

1 hour ago, Photoguy21 said:

Funny how Hamas attacked Israel, not the other way around but when Israel retaliates they are the ones in the wrong. The mentality that thinks like that is the mind of a very sick individual. I suggest you see a doctor immediately.

The left is still mad at Isreal over the holocaust.  

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

It’s a drawing Nick, it can be made to illustrate anything.

 

That is not proof that what the drawing illustrates is true.

 

A graphic is often used to illustrate evidence in a form that's easily understood.  Lawyers use graphics all the time to present evidence in court.   I suggest you look at the evidence Israel gives and then tell us what's false about it.

You can read and see the evidence in the 22-page report by The Ministry for Diaspora Affairs and Combating Antisemitism.  It's titled "'Global Sumud Flotilla': A Humanitarian Cover with Documented Links to Hamas and the Muslim Brotherhood." (https://www.gov.il/en/pages/global_sumud_flotilla_hamas_muslim_brotherhood_links)

The report states: "The findings indicate that the planned Global Sumud Flotilla is operated by an international network with ties to the Hamas terrorist organization, the Muslim Brotherhood and other extremist groups."

In what way is that conclusion false?

Much of the evidence is culled from Web sites and social media pages belonging to Hamas and associated groups.  From page 4 of the report (I inserted the yellow arrow):

 

sarri.png.171048cbfcd1d0de80b76c0f93a293f1.png

 

And from page 12:

 

AbuK.jpg.ea2d8e9bea30ac08898f6dff21c96b06.jpg

 

 

3 hours ago, Jeff the Chef said:

 

If that is the case they need to change their plans, it's not work since their creation in 1948, they were terrorists then as well.

 

When Israel declared independence in1948, it had 800,000 inhabitants who stood against the 75 million Arabs in the Arab League countries.  The belligerent Arab countries that sent forces against Israel a population of about 35 million.  It's amazing by any standard that the Jews of Israel by themselves could win against such huge odds.  I'd say their plans have worked out quite well over the years, given the constant attacks against them by enemies who massively outnumber the Jews of Israel.  

 

Today Israel is not battling national armies but terrorist groups such as Hamas and Hezbollah.  It's a tough fight, but nowhere as bad as it could be.

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9 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Does any rational person believe anything Israel says anymore?

People on your side of the argument regularly quote stuff put out by Hamas, e.g. death toll etc. without questioning it. 

 

9 minutes ago, CG1 Blue said:

People on your side of the argument regularly quote stuff put out by Hamas, e.g. death toll etc. without questioning it. 

 

I don't think anyone believes the hamas statistics.

45 minutes ago, stevenl said:

I don't think anyone believes the hamas statistics.

 

Apparently both the AP and @Jeff the Chef do.

 

4 hours ago, Jeff the Chef said:

...  65 thousand deaths in Gaza, so far.

 

Israeli troops press forward into Gaza City as Palestinians flee and death toll passes 65,000

JERUSALEM (AP) — The Palestinian death toll in the Israel-Hamas war surpassed 65,000 on Wednesday, according to Gaza’s Health Ministry, as Israeli troops and tanks pushed deeper into Gaza City and residents fled the devastated area.

...

The death count in Gaza reached 65,062, with another 165,697 wounded, since Hamas’ Oct. 7, 2023, attack, said the Health Ministry, which is part of the Hamas-run government.

https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-wars-09-17-2025-902e4a41eb3c5802fd18c598083d247a

3 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

 

Israel frequently engage in misinformation and make false claims, you admit as much yourself.

 

 

"I did not say that Israel frequently  makes false claims ."

 

 

 

2 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

I didn’t say you did.

 

   May as well leave this here .

Nothing more to add .

 

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11 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Does any rational person believe anything Israel says anymore?

Ok, so, you are dismissing the Israeli claim outright. The evidence presented in the thread is compelling, and yet you still dismiss the Israeli position.  Why is it inaccurate or unbelievable? What was factually  incorrect?

11 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Does any rational person believe anything Israel says anymore?

Personally I would believe them before I believed Thunberg.

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2 minutes ago, Celsius said:

A legit target then

Not in the slightest.

 

The murderous IDF, under the Zionist war criminal cabinet and its PM, Netanyahu, attacking yet another neutral country. The pretend to want peace , yet they even attack the Palestinian peace negotiators in Qatar. yet another neutral country.

 

But some people, even on this forum, actually believe the BS propaganda coming from the Israeli news.

16 minutes ago, billd766 said:

Not in the slightest.

 

The murderous IDF, under the Zionist war criminal cabinet and its PM, Netanyahu, attacking yet another neutral country. The pretend to want peace , yet they even attack the Palestinian peace negotiators in Qatar. yet another neutral country.

 

But some people, even on this forum, actually believe the BS propaganda coming from the Israeli news.

 

   They were Hamas war criminals being shielded by Qatar .

There is no hiding place for Hamas 

1 hour ago, billd766 said:

But some people, even on this forum, actually believe the BS propaganda coming from the Israeli news.

 

Maybe you could give an example of something you think is "BS propaganda" in the Israeli news? There has definitely been a shortage of "Israeli lies" in these threads on AN. Strange, considering if they were so common, the antisem-  I mean anti-Zionists- wouldn't have trouble finding them.

9 hours ago, Evil Penevil said:

 

Apparently both the AP and @Jeff the Chef do.

 

 

Israeli troops press forward into Gaza City as Palestinians flee and death toll passes 65,000

JERUSALEM (AP) — The Palestinian death toll in the Israel-Hamas war surpassed 65,000 on Wednesday, according to Gaza’s Health Ministry, as Israeli troops and tanks pushed deeper into Gaza City and residents fled the devastated area.

...

The death count in Gaza reached 65,062, with another 165,697 wounded, since Hamas’ Oct. 7, 2023, attack, said the Health Ministry, which is part of the Hamas-run government.

https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-wars-09-17-2025-902e4a41eb3c5802fd18c598083d247a

AP is quoting it's source, expressing doubts about the numbers.

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32 minutes ago, stevenl said:

AP is quoting it's source, expressing doubts about the numbers.

In addition, due to Israeli policies, not many alternatives available.

12 hours ago, Evil Penevil said:

 

A graphic is often used to illustrate evidence in a form that's easily understood.  Lawyers use graphics all the time to present evidence in court.   I suggest you look at the evidence Israel gives and then tell us what's false about it.

You can read and see the evidence in the 22-page report by The Ministry for Diaspora Affairs and Combating Antisemitism.  It's titled "'Global Sumud Flotilla': A Humanitarian Cover with Documented Links to Hamas and the Muslim Brotherhood." (https://www.gov.il/en/pages/global_sumud_flotilla_hamas_muslim_brotherhood_links)

The report states: "The findings indicate that the planned Global Sumud Flotilla is operated by an international network with ties to the Hamas terrorist organization, the Muslim Brotherhood and other extremist groups."

In what way is that conclusion false?

Much of the evidence is culled from Web sites and social media pages belonging to Hamas and associated groups.  From page 4 of the report (I inserted the yellow arrow):

 

sarri.png.171048cbfcd1d0de80b76c0f93a293f1.png

 

And from page 12:

 

AbuK.jpg.ea2d8e9bea30ac08898f6dff21c96b06.jpg

 

 

 

When Israel declared independence in1948, it had 800,000 inhabitants who stood against the 75 million Arabs in the Arab League countries.  The belligerent Arab countries that sent forces against Israel a population of about 35 million.  It's amazing by any standard that the Jews of Israel by themselves could win against such huge odds.  I'd say their plans have worked out quite well over the years, given the constant attacks against them by enemies who massively outnumber the Jews of Israel.  

 

Today Israel is not battling national armies but terrorist groups such as Hamas and Hezbollah.  It's a tough fight, but nowhere as bad as it could be.

Graphics are not evidence.

 

They are just another means to present information, often to people with low reading skills.

 

They are not a validation of the information being presented.

11 hours ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

"I did not say that Israel frequently  makes false claims ."

 

 

 

 

   May as well leave this here .

Nothing more to add .

 

Yes leave it there.

 

 

10 hours ago, Patong2021 said:

Ok, so, you are dismissing the Israeli claim outright. The evidence presented in the thread is compelling, and yet you still dismiss the Israeli position.  Why is it inaccurate or unbelievable? What was factually  incorrect?

No, I’m asking the very same question you quoted me asking.

 

“Does any rational person believe anything Israel says anymore?”

 

Israel engage in propaganda, any rational person will question the claims Israel make.

10 hours ago, JAG said:

Personally I would believe them before I believed Thunberg.


Each person has the right to choose who they believe.

9 hours ago, Evil Penevil said:

 

Maybe you could give an example of something you think is "BS propaganda" in the Israeli news? There has definitely been a shortage of "Israeli lies" in these threads on AN. Strange, considering if they were so common, the antisem-  I mean anti-Zionists- wouldn't have trouble finding them.


here you go:

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cp317zx3r93o

 

And it turned out Israel were lying:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/apr/06/israeli-military-admits-initial-account-of-palestinian-medics-killing-was-mistaken

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:


Each person has the right to choose who they believe.

Which is precisely why I said "personally".

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

 

Contrary to your claim, the example you cite demonstrates honesty. Israel admits to an error and accepts responsibility. Quite different than the constant barrage of falsehoods from Hamas and its enablers and sympathizers.

27 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

 

Contrary to your claim, the example you cite demonstrates honesty. Israel admits to an error and accepts responsibility. Quite different than the constant barrage of falsehoods from Hamas and its enablers and sympathizers.

It does no such thing.

 

It demonstrates Israel making false statements and then backtracking when video footage recovered from a phone on the body of a medic slaughtered and dumper in a mass grave by Israel.

 

Israel got caught lying about slaughtering medics, the evidence was solid, the international response forced Israel to retract the lies Israel told in the matter.

 

And once again, questioning Israel and pointing out Israel’s use of false information , lies and propaganda is not believing, enabling or sympathizing with Hamas.

 

Your resort to the Hamas slur reeks of desperation.

2 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

It does no such thing.

 

It demonstrates Israel making false statements and then backtracking when video footage recovered from a phone on the body of a medic slaughtered and dumper in a mass grave by Israel.

 

Israel got caught lying about slaughtering medics, the evidence was solid, the international response forced Israel to retract the lies Israel told in the matter.

 

And once again, questioning Israel and pointing out Israel’s use of false information , lies and propaganda is not believing, enabling or sympathizing with Hamas.

 

Your resort to the Hamas slur reeks of desperation.

 

You are  making assumptions based upon a biased  position. In war, mistakes occur. The Israeli statement was rushed out to respond to inquiries and was based upon a field report that was erroneous and mixed up circumstances. There had been a fire fight with Hamas including Hamas militants in vehicles prior to the "ambulance" event. Those vehicles were not identified as ambulances, nor were they  "lit up". The  person writing the report included the ambulances in their report and was wrong. Errors like that are common in war zones. Combat soldiers give verbal reports to the rear and the administration clerk writes up the information. That person or persons made erroneous assumptions about the ambulance that was hit. Don't assume that  IDF clerical staff are top notch.  Some of them are poorly educated, lazy  and downright stupid. In the IDF the useless type of people are put into clerical roles. I can easily see some slob not verifying and putting down whatever he or she thought would pass. It would not be the first time corners were cut and regulations not followed.

 

The reality of Gaza is that Hamas does use ambulances to transport militants and supplies. It is understandable why and how an ambulance  could be seen as a legitimate target when there was a fire fight prior to the ambulance's arrival. The firefight that occurred prior to the ambulance event  resulted in  2 Hamas militants dead and 2 captured.The captured personnel had been armed and readily admitted to being  Hamas militants, even though they were dressed as civilians. There was no conspiracy. The reality of war is that information is often fractured and incomplete. Friendly fire casualties are also a common occurrence. 

 

18 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Given this thread is not discussing attacks by Hamas on Israel or attacks by Israel on Hamas I’m left wondering what on earth you are banging on about.

 

’see a doctor immediately’ you say!

 

You might want to take your own advice.

I agree but unfortunately there are many blind people around who want to blame Israel for everything whilst at the same time conveniently forgetting who started it all.

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