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Patriotic Ohio Senator's Proposed Bill Would Snare 2 Trumps

Featured Replies

Ohio Senator Bernie Moreno plans to introduce legislation which would end dual citizenship by requiring citizens to declare their “exclusive allegiance” to the U.S...

Both Melania and Barron Trump remain dual citizens of the U.S. and Slovenia, and would be potentially impacted by Moreno’s planned legislation.
Melania, who was born in Slovenia, is only the second first lady born outside of America, after Louisa Adams, the wife of President John Quincy Adams. She was born in London in 1775.

In her 2024 book The Art of Her Deal, Pulitzer Prize-winning Washington Post reporter Mary Jordan said Melania, 55, and Barron Trump, 19, remain dual citizens.

https://archive.ph/9wJuI#selection-869.0-873.123

 

Clearly a case of divided loyalties. And these 2 security threats are allowed to roam the White House?  At the very least they should be compelled to live half of every year in Slovenia. Which, from what little I know about that country, would actually be a pretty great deal.

Please pardon my cutting and pasting all over the place.

 

"Roughly 9 million Americans hold dual citizenship. Moreno’s bill would force all of them to pick a country within 12 months or face automatic expatriation from the United States."

 

It affects "Americans who married foreign nationals and obtained spousal citizenship... Americans who obtained foreign citizenship for work, tax, or family reasons."

 

"In 1958, the Supreme Court ruled in Trop v. Dulles that stripping citizenship as punishment violates the Eighth Amendment’s prohibition on cruel and unusual punishment. Chief Justice Earl Warren wrote that citizenship is “a right protected by the Fourteenth Amendment” that cannot be taken away without voluntary renunciation."

 

https://www.usconstitution.net/the-dual-citizenship-ban-that-would-force-millions-to-pick-a-country-or-lose-america/

 

 There are a few ways to lose your US citizenship but regarding this case would be by formally renouncing it. 

 

"A formal renunciation of U.S. Nationality can only be made in front of a Diplomatic or consular officer of the United States in a foreign state."

 

"The U.S. Supreme Court has spoken (Afroyim v. Rusk, 387 U.S. 253 (1967) and Vance v. Terrazas, 444 U.S. 252 (1980)):  a person cannot lose U.S. nationality unless he or she voluntarily relinquishes that status."

 

 https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal/travel-legal-considerations/us-citizenship.html

 

Dual citizenship, in the case of Thailand, would be for practical reasons such as owning land, owning a business, traveling to ASEAN nations under a Thai passport, etc.

 

SCOTUS will prevent this from becoming law. 

 

Now if our esteemed Congress will keep their mouths shut unlike that knucklehead Democratic Rep. Delia Ramirez of Illinois who said, "I’m a proud Guatemalan before I’m an American" maybe this all will whither on the vine. I'm more interested in the eradication of the national debt, illegal immigration, and the seemingly successful operation to change America into a socialist caliphate. 🫣  

  • Author

It's an interesting question. Is stripping the citizenship of an American and leaving them stateless, the same thing as giving a dual citizen the option of choosing which citizenship they wish to keep? I would say that the former is a punishment but it's not so clear that the latter is.

Still, in the unlikely event that the bill does make it into law and Melania and Baron opt for Slovenian citizenship, I hope the White House won't hide the two of them  when ICE comes calling.

27 minutes ago, Alan Zweibel said:

It's an interesting question. Is stripping the citizenship of an American and leaving them stateless, the same thing as giving a dual citizen the option of choosing which citizenship they wish to keep? I would say that the former is a punishment but it's not so clear that the latter is.

A quick survey of how the US government could punish a citizen by revoking their US citizenship (Thank you Forbes):

 

"Become a citizen of another country or declaring allegiance to another country and then accepting a position in that country’s government can cause the loss of your U.S. nationality especially if the person also had a specific intent to renounce U.S. citizenship.

 

If you join another country’s military when they are engaged in hostilities against the U.S., or if you become an officer in another country’s military, this can be seen as a voluntary revocation of your citizenship.

 

Apply for citizenship elsewhere with the intent to renounce U.S. citizenship.

 

Treason."

 

https://www.forbes.com/advisor/legal/immigration-law/can-us-citizenship-be-revoked/

 

See the common factor in all of these reasons? Intent.

 

This bill revokes your citizenship if you do nothing after one year. If you do not choose, you lose. No intent to do anything. Where's the person's intent to renounce citizenship? 

 

As I understand it, the law says renouncing citizenship is a deliberate and intentional action that must be initiated by the person.

 

Losing your citizenship just because you did not do what the government demanded you to do... you did nothing... take it to the extreme... maybe you need to lose your citizenship if you don't pledge allegiance to a political party! Lost yet another freedom.

 

I don't like stuff like this being produced by our government.

 

Here's a little ditty I found on the web. It's non-partisan and surely compliments my personal ideals3e.

 

Imagine every classroom,

Learning how we all belong.

The rights that guard our freedom,

The duties that keep us strong.

Imagine all the people

Knowing where their power lives…

 

You may say it’s just a lesson,

But it’s the start of something true.

When every voice can understand it,

There’s nothing we can’t choose to do.

 

Picture children reading

How checks and balances are made.

Debates without the anger,

Decisions we’re not afraid.

Imagine every voter

Knowing why their choices matter…

 

You may say it’s just a textbook,

But it teaches us to see—

That liberty is not a mystery,

It’s a promise we must keep.

 

Oh, a nation built on ideals

Needs hearts that know the past.

If we learn the Constitution,

Maybe this time it can last.

 

Imagine all the neighbors

Talking through what’s just and fair.

Disagreeing kindly,

Because we know what rights we share.

Imagine all the people

Lifting up the common good…

 

You may say it’s only civics,

But it shapes the world we make.

If we teach it to each other,

There’s no dream we cannot wake.

 

Imagine if we all learned
How our government was made—
The rights we all are born with,
The rules that cannot fade.
Imagine people knowing
What the Constitution says…


It’s not a dream or mystery,
Just lessons we should share.
When everyone understands their freedoms,
We build a country that’s more fair.


Imagine kids in classrooms
Learning how the branches work—
How power checks on power,
So no one gets to hurt.
Imagine every voter
Knowing how their choices count…


It’s not a dream or mystery,
Just knowledge we can spread.
When people see the whole design,
They won’t be easily misled.


A nation only functions
When people know the plan.
If we’re taught the basic principles,
We can hold the power in our hands.


Imagine honest conversations
About what’s right and fair—
Not shouting, but understanding
The rights we all must share.
Imagine all the people
Who know what they’re standing for…


It’s not a dream or mystery,
It’s something we can teach.
When everyone knows the founding truths,
Real unity’s in reach.

 

Would ICE obey the six Democrats ala "Don't give up the ship" and disobey the order to arrest Melania and Baron if they did nothing (not choose allegiance/renounce) after their one year is up?😑🤩

  • Author
3 minutes ago, mymonkeyhusb said:

A quick survey of how the US government could punish a citizen by revoking their US citizenship (Thank you Forbes):

 

"Become a citizen of another country or declaring allegiance to another country and then accepting a position in that country’s government can cause the loss of your U.S. nationality especially if the person also had a specific intent to renounce U.S. citizenship.

 

If you join another country’s military when they are engaged in hostilities against the U.S., or if you become an officer in another country’s military, this can be seen as a voluntary revocation of your citizenship.

 

Apply for citizenship elsewhere with the intent to renounce U.S. citizenship.

 

Treason."

 

https://www.forbes.com/advisor/legal/immigration-law/can-us-citizenship-be-revoked/

 

See the common factor in all of these reasons? Intent.

 

This bill revokes your citizenship if you do nothing after one year. If you do not choose, you lose. No intent to do anything. Where's the person's intent to renounce citizenship? 

 

As I understand it, the law says renouncing citizenship is a deliberate and intentional action that must be initiated by the person.

 

Losing your citizenship just because you did not do what the government demanded you to do... you did nothing... take it to the extreme... maybe you need to lose your citizenship if you don't pledge allegiance to a political party! Lost yet another freedom.

 

I don't like stuff like this being produced by our government.

 

Here's a little ditty I found on the web. It's non-partisan and surely compliments my personal ideals3e.

 

Imagine every classroom,

Learning how we all belong.

The rights that guard our freedom,

The duties that keep us strong.

Imagine all the people

Knowing where their power lives…

 

You may say it’s just a lesson,

But it’s the start of something true.

When every voice can understand it,

There’s nothing we can’t choose to do.

 

Picture children reading

How checks and balances are made.

Debates without the anger,

Decisions we’re not afraid.

Imagine every voter

Knowing why their choices matter…

 

You may say it’s just a textbook,

But it teaches us to see—

That liberty is not a mystery,

It’s a promise we must keep.

 

Oh, a nation built on ideals

Needs hearts that know the past.

If we learn the Constitution,

Maybe this time it can last.

 

Imagine all the neighbors

Talking through what’s just and fair.

Disagreeing kindly,

Because we know what rights we share.

Imagine all the people

Lifting up the common good…

 

You may say it’s only civics,

But it shapes the world we make.

If we teach it to each other,

There’s no dream we cannot wake.

 

Imagine if we all learned
How our government was made—
The rights we all are born with,
The rules that cannot fade.
Imagine people knowing
What the Constitution says…


It’s not a dream or mystery,
Just lessons we should share.
When everyone understands their freedoms,
We build a country that’s more fair.


Imagine kids in classrooms
Learning how the branches work—
How power checks on power,
So no one gets to hurt.
Imagine every voter
Knowing how their choices count…


It’s not a dream or mystery,
Just knowledge we can spread.
When people see the whole design,
They won’t be easily misled.


A nation only functions
When people know the plan.
If we’re taught the basic principles,
We can hold the power in our hands.


Imagine honest conversations
About what’s right and fair—
Not shouting, but understanding
The rights we all must share.
Imagine all the people
Who know what they’re standing for…


It’s not a dream or mystery,
It’s something we can teach.
When everyone knows the founding truths,
Real unity’s in reach.

 

Would ICE obey the six Democrats ala "Don't give up the ship" and disobey the order to arrest Melania and Baron if they did nothing (not choose allegiance/renounce) after their one year is up?😑🤩

The law as it's written now specifies intent. Bernie Moreno proposes to change that law. What's so hard to understand about that? Maybe in the very unlikely event that it got passed, the Supreme Court might find it violates the Constitution. But that's another issue.

  • Author
9 minutes ago, mymonkeyhusb said:

A quick survey of how the US government could punish a citizen by revoking their US citizenship (Thank you Forbes):

 

"Become a citizen of another country or declaring allegiance to another country and then accepting a position in that country’s government can cause the loss of your U.S. nationality especially if the person also had a specific intent to renounce U.S. citizenship.

 

If you join another country’s military when they are engaged in hostilities against the U.S., or if you become an officer in another country’s military, this can be seen as a voluntary revocation of your citizenship.

 

Apply for citizenship elsewhere with the intent to renounce U.S. citizenship.

 

Treason."

 

https://www.forbes.com/advisor/legal/immigration-law/can-us-citizenship-be-revoked/

 

See the common factor in all of these reasons? Intent.

 

This bill revokes your citizenship if you do nothing after one year. If you do not choose, you lose. No intent to do anything. Where's the person's intent to renounce citizenship? 

 

As I understand it, the law says renouncing citizenship is a deliberate and intentional action that must be initiated by the person.

 

Losing your citizenship just because you did not do what the government demanded you to do... you did nothing... take it to the extreme... maybe you need to lose your citizenship if you don't pledge allegiance to a political party! Lost yet another freedom.

 

I don't like stuff like this being produced by our government.

 

Here's a little ditty I found on the web. It's non-partisan and surely compliments my personal ideals3e.

 

Imagine every classroom,

Learning how we all belong.

The rights that guard our freedom,

The duties that keep us strong.

Imagine all the people

Knowing where their power lives…

 

You may say it’s just a lesson,

But it’s the start of something true.

When every voice can understand it,

There’s nothing we can’t choose to do.

 

Picture children reading

How checks and balances are made.

Debates without the anger,

Decisions we’re not afraid.

Imagine every voter

Knowing why their choices matter…

 

You may say it’s just a textbook,

But it teaches us to see—

That liberty is not a mystery,

It’s a promise we must keep.

 

Oh, a nation built on ideals

Needs hearts that know the past.

If we learn the Constitution,

Maybe this time it can last.

 

Imagine all the neighbors

Talking through what’s just and fair.

Disagreeing kindly,

Because we know what rights we share.

Imagine all the people

Lifting up the common good…

 

You may say it’s only civics,

But it shapes the world we make.

If we teach it to each other,

There’s no dream we cannot wake.

 

Imagine if we all learned
How our government was made—
The rights we all are born with,
The rules that cannot fade.
Imagine people knowing
What the Constitution says…


It’s not a dream or mystery,
Just lessons we should share.
When everyone understands their freedoms,
We build a country that’s more fair.


Imagine kids in classrooms
Learning how the branches work—
How power checks on power,
So no one gets to hurt.
Imagine every voter
Knowing how their choices count…


It’s not a dream or mystery,
Just knowledge we can spread.
When people see the whole design,
They won’t be easily misled.


A nation only functions
When people know the plan.
If we’re taught the basic principles,
We can hold the power in our hands.


Imagine honest conversations
About what’s right and fair—
Not shouting, but understanding
The rights we all must share.
Imagine all the people
Who know what they’re standing for…


It’s not a dream or mystery,
It’s something we can teach.
When everyone knows the founding truths,
Real unity’s in reach.

 

Would ICE obey the six Democrats ala "Don't give up the ship" and disobey the order to arrest Melania and Baron if they did nothing (not choose allegiance/renounce) after their one year is up?😑🤩

Actually, I think the six conservative justices on the Supreme court should read and reread that poem. As of now, they seem quite intent on creating an imperial presidency.

Just now, Alan Zweibel said:

Actually, I think the six conservative justices on the Supreme court should read and reread that poem. As of now, they seem quite intent on creating an imperial presidency.

Agreed and going further that we all need a refresher course on founding principles.

38 minutes ago, Alan Zweibel said:

Actually, I think the six conservative justices on the Supreme court should read and reread that poem. As of now, they seem quite intent on creating an imperial presidency.

It's obvious you know very little about this topic.    You need to read this book

 

https://www.amazon.com/Imperial-Presidency-Pa-04/dp/0618420010

 

From two-time Pulitzer Prize–winning historian Arthur M. Schlesinger, Jr., comes one of the most important and influential investigations of the American presidency. The Imperial Presidency traces the growth of presidential power over two centuries, from George Washington to George W. Bush, examining how it has both served and harmed the Constitution and what Americans can do about it in years to come. The book that gave the phrase “imperial presidency” to the language, this is a work of “substantial scholarship written with lucidity, charm, and wit” (The New Yorker).

 

 

  • Author
1 minute ago, TedG said:

It's obvious you know very little about this topic.    You need to read this book

 

https://www.amazon.com/Imperial-Presidency-Pa-04/dp/0618420010

 

From two-time Pulitzer Prize–winning historian Arthur M. Schlesinger, Jr., comes one of the most important and influential investigations of the American presidency. The Imperial Presidency traces the growth of presidential power over two centuries, from George Washington to George W. Bush, examining how it has both served and harmed the Constitution and what Americans can do about it in years to come. The book that gave the phrase “imperial presidency” to the language, this is a work of “substantial scholarship written with lucidity, charm, and wit” (The New Yorker).

 

 

Fair enough. But the Supreme Court has taken it to astonishing new extremes.

Just now, Alan Zweibel said:

Fair enough. But the Supreme Court has taken it to astonishing new extremes.

How so? 

  • Author
Just now, TedG said:

How so? 

That even though the Constitution grants the President the right to veto a law only once, in effect he can veto laws as much as he likes by refusing to spend funds or trashing departments that adminster those funds

 

That the President cannot ever be prosecuted for crimes he has committed using the official powers of his office

Just now, Alan Zweibel said:

That even though the Constitution grants the President the right to veto a law only once, in effect he can veto laws as much as he likes by refusing to spend funds or trashing departments that adminster those funds

 

That the President cannot ever be prosecuted for crimes he has committed using the official powers of his office

What court ruling are you referring to?   

Something interesting about Melania and Barron...

 

When I was inquiring about dual citizenship of Slovenia and Thailand back in the day, I was told that I can have dual citizenship as long as both of them are EU countries. Thailand isn't. But then again, neither is the US.

So, rightfully, according to those rules, both of them should be stripped of Slovenian citizenship by law anyway... as it can't be that Slovenian government isn't aware of it...

I didn't know that about Barron. Regardless of any law if he ever wants to be president some day, he'll be dropping the Slovenian citizenship anyway.

  • Author
Just now, Alan Zweibel said:

All this relates to what is called the Unitary Executive Theory. Here's something I should have included.

Originalist ‘Bombshell’ Complicates Case on Trump’s Power to Fire Officials

As the Supreme Court seems poised to expand the president’s power, a leading scholar whose work the justices have often cited issued a provocative dissent.

https://archive.ph/JTBYX#selection-505.0-505.155

12 minutes ago, Alan Zweibel said:

Fair enough. But the Supreme Court has taken it to astonishing new extremes.

Here is a .pdf summary of the book

 

https://cdn.bookey.app/files/pdf/book/en/the-imperial-presidency.pdf

 

Congress has shoved too much power into the executive branch, and this really took off during the FDR years.  People are fine with the imperial president as long as the POTUS is doing something they favor.   

  • Author
6 minutes ago, TedG said:

You don't think the POTUS should have the power to reduce the federal workforce? 

Not if it means laws authorized by Congress can't be carried out. Why do you think the President is called the Chief Executive. It's because he's supposed to execute the laws passed by Congress and signed by himself or previous Presidents.

Here's what the constitution says (boldface mine)

"He shall from time to time give to the Congress Information of the State of the Union, and recommend to their Consideration such Measures as he shall judge necessary and expedient; he may, on extraordinary Occasions, convene both Houses, or either of them, and in Case of Disagreement between them, with Respect to the Time of Adjournment, he may adjourn them to such Time as he shall think proper; he shall receive Ambassadors and other public Ministers; he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, and shall Commission all the Officers of the United States."

  • Author
20 minutes ago, tomazbodner said:

Something interesting about Melania and Barron...

 

When I was inquiring about dual citizenship of Slovenia and Thailand back in the day, I was told that I can have dual citizenship as long as both of them are EU countries. Thailand isn't. But then again, neither is the US.

So, rightfully, according to those rules, both of them should be stripped of Slovenian citizenship by law anyway... as it can't be that Slovenian government isn't aware of it...

Interesting. 

1 hour ago, Alan Zweibel said:

Not if it means laws authorized by Congress can't be carried out. Why do you think the President is called the Chief Executive. It's because he's supposed to execute the laws passed by Congress and signed by himself or previous Presidents.

Here's what the constitution says (boldface mine)

"He shall from time to time give to the Congress Information of the State of the Union, and recommend to their Consideration such Measures as he shall judge necessary and expedient; he may, on extraordinary Occasions, convene both Houses, or either of them, and in Case of Disagreement between them, with Respect to the Time of Adjournment, he may adjourn them to such Time as he shall think proper; he shall receive Ambassadors and other public Ministers; he shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed, and shall Commission all the Officers of the United States."

Is there a law that states the size of the federal workforce?

  • Author
7 hours ago, TedG said:

Is there a law that states the size of the federal workforce?

Is there a Constitution that specifies that the President shall faithfully execute the laws?

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