Baht Bus Fare - The Real Story

[torrenova]

Interesting, because lately it is more common for them to get violent if you give them 10 for a long ride, they now often want 20.

And therein lies a fundamental Thai flaw in their shoddy mathematics and logic / reasoning.

Now if the price was Bt10 and fuel went up then the semi logical thing to do would be to set a price of perhaps Bt12 which would usually see them getting Bt15. The real ,logical thing would be to reduce the number of buses ! Will they ever move prices in such a manner ? No. They jump to the next large unit. They get no sympathy and deserve no right to work. Bring in capitalism and a free market and you'll see about half the buses disappear.

[mikethevigoman]

Why ? could have been all she had in the world, do you really think that was a days wages ? come on

[mikethevigoman]

Remember this, the chances of farang changing anything in thailand is pretty remote,.its their way or no way, you will only make your self ill getting worked up,.

[torrenova]

But it would never have been 50k would it ?

But it would be a problem for her as I understand the sellers don't actually have the money to buy the tickets upfront but "borrow" it and live on the commission and what price they can scam off people above the Bt40*2 = Bt80 per ticket.

[Jingthing]

Not a bad question but my answer would probably be ,most look like they havent got a pot to piss in, and compared to us im sure the standard of living is slightly lower than mos

I am sure it varies, but I did ask one baht bus driver this question once. He was a nice baht bus driver and didn't seem like a violent drugged maniac like so many, so we had a nice talk. He told me that after paying the truck rental and expenses on a good day in high season he clears 1000 baht a day. Thats more than many doctors earn in Thailand! I am not saying they don't work hard or deserve to earn good money; I am saying they don't need your white man's burden guilt donations, they are not poor Thais! Like mafioso in countries all over the world, there are benefits. If you want to help out a poor Thai, give your extra money to some real poor Thais, you bleeding hearts! I really think some of you really are communists, buying into the idea that our role as whiteys in Thailand is to redistribute the wealth from the first world to the third world. The way trends are going in geopolitics these days, it is the whitey countries that are going to need the charity.

Edited September 12, 2007 by Jingthing

[MELATONIN]

Never underestimate the masses.

The masses are asses.

[Maestro]

It will be appreciated if you don’t quote the entire post to which you reply or, even worse, a whole series of nested posts. This is considered bad netiquette.

Please snip copiously and quote only the text passages relevant to your reply. This will make it easier to read and understand your own post, and the thread as a whole.

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Maestro

[Naam]

He told me that after paying the truck rental and expenses on a good day in high season he clears 1000 baht a day. Thats more than many doctors earn in Thailand!

it would be interesting to know how much he earns on a bad day in the low season and how much working hours he puts in daily.

[klikster]

Life is much too short to get worked up about 5 Baht - principle or no principle.

You'll only get killed by the driver or have a heart attack due to high blood pressure.

Is it really worth it?

Well, sometimes odd things happen.

I lived in Pattaya for about a year and often took a songtaew down Buakhow to Central, to Second Road to Top's, did my shopping then reversed, walking back along the street market to the mouth of Buakhow. I usually offered 5 baht and would start to walk away .. but if the driver protested I would feign surprise at my error and pay the extra.

Sometimes I got off at an ATM on Central Road. I'm a bit long of tooth and my thoughts often become occupied with something other than the present. One night I got off at the ATM, got my Bt and walked down to Top's. Then I got to thinking and realized I hadn't paid at all.

I guess the driver figured that he had cheated me/others enough times to balance the equation.

One thing I never did was argue. Basically, I believe it's really a waste of time and blood pressure to argue with one driver over a principle that involves hundreds of drivers .. especially over Bt 5.

Edited September 13, 2007 by klikster

[klikster]

They get no sympathy and deserve no right to work. Bring in capitalism and a free market and you'll see about half the buses disappear.

".. deserve no right to work." How is that? Who determines who "deserves" to work? Foreigners shouldn't be thinking they possess Godlike wisdom, IMO.

How many transportation companies have priced themselves into bankruptcy and who benefits from that?

While there may be a situation barring free entry to the songtaew market , are you forced to make use of their service? So that side of the market is "free".

[MELATONIN]

While there may be a situation barring free entry to the songtaew market , are you forced to make use of their service? So that side of the market is "free".

YES. ]The songtaews along with their mafia people have made it impossible for a regular taxi to pick up a fare in Pattaya unless the fare is going out of town.

Next time you see Bangkok Taxi (there are no Pattaya Taxis) flag him down to ask a question. In seconds you will see why - A baht bus will pull up behind the taxi and start honking.

[Jingthing]

The other alternative is motorcycle taxis, great for those with death wishes. For there to be a real free market for public transport in Pattaya, we need Bangkok style taxi meters that are actually Pattaya taxi meters. not actual Bangkok taxis, and these taxis must not be owned and controlled by the corrupt baht bus mafia. The chances of this happening? Almost zero. Some free market!!!

Edited September 13, 2007 by Jingthing

[MELATONIN]

In fact, the taxi drivers are afraid to talk to you in Pattaya - they are afraid the police will give them trouble. What does that tell you? The f**#*ING POLICE are in on it as well. Don't bother complaining about a Songtaew driver to the police - they don't give a shit.

[tropo]

He told me that after paying the truck rental and expenses on a good day in high season he clears 1000 baht a day. Thats more than many doctors earn in Thailand!

it would be interesting to know how much he earns on a bad day in the low season and how much working hours he puts in daily.

I too find this hard to believe.

Although I never question people about their income because I consider it impolite, I reckon your friendly baht bus driver was exagerating, or he gave you his income for a very good day in peak season.

[tropo]

It will be appreciated if you don’t quote the entire post to which you reply or, even worse, a whole series of nested posts. This is considered bad netiquette.

Please snip copiously and quote only the text passages relevant to your reply. This will make it easier to read and understand your own post, and the thread as a whole.

Thank you all for your kind cooperation.

--

Maestro

Thank you Maestro, and all the other kind moderators who have started snipping lengthy quotes...what took you guys so long?

[colino]

know doubt i'l get flamed for this

just pay it and remember how much your saving and how much it would cost in your native home land ,

people moaning over 5 -10 baht,, 99% of you lot over here are on to a good thing and enjoy your new life , 1% moan about duel pricing for this duel pricing for that , a Songtaew driver charged me to much , moan moan moan all over 5-10 baht get a life

[cobra]

... just pay it and remember how much your saving and how much it would cost in your native home land ,

people moaning over 5 -10 baht,, 99% of you lot over here are on to a good thing and enjoy your new life , 1% moan about duel pricing for this duel pricing for that , a Songtaew driver charged me to much , moan moan moan all over 5-10 baht get a life

Well said,

I think this small percentage of people who bemoan and rant over having to pay a little extra, be it tiered pricing or whatever, always play the "it's the principle" card.

Which compels me to over compensate, over tip, to show that farangs can be friendly and generous, and not whining cheap penny pinchers.

I'm a guest here, I don't make policy, I follow it, I don't make enemies, I make allies, and I don't have baht bus drivers chasing me down and threatening me over 5b.

[MELATONIN]

I too find this hard to believe.

Although I never question people about their income because I consider it impolite, I reckon your friendly baht bus driver was exagerating, or he gave you his income for a very good day in peak season.

Of course you do. It doesn't fit your expectation of the facts so why would you not disagree with it. Who needs facts, we have your opinion.

Edited September 13, 2007 by MELATONIN

[MELATONIN]

I'm a guest here, I don't make policy, I follow it, I don't make enemies, I make allies, and I don't have baht bus drivers chasing me down and threatening me over 5b.

Ah yes, what would we do in this world without the followers. Being a leader is so unique, dangerous, and it's diffiucult to live under moral codes and such. Yes, what would we do without all the little followers who follow.

What would we do?

[onzestan]

I'm a guest here, I don't make policy, I follow it, I don't make enemies, I make allies, and I don't have baht bus drivers chasing me down and threatening me over 5b.

Ah yes, what would we do in this world without the followers. Being a leader is so unique, dangerous, and it's diffiucult to live under moral codes and such. Yes, what would we do without all the little followers who follow.

What would we do?

Live happily ever after?

onzestan

Edited September 13, 2007 by onzestan

[tropo]

Of course you do. It doesn't fit your expectation of the facts so why would you not disagree with it. Who needs facts, we have your opinion.

You should go back and read some of the nonsense (sorry, facts) you've posted so far on this thread.

[torrenova]

They get no sympathy and deserve no right to work. Bring in capitalism and a free market and you'll see about half the buses disappear.

".. deserve no right to work." How is that? Who determines who "deserves" to work? Foreigners shouldn't be thinking they possess Godlike wisdom, IMO.

How many transportation companies have priced themselves into bankruptcy and who benefits from that?

While there may be a situation barring free entry to the songtaew market , are you forced to make use of their service? So that side of the market is "free".

Sorry I meant that they should have no absolute right to work. If it was free then some drivers prepared to buy new buses and charge real set fares could enter the market. The fact that they cannot is because the current drivers are part of organised crime which protects their greedy vested interests and denies entry to honest hardworking guys. There are some good guys out there by the way but they are a very small minority.

As for their earnings, you really have to see what they get day in day out to fully appreciate it. I did see it for years and got to know quite a few drivers. The fact is that they clear a fine wage for Thailand, particularly for their uneducated / lowly educated peer group. The proof of the pudding is how many give up the job to do something else. The fact is they do not.

[MELATONIN]

You should go back and read some of the nonsense (sorry, facts) you've posted so far on this thread.

Deflect when you have no valid response. Good job deflecting.

[tropo]

You should go back and read some of the nonsense (sorry, facts) you've posted so far on this thread.

Deflect when you have no valid response. Good job deflecting.

You must have a short memory as you're the one who initiated deflection.

Is it not nonsense to claim one (you) posts facts when others post only opinions?

Edited September 13, 2007 by tropo

[tropo]

The proof of the pudding is how many give up the job to do something else. The fact is they do not.

It proves nothing at all.

Just the fact that it is a sedentary job is more than enough to discourage the drivers from finding other work because humans are intrinsically lazy. Even if they could make 3 times as much doing manual labor or some nasty job, I'm sure they would prefer driving.

Another reason would be that Thai males just love driving cars because it makes them feel important.

Edited September 13, 2007 by tropo

[MELATONIN]

You must have a short memory as you're the one who initiated deflection.

Is it not nonsense to claim one (you) posts facts when others post only opinions?

When deflection is pointed out, obfuscate. Good job Tropo - you're a master at obfuscation.

[tropo]

You must have a short memory as you're the one who initiated deflection.

Is it not nonsense to claim one (you) posts facts when others post only opinions?

When deflection is pointed out, obfuscate. Good job Tropo - you're a master at obfuscation.

You shouldn't be using words you don't understand.

Here's your own display of deflection and obfuscation which you hastily forgot:

I too find this hard to believe.

Although I never question people about their income because I consider it impolite, I reckon your friendly baht bus driver was exagerating, or he gave you his income for a very good day in peak season.

Of course you do. It doesn't fit your expectation of the facts so why would you not disagree with it. Who needs facts, we have your opinion.[/

What should I call this? Debate?

Edited September 14, 2007 by tropo

[MELATONIN]

Ahhh Tropo, I see Thailand is getting to you after all - You're learning the Thai way. If there are no good facts in your favor, interject opinion. If the opinion isn't enough introduce nonsense to obfuscate. If called on the obfuscation and lack of facts, then by all means blame it on the other guy.

What happened to personal responsibility Tropo? Own your obfuscation and opinion, don't be afraid of it, own it! When it doesn't work, make it someone else's fault. Congrats on learning the Thai way.

[Jingthing]

Regarding how much baht bus drivers make. Well, clearly there are too many of them, and clearly they aren't losing money, and clearly they should not be your number one choice when thinking of giving to charity. I agree with the poster who said they do make good money for their low education levels. Sorry if that sound rude to assume they have low education levels, maybe some have advanced degrees, you think?

Edited September 14, 2007 by Jingthing

[MELATONIN]

You shouldn't be using words you don't understand.

Prevarication is not something for which you should be proud. How would you know what words I comprehend?