Dark Days Are Ahead

[smartecosse]

"What if you don't die? What if you are a vegetable or permanently incapacitated in some way?" There was no answer to this.

What if the presence of helmet made one a vegetable whilst without one one would have just died?

i dont think you need to worry about thai style "helmets" saving anyone, all they are good for is keeping your head dry when it rains

[jstumbo]

I was reading that the guy that used to be in charge of the communications ministry didn't even use the Internet. How could someone in charge of that ministry not use the internet in this day and age.

Edited November 12, 2007 by jstumbo

[elkangorito]

"What if you don't die? What if you are a vegetable or permanently incapacitated in some way?" There was no answer to this.

What if the presence of helmet made one a vegetable whilst without one one would have just died?

i dont think you need to worry about thai style "helmets" saving anyone, all they are good for is keeping your head dry when it rains

Well, my question to my students wasn't meant to change them. It was meant to see what they would do in their given situation. My personal results have been strangely conclusive but in such a way that many others may not agree.

I was reading that the guy that used to be in charge of the communications ministry didn't even use the Internet. How could someone in charge of that ministry not use the internet in this day and age.

I guess that this one goes down to "TIT"...& never returns from this state.

[JSixpack]

Anybody noticed how in public places, BTS or even in big dept stores, everywhere there's a sound system, it seems that a "love Thailand" patriotic song is played every hour or sometimes more frequently these days? Disgusting how insecure the gov't is, to resort to such blatant brainwashing.

[NanLaew]

It just seems to me a little disconcerting that only a very small percentage of the population have any clue as to what is going on in Parliament, and what effect it may have on their future lives.

What's your take on the +60% vote against the new constitution from the northeast of the country? Are they more aware of what government is doing? Do they think things were genuinely better under Thaksin or is it just a longing for ANY democratically elected leader?

I think that the very charismatic Thaksin gave them something to focus on and his government was just the same old mix of alliances, nepotism and cronyism; a staple of most governments. Military appointed leaders are possibly 'more of the same' as far as the Thai population is concerned.

[jbowman1993]

Whatever happens, good or bad, the world will still be round.

[NanLaew]

All these problems will pale into significance if a certain person passes on.....

Yes, yes quite but let's not go there right now. It will certainly contribute to the jockeying for position over the next few years IMHO.

[007]

It just seems to me a little disconcerting that only a very small percentage of the population have any clue as to what is going on in Parliament, and what effect it may have on their future lives.

It has been said before, every people deserves that government and the laws which it tolerates. With the prevalent 'mai pen rai' and 'sha la la - live for today' mentality, as well as the fact that 65% of Thais are willing to sell their parliamentary vote for 5 or 10 bucks, it is so obvious: Thais really do NOT care...

[thedude]

It appears to me as though the "uncivilised" (tongue in cheek) world MUST follow the western trends. I think that this is very sad because I so much enjoy being away from the western crap. Singapore, unfortunately, is simply an Asian country that has been largely westernised. I shall not be going there.

Many countries seem to fear the loss of their culture to western idealoligy (perhaps justifiably so), which is not at all an unreasonable fear. The only thing that I don't like is that "nationalism" seems to spring from this fear, which leads to such things as excessive censorship etc.

Fears do nothing but segregate the world. If only people realised that a culture is like anything...it has a life & death...that then we can begin to coexist in relative harmony. EVERYTHING has a life & a death.

Look at the classic example of religion. How many people & governments are acting violently to preserve a religious ideal? And for what reason? It doesn't make sense. Many people seem to think that there are only 2 choices...western culture or "original" culture, when this is clearly not the case.

You can take the opposite point of view and state with as much validity that Singapore is a Western country that was largely Asianized. The only difference is in whether you start the analysis from day-to-day household culture or the political culture.

In the usual sense, a culture rarely "dies". That typically only happens when the population falls below a critical mass and can't recover from a natural disaster or is subjected to genocide. Cultures evolve. Where did Norman and Anglo-Saxon-Jutish cultures go? They're here on ThaiVisa; we call them Englishmen and Americans and Australians, etc. Where did the dinosaurs go? One probably crapped on your balcony this morning; we call them birds.

you are both way off the mark. singapore, or for that matter hong kong or taiwan, are not "westernised" by any stretch of the imagination, just like how japan or korea are not westernised. they are merely "modernized" and operating in a globalised setting. the western world does not have a monopoly over all things progressive or advanced. i think one can be economically advanced and still maintain the essence of one's culture, but the central question for thailand is whether its culture is compatible with the type of values requred to be economically competitive and progressive.

that is the question.

there are those in the power establishment who believe that the thais are not culturally tuned for this type of competition, and thus encourage the view that the people be taught to live with less and to be self sustainable. they dig up religious precepts to justify and cling to this nostalgic view of what the thai people are and should be.

there are others who feel that the thais, given the right leadership, can be taught, inspired, motivated, organised in such a way as to be productive and competitive. i tend to hold this latter view. the key is education, unfortunately it is the very elite within this culture who have wilfully negleted this duty to educate and modernize while focussing instead on furthering their own status and wealth. perhaps a revolutionary is required to tip the course.

if you think about it, there must have been thousands of cultures that have sprung up and failed throughout history, the few hundred that we are left with today survived because they ultimately embody the values consistent with survival, and the thai culture is likewise one of the successful survivors of history.

[sibeymai]

Bring on the revolution.....why put off the inevitable ?

Get it over and done with so whoever's left can get on with life.

[sibeymai]

another thought....

when those "dark days" do arrive, as I believe they surely will, by revolution or otherwise, foreigners in thailand better have a piece of dirt somewhere upcountry to disappear to and escape the turmoil which could erupt in Bangkok. I'd think bangkok would be a pretty unpleasant place to be if you had nowhere else to go in Thailand. Make preparations now for your alternatives is my advice.

Edited November 13, 2007 by sibeymai

[jbowman1993]

Anybody noticed how in public places, BTS or even in big dept stores, everywhere there's a sound system, it seems that a "love Thailand" patriotic song is played every hour or sometimes more frequently these days? Disgusting how insecure the gov't is, to resort to such blatant brainwashing.

Yes, I noticed the same thing on Radio and TV all the time. I strong feel that if the people would play those songs less and practice more patriotism, the country will be a lot better!

What's your take on the +60% vote against the new constitution from the northeast of the country? Are they more aware of what government is doing? Do they think things were genuinely better under Thaksin or is it just a longing for ANY democratically elected leader?

I think that the very charismatic Thaksin gave them something to focus on and his government was just the same old mix of alliances, nepotism and cronyism; a staple of most governments. Military appointed leaders are possibly 'more of the same' as far as the Thai population is concerned.

According to what I heard, they are not longing for any democratic stuff. They long for cash!!

Absolute poverty and starvation of cash made $5-10 so irresistible over any principle.

It was widely said that in the rural NE and N, people practice "No money, don't know how to mark (the ballot)".

The 60%+ mark bore no reflection to any preference for the constitution. Almost all of them don't know the content of the constitution - and they don't care. The percentage was widely known to be the test of the vote buying system for the real election in December. Those 60%+ votes reflected that many votes paid for!

Pundits said the old guards could have paid enough to trash the constitution, but that wouldn't gain them anything as they might get an unwanted constitution. This 60%+ re-affirmed the old guard's confidence that their vote buying machine installed during the 6-year reign was still very much intact. This is why most Thai observers generally agree that PP will come in 1st in their stronghold of NE and N in December. Some even said the payment for the upcoming election has already been paid for, with the payment for the constitution vote a down payment, before the new election law (with severe penalties) came out.

Most foreign governments/press don't understand this point. They kept measuring Thai election based on the mostly clean Western elections, of who won the vote; as if that really meant the persons elected are more popular - rather than having bought the votes. In the poor NE and N, the reported B25bn earmarked for this election goes a long way to influence votes.

Even today, it is still projected that the party would garner the most votes. Buying votes are already reported by those overseeing the election. If the cheaters are not caught, the outcome seems assured.

All these problems will pale into significance if a certain person passes on.....

Absolutely true.

Interestingly though, it was documented that the 'certain person' reportedly told a lady in the inner circle that he would live until 120. The lady reported that it was not said as a joke.

It just seems to me a little disconcerting that only a very small percentage of the population have any clue as to what is going on in Parliament, and what effect it may have on their future lives.

It has been said before, every people deserves that government and the laws which it tolerates. With the prevalent 'mai pen rai' and 'sha la la - live for today' mentality, as well as the fact that 65% of Thais are willing to sell their parliamentary vote for 5 or 10 bucks, it is so obvious: Thais really do NOT care...

Concur! They don't care. Isn't that so sad!? Pitiful too!?

Wish the world is better than this.

The quotations marks are not fooling anyone. This topic is strictly off limits on TV.

[Losangels]

Bring on the revolution.....why put off the inevitable ?

Get it over and done with so whoever's left can get on with life.

Tend to agree, however what if the end result wasn't what we expect?

We may become another Myanmar. Something like getting rid of Taksin and we now have something that may be like heading toward a military dictatorship

[sriracha john]

another thought....

when those "dark days" do arrive, as I believe they surely will, by revolution or otherwise, foreigners in thailand better have a piece of dirt somewhere upcountry to disappear to and escape the turmoil which could erupt in Bangkok. I'd think bangkok would be a pretty unpleasant place to be if you had nowhere else to go in Thailand. Make preparations now for your alternatives is my advice.

Very sound. This is a little something I've been spending my weekends assembling in the backwoods of Yasothan:

[TheEmperorOfTheNorth]

I think more Thais are aware of what's happening than you give them credit for.

'They' (dam_n, those evil quote marks again eh JB) can't keep up a democratic facade with elections AND be pulling coups all the time. It will hit breaking point somewhere, similar to 1992 and 1973.

[Payboy]

another thought....

when those "dark days" do arrive, as I believe they surely will, by revolution or otherwise, foreigners in thailand better have a piece of dirt somewhere upcountry to disappear to and escape the turmoil which could erupt in Bangkok. I'd think bangkok would be a pretty unpleasant place to be if you had nowhere else to go in Thailand. Make preparations now for your alternatives is my advice.

Very sound. This is a little something I've been spending my weekends assembling in the backwoods of Yasothan:

you forgot to put in the flush handle!

Edited November 13, 2007 by Payboy

[cloudhopper]

another thought....

when those "dark days" do arrive, as I believe they surely will, by revolution or otherwise, foreigners in thailand better have a piece of dirt somewhere upcountry to disappear to and escape the turmoil which could erupt in Bangkok. I'd think bangkok would be a pretty unpleasant place to be if you had nowhere else to go in Thailand. Make preparations now for your alternatives is my advice.

Very sound. This is a little something I've been spending my weekends assembling in the backwoods of Yasothan:

excellent design except you forgot the escape tunnel to Burma!

[NanLaew]

excellent design except you forgot the escape tunnel to Burma!

Escape TO Burma? Now there's a novel thought.

[007]

Anybody noticed how in public places, BTS or even in big dept stores, everywhere there's a sound system, it seems that a "love Thailand" patriotic song is played every hour or sometimes more frequently these days? Disgusting how insecure the gov't is, to resort to such blatant brainwashing.

Yes, I overheard older female teachers at government school actually singing/humming such age-old patriotic songs, cause they hear them daily on the bus, radio, TV, at work, at school... And these songs have been played for the last 200 years(?) I always wondered why the Thais don't get tired of them. Can you imagine singing or even listening to your national anthem, or songs like "Rule Britannia" every day? How simple-minded can Thais be?

[TheEmperorOfTheNorth]

I love Rule Britannia. Its a very good song and not played nearly enough as it should.

And I'm not even British.

Also, it's typically not sung by ridiculous big-haired dames, but by cool people, like football hooligans and the like.

Edited November 14, 2007 by TheEmperorOfTheNorth

[hammered]

I think more Thais are aware of what's happening than you give them credit for.

'They' (dam_n, those evil quote marks again eh JB) can't keep up a democratic facade with elections AND be pulling coups all the time. It will hit breaking point somewhere, similar to 1992 and 1973.

or 1976 if we want to be pessimistic.

Unfortunately there is no way this subject can be fully discussed as it touches on touchy topics.