Tourist Police

[Tufty]

Ok I know that the recent treads regarding Pattaya’s Tourist Police Volunteers have been closed due to personal attacks but I would like to know why are they too busy arresting flower sellers and the like rather than trying to make Pattaya a safer place

Walk down the promenade at night and the new lighting illuminating the beach looks very nice but the footpath is now very dimly lit and in the absence of Tourist Police it's now a good place for groups of ladyboy’s to ply their trade or god forbid rob a unsuspecting tourist.

I thought the basic role of the Police was to protect and serve, not harass honest working people and ignore criminals, maybe I am wrong or maybe this, like many other things Thailand is totally opposite to the rest of the world

Is it just the footpath that is dim or does that go for Pattaya city hall alike

I consider this to be a legitimate question and hope the TVP’s who read this will reply or at least take note and provide a service that keeps me safe when walking alone at night

Also I hope admin will keep a Tourist Police tread open so board members who are interested in the welfare of residents and tourists can ask questions and make suggestions to keep the streets a safer place

[bkk barney]

They only seem interested in arresting flower sellers and gogo girls showing their breasts, its probably a lot safer than arresting real criminals.

[Up2U]

Yet again, please distinguish between the Tourist Police and the local gendarmerie. Basic criminals fall under the remit of the boys in brown. The TP (or men in black) are there to prevent tourists from being ripped off.

Then of course there are the Immigration Police, who are there to make sure you have the correct documentation to allow you to stay in Thailand.

[bartender100]

One of my peronal dislikes,is seeing 2-3 year olds being used as photo props till after 2am,every night on walking street.Nothing seems to be done about it,its not as though they are trying to hide,the police just walk past them.

[IamMaiC]

(or men in black)

So it is true after all I thought they were joking in the movies and on the internet

[astral]

Yet again, please distinguish between the Tourist Police and the local gendarmerie. Basic criminals fall under the remit of the boys in brown. The TP (or men in black) are there to prevent tourists from being ripped off.

Then of course there are the Immigration Police, who are there to make sure you have the correct documentation to allow you to stay in Thailand.

So where do the "volunteers" fit in?

Thailand has enough police already, they just need to do their job.

If the volunteers are keen to help, they can do so at the police station helping to translate between police and the farang

If they want to arrest people they should go home and do it in their own country

Edited August 25, 2004 by astral

[Up2U]

Yet again, please distinguish between the Tourist Police and the local gendarmerie. Basic criminals fall under the remit of the boys in brown. The TP (or men in black) are there to prevent tourists from being ripped off.

Then of course there are the Immigration Police, who are there to make sure you have the correct documentation to allow you to stay in Thailand.

So where do the "volunteers" fit in?

Thailand has enough police already, they just need to do their job.

If the volunteers are keen to help, they can do so at the police station helping to translate.

If they want to arrest people they should go home and do it in their own country

As I understand it (not being a volunteer, not nowing any volunteers personally) the volunteers go around tourist areas, accompanied by the real thing (Men In Black). The idea is to de-fuse situations before they ever get to a police station. I have seen these guys in Walking Street, wearing T-shirts with 'Volunteer' on them, so they are not doing any undercover work. But they are there if a tourist needs help from someone who speaks their language and is known to the MIB.

I have only ever seen these guys (and the Tourist Police in general) being helpful to tourists. I do not think the 'volunteers' have the power of arrest.

It is the boys in brown who do most bar-raids, as well as chasing snatch-and-grab motorcyclists, reviewing the suicide statistics and so on.

(But - as always - I am open to correction by those who really know.)

[Tufty]

Yet again, please distinguish between the Tourist Police and the local gendarmerie. Basic criminals fall under the remit of the boys in brown. The TP (or men in black) are there to prevent tourists from being ripped off.

Then of course there are the Immigration Police, who are there to make sure you have the correct documentation to allow you to stay in Thailand.

I am not just having a go at farang Tourist Police Volunteers but also city hall re the poor lighting, but if farang TVP's really want to assist the boys in brown to protect tourists and residents they could stagger down the beach road at 4 in the morning with the "local gendarmerie" (at a distance in an unmarked car) I am sure they would be approached by several ladyboys who would more than likely surround the individual (as I have been) and literally frisked for valuables and possibly ripped off.

Its stupid to think that this would happen to a Thai policeman in plain clothes and obviously the farang TVP's couldn't do it nightly as they would become too well known

I suppose the point I am trying to make is that I have never seen any tourist police on foot down the beach road day or night

[bkk barney]

the boys in brown used a belgian guy to set up jade bar, it cost jade bar just over 20,000baht in fines, the belgian baker has a business here, is he doing this to get well known by the bars?

10 days before peppermint was closed howard the volunteer was in there, 3 days before that 2 tourist police were in there getting their free drinks.

certainly makes me wonder..

[Tufty]

The TP (or men in black) are there to prevent tourists from being ripped off.

How about arresting the multitude of time share touts on the beach road are they not assisting farang to rip off tourists

[bkk barney]

ok, its time for admins to own up to the emails they have recieved from tourist police and tourist police volunteers, i have noticed every forum that has a thread about tourist police whether it becomes a flaming war or not is deleted on all the boards howard belongs to,

so admins are you getting threatening emails??

a post from an admin from another thai based site

"Like them or loathe them the tourist police are part and parcel of the Thai authorities!

I am sure the authorities are well aware of the presence of this forum on the internet & believe that constantly harrassing/threatening/abusing any member/section of any dept of the authorities, will surely result in the enforced blocking/closure of this website/forum.

I hope the removal of this thread does not upset any particular member too much, as i can assure you that was most certainly not the reason behind it's removal.

Regards"

so as we see most forums are deleting or locking threads about police volunteers, now why would that be if there is a reasonable discussion without flaming??

[bkk barney]

if anybody wants, i can post the thread of about 4 posts before it was locked, unfortuneately the admin of this forum was made to delete the original tourist police thread so i cant post that, yep those police are clamping down on american etc based web sites.

howard ur doing a good job of stopping freedom of speach..

[bkk barney]

a post from an admin from another thai based site

"Like them or loathe them the tourist police are part and parcel of the Thai authorities!

I am sure the authorities are well aware of the presence of this forum on the internet & believe that constantly harrassing/threatening/abusing any member/section of any dept of the authorities, will surely result in the enforced blocking/closure of this website/forum.

I hope the removal of this thread does not upset any particular member too much, as i can assure you that was most certainly not the reason behind it's removal.

Regards"

so as we see most forums are deleting or locking threads about police volunteers, now why would that be if there is a reasonable discussion without flaming??

ok its time to think about this admins post, he is quite high profile in pattaya and he has his name and address on the who is, i shall email him and get him to correct that, but his website is hosted in the usa much the same as this website, so the question is why are they scared of a few emails??

"Like them or loathe them the tourist police are part and parcel of the Thai authorities!

erm are they really part and parcel of thai authorities while working without work permits???

I am sure the authorities are well aware of the presence of this forum on the internet & believe that constantly harrassing/threatening/abusing any member/section of any dept of the authorities, will surely result in the enforced blocking/closure of this website/forum

erm yes howard is but as most of ur posters aint in thai it wouldnt make any differance if howard got ur site banned from thailand, would howard do that?? a lot have threads have been closed down for him, howard also posts in wot wou;ld be considered the most illegal of thai forums, he also goes to gogo bars and watches naked women, wot he does after that i have no idea...

[bkk barney]

Am I not looking carefully enough or has the discussion on police volunteers suddenly 'disappeared'?

This post has been edited by Binky on Aug 23 2004, 04:01 AM

Posted: Aug 23 2004, 07:31 AM

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http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=15415

seems to be happening everywhere.. doesnt that make u paranoid?

--------------------

I spent most of my money on beer and women, The rest i just wasted.

Posted: Aug 23 2004, 10:35 AM

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QUOTE

German man sleeps on the beach as lady steals his money.

Mr. Ertl Joachim, a 39 year old man from Germany had spent Sunday night drinking and enjoying himself in the many bars Pattaya has to offer. He decided that because of his intoxicated state he would not be able to make it back to his Hotel and decided to sit on a deckchair on the beach and he soon fell asleep. Unbeknown to him, a 36 year old lady, Khun Pisawong saw him sleep and decided to attempt to steal everything he had including his wallet and passport. Luckily for the German man, two young men who were close by saw the incident and detained the woman and, along with the German man escorted her to the nearby Pattaya Police Station where she was charged with stealing and locked up for the night.

sounds like a set up to me

the link of the man that was asleep but had 2 ppl willing to watch and help

--------------------

I spent most of my money on beer and women, The rest i just wasted.

Posted: Aug 24 2004, 03:09 AM

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The thread was indeed removed mainly for 2 reasons which i have outlined below:

A,

This topic had degenerated into nothing more than a personal attack/witch hunt focusing mainly one one member of the police volunteer unit.

As most of you are well aware Flaming posts/personal attacks are not permitted in any topic/thread.

As such any topic/thread originating or degenerating in this manner will be removed without warning regardless of content.

Quite apart from that though,

B,

Like them or loathe them the tourist police are part and parcel of the Thai authorities!

I am sure the authorities are well aware of the presence of this forum on the internet & believe that constantly harrassing/threatening/abusing any member/section of any dept of the authorities, will surely result in the enforced blocking/closure of this website/forum.

I hope the removal of this thread does not upset any particular member too much, as i can assure you that was most certainly not the reason behind it's removal.

Regards

[Howard The Volunteer]

BKK Barney,

What the h??? are you on about. Are you a class A drug user or what. Now this I haven't heard before. I was in Peppermint 10 days before a raid. You idiot, if I was spying on the bar, the raid would have taken place HOURS after I was there not 10 frigging days. I can also confirm that I have not put any pressure on any webmaster to lock or delete threads. However, disrespecting Thai Police volunteers, whatever their ethnic origin is clearly not a wise thing to have on your website, those guys at C.A.T. are well on the case these days. Personally, I don't care about the threads.

I like that about peppermint....LMFAO.

I have been in every f???ing gogo bar on Walking Street, they all looked open tonight and in a couple of them I even saw pairs of ti ts. Shocking!!!!

Edited August 25, 2004 by astral

[Tufty]

Howard

I am glad to see you are reading this thread but please rise above the stupidity of BKK Barney's comments and start doing something to help tourists and residents by intermediating between us and the police/city hall to do something constructive rather than concentrating you efforts arresting the Thai people who tour the bars trying to make a honest living (blokes who come are happy to buy their girl some flowers or have their photo together) they aren't ripping people off (if the flowers are too expensive people don't buy them)

Many people who live here can supply you with ideas to make this a safer city

[Up2U]

I have been in every f???ing gogo bar on Walking Street, they all looked open tonight and in a couple of them I even saw pairs of ti ts. Shocking!!!!

HTV

First, you may get barred for swearing.

Warned, actually

Moderator

Second - which one? which one? which one!!!?

ANyway - as you are also appearing on the idiot box every day, and wearing your TP Volunteer T-shirt every night, I doubt that anyone with the slightest bit of common sense would expect you to set up any bar for a raid.

Who have you upset so much that they post so much derogatory rubbish on any thread that has even the faintest sniff of 'volunteer' about it?

I do agree about the TP making Beach Road safer for late-night tourists. The lighting in some parts has helped, but there are still dark, katoey-infested, less salubrious patches.

Edited August 25, 2004 by astral

[Digger]

I really am getting bored by all this negative stuff about the tourist police volunteers. If they wish to give up their time to assist then its up to them. However clearly there is a major public relations problem in that most of the Pattaya residents see them as some kind of disaster. Sounds to me like there needs to be a concerted effort to actually publicise far more effectively what good the tourist police (and MIB) actually do in Pattaya. Personally, I think some concerted efforts at stamping out crime would not go amiss.

My ideas to kick start a discussion include:

Sting operation on pickpockets in Soi Blues factory (3 people I know have been pickpocketed in last week down there)

Work to improve the lighting outside Royal Garden Plaza which is virtually black after the mall closes.

Keep a continued effort at tackling the Katoeys who are basically hardened criminals (and I have nothing against katoeys, but seems there area group of extreme one's who must be known to the police - keep clammering down on them and hopefully they will go somewhere else or change their ways.)

Carry out more randomn drink driving tests over the key routes in the city - how many more people need to die to actually get something done about this - drinking & driving is a major problem in this town 52 weeks a year - not just at Songkran.

[davethailand]

I really am getting bored by all this negative stuff about the tourist police volunteers. If they wish to give up their time to assist then its up to them. However clearly there is a major public relations problem in that most of the Pattaya residents see them as some kind of disaster. Sounds to me like there needs to be a concerted effort to actually publicise far more effectively what good the tourist police (and MIB) actually do in Pattaya. Personally, I think some concerted efforts at stamping out crime would not go amiss.

My ideas to kick start a discussion include:

Sting operation on pickpockets in Soi Blues factory (3 people I know have been pickpocketed in last week down there)

Work to improve the lighting outside Royal Garden Plaza which is virtually black after the mall closes.

Keep a continued effort at tackling the Katoeys who are basically hardened criminals (and I have nothing against katoeys, but seems there area group of extreme one's who must be known to the police - keep clammering down on them and hopefully they will go somewhere else or change their ways.)

Carry out more randomn drink driving tests over the key routes in the city - how many more people need to die to actually get something done about this - drinking & driving is a major problem in this town 52 weeks a year - not just at Songkran.

this could be solved by shutting down the poxy jp bar, this is the attraction for all the pissed up idiots after 2am, (also unfortunatley for the soi itself, the 19th hole is the place where the thieving katouys live).

yes i'm more against it being the owner of The Blues Factory but it really does piss me off.

I'd like to add that the volunteer police are well out of harms way by 130 - 2am, why?

[Howard The Volunteer]

Dave, the reason we leave is because we have to go to sleep sometimes. Some of us have to work in the morning. I agree with you that after 2am all the snakes, monkeys etc all come out. And the majority of "anti-social" behaviour takes place. Sometimes we work after 2 but not very often, it depends on whether we have anything specific to do. I will mention your problem to the Captain who works with me, tonight when i see him.

[davethailand]

i'll probably get whipped for this howard but i would love to see strong police presence around that area from say 2.30 - 3 ish (even i don't always empty out till then ) the main reason is as you say the anti social <deleted>, especially the anti social <deleted> who piss and puke over my office etc.

I quite often stay in the corner bar next to JP because its nice and quiet and sociable, its a shame because it will only be a matter of time before the idiots start packing that place out, (the arabs have already started).

[wcr]

Digger you are right. I'll admitt to being a volunteer for about one month back around feb/mar time. I left for a couple of reasons, first lack of training/ id badge/ protection, secondly boredom.

I joined because I felt I could help in someway both the TP and tourists/residents. I am an ex police officer from London so have a lot of experience and felt that I may be able to difuse situations and be a knowledgable go-between, whilst giving some of my knowledge to the TP (if they wanted it).

I had several conversations with Howard about tackling the lady boy situation and other things to; not raiding gogo bars that is stupid. I can guarentee from my knowledge of Howard he is certainly not involved in this. I can't speak for any of the new intake. Howard was always against undercover work on the ladyboys for reasons I will keep to myself.

This is what is needed without a doubt. I was not prepared to do it without my ID card and backup. This is what will win back public support. This is seen to be helping us (tourists and residents). I, for one, would not have nicked the flower sellers. That is not a good move in the publics eye. Howard see's that differently.

At the end of the day its down to the TP who they take on as Farang Volunteers. My concern is and was how they select these people. If they are selected correctly, trained properly then only people with something to hide will slate the TPV's. You will never win over the criminal element, and those laying into Howard and the volunteers would probally do so anyway as they are up to no good here one can guess.

Dave, you won't get support after 2am as thats when the TP finish. Its down to the Pattaya City boys to cover that I guess.

[bkk barney]

nice post wcr.

i have actually had a lot of involvement with the thai police,(no not becos of illegal activities b4 anyone starts ) , i have a couple of friends in the foriegn crime suppresion unit and know the rest from the unit, once or twice a week i go out drinking with a couple of them or to parties etc, the main guy i know i have known for about 12 years, b4 this unit he was in cid, now obviously we mainly goto bars or gogos, and nearly everytime they would ask me if i knew the owners, i always said no cos i dont want to get involved in that sort of stuff, it gets a bit embarrassing though when the owner comes up and says hi bkk barney, then i just say to my police friend,"well i have met the owner b4 but i dont know him ". but basically all the thai police are doing is using farangs to get evidence and info about other farangs as other farangs trust them, manys the time he has passed his mobile phone to me and i have taken the message from some farang grassing up another farang, the thing that really foked me off was one time when i knew the farang that was phoning him and i also knew the farang that he was accusing of being a farang mafia boss, did i pass the message on? yep i sure did, but unfortuneatly i got the accused surname wrong and the name of his bar wrong

as for howard, every time u go out and have a good time ur fellow workers will ask ,where u went etc etc etc, would u lie to them about seeing naked breasts as u saw a few days ago, or do u tell them the truth and hope that they dont pass it on?

i know my police friends always ask where to see naked women, i always say i have no idea, wot do u say howard??

[booman]

BKK Barney,

What the h??? are you on about. Are you a class A drug user or what. Now this I haven't heard before. I was in Peppermint 10 days before a raid. You idiot, if I was spying on the bar, the raid would have taken place HOURS after I was there not 10 frigging days. I can also confirm that I have not put any pressure on any webmaster to lock or delete threads. However, disrespecting Thai Police volunteers, whatever their ethnic origin is clearly not a wise thing to have on your website, those guys at C.A.T. are well on the case these days. Personally, I don't care about the threads.

I like that about peppermint....LMFAO.

I have been in every f???ing gogo bar on Walking Street, they all looked open tonight and in a couple of them I even saw pairs of ti ts. Shocking!!!!

me thinks the Lady doth protest too much

[bkk barney]

BKK Barney,

What the h??? are you on about. Are you a class A drug user or what. Now this I haven't heard before. I was in Peppermint 10 days before a raid. You idiot, if I was spying on the bar, the raid would have taken place HOURS after I was there not 10 frigging days. I can also confirm that I have not put any pressure on any webmaster to lock or delete threads. However, disrespecting Thai Police volunteers, whatever their ethnic origin is clearly not a wise thing to have on your website, those guys at C.A.T. are well on the case these days. Personally, I don't care about the threads.

I like that about peppermint....LMFAO.

I have been in every f???ing gogo bar on Walking Street, they all looked open tonight and in a couple of them I even saw pairs of ti ts. Shocking!!!!

hmmm, first u r accusing me of being a drug user, not very professional and totally innaccurate.

most police info about bars is not acted on straight away as they need so many police to actually go into the bar at the same time and there are crimes happening all over pattaya that merit more attention than some topless bird dancing in peppermint agogo, yes howard u were there 10 days b4 it was raided, ok that is probably totaly irrelavant u being there as far as u are concerned.

cat aint doing a good job of banning sites from thailands viewing howard, if u believe they are u know nothing about the internet try www.webwarper.net howard and u can goto anything u want from thailand that is banned by cat, or try any proxy server, loads of em out there. as for cat caring about a few farangs working illegally as tourist police volunteers im sure they will be checking out sites for that just after they finish checking all the www.thailadymen are sexually confused sites.com

hey i loved ur comment on how u would tell the captain u r working with, that made me laugh, made it sound like u were on equal footing till i remembered u was white and dont speak thai lol..

[igotworms]

nice post wcr.

i have actually had a lot of involvement with the thai police,(no not becos of illegal activities b4 anyone starts ) , i have a couple of friends in the foriegn crime suppresion unit and know the rest from the unit, once or twice a week i go out drinking with a couple of them or to parties etc, the main guy i know i have known for about 12 years, b4 this unit he was in cid, now obviously we mainly goto bars or gogos, and nearly everytime they would ask me if i knew the owners, i always said no cos i dont want to get involved in that sort of stuff, it gets a bit embarrassing though when the owner comes up and says hi bkk barney, then i just say to my police friend,"well i have met the owner b4 but i dont know him ". but basically all the thai police are doing is using farangs to get evidence and info about other farangs as other farangs trust them, manys the time he has passed his mobile phone to me and i have taken the message from some farang grassing up another farang, the thing that really foked me off was one time when i knew the farang that was phoning him and i also knew the farang that he was accusing of being a farang mafia boss, did i pass the message on? yep i sure did, but unfortuneatly i got the accused surname wrong and the name of his bar wrong

as for howard, every time u go out and have a good time ur fellow workers will ask ,where u went etc etc etc, would u lie to them about seeing naked breasts as u saw a few days ago, or do u tell them the truth and hope that they dont pass it on?

i know my police friends always ask where to see naked women, i always say i have no idea, wot do u say howard??

Who the heck can you trust in that town? Sounds like there's a whole lotta snitching going down in sin city. I feel sorry for the legitimate folk caught in the middle...get out while you can. Or at the very least, trust no one.

For all you know, one day your an ice cream cart vendor, the next day your a wanted mafia pimp.

Best be scratching this place off the "places to see" list.

[bkk barney]

hey anybody want one of these

[WISteve]

"disrespecting Thai Police volunteers, whatever their ethnic origin is clearly not a wise thing to have on your website, those guys at C.A.T. are well on the case these days"

Gosh, I wonder who might have put C.A.T. on to the websites? And that wouldn't be a veiled threat to the webmasters or anything would it be, Howard?

Maybe you would consider matching up a few of these for a good joke, huh Howard?

All in good fun of course. Knowing you are such a good humored fellow and all..

+

Glad you have such a fun-loving nature Howard....

~WISteve

[shellman]

Gosh, I wonder who might have put C.A.T. on to the websites?  And that wouldn't be a veiled threat to the webmasters or anything would it be, Howard?

Do you think that the people at CAT need anyones assistance to monitor their log files? They also can use Google like every other person. And then there is the "Cyber Inspector Commitee" at the Ministry of Information and Communication Technology. They also do nothing else but finding any site that may be "harmful" to the thai image in the world. Anyone using an internet connection in Thailand has to go through what are called "transparent proxies" - at asianet for example, they are the IP addresses 203.144.144.184 - 203.144.144.187. You can or can not use your providers proxy server, your traffic will still go through his transparent proxy where all logs are kept for review requests by police in case of criminal investigations.

I hope nobody here is stupid enough to think that CAT has no knowledge of all the boards, they sure do. But as long as there are no real offences, they are not likely to care as there is a bunch of other sites they would want to block before any of the boards we all use.

I don't think that Howard needs to point any site to CAT, they are smarter then most of you might think and they have some real good people working for them.

cheers

shellman

PS - for the people who did not figure it out allready, I usually use the name cyber on all other boards - when I signed up here early this year...for some reason i sued shellman - i saw that nic somewhere else and for some reason I liked it - would like to change it now but that can only be done by an admin (anoyone cares to change it to cyber? )

[Phil Conners]

Anyone using an internet connection in Thailand has to go through what are called "transparent proxies" - at asianet for example, they are the IP addresses 203.144.144.184 - 203.144.144.187. You can or can not use your providers proxy server, your traffic will still go through his transparent proxy where all logs are kept for review requests by police in case of criminal cases.

Sorry but you're now in an area where you obviously don't know what you're talking about. Transparent proxies only intercept port 80 and possible port 443 traffic. If you configure your browser to use a proxy server on another port such as 3128 you will not be intercepted by the transparent proxy.