Australian Aged Pension

harrry · June 11, 2014

This article on Aussie pensioners going overseas for a better

standard of living may interest some.

http://www.watoday.com.au/national/pensioners-forced-to-flee-abroad-20140607-39q4y.html

I hope Mr Ron Craney knows that he will have to spend another 2 years in Australia before and/or after her gets his Age Pension. That is the present rules, who knows what it will be then.

I am very interested to see your source harry. I have looked at the DHS & Centrelink site extensively today and cannot find anything about a requirement to stay in Australia for 2 years after getting a grant of age pension. A website link would be very handy if you would be so kind.

I suggest you send an email to international services at human services asking them about it. You must be in Australia and a resident to apply. If you have not been in Austrlia for about 2 years before applying you will not be able to leave for 2 years however you will be paid in Australia. It boils down to their test of Australian Resident.

Here's the law:

SOCIAL SECURITY ACT 1991 - SECT 1220

No portability where claim based on short residence

(1) If:

(a) a person is an Australian resident; and

( the person ceases to be an Australian resident; and

(d) within the period of 2 years after the person again becomes an Australian resident, the person is granted, or is transferred to:

(i) an age pension; or

(ii) a disability support pension; or

(iii) a bereavement allowance; and

(e) after the pension or allowance is granted, or the person is transferred to the pension or allowance, as the case may be, but before the end of that period of 2 years, the person leaves Australia; and

(f) financial assistance is not payable in respect of the person's absence from Australia under the Medical Treatment Overseas Program administered by the Minister who administers the National Health Act 1953 ;

a pension or allowance based on that claim is not payable to the person during any period during which the person is outside Australia.

(2) If:

(a) a person resides in an area that is, at the time of residence, an external Territory; and

( the person has never before resided in Australia; and

(d) within the period of 2 years after the person arrives in Australia, the person is granted, or is transferred to:

(i) an age pension; or

(ii) a disability support pension; or

(iii) a bereavement allowance; and

(e) after the pension or allowance is granted, or the person is transferred to the pension or allowance, as the case may be, but before the end of that period of 2 years, the person leaves Australia; and

(f) financial assistance is not payable in respect of the person's absence from Australia under the Medical Treatment Overseas Program administered by the Minister who administers the National Health Act 1953 ;

a pension or allowance based on that claim is not payable to the person during any period during which the person is outside Australia.

(4) For the purposes of the application of this section in relation to a particular social security payment, a person who has a qualifying residence exemption for that payment is taken:

(a) to be an Australian resident; or

( to reside in an area that is, at the time of residence, an external Territory;

as the context requires.

raybal5 · June 11, 2014

Residence requirements for Age Pension
To be eligible for Age Pension you must satisfy residence requirements. You must be:

an Australian resident on the day you lodge your claim, and

be physically present in Australia on the day you lodge your claim

You also need to have been an Australian resident for a continuous period of at least 10 years, or for a number of periods that total more than ten years, with one of the periods being at least five years, unless you:

are a refugee or former refugee, or

were getting Partner Allowance, Widow Allowance or Widow B Pension immediately before turning Age Pension age, or

are a woman whose partner died while you were both Australian residents, and you have been an Australian resident for two years immediately before claiming Age Pension

A very incomplete quote.

If you say so harry. Would you please enlighten us all with the complete quote?

http://www.humanservices.gov.au/customer/news/changes-to-australian-working-life-residence-rules

Age Pension and Pension Supplement

Your pension payment is made up of 2 different parts: Age Pension and Pension Supplement. When you leave Australia and we calculate the amount of payment you will receive, we look at Age Pension and Pension Supplement individually. Both payments can change depending on your circumstances.

Age Pension

You can get Age Pension for the whole time you are overseas, regardless of whether you leave Australia temporarily or permanently.

However, the amount of pension you receive may change if you remain outside Australia for more than 26 weeks. Whether or not your payment amount changes will depend on how long you have lived in Australia between age 16 and age pension age.

For more information on how the pension payment rates are calculated, go to Pension payment rates while absent from Australia.

If you are travelling to New Zealand, the amount you receive may be affected by the social security agreement between Australia and New Zealand.

If you returned to live in Australia and were granted or transferred to Age Pension within the last 2 years, you will not be able to receive your Age Pension outside the country. After you return, to be paid outside the country, you must have been living in Australia for two years since your last arrival for residence. If you travel to a country that Australia has a social security agreement with, you may be able to continue to get your payment under that social security agreement.

gives a more complete coverage of very important information.

Thanks Harry. My quote was from the page http://www.humanservices.gov.au/customer/services/centrelink/age-pension

and press the + symbol titled Residence requirements for Age Pension.

I chose this page because simple1 and yourself were speaking about ".. Australian Residency criteria compliance rules ...." and this page was in my view, more relevant to that issue than the page you have quoted above. My apologies for not adding the link to my post 11 June at 16:59

By the way, did you find a source regarding the 2 year rule as per your post made 8 June at 12:05 . I haven't found a reference for it. { I hope Mr Ron Craney knows that he will have to spend another 2 years in Australia before and/or after her gets his Age Pension. That is the present rules, who knows what it will be then.}

raybal5 · June 12, 2014

As an OAP recipient overseas for 6+years (also CPP and OAP from Canada) the new rules are quite simple - 2 years in Australia before or after the grant before it is portable overseas.

And, return to OZ for more than 26 weeks you will be re-assessed on the 35 year rule.

Another little quirk to watch for is that if you are away from OZ continuously for more than 5 years you will have to re-establish "residency" in OZ before you are re-eligible for Medicare benefits.

Another one to consider with your forward planning.

It's almost as complicated as having a TG partner.

(no crossword puzzles needed to ward of that Alz syndrome)

Hi Evilbaz. About your comment "...the new rules are quite simple - 2 years in Australia before or after the grant before it is portable overseas...." I have been searching for a reference to an official website or legislation which states the 2 year rule. Apart from unsourced comments on thsi site I can find nothing on Department of Human Services (Centrelink) websites. Your assistance in providing a link to a source would be much appreciated.

mcfish · June 12, 2014

As an OAP recipient overseas for 6+years (also CPP and OAP from Canada) the new rules are quite simple - 2 years in Australia before or after the grant before it is portable overseas.

And, return to OZ for more than 26 weeks you will be re-assessed on the 35 year rule.

Another little quirk to watch for is that if you are away from OZ continuously for more than 5 years you will have to re-establish "residency" in OZ before you are re-eligible for Medicare benefits.

Another one to consider with your forward planning.

It's almost as complicated as having a TG partner.

(no crossword puzzles needed to ward of that Alz syndrome)

Hi Evilbaz. About your comment "...the new rules are quite simple - 2 years in Australia before or after the grant before it is portable overseas...." I have been searching for a reference to an official website or legislation which states the 2 year rule. Apart from unsourced comments on thsi site I can find nothing on Department of Human Services (Centrelink) websites. Your assistance in providing a link to a source would be much appreciated.

its correct. however you only need to return for 2 years IF YOU are classified a non resident

harrry · June 12, 2014

As an OAP recipient overseas for 6+years (also CPP and OAP from Canada) the new rules are quite simple - 2 years in Australia before or after the grant before it is portable overseas.

And, return to OZ for more than 26 weeks you will be re-assessed on the 35 year rule.

Another little quirk to watch for is that if you are away from OZ continuously for more than 5 years you will have to re-establish "residency" in OZ before you are re-eligible for Medicare benefits.

Another one to consider with your forward planning.

It's almost as complicated as having a TG partner.

(no crossword puzzles needed to ward of that Alz syndrome)

Hi Evilbaz. About your comment "...the new rules are quite simple - 2 years in Australia before or after the grant before it is portable overseas...." I have been searching for a reference to an official website or legislation which states the 2 year rule. Apart from unsourced comments on thsi site I can find nothing on Department of Human Services (Centrelink) websites. Your assistance in providing a link to a source would be much appreciated.

SOCIAL SECURITY ACT 1991 - SECT 1220

No portability where claim based on short residence

(1) If:

(a) a person is an Australian resident; and

( the person ceases to be an Australian resident; and

(d) within the period of 2 years after the person again becomes an Australian resident, the person is granted, or is transferred to:

(i) an age pension; or

(ii) a disability support pension; or

(iii) a bereavement allowance; and

(e) after the pension or allowance is granted, or the person is transferred to the pension or allowance, as the case may be, but before the end of that period of 2 years, the person leaves Australia; and

(f) financial assistance is not payable in respect of the person's absence from Australia under the Medical Treatment Overseas Program administered by the Minister who administers the National Health Act 1953 ;

a pension or allowance based on that claim is not payable to the person during any period during which the person is outside Australia.

(2) If:

(a) a person resides in an area that is, at the time of residence, an external Territory; and

( the person has never before resided in Australia; and

(d) within the period of 2 years after the person arrives in Australia, the person is granted, or is transferred to:

(i) an age pension; or

(ii) a disability support pension; or

(iii) a bereavement allowance; and

(e) after the pension or allowance is granted, or the person is transferred to the pension or allowance, as the case may be, but before the end of that period of 2 years, the person leaves Australia; and

(f) financial assistance is not payable in respect of the person's absence from Australia under the Medical Treatment Overseas Program administered by the Minister who administers the National Health Act 1953 ;

a pension or allowance based on that claim is not payable to the person during any period during which the person is outside Australia.

(4) For the purposes of the application of this section in relation to a particular social security payment, a person who has a qualifying residence exemption for that payment is taken:

(a) to be an Australian resident; or

( to reside in an area that is, at the time of residence, an external Territory;

as the context requires.

Buy the act or widen your horizons....

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/cth/consol_act/ssa1991186/s1220.html

is a much more authoritive source than the Human Services Website and my quote above gave the full details of what it was so a little bit of effort would have had you find this.

raybal5 · June 12, 2014

As an OAP recipient overseas for 6+years (also CPP and OAP from Canada) the new rules are quite simple - 2 years in Australia before or after the grant before it is portable overseas.

And, return to OZ for more than 26 weeks you will be re-assessed on the 35 year rule.

Another little quirk to watch for is that if you are away from OZ continuously for more than 5 years you will have to re-establish "residency" in OZ before you are re-eligible for Medicare benefits.

Another one to consider with your forward planning.

It's almost as complicated as having a TG partner.

(no crossword puzzles needed to ward of that Alz syndrome)

Hi Evilbaz. About your comment "...the new rules are quite simple - 2 years in Australia before or after the grant before it is portable overseas...." I have been searching for a reference to an official website or legislation which states the 2 year rule. Apart from unsourced comments on thsi site I can find nothing on Department of Human Services (Centrelink) websites. Your assistance in providing a link to a source would be much appreciated.

SOCIAL SECURITY ACT 1991 - SECT 1220

No portability where claim based on short residence

(1) If:

(a) a person is an Australian resident; and

( b ) the person ceases to be an Australian resident; and

( c )the person again becomes an Australian resident; and

(d) within the period of 2 years after the person again becomes an Australian resident, the person is granted, or is transferred to:

(i) an age pension; or

(ii) a disability support pension; or

(iii) a bereavement allowance; and

(e) after the pension or allowance is granted, or the person is transferred to the pension or allowance, as the case may be, but before the end of that period of 2 years, the person leaves Australia; and

(f) financial assistance is not payable in respect of the person's absence from Australia under the Medical Treatment Overseas Program administered by the Minister who administers the National Health Act 1953 ;

a pension or allowance based on that claim is not payable to the person during any period during which the person is outside Australia.

(2) If:

(a) a person resides in an area that is, at the time of residence, an external Territory; and

( b ) the person has never before resided in Australia; and

( c ) the person then arrives in Australia; and

(d) within the period of 2 years after the person arrives in Australia, the person is granted, or is transferred to:

(i) an age pension; or

(ii) a disability support pension; or

(iii) a bereavement allowance; and

(e) after the pension or allowance is granted, or the person is transferred to the pension or allowance, as the case may be, but before the end of that period of 2 years, the person leaves Australia; and

(f) financial assistance is not payable in respect of the person's absence from Australia under the Medical Treatment Overseas Program administered by the Minister who administers the National Health Act 1953 ;

a pension or allowance based on that claim is not payable to the person during any period during which the person is outside Australia.

(4) For the purposes of the application of this section in relation to a particular social security payment, a person who has a qualifying residence exemption for that payment is taken:

(a) to be an Australian resident; or

( b ) to reside in an area that is, at the time of residence, an external Territory;

as the context requires.

Buy the act or widen your horizons....

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/cth/consol_act/ssa1991186/s1220.html

is a much more authoritive source than the Human Services Website and my quote above gave the full details of what it was so a little bit of effort would have had you find this.

Thanks for that harry. Sorry I missed your previous post on the Notifications list.

The section 1220 No portability where claim based on short residence you have quoted seems to me to apply more to recent immigrants to Australia. and not to the situation of the OP.

If we also read the Definitions part of the Act

SOCIAL SECURITY ACT 1991 - SECT 7

Australian residence definitions

(1) In this Act, unless the contrary intention appears:

"Australian resident" has the meaning given by subsection (2).

and

"qualifying residence exemption" has the meaning given in subsections (6) and (6AA).

(2) An Australian resident is a person who:

(a) resides in Australia; and

( b ) is one of the following:

(i) an Australian citizen;

(ii) the holder of a permanent visa;

(iii) a special category visa holder who is a protected SCV holder.

So if an Australian citizen who has returned from overseas and returns to Australia to apply for Age Pension (it is a requirement to be in Australia at the time of lodging the claim), then by the Act's definitions under subsections 2(a) and 2( b )(i) they do have a qualifying residence exemption meaning they do not have to stay the 2 years as described by Section 1220 entitled "No portability where claim based on short residence".

Where am I and mcfish incorrect in regard to the OP's situation? What other relevant sections have I missed that would invalidate our interpretation?

Evilbaz · June 12, 2014

The key word is "resides"in Australia.

DHS/Centrelink have their own interpretation of where you have been "residing" which takes in many factors:

length of time out of the country

do you own property overseas or have a longterm lease

do you own a vehicle overseas

do you have a wife, defacto or children living overseas

etc etc

So if they determine that you have been residing overseas you obviously can't have been residing in Australia.

harrry · June 12, 2014

http://www.guidesacts.fahcsia.gov.au/guides_acts/ssg/ssguide-7/ssguide-7.1/ssguide-7.1.4.html

Answering enquiries from former residents
If people overseas ask about getting a pension on return to Australia, great care should be taken to give them complete and accurate information about the residence provisions and their subsequent portability entitlements. A claim for pension can be lodged by a former resident ONLY IF, on the evidence available, there is a clear intention to remain permanently in Australia. A person who intends to return to Australia for a 24 month period only would not be an 'Australian resident' as per SSAct subsection 7(2).

It is important to inform a recipient that there is NO discretionary power allowing portability of pensions during the first 24 months of resumed Australian residency. However, payment may be suspended for the period of the short overseas absence and does not have to be reclaimed on return to Australia. A short absence from Australia (as long as the person is still classed as an Australian resident) should not impact on the end date of this 24 month residence period (i.e. the absence still counts towards the person's 24 month residence period).

Act reference: SSAct section 7(2) An Australian resident…, section 1220(1) to (2) No portability where claim based on short residence

_______________________________________________________

mickjn · June 12, 2014

I have been on the OAP since September last year.I have posted before that I was on the Disability Pension since I was 49 due to reoccurring brain tumours.During this time I left Australia on many occasions,never told them and had no problems.A few weeks before I turned 65 I was sent out forms and a letter asking if I wanted to change to the OAP.I had a bit of trouble understanding the forms so I went to Cenrelink and a guy there who was very helpful helped me fill in the forms.I took all my banking details,inverstments,which was small etc..The guy said this will be no problems your pensions will just change over.A few days later I got a call from Centrelink to come up for an interview.When I went I was greeted by a lady and 2 gentlemen.If you have ever been interviewed by the coppers they are amauters compared to these guys.They were on about a missing $30000 from my bank account.I told them I have been asked about this matter 4 times over the years and I have told them everytime I know nothing about $30000 as I told them last time if you can find the money you can keep it.They had all my bank accounts for years,trips in and out of Australia,they knew more about me than I knew about myself.In the end they eased up in this and turned to my trips to Thailand..The main thing they were going on about was that I didn't notify them I was leaving.They said you get a letter from us and it is in that letter you have to notify us when you leave it is in that letter.I told them I have not read the letter as I cannot concentrate on reading,I have had operations on my brain.Then they played their final card.They said you left the country for 7 months and did not tell us and they told me the dates.I was thinking then the light went on for the first time in years.I said that is not correct,so how do I know what you are saying about the $30000 is correct.They were angry now and said this information is 100%.I said I am going now if you want to come with me I will show you my passport which is stamped when I left Australia for a month when came back.About 6 months laterI went to Bali for a month there are stamps in my passport for in and out They were saying I was out of the country for 7 straight months which was wrong.I went home not long after I was switched to the OAP

I am in LOS for 90 days.Before I left I rang them up and told them I was leaving.The girl asked me how long I was leaving for I said 90 days.She said are sure only 90 days I said yes.She said hang on I have to work it out.She came back and said after 6 weeks your pension is reduced.I said it was 26 weeks she said no you get a clean energy supplement which you do not get after 6 weeks,it will make your pension about $8 a fortnight less.If you stay longer and go over 26 weeks your pension will be reduced again but not by much but you will loose your benefits.She seemed a nice girl so I asked her.I have a mate living overseas and he is going to come back when he is 65 what does he have to.She said it is simple,come back for 2 years leave again we will give him his pension but soon the age will be going up to 67.I said ok then I said just one final question I ring you when I leave do I have to ring you when I come back.She said no unless your circumstances change dramactilly we will know.She said its not like the days when you used to leave the country and not tell us and she laughed. I started laughing to she was a good girl. You cannot get anyway with much now they know all the tricks

simple1 · June 12, 2014

For those who no longer have their expired passports you can obtain your Movement Record from Immigration at no charge

https://www.immi.gov.au/managing-australias-borders/border-security/systems/movement-records.htm

mcfish · June 12, 2014

I have been on the OAP since September last year.I have posted before that I was on the Disability Pension since I was 49 due to reoccurring brain tumours.During this time I left Australia on many occasions,never told them and had no problems.A few weeks before I turned 65 I was sent out forms and a letter asking if I wanted to change to the OAP.I had a bit of trouble understanding the forms so I went to Cenrelink and a guy there who was very helpful helped me fill in the forms.I took all my banking details,inverstments,which was small etc..The guy said this will be no problems your pensions will just change over.A few days later I got a call from Centrelink to come up for an interview.When I went I was greeted by a lady and 2 gentlemen.If you have ever been interviewed by the coppers they are amauters compared to these guys.They were on about a missing $30000 from my bank account.I told them I have been asked about this matter 4 times over the years and I have told them everytime I know nothing about $30000 as I told them last time if you can find the money you can keep it.They had all my bank accounts for years,trips in and out of Australia,they knew more about me than I knew about myself.In the end they eased up in this and turned to my trips to Thailand..The main thing they were going on about was that I didn't notify them I was leaving.They said you get a letter from us and it is in that letter you have to notify us when you leave it is in that letter.I told them I have not read the letter as I cannot concentrate on reading,I have had operations on my brain.Then they played their final card.They said you left the country for 7 months and did not tell us and they told me the dates.I was thinking then the light went on for the first time in years.I said that is not correct,so how do I know what you are saying about the $30000 is correct.They were angry now and said this information is 100%.I said I am going now if you want to come with me I will show you my passport which is stamped when I left Australia for a month when came back.About 6 months laterI went to Bali for a month there are stamps in my passport for in and out They were saying I was out of the country for 7 straight months which was wrong.I went home not long after I was switched to the OAP

I am in LOS for 90 days.Before I left I rang them up and told them I was leaving.The girl asked me how long I was leaving for I said 90 days.She said are sure only 90 days I said yes.She said hang on I have to work it out.She came back and said after 6 weeks your pension is reduced.I said it was 26 weeks she said no you get a clean energy supplement which you do not get after 6 weeks,it will make your pension about $8 a fortnight less.If you stay longer and go over 26 weeks your pension will be reduced again but not by much but you will loose your benefits.She seemed a nice girl so I asked her.I have a mate living overseas and he is going to come back when he is 65 what does he have to.She said it is simple,come back for 2 years leave again we will give him his pension but soon the age will be going up to 67.I said ok then I said just one final question I ring you when I leave do I have to ring you when I come back.She said no unless your circumstances change dramactilly we will know.She said its not like the days when you used to leave the country and not tell us and she laughed. I started laughing to she was a good girl. You cannot get anyway with much now they know all the tricks

mick, dont take this the wrong way but Im wondering what was the point of your post?

mickjn · June 12, 2014

mcfish, on 12 Jun 2014 - 03:19, said:

mickjn, on 12 Jun 2014 - 02:20, said:

I have been on the OAP since September last year.I have posted before that I was on the Disability Pension since I was 49 due to reoccurring brain tumours.During this time I left Australia on many occasions,never told them and had no problems.A few weeks before I turned 65 I was sent out forms and a letter asking if I wanted to change to the OAP.I had a bit of trouble understanding the forms so I went to Cenrelink and a guy there who was very helpful helped me fill in the forms.I took all my banking details,inverstments,which was small etc..The guy said this will be no problems your pensions will just change over.A few days later I got a call from Centrelink to come up for an interview.When I went I was greeted by a lady and 2 gentlemen.If you have ever been interviewed by the coppers they are amauters compared to these guys.They were on about a missing $30000 from my bank account.I told them I have been asked about this matter 4 times over the years and I have told them everytime I know nothing about $30000 as I told them last time if you can find the money you can keep it.They had all my bank accounts for years,trips in and out of Australia,they knew more about me than I knew about myself.In the end they eased up in this and turned to my trips to Thailand..The main thing they were going on about was that I didn't notify them I was leaving.They said you get a letter from us and it is in that letter you have to notify us when you leave it is in that letter.I told them I have not read the letter as I cannot concentrate on reading,I have had operations on my brain.Then they played their final card.They said you left the country for 7 months and did not tell us and they told me the dates.I was thinking then the light went on for the first time in years.I said that is not correct,so how do I know what you are saying about the $30000 is correct.They were angry now and said this information is 100%.I said I am going now if you want to come with me I will show you my passport which is stamped when I left Australia for a month when came back.About 6 months laterI went to Bali for a month there are stamps in my passport for in and out They were saying I was out of the country for 7 straight months which was wrong.I went home not long after I was switched to the OAP

I am in LOS for 90 days.Before I left I rang them up and told them I was leaving.The girl asked me how long I was leaving for I said 90 days.She said are sure only 90 days I said yes.She said hang on I have to work it out.She came back and said after 6 weeks your pension is reduced.I said it was 26 weeks she said no you get a clean energy supplement which you do not get after 6 weeks,it will make your pension about $8 a fortnight less.If you stay longer and go over 26 weeks your pension will be reduced again but not by much but you will loose your benefits.She seemed a nice girl so I asked her.I have a mate living overseas and he is going to come back when he is 65 what does he have to.She said it is simple,come back for 2 years leave again we will give him his pension but soon the age will be going up to 67.I said ok then I said just one final question I ring you when I leave do I have to ring you when I come back.She said no unless your circumstances change dramactilly we will know.She said its not like the days when you used to leave the country and not tell us and she laughed. I started laughing to she was a good girl. You cannot get anyway with much now they know all the tricks

mick, dont take this the wrong way but Im wondering what was the point of your post?

You are right Sir,it was stupid and pointless please forgive me mea culpa mea culpa mea maxima culpa

harrry · June 12, 2014

mcfish, on 12 Jun 2014 - 03:19, said:

mickjn, on 12 Jun 2014 - 02:20, said:

I have been on the OAP since September last year.I have posted before that I was on the Disability Pension since I was 49 due to reoccurring brain tumours.During this time I left Australia on many occasions,never told them and had no problems.A few weeks before I turned 65 I was sent out forms and a letter asking if I wanted to change to the OAP.I had a bit of trouble understanding the forms so I went to Cenrelink and a guy there who was very helpful helped me fill in the forms.I took all my banking details,inverstments,which was small etc..The guy said this will be no problems your pensions will just change over.A few days later I got a call from Centrelink to come up for an interview.When I went I was greeted by a lady and 2 gentlemen.If you have ever been interviewed by the coppers they are amauters compared to these guys.They were on about a missing $30000 from my bank account.I told them I have been asked about this matter 4 times over the years and I have told them everytime I know nothing about $30000 as I told them last time if you can find the money you can keep it.They had all my bank accounts for years,trips in and out of Australia,they knew more about me than I knew about myself.In the end they eased up in this and turned to my trips to Thailand..The main thing they were going on about was that I didn't notify them I was leaving.They said you get a letter from us and it is in that letter you have to notify us when you leave it is in that letter.I told them I have not read the letter as I cannot concentrate on reading,I have had operations on my brain.Then they played their final card.They said you left the country for 7 months and did not tell us and they told me the dates.I was thinking then the light went on for the first time in years.I said that is not correct,so how do I know what you are saying about the $30000 is correct.They were angry now and said this information is 100%.I said I am going now if you want to come with me I will show you my passport which is stamped when I left Australia for a month when came back.About 6 months laterI went to Bali for a month there are stamps in my passport for in and out They were saying I was out of the country for 7 straight months which was wrong.I went home not long after I was switched to the OAP

I am in LOS for 90 days.Before I left I rang them up and told them I was leaving.The girl asked me how long I was leaving for I said 90 days.She said are sure only 90 days I said yes.She said hang on I have to work it out.She came back and said after 6 weeks your pension is reduced.I said it was 26 weeks she said no you get a clean energy supplement which you do not get after 6 weeks,it will make your pension about $8 a fortnight less.If you stay longer and go over 26 weeks your pension will be reduced again but not by much but you will loose your benefits.She seemed a nice girl so I asked her.I have a mate living overseas and he is going to come back when he is 65 what does he have to.She said it is simple,come back for 2 years leave again we will give him his pension but soon the age will be going up to 67.I said ok then I said just one final question I ring you when I leave do I have to ring you when I come back.She said no unless your circumstances change dramactilly we will know.She said its not like the days when you used to leave the country and not tell us and she laughed. I started laughing to she was a good girl. You cannot get anyway with much now they know all the tricks

mick, dont take this the wrong way but Im wondering what was the point of your post?

You are right Sir,it was stupid and pointless please forgive me mea culpa mea culpa mea maxima culpa

Not stupid, just a bit too trusting. I understand you just wanted to point out that although the individuals are human there the processes are fixed and big brother knows all.

moojar · June 12, 2014

I have been on the OAP since September last year.I have posted before that I was on the Disability Pension since I was 49 due to reoccurring brain tumours.During this time I left Australia on many occasions,never told them and had no problems.A few weeks before I turned 65 I was sent out forms and a letter asking if I wanted to change to the OAP.I had a bit of trouble understanding the forms so I went to Cenrelink and a guy there who was very helpful helped me fill in the forms.I took all my banking details,inverstments,which was small etc..The guy said this will be no problems your pensions will just change over.A few days later I got a call from Centrelink to come up for an interview.When I went I was greeted by a lady and 2 gentlemen.If you have ever been interviewed by the coppers they are amauters compared to these guys.They were on about a missing $30000 from my bank account.I told them I have been asked about this matter 4 times over the years and I have told them everytime I know nothing about $30000 as I told them last time if you can find the money you can keep it.They had all my bank accounts for years,trips in and out of Australia,they knew more about me than I knew about myself.In the end they eased up in this and turned to my trips to Thailand..The main thing they were going on about was that I didn't notify them I was leaving.They said you get a letter from us and it is in that letter you have to notify us when you leave it is in that letter.I told them I have not read the letter as I cannot concentrate on reading,I have had operations on my brain.Then they played their final card.They said you left the country for 7 months and did not tell us and they told me the dates.I was thinking then the light went on for the first time in years.I said that is not correct,so how do I know what you are saying about the $30000 is correct.They were angry now and said this information is 100%.I said I am going now if you want to come with me I will show you my passport which is stamped when I left Australia for a month when came back.About 6 months laterI went to Bali for a month there are stamps in my passport for in and out They were saying I was out of the country for 7 straight months which was wrong.I went home not long after I was switched to the OAP

I am in LOS for 90 days.Before I left I rang them up and told them I was leaving.The girl asked me how long I was leaving for I said 90 days.She said are sure only 90 days I said yes.She said hang on I have to work it out.She came back and said after 6 weeks your pension is reduced.I said it was 26 weeks she said no you get a clean energy supplement which you do not get after 6 weeks,it will make your pension about $8 a fortnight less.If you stay longer and go over 26 weeks your pension will be reduced again but not by much but you will loose your benefits.She seemed a nice girl so I asked her.I have a mate living overseas and he is going to come back when he is 65 what does he have to.She said it is simple,come back for 2 years leave again we will give him his pension but soon the age will be going up to 67.I said ok then I said just one final question I ring you when I leave do I have to ring you when I come back.She said no unless your circumstances change dramactilly we will know.She said its not like the days when you used to leave the country and not tell us and she laughed. I started laughing to she was a good girl. You cannot get anyway with much now they know all the tricks

mick, dont take this the wrong way but Im wondering what was the point of your post?

Well I found it an interesting "real world" read, thanks Mick for sharing. And there is some very useful information in there too - the bit about how much information Centrelink is able to obtain, the pressure they put you under during interviews - all good to know.

moojar · June 12, 2014

The key word is "resides"in Australia.

DHS/Centrelink have their own interpretation of where you have been "residing" which takes in many factors:

length of time out of the country

do you own property overseas or have a longterm lease

do you own a vehicle overseas

do you have a wife, defacto or children living overseas

etc etc

So if they determine that you have been residing overseas you obviously can't have been residing in Australia.

Umm, what I'm wondering is, how do they know if you own property / a motor vehicle overseas? How do they know most of that stuff (besides travel history) actually, unless you tell them?

Evilbaz · June 13, 2014

The key word is "resides"in Australia.

DHS/Centrelink have their own interpretation of where you have been "residing" which takes in many factors:

length of time out of the country

do you own property overseas or have a longterm lease

do you own a vehicle overseas

do you have a wife, defacto or children living overseas

etc etc

So if they determine that you have been residing overseas you obviously can't have been residing in Australia.

Umm, what I'm wondering is, how do they know if you own property / a motor vehicle overseas? How do they know most of that stuff (besides travel history) actually, unless you tell them?

Well, they'll ask you at your interview, (in many different ways) as they have direct access to Immigrations' travel records.

You also have to regularly declare your assets and income, in both Australia and overseas to gain and maintain your OAP.

mickjn · June 13, 2014

moojar, on 12 Jun 2014 - 16:05, said:

Evilbaz, on 11 Jun 2014 - 20:40, said:

The key word is "resides"in Australia.

DHS/Centrelink have their own interpretation of where you have been "residing" which takes in many factors:

length of time out of the country

do you own property overseas or have a longterm lease

do you own a vehicle overseas

do you have a wife, defacto or children living overseas

etc etc

So if they determine that you have been residing overseas you obviously can't have been residing in Australia.

Umm, what I'm wondering is, how do they know if you own property / a motor vehicle overseas? How do they know most of that stuff (besides travel history) actually, unless you tell them?

This is just my opinion Sir.If they are asking anyone about property/vehicles overseas they are asking you a question they already know the answer to.All the best

mcfish · June 13, 2014

I can tell you first hand although mine is related to DSP the process is the same. I declared my condo in Bangkok when applying for the pension and they took a statement along with the address and what i payed they then did an "international search" and found it that way. Would they have found it if undeclared? that is a bit complicated because you must give them all your Bank balance info for the last 5 years and if you dont they will check it anyway

So you will be asked where did that 300k go that you sent to Thailand in 2009?? if you haven't declared you have a property then you are snookered !

I never had a problem getting the pension with a condo in Thailand because it was bough as an "investment' and its not my home, so they are snookered!

simple1 · June 13, 2014

I can tell you first hand although mine is related to DSP the process is the same. I declared my condo in Bangkok when applying for the pension and they took a statement along with the address and what i payed they then did an "international search" and found it that way. Would they have found it if undeclared? that is a bit complicated because you must give them all your Bank balance info for the last 5 years and if you dont they will check it anyway

So you will be asked where did that 300k go that you sent to Thailand in 2009?? if you haven't declared you have a property then you are snookered !

I never had a problem getting the pension with a condo in Thailand because it was bough as an "investment' and its not my home, so they are snookered!

As far as I am aware Thai Land Offices do not have an online database facility to search. Don't believe there is any agreement between Thai & Oz governments for info sharing regarding social security matters, so how would Centrelink do a search for property owned in Thailand?

mcfish · June 13, 2014

I can tell you first hand although mine is related to DSP the process is the same. I declared my condo in Bangkok when applying for the pension and they took a statement along with the address and what i payed they then did an "international search" and found it that way. Would they have found it if undeclared? that is a bit complicated because you must give them all your Bank balance info for the last 5 years and if you dont they will check it anyway

So you will be asked where did that 300k go that you sent to Thailand in 2009?? if you haven't declared you have a property then you are snookered !

I never had a problem getting the pension with a condo in Thailand because it was bough as an "investment' and its not my home, so they are snookered!

As far as I am aware Thai Land Offices do not have an online database facility to search. Don't believe there is any agreement between Thai & Oz governments for info sharing regarding social security matters, so how would Centrelink do a search for property owned in Thailand?

There is a form supplied for international assets that comes with the application.They also came back with a different BHT value to what I declared. Also when they were taking to long I rang C/L twice and both times was told by the person looking at my case file that the International search was not finished.

Im just the messenger buddy maybe they called the land office with my details already supplied so it wasn't a search by online data. Seems like a waste of time since i already declared it..

Evilbaz · June 13, 2014

As mentioned above Centrelink follow the money trail.

OZEMADE · July 8, 2014

Latest News for Seniors magazine

News for Seniors provides information to older Australians on the government and community support available to them. For more than 2 million readers, News for Seniors explains government payments, concessions, current pension rates and thresholds, allowances and services as well as broader government programs and policies.

News for Seniors issue 92 - June 2014 [pdf, 2.5mb]
News for Seniors issue 92 - June 2014 [rtf, 341kb]

You can read News for Seniors online in languages other than English.

This link for all latest info

http://www.humanservices.gov.au/customer/publications/rt010

harrry · July 8, 2014

As an OAP recipient overseas for 6+years (also CPP and OAP from Canada) the new rules are quite simple - 2 years in Australia before or after the grant before it is portable overseas.

And, return to OZ for more than 26 weeks you will be re-assessed on the 35 year rule.

Another little quirk to watch for is that if you are away from OZ continuously for more than 5 years you will have to re-establish "residency" in OZ before you are re-eligible for Medicare benefits.

Another one to consider with your forward planning.

It's almost as complicated as having a TG partner.

(no crossword puzzles needed to ward of that Alz syndrome)

Not quite as simple as that. I read on one of their publications about whether you are a resident when you appliesd that if you intended to stay to years and leave at the end of it they would not consider you a permanent resident so you could not get your pension.

They are getting nasty. Do not shoot the messenger.

Evilbaz · July 8, 2014

Again - phone the International Affairs division in Hobart - they are most helpful.

oldsailor35 · July 11, 2014

Mmmmmmm! all these overseas investigations and the staff to man it, must be costing Centre Link millions. i wonder how much they are able to "claw" back, and if the whole exercise is really worth while.

oldsailor35 · July 11, 2014

You are making facts up to suit yourself Chiang2000. Saying that pensions are a basic human right is nonsensical.

BookMan and I are mates.

We disagree on many things ... and that's great ... keeps me on my toes.

He writes "Saying that pensions are a basic human right is nonsensical" ...

Pensions are a safety net, not an income source. They are a privilege, not a right.

That said, most likely when I retire, circa over 2 decades hence and Bookie closer to 3 decades, there will no pension as we know it today which you guys benefit from.

We will have to take care of ourselves through superannuation, a personal pension scheme.

Now, hawking back (pun intended) there were salary rises forgone so that there could be the 'Super' scheme. Back then, we could have had more toys to play with, more coin in the pocket ... but no, the Government made us have a forced saving scheme to help us in the times ahead, 37 years ahead in my case when we weren't working anymore.

It's our taxes which we pay now which, in part, gives you your pension ... as you did by paying your Father's.

None of us begrudge doing that.

It was the system with which you were raised.

Added to that, there was a sense 'of entitlement' ... that the State would take care of you.

That entitlement phase is over ... the country simply can't afford an ever increasing Welfare Bill.

.

But it can afford the ever increasing payments and benefits to "has been" and present politicians.

Evilbaz · July 11, 2014

As an OAP recipient overseas for 6+years (also CPP and OAP from Canada) the new rules are quite simple - 2 years in Australia before or after the grant before it is portable overseas.

And, return to OZ for more than 26 weeks you will be re-assessed on the 35 year rule.

Another little quirk to watch for is that if you are away from OZ continuously for more than 5 years you will have to re-establish "residency" in OZ before you are re-eligible for Medicare benefits.

Another one to consider with your forward planning.

It's almost as complicated as having a TG partner.

(no crossword puzzles needed to ward of that Alz syndrome)

Not quite as simple as that. I read on one of their publications about whether you are a resident when you appliesd that if you intended to stay to years and leave at the end of it they would not consider you a permanent resident so you could not get your pension.

They are getting nasty. Do not shoot the messenger.

Evilbaz · July 11, 2014

As an OAP recipient overseas for 6+years (also CPP and OAP from Canada) the new rules are quite simple - 2 years in Australia before or after the grant before it is portable overseas.

And, return to OZ for more than 26 weeks you will be re-assessed on the 35 year rule.

Another little quirk to watch for is that if you are away from OZ continuously for more than 5 years you will have to re-establish "residency" in OZ before you are re-eligible for Medicare benefits.

Another one to consider with your forward planning.

It's almost as complicated as having a TG partner.

(no crossword puzzles needed to ward of that Alz syndrome)

Not quite as simple as that. I read on one of their publications about whether you are a resident when you appliesd that if you intended to stay to years and leave at the end of it they would not consider you a permanent resident so you could not get your pension.

They are getting nasty. Do not shoot the messenger.

Why would you say what you think you might do in two years time?

As the Thais say " nobody know the future".

No cost for checking - there is a direct link from Centrelink to Immigration.

So when you exit OZ be careful what you put on your departure statement.

Don't say you are leaving permanently (you'll then get an extra bonus of 13 weeks of "allowances".)

harrry · July 11, 2014

As an OAP recipient overseas for 6+years (also CPP and OAP from Canada) the new rules are quite simple - 2 years in Australia before or after the grant before it is portable overseas.

And, return to OZ for more than 26 weeks you will be re-assessed on the 35 year rule.

Another little quirk to watch for is that if you are away from OZ continuously for more than 5 years you will have to re-establish "residency" in OZ before you are re-eligible for Medicare benefits.

Another one to consider with your forward planning.

It's almost as complicated as having a TG partner.

(no crossword puzzles needed to ward of that Alz syndrome)

Not quite as simple as that. I read on one of their publications about whether you are a resident when you appliesd that if you intended to stay to years and leave at the end of it they would not consider you a permanent resident so you could not get your pension.

They are getting nasty. Do not shoot the messenger.

Why would you say what you think you might do in two years time?

As the Thais say " nobody know the future".

No cost for checking - there is a direct link from Centrelink to Immigration.

So when you exit OZ be careful what you put on your departure statement.

Don't say you are leaving permanently (you'll then get an extra bonus of 13 weeks of "allowances".)

Yes but not everyone knows not to say it.

Evilbaz · July 11, 2014

^^^

That is what these forums are for - to spread the knowledge.

To often "assumption is the mother of all SNAFUs".

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